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(Topic ID: 142479)

Pinbot Flasher issue


By blowback1976

4 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 20 posts
  • 6 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 years ago by blowback1976
  • Topic is favorited by 4 Pinsiders

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#1 4 years ago

I have an odd issue with Pinbot flashers. The sun, the pop lights, and the two flashers on the left by the ramp are always on, but will pulse when they are suppose to flash. I've already replaced all the snubber boards and flash lamp baords. Thought it might be a transistor, but if they pulse when they're suppose to, I'm guessing I have a bigger issue.

#2 4 years ago

Yes, you do.
The power is finding ground somehow through the flashers.
Do the coils work properly in test?
Do you hear the A/C select relay click during its test!
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
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#3 4 years ago

Will go through the tests tomorrow and see what happens.

#4 4 years ago

Are these flashers led?

#5 4 years ago

Check the resistor banks for proper sizes, my sun insert had wrong resistor on one set of bulbs.

#6 4 years ago
Quoted from Stretch7:

Are these flashers led?

Yes they're LED, but the incandescent's were doing the same thing before they were changed out.

Quoted from Out-West:

Check the resistor banks for proper sizes, my sun insert had wrong resistor on one set of bulbs.

I'm guessing that's the diode board by the chest plate? I'll check when I do my solenoid tests.

#7 4 years ago

So, there's obviously a bigger issue than I thought. Going through the solenoid tests, the lights were on during several of them:

Lights on at Knocker
Lights on at F.L Top F.L. 2
Lights on at Backglass L. Flash
Lights on at Backglass R. Flash
Lights on at Top F.L. 1
Lights on at Energy Flash
Lights on at Left Flash L.
Lights on at Sun Flash L.
Lights on at A/C Select

That seems like a lot that are energized at the same time. Would this be a grounding issue? Anything specific I should be checking under the playfield?

#8 4 years ago
Quoted from blowback1976:

The sun, the pop lights, and the two flashers on the left by the ramp are always on

Quoted from blowback1976:

Yes they're LED, but the incandescent's were doing the same thing before they were changed out.

This will happen if you have not removed the warming resistors from the flash circuit.

But...with flasher LEDs you still may need to make an additional mod:

The warming resistors pass a little current through the circuit
all the time. But LEDs only take a little current to get running so they
appear on all the time. By removing them, you are killing the warming
circuit as desired.

However, you still need a little resistance in the circuit for the circuit
to work. The LED bulb alone is too high of a resistance to cause the
circuit to work... so you have to put the 100ohm or 1k ohm across the LED
terminal to make the circuit work complete."

#9 4 years ago

So with incandescent flashers in, it is still doing the same thing, and failing during the same tests. Are the warming resistors the ones on the Flash Lamp boards?

#10 4 years ago
Quoted from blowback1976:

So with incandescent flashers in, it is still doing the same thing, and failing during the same tests. Are the warming resistors the ones on the Flash Lamp boards?

Hmmm. OK appears not because of the LED flashers then.

I just noticed a possible clue.

You said the flashers are coming on with the A/C relay selected. You also said you replaced the snubber boards and flash lamp boards. What I have noticed in your last post is you say the lights are coming on when the coil test enables the A/C relay. Nothing visual should happen here, all that should happen is that you hear a click of the A/C relay in the cabinet.

When the relay clicks, It puts power on "C" for the flashers. In test mode, the flashers should not be coming on, because the transistors should be off. In coil test, too...when those coil tests are run, the A/C should be on the "A" side for the coil only when the solenoids are fired. Somehow, the flashers are also simultaneously getting power.

I'd be taking a closer look at the A/C relay board. (miswired? shorted?)

145484.jpg

#11 4 years ago
Quoted from wayout440:

I'd be taking a closer look at the A/C relay board. (miswired? shorted?)

I'll check that tomorrow, and see what I find. I hope its not the board, I replaced it as I was having this issue with the original board.

#12 4 years ago

So just checked it out. Wiring is correct, but appears the Drive transistor may be the issue. Thought I had already ruled it out, as being good. Will replace it and see what happens.

#13 4 years ago

Just noticed this, but how many of the snubber boards are suppose to have G and power jumpered? In one of my previous posts, I noticed the jumper was on solenoid 12, and this one is solenoid 14. I think I'm missing pages in my manual as I don't see the snubbers listed, or the drawings for them. This could also be part of my issue.

#14 4 years ago
Quoted from blowback1976:

Just noticed this, but how many of the snubber boards are suppose to have G and power jumpered? In one of my previous posts, I noticed the jumper was on solenoid 12, and this one is solenoid 14. I think I'm missing pages in my manual as I don't see the snubbers listed, or the drawings for them. This could also be part of my issue.

Only the A/C relay board. It is wired this way as a power selector. If you look at the diagram above in the thread, the tab labeled ground is connected to the common points on the relay terminals. This way when Q7 goes low and makes conduction through the relay coil, it routes power through the other set of contacts.

The snubber boards are typically wired this way, allowing a drive transistor to control a higher power coil. In this case, the ground labeled tab is actually connected to ground. They could have made a second silkscreen for when the board is used as an A/C relay configuration, but it wasn't that important.

145406.jpg

#15 4 years ago

Alright, another update. So replaced Q33 and everything works properly with incandescent bulbs. Put LEDs back in, and they stay on. Instead of Fighting and modify the flasher boards, I'm going to keep the incandescents's in.

Thanks for the help.

#16 4 years ago
Quoted from blowback1976:

Alright, another update. So replaced Q33 and everything works properly with incandescent bulbs. Put LEDs back in, and they stay on. Instead of Fighting and modify the flasher boards, I'm going to keep the incandescents's in.
Thanks for the help.

just remove the ground wires and the led's will work perfectly

#17 4 years ago
Quoted from bobbyt:

just remove the ground wires and the led's will work perfectly

Would that be from the snubber or the flasher board? I would prefer the LED's for sure.

#18 4 years ago
Quoted from blowback1976:

Would that be from the snubber or the flasher board? I would prefer the LED's for sure.

The ground side of the 330 ohm resistor on the flasher boards.

#19 4 years ago
Quoted from wayout440:

The ground side of the 330 ohm resistor on the flasher boards.

That is exactly what i did, I clipped all the ground wires from all the flasher boards and all the led's work properly now, I left the wires there and shrink wrapped the ends just in case i ever want to go back to original bulbs or when i sell it

#20 4 years ago
Quoted from bobbyt:

That is exactly what i did, I clipped all the ground wires from all the flasher boards and all the led's work properly now, I left the wires there and shrink wrapped the ends just in case i ever want to go back to original bulbs or when i sell it

Thanks guys. She's all LED's now.

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