Hello All,

I found a firepower to buy and outside of machine looks to be in good condition. I have some photos of the boards. This is being bought as a project pin. Could someone give me some general feedback. I am buying this anticipating I'll have to replace driver board and there will be other work that needs to be done. Still learning but any general feedback would be greatly appreciated!! Any severe show stoppers that pop up? (Sorry for the poor photos)
Thanks,
Dan

Thanks Patofnaud... Kind of taking a gamble on this one but I really want it for my collection so just hoping I do not get in over my head...Driving 3 hours to get it so gonna buy for sure... Been looking too long for one that is not extremely over priced to let this one slip past my finger tips...Dan

Oh boy.. Might be in over my head on this one but after a 3h45m drive (one way) I had to pick it up... I'll post a few photos I took quickly after I loaded it in my garage...

Cabinet

IMG-20130715-01491.jpg IMG-20130715-01492.jpg IMG-20130715-01494.jpg

Backglass... Yes I dared plug it in...(Missing ground 3rd prong on plug)..The extent of what happened is lights turned on... Guy I bought from was a picker and had an old building (no electricity) that he used for storage.. Had several pins he just bought and sold as-is... What I saw was issued around fire power on back light but the detail of the moon/planent looked OK

IMG-20130716-01506.jpg IMG-20130716-01509.jpg IMG-20130716-01511.jpg

One more backglass..

IMG-20130715-01490.jpg

Lower Playfield... Was about to walk away but... just had to get it...

IMG-20130715-01495.jpg IMG-20130715-01496.jpg

Mid Playfield

IMG-20130715-01498.jpg IMG-20130715-01497.jpg

Upper Playfield

IMG-20130716-01505.jpg

Underneath Playfield

IMG-20130716-01512.jpg

Boards

IMG-20130716-01497.jpg IMG-20130716-01498.jpg IMG-20130716-01499.jpg IMG-20130716-01500.jpg IMG-20130716-01501.jpg

Actually had manuals...

IMG-20130716-01514.jpg

Not sure I even know where to start... Any help would be greatly appreciated. HHasse I'll get some better photos of the CPU and what you described above.... Any comments on the purchase?... I really wanted a Firepower but not at the going EBAY prices (yikes)... I really have not seen anything in Chicagoland area that was less than $1600. I'm beat.. hitting the sack.

viperwk - no mice (actually checked when I bought it if anything was chewed up). It was supposively in a guy's basement who no longer wanted it. Thanks for the advice

dtown - Did you post anything on your restoration? Also thanks for the advice... I took a quick peak at fuses last night and definately look like some were incorrect.

thanks everybody!!!.. got some work to do...I'll update this thread with progress...Step one is to get her to play then I'll figure out what to do with playfield and backglass. All ready printed up the PDF's and saved even though I had manuals. This should be fun!

Hello All,

Got the driver board and CPU board out of back cabinet. Have some photos...
First HAN (HHASSE)

"I am a bit concerned about the CPU board. Looks like somebody put a 2716 EPROM at IC26 via a method I haven't seen before"

Here are some photos of that...

IMG-20130716-01518.jpg IMG-20130716-01519.jpg IMG-20130716-01521.jpg

On the driver board for the special solenoid connection this was soldered in place..

IMG-20130716-01517.jpg

CPU board.. battery holder removed and back of board (I got the solder out of battery holder holes but no photo)

IMG-20130716-01523.jpg IMG-20130716-01531.jpg

Driver Board Concerns 40 pin connection and resistors underneath

Photo of above

IMG-20130716-01527.jpg

Driver Board

All resistors on right side of board

IMG-20130716-01526.jpg

Here is the back of Driver Board...Looks burnt up a little. Do you think this will be OK after I replace the 40 pin and all the resistors below and all the burnt of resistors on the right side???

IMG-20130716-01530.jpg IMG-20130716-01528.jpg IMG-20130716-01529.jpg

Hello,

I am looking on the great plains electronics site and I found the "Williams System 3-6 Power Supply - Electrolytic Capacitor kit" and the "Connector, 0.156", Receptacle" for the 40 pin (4 -10 connectors).

For the resistors- Could someone help me clarify which product ID I should buy from great plains electronics...

From Driver Board Assembly drawing...
P/N 5A-8991 lamp cloumns resistors R149 - R156 (or everything to put in SCR's and jumpers )

P/N 5A-8984 switch row resistors R196 -R203

P/N 5A-9534 switch column resistors W9-W15

Also, For this issue with IDC connectors/pins which product ID.

