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All of this recent PinGreed is an absolute cancer. I thought these sale posts were jokes at first, but I realize now it’s a dangerous trend that’s spreading.
A BKSOR topper for $4.5k?
A PotC for $39k?
A WoZ YBR for $19?
A HUO MB for $20k?
An EM Joker Poker for $7.5k?
How do we get out of this mess? Can we just auto-delete sale posts that have 30+ downvotes? Any other ideas?
Quoted from RyanStl:Well, at least this isn't a newb thread, but OP has been here for a long time.
Yea - I’ve been around the hobby since the 90s when we were all using Rec.Games.Pinball. Pinflation has been around since 2000 - we all understand it’s part of the hobby but this new 2,3,4x asking price junk is a recent pumping/gouging trend.
Quoted from LordHumungus:By the way is that a boy or a girl in ur avatar?
Jack Skellington.
Quoted from 1963BSARGS:Start a trend. Sell me your Tron LE for $6,500.
In the past I’ve hated remakes of any form. Now I find myself wishing they could remake everything - even TronLE!
Quoted from YeOldPinPlayer:It brings up a larger question- was the marketplace data ever really useful? If so, in what ways and to whom?
The spate of recent joke ads has raised the profile a bit but this was probably always happening to some degree. No one who spends much time here places any value on EBay listings because we “know” they are ridiculous. What makes Pinside market data any more useful?
It’s probably not worth the resources required to do any verification so why bother?
Excellent observation. There’s nothing that can be done I guess. Hopefully it’s just a dumb trend and will subside at some point.
Quoted from Nevus:How is this dangerous? I don't see it.
dan·ger·ous
/ˈdānj(ə)rəs/
Learn to pronounce
adjective
able or likely to cause harm or injury.
"a dangerous animal"
Dangerous in that it causes harm to the hobby. In order for pinball to survive, we need more young people to keep coming into the hobby. If used low end pins become $5k and desirable pins become $10k+, it’s going to be hard for new people to justify that kind of $$.
Dangerous in that high margins (or the perception of them) attracts more speculators that care nothing about pinball - only about making a buck.
As I said - inflation is part of the hobby, we all agree. It’s the price gouging and speculating that poses the “danger”.
Quoted from CrazyLevi:Dammit. It’s a price bubble thread.
At least it’s not a cargument!
Price bubble threads, pinflation, code update bitching and carguments. The 4 things that that will never change about the hobby.
Quoted from Palmer:Can we add price whining to the auto-delete list?
I’ve change my mind. Young people suck. Let’s jack up the prices so high that only us old farts can afford it. 
Quoted from Beechwood:I will be listing my Twister for sale soon.
I was going to ask $3000 for it but after reading this thread its going to be listed at $6,000. (I need funds for a GB topper)
Nah - $100k.
OBO.
Quoted from Psw757:Like to hear your thoughts on the Mickey Mantle baseball card that sold for 5.2 million in January? Yes, the one wrapped in paper with a stick of chewing gum.
How about the Fabbri shotguns that now sell for over $200k
This is pretty common with just about anything deemed collectible.
This kind of started happening about 15 years ago with MM. Then the remakes happened and kept the hyper inflation in check a bit. I think most of us were fully expecting to see LOTR, TRON, TAF, TZ, TOTAN, TOM, CC, etc be remade. Now that CGC has slowed down on the remakes and Stern has 5k back orders on new titles, the hyper inflation seems to be returning (coupled with our government printing lots of money). Unfortunately I don’t see anything to keep it in check at this point.
Quoted from CrazyLevi:This is exactly what the hobby was (for me) between around 2001-2011.
Then all these new people showed up. And the prices started to rise.
Now all of those new people who glommed on to the hobby the last 10 years are bitching about it and want prices to fall again.
So...just go back where you all came from and me and the 200 other guys who were doing this in 2005 can get back to buying $900 Doctor Whos.
Thanks in advance!
That’s exactly how I felt when all of the new people showed up in 2005! Back in the 90’s I bought my MM for $2k and it was the most I’d ever spent on a pin. Close out CVS and NGGs for $1300 was the shiz (until the poor business plan of allowing close outs and the longevity of Diamondplate caused all the operators to stop buying).
Quoted from metallik:Never saw a closeout under $1850, not sure where you're getting 1300. I paid 2150 for my closeout NGG but was via an op who'd ordered too many.
You are correct - the lowest published price was $1850. My local distributor offered me a NGG for $1300 because I sold so many for them by posting the close out info to RGP.
I paid $1850 for my CV, but I had heard of others getting them for $1300 because none of the ops wanted them.
Quoted from mbeardsley:Well, if we're going to do the "back in the day" thing...
I remember having to drive to Betson's to order parts for my EBD in 1985, and they really didn't like ordering parts for "just some guy" who wasn't an operator that consistently bought new machines from them. Eventually they came to know me as "that guy with a pinball machine in his home, for God's sake!"
Eventually, I found Steve at Pinball Resource and life was good...
Haha - it was the same for me. The local ops thought I was crazy for putting them in my house. But you have me beat - in 1985 I was still a twerp in middle school.
Quoted from The_Director:I’ve toyed with the idea of posting my entire collection for $150k just for the heck of it, but too scared I’d get a taker and be put in the position of having to make a difficult decision
I’ll start the bidding at $75k! 
Quoted from Beechwood:Okay, memory lane...
About 12 years ago I picked up a meteor and Freddy on an Ebay auction for $800. My first two purchases.
