(Topic ID: 70838)
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Pinbot
Williams, 1986
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Berea, OH
Quoted from GListOverflow:Just kidding. Yay Pinbot! Mine only ever gives me trouble in the very far back where it is impossible to get to anything without pulling the whole playfield. Right now I have to decide whether to find a rivet kit to put a new flap on my (black Jackbot) vortex ramp, or buy a new red one from Planetary.
Red vortex looks better IMO. If you have a functional black that is o.k. too. Another option might be to find a used red one and repair that I suppose.
Quoted from skywalker:No turning back now, really didn't buy this pin to do major work started the strip down, will do more tmo,
ordered some cans of freeze, i might use this mylar sheet & then trim it off http://mrpinballa2.cart.net.au/details/2901055.htmlno turning back.jpg 170 KB
Well it looks like the poor ol' pinny needs a good bath, so you might as well. Think of the smile on your face when you get it all shiny in the end 
Quoted from skywalker:have searched some threads on removing mylar on pinbots, couple of guys have removed old mylar & then polished/wax PF, no CC'ing or replacing mylar, i know the pin will have limited use if i go with not replacing the mylar, seems to be the quickest/cheapest solution, short term ok long term who knows
Yep - I remove most mylar (I usually keep the mylar rings around pops) and then polish/wax PF. Maybe I don't play mine as much as others, I feel that if I keep it clean it is going to take a long time to wear it out. I just don't like mylar, and I don't have the ambition to go through the work of a CC.
Quoted from alb0711:Wondering if anybody has ever upgraded Pinbot's speakers and if it made a real difference?
Just replacing the speakers not much. Now if you break out the audio to an amp and speakers and/or sub that would be a different story. The music is really good in PB and I've come to appreciate it more.
1 week later
Quoted from ShinyBallz:One question I have for my fellow and more seasoned Pinbot-ers… One minor issue I have with the machine is occasionally when I get a solid shot up the left ramp, the ball will hop up when it hits the first rollover switch, hitting the glass (*kringe*) and will hop right off the ramp. I thought that maybe the switch was sticking but on pressing it with my finger it seems to move effortlessly – no resistance whatsoever. The ramp itself does not appear to have any flaws either. Have any of you experienced this on your machines? I kringe every time this happens.
As you said...happens to me occasionally. It doesn't bother me. Yesterday I had the Yagov kicker on F-14 shoot the ball hard at the flipper, and it ricocheted off the flipper and glass, and landed all the way over into the shooter lane of all places.
Perhaps your game is too flat/not steep enough? As you say, it's subjective and without much comparison being your first pin, you're not used to snappy new flippers. Mine are pretty old and still launch off the ramp when I hit it just right, so I wouldn't count on a break in making the flippers significantly weak in the near term.
Perhaps try adjusting the EOS so it opens up sooner, and this may take a little power off for you?
Quoted from ShinyBallz:I can replicate the issue by hand rolling the ball quickly over the ramp. But I have to roll the ball pretty hard to cause it.
Me thinks this is probably the biggest clue. This switch too stiff or not adjusted? The ball should effortlessly push this switch down below the plane of the ramp. If any of it stays up or remains above the ramp surface the ball would probably launch off it.
3 months later
Quoted from rottenrobert1313:I'm in the club. I picked mine up a few days ago from a fellow pinsider. In great shape, also has factory mylar.
NICE! I see you have Elektra, that is a good game as well. The funny thing is, if I remember correctly my funds from the sale of my Elektra went toward buying my Pinbot!
2 weeks later
Quoted from BadBrad97:II got the trim around the speaker panel chrome plated along with the metal trim at the bottom of the backglass. That trim has never looked that good.
This was such a great idea. I cheated and used some of my leftover 3M 1/2" self adhesive automotive trim to do mine. Almost looks as good I think.
Quoted from Choggard:Yeah I want to see the mods for this one..
