$199 is literally pocket change. I don't get the aversion from people who were happy to pay $8,000 in the first place.

Does that include ticket dispenser ? I thought everyone got the software free.

I'm a little light; could you spare $100 to help a guy out?

For my home WOZ no way, what's the point?

If I owned an arcade where one could win teddy's and kids toys then yes.

It's a different mode of play with different set of strategies.

So you could play pindemtion mode with out the tickets?? Or the dongle?

The question I have is, can the player choose not to play redemption mode, or is it locked in by the operator?

So $200 to set your game to another mode in home use without tickets dispensing? That sounds like some horrible DLC future for ya right? Then again I guess you're "mis-using" a coin-op option...strange

The $199 includes the ticket dispenser.

Ok thanks for clearing that up...sounded weird.

Funny me for thinking the LE might be the complete package....

I don't think this is going to be a big seller/earner although I think it was worth doing and with use of the screen will have some modest success. As I mentioned on another thread I believe only a purpose-built pindemption machine will have any chance of making a real impact. You are almost entirely taking on fairground games not arcade games.

Pinball machines as we know them don't seriously compete in that environment. Jack at Expo mentioned pindemption earnings around $3500 for WOZ v. $70,000 for the top redemption game in the place over the same period. That's surely too much of a difference as I believe he said that machine cost $22,000 which is clearly value.

Is there any hope for a return of the player at each end (with screens above in the middle ) game ?

I was at the Jersey Jack round table at expo and I heard $199 special price for home buyers, no ticket dispenser. It awards virtual tickets. Rules are also simplified, good for new players or fun to just mix it up.

No.

LTG : )

Wasn't WOZ promoted as having no software differences between versions? Is the difference that the game does have it, you just have to pay to unlock it?

The code is there, the dongle unlocks it.

Seems a slippery slope for buyers though. You're told the game will play the same across all models but later told that to access new play modes you have to pay to unlock them even though the code exist in the game.

$199 isn't pocket change, but it isn't a huge expense either. And I see it as a reasonable cost of this completely new way of using the games hardware. This isn't something like only an LE has Rescue Multiball. This is software to run a redemption game. And really, how many people would even want to run it? You know you would try it once, and never run it again in your house.

Seems like a waste of time. I can't see how it would make game play anymore interesting.

I think most owners would at least like to try it. As others have said the idea of a timed game could be great as way for kids to play or
even a different way to run a tournament. I want access to it, just don't like the idea of shelling out money for a key to something already in the code.

Technically, it is the same across all versions (as I understand it). The code is in all 3 versions of the machine (Std, LE, RR), but all 3 require the dongle to use this feature, so it is still a true statement to say that there are no software differences between versions.

Yep, scary road for the industry to steer down IMO.

I don't think I am really interested in it but I would probably try it if available. Might be fun to play a timed game under some circumstances. Might work when playing with friends that are not that good. Puts you on a little more even ground.

But pay $199 for it? Not a chance in hell. I simply do not understand the reason for that on JJP's part. Isn't the whole idea of Pindemption a way for JJP to sell more machines? To get machines back into places that have abandoned pinball for more profitable video type games? So why am I helping to pay for that on top of the over 8K already paid to JJP.

What's the difference if they put out code version 6.0 the ultimate code for an even better experience but we have to add an additional dongle for $199 to unlock it. How would that go over? Not to well I bet. We didn't buy software where you expect to pay for new versions and some upgrades now and then. We bought a pinball machine that runs on software.

By the way I love the software and baring 1 issue for me 5.05 is awesome.

I'd like to see a 30 day trial period so I can try it and see if it's worth spending $199 to me to have it at home.

Curious - since I don't have a WOZ or Hobbit or any other JJP game..

What's the 'kit' come with? JUST the dongle? Or a ticket dispenser, or some other piece of hardware?

I thought Jack said the Ticket Dispenser was ANOTHER $100 on top of the $199 for the software upgrade ??

Yes it is. Or more expensive kits with the dongle and ticket dispenser.

Jack knows a lot of collectors would like to try it. From what I heard if you have kids, it's a lot of fun. That is why JJP made the dongle available separately and then lowered the price too.

LTG : )

I would be REALLY surprised if the original $199 includes the ticket dispenser..!

IIRC from the seminar at Expo the $199 price is for a limited time only. Then it goes to the regular price of $299 or $399.