"As for the wire soldered on the driver board, thats a standard 'oops my connector burnt so I'll do a bypass' hack to keep the board running. Simply replace the IDC connectors/pins and you'll be all set."

Thanks again everyone for their help... Dan

So for P/N 5A-8999-1 lamp columns resistors R149 - R156 I am just going to do this as VID recommended..

"Or, if you want to, you can replace the 8 TIP42 lamp matrix transistors (Q63, 65, 67, 69, 71,73, 75 and Q77) with IRF9Z34N MOSFETs"

--------------------------

P/N 5A-8991resistors R165 - R195 under 40 pin (Which one do I use?)

Drawing says: Resistor, FC, 4.7K Ohm 10% 1/4 W

Is this OK...
Product ID: RCF1/4-4.7K
Resistor, 4.7K Ohm, 1/4W, 5%
Resistor, Carbon Film, 4.7K ohm, 1/4 Watt, 5%
Color Code: Yellow, Violet, Red, Gold

http://www.greatplainselectronics.com/proddetail.asp?prod=RCF1/4-4.7K
-----------------------------------------
P/N 5A-9534 switch column resistors W9-W15

Not sure what to use here

-----------------------------------

P/N 5A-8984 switch row resistors R196 -R203

Drawing: Resistor, FC, 1K Ohm 10% 1/4 W

Is this OK?
Product ID: RCF1/4-1K
Resistor, 1K Ohm, 1/4W, 5%
Resistor, Carbon Film, 1K ohm, 1/4 Watt, 5%
Color Code: Brown, Black, Red, Gold

http://www.greatplainselectronics.com/proddetail.asp?prod=RCF1/4-1K

==========================

Thanks!
Dan

dtown
"Are you using the original schematics or the one's from Firepowerpinball.com. The original's specify these as R204-R211 which are 330k ohm 1/4 watt resistors. Break out the book and take a look."

I was using the drawings off the firepower site because they were so easy to print and was better then the old yellowed manuals.

Manual definately says P/N 5A-9001 (R204 - R211) Resistor, FC, 330 Ohm 10% 1/4W

I also notice after a quick glance his drawing has the F3 fuse slow blow but in the bill of materials it does not say slow blow...

lord loss...he was slow on emails responses for me too. i didn't get a good deal...saved you a trip.. However; I'll be happy if after these fixes it works... only time will tell but I also wanted a project to work on and after a 3h45 drive (one way)I was bringing something home... That Tri-Zone he posted looked to be in good shape when I saw it if you were trying to pick up an early SS pin from Williams... guy was a picker and was just flipping these as he found them.

Updates...

CPU Board
- Old battery holder removed. Cleaned up board. New battery holder installed and remote battery holder purchased.
Open concerns noted from previous replies ( SW1 command enter and SW2 diagnostic start look burned up) ... Can I get replacements.. SHould I leave alone??? any thoughts???

Driver Board
- Lamp Column resistors pulled as well as TIP42.. Waiting on parts for mods
-40 pin pulled (pain in ass) and waiting on parts
-Bunch of resitors on order to replace burnt out ones...

Power supply board
- 3 capacitors pulled as well as c15 which was mounted in box. waiting on replacements
-Diodes and resistors on order
-fuses on order for all that I did not have laying around

Speech and Sound board
- Going to leave alone

Thanks... i will just leave the SW1 and SW2 alone unless there is an issue... I will be careful with the cap's.. I saw Vid's thread showing orientation and markings on cap's and I have the original drawings so I should be OK.

On the power supply board for the C15,, where do I solder? Look at drawing and look at where I removed the old solder... This look was where it was at at one point even though we saw the c15 was mounted in back box next to othe large capacitor.... showing ophoto of back of board as well...

On the power supply board for the C15,, where do I solder? Look at drawing and look at where I removed the old solder... This look was where it was at at one point even though we saw the c15 was mounted in back box next to othe large capacitor.... showing ophoto of back of board as well...

hmm .. photos didnt post .... lets try again

c15_power_supply_where.JPG

photo 2 of back of power supply board

7_19_c15_back.JPG

Hi guys.. I do not think I was clear with my question. Take a look here at the mocked up photo and i think you will see what I am asking

c15_issue.JPG

Vid,

So I am ok to use the hole by black arrow? It seemed the hole was not going through by red arrow and I did not want to mess anything up...

thanks for all your help on this and other posts...