Pinbot doesn't really need mods. But I did add LED lighted flipper buttons...color matched to the left and right of the playfield.
pinbotleft.JPG
pinbotright.JPGQuoted from rottenrobert1313:I was thinking about doing the same with mine. Looks sweet. I did get my new displays put in. Still waiting on my LED's from cointaker. I just got my highest score so far. Was a great game for me.
I have to ask, I've them before...where did you get the 1/2 and 1/2 display? Is that an XPin? Do you know if they are still available?
I did get my replacement glass for the the backglass. Now my PinBot is no longer nekkid!
Quoted from rottenrobert1313:Yes they're still available. I got mine here:
http://lockwhenlit.com/displays.htm:
Takes about 15 min to install.
Glad you got your replacement glass. Now let's see some more pictures of your machine.
Very nice. Thanks. Mine's a "players condition" machine, so to speak - nothing special. I hope to someday have the time for a complete teardown and shop, but I would not be able to play my Pinbot for so long! I might add playfield LEDs, but it is just not on my priority list. It cost me $900 fully working and and 8 hour round trip. It plays fantastic and it is here to stay.
Quoted from phalcon_2600:Instead of spending big money on new displays couldn't you just buy a blue and a red theater lighting gel like the ones in the link and cut to size and put over your displays to change the color. I put a red gel on the dmd on my T2 pin and it looks good.
ebay.com link » American Dj Cgs 8a 8x8 Gel Sheet Packet A
Yes, the new displays are kind of big money - as in I have a lot of other things I would rather spend that kind of coin on. Your idea is great! Thank you. I just ordered those to try 'em out. I'll post my findings when I get them.
Quoted from phalcon_2600:Instead of spending big money on new displays couldn't you just buy a blue and a red theater lighting gel like the ones in the link and cut to size and put over your displays to change the color. I put a red gel on the dmd on my T2 pin and it looks good.
ebay.com link » American Dj Cgs 8a 8x8 Gel Sheet Packet A
Just a warning for anyone using these gels:
Unfortunately, I bought those exact ones on the link and tried them out this evening and they did not accomplish what I was looking for. The red looked ok, with just a small loss of intensity...but the blue was NOT good at all. The blue almost blocks out the displays entirely. I mean bad and unreadable. Oh well, at least it was an inexpensive experiment.
Quoted from BadBrad97:It's a science thing. The problem is that the gels "block" out the colors from bulb that do not exist in the gel. So a red gel blocks out everything from the orange display except red. The blue gels block out everything from the orange light except blue (and blue doesn't really exist in orange).
I get that, it was an experiment. I have seen these displays emit blue hazes around the segments once, so I could not be certain how much blue or white spectrum is being emitted, plus the blue gel looks extremely dark - possibly a thinner, lighter blue gel would give some kind of better results. I'm just going to be happy with the way it is.
2 weeks later
Quoted from PinsideMike:*Bump bump* Anyone willing to help me out with one last favor? When I rewired my playfield, I missed a wire that powers up the left side of the playfield GI lights. I don't need this wire traced back into the head just where I put a jumper on to feed the left side.
(If this doesn't make sense I can post a pic of the right side and what I missed but finally found that made everything work)
Trying to understand, you've lost one GI branch circuit it would seem from what you are saying. Bear with me, I might be totally off base with this.
Looking at the GI schematic, there are 5 distinct branches of lamps fed from 4 separately fused GI power branch circuits. I looked under my Pinbot through the coin door, and see the slingshot area GI bulbs are fed with a yellow wire. Please look at your dead sockets to confirm that it is the yellow branch that is out and only that branch (all the GI bulbs in question are fed by a yellow wire).
If this is not true at all, ignore my next paragraph, and let us know which colors are out.