I sold them for a profit ($1700, but I did a lot of fixing)
Thinking I was the shit, I went to a guys house to look at an Addam's Family. The guy had about 10 beautiful pins. Turn's out this dude was convicted of some IRS fraud of some sort and the agents tried to seize his assets. He told me they didn't even get the first pin out the door and decided it was way too much work and left the pins. I could have bought that Addams for $2000. He had an IMMACULATE TOTAN for $2500. I was young and had a young family and didn't have extra $$ to work with so I had to pass. Now that I am older and have much more disposable income, I cringe at the thought of me passing on those games. But that is life.
A year later I accidentally bought a TZ on ebay (I blame the beer) and then sold it for what I had into it -$3000. That was pin was a 9 out of 10 condition wise. UGH
Fast forward to today...I just spent $5700 on a Ghostbusters and am very pleased that I could get a minty game for that price and, in the end, the prices are all relative to the times.
It's my belief that Stern Pro's are still a decent deal for what you get.
In the end, it's not greed, it's called capitalism.
Joel
"Hey, It's Only Pinball!!"
Not pinball related but applicable - I had the chance in the 90’s to buy a complete set of 12 back original Star Wars figures on the card in near mint condition for $100/each. It was a great deal then but I tried to get an even better deal when someone else swooped in and gave them what they were asking. That was the last time I tried to negotiate an already great deal. Today’s price on a 12 back set is $60k+.
Quoted from CrazyLevi:Good point.
I can afford an $8000 TZ today a lot better than I could afford a $3000 TZ 20 years ago.
It's like when people are bitching that concert tickets don't cost $6 like they did in 1980.
If your earning power hasn't increased exponentially in 40 years you got much bigger problems than the price of a Fleetwood Mac ticket!!
What kind of junk bands were you watching for $6? My first concert was $13.50 in 1984!
Quoted from Bublehead:Let me see... Styx, Journey, Jefferson Starship, ELO, Cheap Trick, Kansas, Outlaws, Bad Company, Foreigner, Foghat, Kiss, Van Halen, ZZ Top, Boston, The Who...
Tickets in Dayton Ohio ranged around $5 to $9 bucks and we got real pissed when ticket prices jumped up to over $7 because you could buy the vinyl album for that and listen to them any time you wanted. A lot of kids did just that and skipped the concerts. However, there was a whole bunch of Marijuana floating around that we had to interdict and dispose of so it didn't end up in the wrong lungs... we had our work cut out for us.
Haha - figures that one of the poorest states would have the highest ticket prices. They probably had to pay the bands double just to come to AR.
Quoted from Bublehead:Not always, but most of the time, yes, UD Arena was the other venue for smaller stadium sized shows, but the security at UD was way more harsh... they just pick your ass up and toss you out. Saw some neat shows at Mcguffy's too, but the big names usually went to Cinci and Riverfront Coliseum or Cleveland. I've seen hundreds of live concerts for not a lot of money from back then, and looking back, am I glad I wanted to party at the live concerts because those memories were unforgettable and cheap A.F. compared to shows today.
I feel the same - I got some great value for my $ with Van Halen, Ratt, Aerosmith, Def Lepard, KISS, etc in the 80s.
I’ve just been more selective as an adult - I was so happy to see Van Halen’s last concert here in Tulsa. Roger Waters, a couple of A7Xs, Korn, Disturbed have all been phenomenal without being ridiculously priced.
I haven’t quite figured out the GnR CE situation. Functionally, it’s the same as an LE which is still in production, yet people are getting $8k over MSRP after just 6 months on a CE?
This is fundamentally different than POtC, BBB or Alien as those shot up in price because it was perceived they wouldn’t be made again in any form.
What am I missing about GnR CE? Or is this simply a bad sign of what’s coming for the hobby in regards to CE/LE editions?
Quoted from SantaEatsCheese:One of my buddies has a CE I got to play on. It is really nice. The Radcals are super shiny, the shooter holder is super nice, the extra lock in the apron is cool, the light show with the extra lights is cool, the playfield is super shiney. It is out of my price range and not for me but I can absolutely see why someone would want one over an LE if it was in their budget.
I can see the allure of a CE over an LE for an additional $2k. But are those things worth $10k more? Wouldn’t most people prefer a GnR LE + whole other pinball machine? (Not to mention the GnR LE art/backglass looks better to me)
Quoted from SantaEatsCheese:The pricing is getting to that point. My buddy has been debating selling it and taking the money to buy an LE and another game.
However, while a $20,000 pin might seem like a huge expense to us, it is all relative. In buying and trading pins I have been to some multi-million dollar homes and seen pinball collections easily in the half million dollar range. If $20,000 is only a few days income for you, spending it on a pinball machine is no problem.
I completely understand and agree with your point. It just seems like GnR CE is a strange outlier. We aren’t seeing huge $8k price bumps on RRWOZ, TronLE, Star Trek LE, AC/DC Back/Black LE - all great LEs that were desirable over their standard/premium counterparts.
Quoted from Damonator:I completely understand and agree with your point. It just seems like GnR CE is a strange outlier. We aren’t seeing huge $8k price bumps on RRWOZ, TronLE, Star Trek LE, AC/DC Back/Black LE - all great LEs that were desirable over their standard/premium counterparts.
And I spoke too soon - a Tron LE just sold for $25k on eBay. Disregard!
Quoted from Bublehead:I will say the current "trend" has made me look twice at my happily married Pinbot/Bride of Pinbot couple and rub my chin, wring my hands, and see nothing but greedy dollar signs dance in front of my eyes... But in the end, the poor boy dropped to his chrome-plated knees and begged me to just put him and the Bride in storage until we get the RV garage/casita finished and he swore his old lady would make it worth my while... after years of staring at her mouth in a certain "O" shape, I figured, what have I got to loose? (except maybe a nut or two when her head rolls over before I am halfway through...)
Haha! I’ll probably throw a couple of mine out there for trade towards other stupid expensive pins, not for straight $$$.
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