Dan

Thanks.... Just wanted to make sure... Especially since the C15 was already removed when I got the machine....(The old measure twice cut once philosphy)..Thanks

Is their a thread on replacing power cord for Williams this era.... thanks

OK...everyone has been so helpful so far...Let me just double check I got the power supply right before I solder it in... (See mock up sketch)

Just waiting on my order from GPE and then its time to solder everything I removed on Driver and power supply board. Got the CPU board back in with new battery holder installed and remote battery holder in place. Hopefully order is here by Monday and we can get the boards back in next week and try to "fire/power" her up!! Just have to grab a few pinballs and new leg levelers from Pinball Life (As it turns out located just 5 miles from where I live!) and I'm ready....Fingers crossed

Have Great Weekend Everyone!!!

Dan

power_cord_mockup.JPG

Only two prong...33 year old machine I figured I might as well whole thing...10 bucks..

Hello all.

Put everything back together.... I have game displays working now but it come up with the game identification in player 1 display (1497 2) and 04 and 00 in player/ ball display... any ideas of where to go from here?

Thanks
Dan

So I just should of called it anight...went back checked all connections to receptacles and got off that dissplay screen above... turned power on and off and back to where I started. Wiggled all my
ICs and a solenoid fired and game went into attract mode momentarily... then like a dumbass I wiggled that prom in IC26 that HAN mentioned looked different from anything he has saw and it popped out and broke some of male pins....
AHHHHHHHHH......
Looking for advice now... really not sure what to do?????
Replacement WMS system 6 eprom adapter board w/single eprom from planetary pinball????

Thanks
Dan

Good Morning All.... Just wanted to bring this thread to top of the list since I posted so late last night... Any advice on where to go now would be greatly appreciated... Dan

Patofnaud - I tried to turn it off and on really quick and was stuck on that same display. I let it sit for a few minutes and tried again same result.

Thanks all.... I ordered the: Replacement WMS system 6 eprom adapter board w/single eprom for Firepower from planetary pinball... I will install and take it from there...

Replacement WMS system 6 eprom adapter board w/single eprom for Firepower from planetary pinball has arrived... I will be installing when I get home tonight. Fingers are crossed...

Houston we still have a problem.. back to game ID and 04 and 00 on displays.... ideas on where to go from here... thanks dan

Just to play devils advocate.. when I do the self diagnostic push button test the LEDs do not stay on Which the manual says it does need a new 5101 if they stay on.

Yes. I tripled checked with door opened. Can I get the 5101 locally anywhere in chicagolandd tmrw or do I. Need to order from GPE or similar

Hans

All new caps on power supply board.

Cpu has new battery holder. I also. Bought the remote battery holder. For some reason when I used it batteeries were getting hot.. just put battteries now in Battery holder on board now.

Driver board has new 40 pin female installled and the mod for the 27 resistors in vids guide.

The machine always starts in display mode with game ID in player 1 and 04 00 in credit/ball display

Repllaced fuses and power cord.

Fyi sound/speech diagnostic works

Dan

How do you power cycle?

Dtown... I will try what you did. I thought power cycle meant turn on and off but since my recent posts I said I had turn on and off several times I thought Hans might have been asking me to do something else...

4.33 3.65 3.65 looks like my readiness were close to yours... have same DMM as you

What should I have seen if it was good?

Or your saying since I get barrery power there and game is coming up in audit mode than the chip is bad... if I wasn't seeing power there than I had a battery holder issue..?

Thanks Hans and dtown. Going to order sockets and chip... ill update everyone when they arrive in few days.

After seeing the firepower on ebay today go for $600 with aplayfield in same condition (maybe slightly worse) I am feeling a little better bought this purchase. The backglass definetely is better though... is there I site I am missiing for an aftermarket back glass for firepower??? Dan

Socket and new 5101 has arrive... i should be able to get he boards back out and replace and socket the need 5101 tonight....Really hoping to get out of that damn audit mode tonight!!!

FIREPOWER!!!

GAME PLAYS!!!

Put in socket and new 5101.. came up in audit mode....turned on and off twice w/ coin door open and went into game over mode.. set to free play and we had action....TLC time now..looks like all solenoids firing but some switches need some work and a few bulbs... back to life!

Thanks everybody for getting me this far!!!
dan

Photo...ill get it rotated tmrw

IMG-20130801-01580.jpg

Light bulbs... should I be using 44 or 47? Also does any one know what those monster light bulbs under the fire and power on the playfield are??