Then look for the 2 connectors: a 2 pin connector 7P6/7J6. and a 4 pin connector 8P5/8J5. Each should have a yellow and a wht/yellow wire pair. Now you would need to take a DMM/voltmeter and measure for GI voltage across the yellow and wht/yellow pairs. If neither connector has voltage, you have a break from the backbox connector 3P8 connector pin 2. So that would need to be addressed. If you have voltage on one of the 2 connectors, turn off power and measure continuity (ohms) between the yellow wire on each connector and then on the wht/yellow wire. Whichever color is open is the one that needs to be jumpered between the two connectors.
Quoted from 5280wzrd:Does anyone know of a good way to use LEDs under the eye sockets. Don't think they will hold up to the 28volts. Would it be as simple as a resistor in series with the led? The 28 volt lights just get so hot.
They really shouldn't be getting super hot, if they are the correct #1251 bulbs and are not locked on. Did you make sure that there are not #89 bulbs in there by mistake?
There are LEDs that will operate on 28V:
http://www.martekled.com/-strse-214/Indicator-Annunciator--Signal/Detail.bok
You will also need to remove the warming resistor from the flash lamp boards when using LEDs.
There is also a whole thread here, with suggestions for modifying to use with other standard 12V LEDs:
http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/has-anyone-replaced-the-1251-bulbs-on-a-pinbot
3 months later
1 month later
Quoted from Dewey68:I did a quick search on this in the thread but didn't see anything on this issue, apologies if it's been covered before.
When my visor opens to lock balls, the top of the switches still sticks up maybe 1/8" to 1/16", not much, just enough to make a shot hop and not lock. After that shot, or if you the bumpers are firing a lot the switches will continue down until flush.
Is this adjusted with the switches for the visor going up and down?
There is an adjustment, you want it flush - if it's too high up the ball hops, if it is too far down and is a groove, a slow traveling ball can get stuck on it. Two screws, pic in this thread.
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/pinbot-visor-sticks-flaky-lamp-advice#post-466839
Quoted from Zag:Is there a simple way of stopping the 'game over' lights from flashing..? (I know I could just take
the lights out... )
Thanks
Not sure why you would want to do this 
But yes, I think taking the bulbs out is your best option there.
Quoted from jjoravec:Can someone send me some up close pictures of the backbox wiring what connectors go where? I got my pinbot out of storage and everything was unplug in the backbox. I want to make sure to get everything plugged in correctly. I especially need pictures of the connectors around the sound card and upper left corner of the main MPU.
Thanks
Joe
Here's a link to another google image of the backbox that you can zoom in on:
https://img-f.pinside.com/201408/1857167/278339.jpg
If you get stuck and need something more specific, don't hesitate to ask.
There is also an interboards signal diagram on page 58 0f the manual that may be helpful. One cable is a 3 wire jumper from J1 sound board over to the MPU IJ16 ("Volume Control"). The J2 connection on the sound board runs to your cabinet volume control. MPU IJ15 is no connection.
IMG_20141023_041429260.jpg 1 week later
Quoted from sethbenjamin:How many of you on this forum have a plunger/vortex shot that works consistently? I have tried endlessly to adjust and tweak the plunger position, have gone as far as purchasing a new plunger unit outright - no luck. It seems as though the amount of looseness inherent in the plunger itself is enough to account for the plunger tip striking the ball off center enough give it backspin or to send it off course enough for it to hit the post to the left of the ramp entrance. In a given game, one plunge might send it shooting straight to the top of the vortex, just like every full pull on the plunger should do ideally. Next plunge might hit the post and not enter the ramp at all. This says to me that it isn't a problem with the positioning of the plunger itself - believe me, I've repositioned that thing 8 ways to Sunday, and while it's definitely possible to have it in the wrong spot altogether, I've yet to find a "sweet spot", and at this point doubt that one exists.
Pretty sure my game isn't simply cursed, so...what gives? Any insight? I played a Jackbot at White Rose a couple years ago, and it didn't seem to have any problem with the skill shot. I Can't Imagine Why Not. The play field is identical. Any ideas?