Does anyone else think this is a slippery slope? DLC for pinball machines?

How far off is 'Super duper Wizard mode code', yours for a low price of $39.99. Boost your light show and stand out from the rest, only $19.99! Upgrade your dongle today!

Just don't pile on Stern after JJP once again gives them ideas of how to pry more money from people.

Completely different from "Super Duper Wizard Mode". I think the whole ePlate thing made them understand that they wouldn't be able to do that because the market would reject buying a machine and not getting the full software experience of the game.

I'm baffled why this is the prevailing thought though. I think all this does is make Jack realize that putting it into the software to keep his costs lower are not viable. So I'm sure any "Pindemption" going forward will just be much more expensive because they have to maintain a different code base for any redemption systems.

And if anyone really needs timed modes in their WOZ, buy some beer and some chips, and I'll show up at your house with a stopwatch and yank the plug out of your WOZ after 60 seconds. After a few beers there is a slight margin of error on the timings... maybe wait until you light "Melt the witch" before I yank it. But by all means, grab your pitchforks.

I think it's the prevailing thought because I assume a lot of us have been through it with video games. Once the companies realized they could release a game, then release new things (levels, modes, etc.) down the road to keep the customers giving them money, it became the norm.

I'm not saying it's a bad thing per say, lots of good content has come out in the form of DLC's, and it does provide an extra revenue stream.

I can just imagine the pitch forks coming out when Stern releases a licensed title with fake voices, then releases a dongle that enables the real actors voices for $299 (with custom call outs!). Oh crap, I just planted the seed.

That's not what I heard at the seminar, and if true, then there's no point in spending $199 for "virtual" tickets.

I just want to say "Dongle"

Which seminar ? If Expo, I was there, I never heard that. The recording of the fireside chat is up on Pinball News, if you care to listen to it.

Is true.

LTG : )

I think it's reasonable to charge for something completely new. You didn't buy this game with ticket style play in mind. You're paying for an entirely different and new functionality.

Personally I can't see it taking off and the idea will quietly die, but I could be wrong! I know little to nothing about the ticket redemption world.

A more compelling price model would have been free with the ticket dispensing functionality disabled, the paid dongle unlocks that.

Want to be able to access Pindemption™ Software on your Wizard of Oz Pinball Machine? Now available for purchase: Pindemption™ Dongles - $199! Purchasing this Dongle allows you to switch back and forth freely between Pindemption™ and Standard Gameplay.

Questions or to place an order please call 732-364-9900 ext 203. Or you can purchase online - https://store.jerseyjackpinball.com/index.php?route=product%2Fproduct&path=62&product_id=74

The Tickets Topper is also available for Sale. Price includes Green LED Strip as well as shipping the Continental US - https://store.jerseyjackpinball.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=62&product_id=75

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Stern games since at least TRON already have the ticket software installed when you buy the game.

But the ticket dispenser cost $350.

In fairness, the Stern ticket dispenser comes with the topper included.

So the JJP software ($200), plus the ticket dispenser ($100) plus the topper ($89) comes out to about the same price. ($389)

BUT once the JJP software goes "off sale" and the price goes back up to $400, then the total package will be much more than Stern @ $589....

I didn't know Stern had ticket software built in already. Can I play my LOTR in a timed or redemption mode without the ticket dispenser installed?

Where have you seen it for $100 ?

I'm curious because a ticket spitter with 3 banks would surly cost more.

LTG : )

A lot of games from the DMD era on have ticket capability in their software.

Dispense ticket instead of winning a game type stuff though.

Pindemption has the time mode and compressed rules.

LTG : )

It started around TRON, so LOTR is too old.

Sorry.

That's what I believe Jack told me.

If it's much more than $100, it's going to really screw up my Stern math comparison, lol.

TSPP has the capability as I used to win 250 point jumbo tickets often when I took my kids to Chuck E. Cheese years ago. The dispenser was in the coin door where a bill validator could be installed.

I'm not paying $199 for pindemption for I might pay that to finally melt the witch. I really suck at this game.

I'd be curious to see how it was mounted - I wasn't aware of any adapter plate to convert a DBA hole for a ticket. (Though, honestly, I really expected there to be one for the longest time.. beats having to bolt on a whole 'nother small metal cabinet to the underside of the pin..!)