Thanks viperwk and Pafasa... I live like 5 miles from pinballlife so I am going to head up there on my lunch break and grab some bulbs and misc. items (and i get to play a few games!!!).. I had no idea pinballlife was so close to me until like 3 months ago!

Replaced 21 bulbs on playfield (top+underneath), new sleeve+springs for ball shooter, and got all switches working tonight...

IMG-20130801-01590.jpg

So my 1000 bonus light does not work... it looks like lights 1000 - 1000 all have wires that come to them and then a small ??? (diode or resistor???) Does any one know what these are... My 1000 bonus is missing one and I assume this is why it does not work.

Also, Same thing for the 89 bulbs. If i put the two 89 bulbs in the FIRE and POWER will stay lit up the whole time you play. I put a burnt out 89 bulb back in and now the other two 47 lights will light up only when you activate either FIRE or POWER(Believe that is how it is suppose to work?)

Anyone know... Is the an underneath playfield drawing somewhere?
Thanks
Dan

dtown... why you showing up my photo (taken with a top of the line blackberry) with that beautiful photo of your machine... That really looks nice!!! I stopped by pinball life and was think about some LED's but I decided to just put in some bulbs to get everything working first... Maybe down the road... THey just got a FLASH in and I am hoping he installs all LEDs so I Can sse how and early Williams SS looks like compared to the three I have at home but judging by your photo it would look awesome.

viperrwk... Should there be a diode on the 89 bulbs as well? Because there is not one on either bulb assembly.

Thanks
Dan

Also, question viperrwk... How was i suppose to know that diode was a 1n4004... These are obviously old and i could not make anything out on them but is there a drawing or general part list for Williams where I could have found this out myself? Or is this one of those general things you pick up over time? Dan

Thanks guys.. I'll have to take a look when i get home tonight at ll that is mentionned above.

Went to radio shack after work and grabbed a few 1N4004. Got that soldered in and the 1000 light now works... took a look at the 89 bulbs and think there is that warming circuit you mentionned and the big resistor looks shot... ill look at what i have in way of drawings but someone feel free to chime in if they know what that resistor is...(see photo)

Now second photo... went to replace the bulbs behind the backglass (first my displays for player /credit starts acting up and bottom line in display dissappeared) and noticed a small amount of smoke coming from the display board.... closer look like someone made some temporary fixes... got to pull out drawings and see what's going on.....
Dan

IMG-20130802-01595.jpg IMG-20130802-01591.jpg

Found everything I need for the master display and saw viperrwk thread too... could still use some help on identifying those resistors above for the 89 bulbs and if they should have a diodes too..?

Viperrwk...thanks!!

Well I wish that master display didn't start smoking...tried to replace those resistors but not working properly.. I see why previous person must have done what they did...might need to look for master display or try and rig this like previous guy did....here are the as they were photos... hmmmmmm...

IMG-20130803-01605.jpg IMG-20130803-01607.jpg IMG-20130803-01608.jpg

Any recommendation where I should buy a new/refurbish master display board....dan

I will show you some better photos than what is hown above when I get a chance...

It looks like I will need to replace the TIP120 at Q43 to get these flash lamps working correctly. Also I haves new problem, the left slingshot is not working... could use a little advice...this the tip120 at Q12 ???
Thanks
Dan

Viperwk.. why TIP102? I only ask b/c the drawing said TIP120 and the firepower drawings on firepower.com said TIP122... I placed and order last night with GPE.... should I have him add TIP102? I ordered a few both TIP120 and TIP 122 so I had some home inventory... Thanks Dan

Thanks!

Hello....

I checked the resistance across coil and it is ok.. it will fire in solenoid test diagnostic mode.. if you manually move it, it will score... switches don't work in switch diagnostic... how should I test this... do i even need to replace q12???

Thanks
Dan

Thanks guys... ill figure this out.

Arghhh..been out of town.. gpe order arrived ...replaced q12 and q43... left slingshot now works.. yes!!!... but flash lamps still permanently stay on.... new ideas anyone???

Replaced that big fat one that was burned out

And now the left slingshot doesn't work again... that was fun while it lasted....geezzzzzzz...back to does anyone have any ideas

Ummm nevermind bout slingshot..long week. Forgot we determined I did not need to replace q43.. we have an intermittent contact somewhere.. ran solenoid test (then I remembered) and now its working again and so no idea what was wrong. Illwait for it to stop working again and then figure it out...still need help on flash lamps though...

I meant q12 in above post...