There's quite a few threads on the subject, and what works for some doesn't necessarily work for others. There's just so many variables. Even the table leveling and angle can have a huge effect on the ball travel. The groove in the launch area. The condition of the gate as it exits the launch, the angle adjustment and condition of the shooter rod, the type of rubber shooter tip, the spring, the vortex positioning, there could be a slight dip or warp in the playfield center, etc...etc...
I've done everything you have, including purchase a whole new plunger assembly. My wife though I was crazy the several days I spent hours fiddling with it. Mine is improved a lot, but still not perfect.
Quoted from RCA1:Haven't seen the plunger being "loose" like this. Travel should be pretty consistent. Is your shooter sleeve worn or damaged?
There will still be some small play in the plunger. I had tried new shooter sleeves, and then went as far as replacing the entire assembly with new (housing, shooter rod and sleeve). Some small amount of play is there.
Quoted from erak:If you are going to LEd the flashers. Cut all the grounds off the transistor board.
Just keep the power and driver wires connected.
The only ones you really need to cut are the topper. Backbox finger flashers. And upper left blue ramp flasher and I think the two top flashers in the visor.
Those Led flashers will be locked on if you dont remove the grounds from the boards.
When you do remove or cut the wires they will work perfectly.
The warming transistors will no longer be used. So no need to replace.
I cut my grounds off and put heat shrink over the ends so nothing can get shorted.
Not transistors. RESISTORS.
Quoted from Darcy:Marco lists 4 different springs.
Since you mentioned Marco: yes they have 4 different shooter springs, but if you do a search on Pinbot compatable parts ("pinbot spring") only the blue shooter spring shows up in the search results.
1 week later
Quoted from erak:I already did something similar to my Pinbot. I added a lamp socket under the ramp. And installed a superbright blue Led. That is tied to the energy value insert.
So when the energy value lights when the ramp lifts the whole thing lights up blue.
And added another socket with a ultra bright red that is tied into the solar value insert lamp.
So the clear ramp glows red.
I also added a 3 blue led strip on the left side of the visor over the blue ramp. It brightens up the back of the playfied a bit more and makes the ramp glow.
It looks great and is so easy to do.
Easy mods with a high impact NICE! 
2 weeks later
Quoted from jibmums:Do any of you guys have a list of the correct fuses for Pinbot? I've gone thru the manual, the info printed on the circuit boards, the stickers in the backbox, and the fuses themselves, and I have a few discrepancies/questions.
1. Power board F3 - Manual says 8A 32V and sticker in backbox just says 8A, nothing mentioned about slow-blow; this is definitely a fast-blow fuse, right?
2. Power board F4 - Manual says 2.5A 250V. Sticker in backbox says 2.5A slow-blow. I'm assuming an SB is correct, that's what's in there now, but would prefer to make certain.
3. Power board F5/F6 - Manual says 7A 250V slow-blow on one page, just 7A on another. Sticker in backbox just says 7A. Machine currently has SB's which I believe are original. Which is correct?
4. Flipper power board F2 - Manual says 5A SB. Label says 5ASB 50V. Current fuse is 5A 250V SB. I'm thinking the "50V" is just a typo as I can't find reference to a 50V 1.25" fuse anywhere, so the 250V must be correct?
5. There's a bank of 4 fuses mounted to the backbox below the power supply board. I see no mention of them in the manual, and can't fit my fuse puller behind to pull them out. Just wondering what these are for and what the rating is, so I can order a few extras just in case.
1. Yes, should be standard blow (fast)
2. SB is correct, aslo confirmed by schematic for the D-8345-549 power supply board
3. both 7A fuses are SB - confirmed by both the parts list for the D-8345-549 power supply board and by the schematics.
4. Not a typo, but a 250V rated fuse is an acceptable substitution. 50V is a minimum requirement. You would not want to substitute the other way, such as using a 50V fuse in a circuit that can have greater than 50V open circuit voltage, or the fuse could arc.
5. These 4 are all 5A SB for the general illumination branches, see the power wiring schematic on page 63 power wiring diagram.
Also, if not present you should add a fuse holder at the input side of the backbox cabinet mounted bridges on early system 11 games with an 8A fuse installed to prevent the possibility of damage or fire if a bridge fails.
Quoted from jibmums:Thanks Wayout, much appreciated.
Oddly, in making the same list for my Earthshaker fuses, the 8A 32V is spec'd in the manual for slo-blo, I wondered why they changed the specs.
No problem. Like I said earlier, if there is found to be occasions of brief surge current that would blow a standard fuse it is sometimes changed by designers to be a slow blow version.
Quoted from jibmums:I'm guessing you've made this addition to your machines, would you have a good photo so I can see exactly what & where it should be? IIRC there are two bridges, does each get a fuse?
Yes I have made the mod on several machines. I'm not at home now, but here is a good descriptive link with photos. http://creditdotpinball.com/2014/04/21/mods-fireproofing-pinbot-and-other-early-system-11-games/
Quoted from sethbenjamin:Has anybody here taken on a play field restoration on Pinbot? I got mine from a guy who had pronounced it "too far gone", which just seems so sad. The game plays just great, I've got the pops and flippers rebuilt, LEDs throughout, and broken plastics (such as you see in the kick out hole photo here) replaced. I've got the visor sticker and have kept it waxed, so it plays fast and mean. Lately I've been wondering if it would be at all worth the effort to repaint the play field, but maybe that's madness on a PF that is this detailed?
Personally, I think you can save it - as long as you keep your expectations reasonable. Obviously it will never be a perfect playfield, but you can improve it. It just won't be easy or fast. I noticed on the last pic you have severe planking on the left, but virtually no wear on the colored matrix squares. My playfield didn't have the planking but the squares were wiped out to the wood.
My advice is to do some research and then decide if you want to do it or not. There's some great restoration threads here on Pinside and elsewhere
http://www.pinrepair.com/restore/2001pf.htm
Quoted from jazzfusionb0rg:Hi guys - I just purchased Pinbot #8072 (imported to Aus from LA where it was on location). The misses & I are having a blast going head to head every night, but the 'robot' voice scares my 4 y.o boy haha...
Everything words fine, with mylar having protected the playfield from serious wear. Several plastics are cracked (RH slingshot, 20k tip of vortex spiral, crack in solar upper LH blue ramp) & the solar ramp hinge is partially held together by electrical tape. I have to decide if it's worth forking out for a new plastics set + clear washers etc.
As a first time pin owner:
# What playfield polisher / plastics cleaner do you gurus recommend for these older mylar playfields? Novus 1/2?
# This has new rubbers, but should I consider purchasing a spare kit? What about a fuse kit?
(Everything I purchase will be via ebay or overseas online stores, where shipping to Aus is a killer).
Cheers & thanks,
Alan
Congrats and welcome to the club, Alan.
Full plastic sets usually do not include all the plastics (vortex, ramps, helmet "shield" for example) Those items are found separately, when you can find them at all. The vortex is repairable though. I've done mine. Steve Channel has an excellent description of this here: http://www.stevechannel.com/pinbot.htm
Novus is fine to get a new aquired game in shape. You won't be using it all the time, just for initial cleaning and not so often heavy soiling later, such as periodical cleaning of rubbers. Follow it up with hand paste wax, such as Blitz wax. A spare set of rubbers is nice to have but not required. It should be a long time before you'll need to replace the new ones on there now.
Buy extra fuses from your favorite electronics distributor. Usually cheaper than buying kits, but probably not by much.
1 week later
Quoted from sethbenjamin:I'd be interested to see about the plastic repair. So far my ramp is in one piece, but it *is* 28 years old!