Here is a photo of resistor board...look ok?? Not sure what was going on with that left slingshot but game got about an hour of play today and no problems...only problem left to solve is the flash lamps...and the big news is firepower has graduated from garage status to house status! Thanks again everybody for all their help! Game is really playing great!! Donation will be made to pinside!
Thanks,
Dan

IMG-20130817-01666.jpg

Donation made

Need help again on left slingshot..stopped working..played with wires going to leaf switches and started working (thought I had a loose wire). Resoldered wires to switch and now solenoid stays on as soon as you start a game.. unsoldered wires..didn't connect to switch and same problem when start game. Replaced the tip120 (again) at q12 and q11the 2n4401.. no luck..pulled the 7402 at ic9 and replaced/socketed... no luck... not sure where to go from here.....dan

Rubber that holds two leaf switches on playfield? They are not stuck closed.

Wires are off one slingshot switch. That is the one I messed with originally...

Coil pops as soon as I start game...ok when power on.. what are you suggesting I do? One switch has two wires in one hole and three in other hole. One of each of these wires go to other switch. I have the two wires on one hole unsoldered.

Still need some help BUMP...thanks

When I enter diagnostics and go to the solenoid tests as soon as it goes from lamp test to solenoid test the solenoid for left slingshot pops on and stays on. The resistor / capacitor "look great" on leaf switch but I have not checked anything with a DMM. Have not checked coil resisitance but I did this a month or two ago and it was OK.

I'll check some things out tonight when I get home and let you know what I find out..Dan

Coil good..diode good...pulling a driver board from another game...lets see what happens...

So she plays great with the flash driver board! Arghhhh..love the flash I bought. Everything socketed on driver board. Somebody before me and previous owner took pride in that game. If only they all were like that..so the pia ic5 is what I need...looking at GPE and don't see it. Could someone point me in right direction...mc6820 pi
Thanks
Dan

Thanks Andy... I didnt relaize that 6821 and 6820 were interchangeable...Of course I have 6821 laying around from my space shuttle but no socket...socket ordered...patience and do it right... Dan

Gonna get these in stock in my parts box...thanks Vid!

We'll that sucked...replaced pia at ic5 and sling shot is still firing....

Hans.... never replaced the 7408 at ic7... probably should have done first before pia...also remember that we swapped out driver boards and everything worked fine so we'll try 7408 next. Thanks dan

And 7408 at ic7 it is!!! Were back up and running!!!

So question for you.. my time warp just started to have left slingshot go out (Of course when every game was finally working).. It maybe works 1 out of 15 times right now... If i put it in switch test or solenoid test eveything works great,, switches work every time in switch test and it pops fine in solenoid test.. figured same issue as FP so last night I pop out pre-driver and driver (no luck) and then I replace / socket 7408 and still no luck... ideas? Havent tried to swap driver boards yet...

So I looked at time warp...no resistor or capacitor on switch... I see these on FP and flash..there's a diode...this game was working fine for 5 months until changed LEDs.....normal??? I got this game working so haven't gone through Gide guide yet...ordered some basics from gpe..gonna replace 40 pin, add mosfets/jumpers and recap power supply before I mess around with anything else.

Now firepower I finally got a chance to play a bit... I have more sounds then before! But....there is at least one that seems to being played at wrong time... I keep hearing the tilt sound all the time when I hit random things on playfield. Game plays fine except for this and it seems to take long time to eject ball when I get one in a lock....(and is still never got flash lamps to work but all I tried was to replace fat resistor)... so any ideas why I hear more sounds now? And fix? This a 4050 issue again like I had on stellar wars... also the speaker sucks.. what's best place to get a replacement....

Thanks dan

I did 40 pin on firepower first thing when I got game.

Viperwk...been busy...ill go through your note and game hopefully this weekend...

Schawggs...might give it a try. Think speaker is just shot from play/age..all others I have from this era sound great still..

Smokey..looking for a playfield for a swap so thisthread might grow!

Have a little work to do on time warp... I'm gonna start a new thread for it if I need more help so its not confusing in this thread...

Viperwk...are talkingbout ic14 on Cpu?... also we added a Replacement WMS system 6 eprom adapter board w/single eprom from planetary pinball to Cpu...dan

Ok..to end the thread within the thread... time warp is back up and running. This was only game I got that worked when it made it to my house. Recapped power supply.. 40 pin female replaced... mosfets and jumpers added to driver board... game still came up in audit mode.. changed batteries and now 100% good... this is my third battery change in 5 months... is this a sign of another problem?... dan