The "original" vortex repair doc is here at Steve Channels site.
http://www.stevechannel.com/pinbot.htm
I used aluminum ventilation stock for mine, cut with a pair of tin snips to fit the shape of the broken piece. I coated it with epoxy putty formed to the shape and then when dry used a dremel tool to grind it to the original shape, painted it, then added the decal. I'm pretty sure this repair will never break.
The repaired vortex result is the first pic of this thread.
Quoted from Zonda716:Finally got it home yesterday...
Now i'm busy trying to fix an issue with left flipper that has weakened
You just got it home. So have you done any inspection before starting to play? There is some information you can check at the link below for specific causes of weak flippers (dirty, out of adjustment EOS or cabinet switches for example). Most often, the flippers need a complete rebuild on a newly aquired used game.
He's a bit of advice. The game should be gone through thoroughly. Not just the flippers. Little maintenance items overlooked can bite you later. Important checks such as "Are all the fuses the correct value?"
See section "Before Turning the Game On":
http://techniek.flipperwinkel.nl/wms11/index1.html
1 week later
Quoted from Stretch7:Hey all
I just recently replaced bulbs with LED kit from cointaker and i have a issue with some flashers.
The Above plastic flashers on left side,one in far right corner and all the topper ones stay on all the time.
They will still flash when programmed to but they will remain on solid while power is on.
Has anyone else had this issue?
Did you remove the warming resistors?
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/removing-warming-resistors
2 weeks later
Quoted from Sparky:Picked up a Pinbot yesterday! Cabinet, playfield, plastics all look great! Broken Vortex ramp, and some issues I'll need to work through, but I'm looking forward to cleaning it up and making it look nice!
I read through all the posts today in this thread, so I'm all caught up
Welcome,
here's that link again to repairing the vortex if you need it:
http://www.stevechannel.com/pinbot.htm
Wayout
Quoted from PinballBeerGuy:I recently found a pristine Pin-Bot with owner's manual and even a nice box.
All I need now is the matching pin I remember reading a review of this game in Nintendo Power magazine back in 1990, thinking that this was the coolest pinball machine ever made. What would have been even more cool was if this were an actual pinball machine, but my 8 year old self didn't think a machine this complex was possible. Little did I know that almost 25 years later I would discover that it was indeed based off of an actual machine. It is currently at the top of my shortlist for my first machine.
0icuxbLl.jpg 45 KB
Who let these kids on Pinside? 
Quoted from Sparky:Wow, I didn't realize that plastic wrapped all the way behind the saucer hole and along the left of that lane. I probably won't have much luck finding a used one
You mean this one?
1542-2141-thickbox.jpgQuoted from Sparky:Yep! I circled where mine is broken.
Mine was broken at the long point. For a temporary fix I printed the art for the missing part and glued it under a piece of thin clear plastic cut to shape. Casual observers don't even notice.
10177511_10202361447455196_1233428336675570848_n.jpgQuoted from pacman11:Anyone know what chip would cause this? It should say number two. Segment F is messed up according to the manual but I can't figure out what chip would cause this.
You've already swapped this display ribbon cable with a known working one, correct? and when you switch this display with another the problem remains on player on, correct?
Quoted from pacman11:Yes it's not the ribbon cable I already checked that. It seems to happen on almost all of the displays. When the number 2 comes up it looks like a backwards 9 on all displays. Thanks!
In test mode it only happens on display one, but during game play it happens on all of them.
Possibly a short somewhere either in a component or external causing F segment to become lit - perhaps U10, U11, U15-U18 failure on the display board. The weirdness though is the difference between gameplay and test mode, which has me thinking possible PIA problem on the MPU board. Sorry I can't really give you a better answer at the moment.
2 weeks later
Quoted from erak:Hi, hoping someone can help me with a tech issue.
When you press the sound test button on the mpu what is the tone/tones on a working pinbot?
I get what sounds like a scratch and explosion.
That would be SW1, sounds like it is working correctly since your are getting two tones.
"CPU Sound Diagnostic Switch SW1.
On the left side of the CPU board there are two switches. The top switch SW1 is the sound diagnostic switch. If you press this button, you should get two test sounds. This shows that the CVSD (Continuously Variable Slope Delta) modulator, which produces the game's voices, and the DAC (Digital to Analog Converter) sound circuits are working"
Quoted from erak:H
The speech stops working after the machine has been on for about 2 hours.
If i switch it off and back on it works again for about another 2 hours.
Its driving me crazy sourcing this intermittent problem out.
Any help would be appreciated.
No Sound when CPU switch SW1 is Pressed (but sound heard during diagnostic tests).
Check the sound select inputs (U9 pins 2-9) with a logic probe to see if they pulse during Sound Test 01. Also check the -12 volt supply voltage on the CPU board. If this voltage is low (or AC ripple seems high), perform the following checks (you can check for ripple using your meter set to AC volts; more than .75 AC volts is probably too much AC ripple).
Check the gray and gray/green transformer secondary wires for 19.4 volts AC.
Check the CPU board filter capacitor C26 for -12 volts DC.
Check the CPU board filter capacitor C26 for AC ripple (over .75 volts AC).
Note: you may have to check these *when it fails* as they might appear to be working up until that time.
Quoted from erak:One thing I found today when checking the transformer is I only have 10.5 volts on the grey/green lead.
But all other test points on the game test good?
I think you checked the wrong points. Across the transformer secondary gray to gray/green will give you the correct measurement. It sounds like you measured from ground, or center tap - which is giving you half of the measurement you should be seeing.
trans.jpg 1 week later
Quoted from zippydapinhead:Hmm, the ones I got from him have not burned out yet, since they are flashers they are not on a whole lot. Having them in a spot where they were constantly on I can see them going out quickly.
If I was to go that route with LED flashers, I would obtain the current specs for the LEDs chosen and make certain that the supplied current was below the maximum rating by calculating the proper dropping resistor. In theory substituting LEDs for the standard bulbs it should last thousands of hours longer than incandescent, which is one of the prime reasons for changing to them. If you are running them beyond the rated spec, yes - you take the chance of burning it out prematurely. If that's what is going on - then why bother changing to LEDs?
Quoted from sethbenjamin:A friend who knows more about electricity than I do suggested simply daisy chaining a second lamp socket to each (even though you might just have it hanging out under the playfield), so as to pull 24V via 2 12V bulbs?
You could do that too - or perhaps even get more creative by finding some other place on the game for the second socket, maybe even in the light bar up top?
Quoted from sethbenjamin:No blacklight! But I would try them out if they were going to be brighter. Ideally I would like to wire up a 12V blacklight strip under the visor, haven't found a 24V version that doesn't involve some specific marine application or some such thing. I find the visor open moment kind of anticlimactic. This is my obsession du jour.
You could always add a separate dedicated supply for your auxillary lighting, but it would be on all the time (like general illumination) or you might be able to use a 24VDC automotive type relay and turn on whatever...lights, even motors.
1 week later
Quoted from sethbenjamin:I'd be inclined to live with the game and enjoy it for a while before diving into restoration - a nice restore is a big commitment. If you do decide to go ahead with it, please post photos here - always nice to see those projects documented.
I've never done a full restore - but the mylar still must be removed, IMO. However, It's a good time to shop the game when you remove mylar because you are going to make a big mess anyway.
Quoted from calvin12:you can definatly lost art doing it, its just not always. its highly dependent on the method and even with the same method it depends on how fast you work, how hard you pull etc. If you freeze it, and you leave the glue behind, its not possible to lose art since it will still be under the glue. Then you just need to be really careful getting rid of the glue.
Not only these variables, but it can vary even from game to game. In many cases you are talking about games over 20, 30 or more years old. How was it stored over time? Exposed to what temperatures and humidity? When was the mylar put on, at the factory? In a shop much later?
My guess is even two people side by side performing the same technique could end up with differences in the result.
Quoted from sethbenjamin:I'm always surprised by the mylar hate! I *wish* my PinBot had had mylar! My playfield isn't terrible, but it isn't restorable, either. I can see why people want to remove it, now that the game is safely in home-use only. But it seems to me that, unless you're willing and able to do a restore where you can properly clear coat the playfield, there are worse things than having mylar on your game. IMHO
Personally, I don't like the look of the mylar, I think it sucks away some of the vibrance of the color, like it is never perfectly clear - I can see this looking at the edges of the mylar. I don't like the way the ball rolls on it...just something aesthetically different about the ball roll directly on the playfield. I keep them cleaned and waxed, and stocked with good new balls. I have no desire to clear coat and no worry about wear.
Quoted from jibmums:If they'd put the full sheet on when the game was new, the playfield would still look new.
Meh. It all comes down to cleanliness and ball condition. My first game, Mata Hari, had wear right through the mylar and into the wood.
Quoted from nerdygrrl:I hate the way mylar looks, but if it weren't for factory mylar the pf's in my Rollergames and Pin*Bot would have been destroyed. Mylar has saved a good many pf's from death.
I agree. But it's no longer necessary once the game gets into a hobbyist's possession. IMO, of course.
2 weeks later
Quoted from jibmums:I dig the red left side/blue right side look, but to me the LEDs tend to wash out the playfield/plastic colors a bit too much. Has anyone here with a red/blue Pinbot tried colored #44's instead of LEDs? I'm thinking that might be the trick to add the red/blue lights without overpowering the rest of the colors on the game.
IMO, even with colored LEDs this game is pretty dark. I think the 44s will be even darker yet.
Quoted from Daniml:At that time I proceeded to check the fuse (removed) then checked the connection. All was well. Any idea what I may have blown?
When you checked this fuse, did you check for the presence of GI voltage at the fuse tabs with a DMM after installing the fuse?
I had no problems installing my LEDs, you might have just had a bad (shorted) LED or pushed a lamp receptacle into something else.
Quoted from RCA1:Missing on mine as well, with no indication it was ever there.
Are we sure this was a factory part?
I am thinking that the missing part is some kind of add on, maybe from the factory at some later date, or aftermarket. None of the flyer pictures or IPDB pictures show it.
IMO, nobody should "freak out" that there is a missing part, but consider it a nice add on, a modification to improve reliability of the game. As simple a part as it looks, someone making parts could crank some out for sale.
Quoted from zippydapinhead:Might be able to carefully re-shape that with a heat gun
Maybe but only as a very last resort if you can't get a replacement...if you damage it attempting to repair it yourself you might have trouble getting the supplier to replace or refund.
1 week later
Quoted from Sparky:My Pinbot is back together, and I hope to get it upstairs into the gameroom later tonight. I'll try to post pics in the next day or two.
So now that my new Vortex ramp no longer restricts the ball, I have a question about other Pinbot owners' launch results. When I launch the ball, I get five different results, and they all seem to happen equally (20% of the time for each). Full, 3/4, and 1/2 plunges have the same results:
1) Rattles around before the ramp and drops back into the pops
2) Rattles around as it enters the ramp and rolls back down to the pops.
3) Makes it past first hole and drops back into it
4) Makes it to 100K hole
5) Makes it to the top hole
I don't mind the randomness, but I would love to at least eliminate #1 and #2. I think it has to do with the rubber tip on the plunger needing to be centered better. If I spin the plunger rod, I can see that it touches different areas of the ball. I will have to look at this more closely when I get home. Should I expect a good, clean plunge around the ramp every time?
Mine is random, maybe not as bad as yours described. I Have replaced the entire shooter mech and housing, including the bushing and tip. I've adjust the vortex and the gate. Sooo many variables to this skillshot, including the level of the game, and the condition of the playfield since the ball exits the shooter lane and travels across a section of the playfield before entering the vortex. There can even be problems introduced by the rubber along the right side of the playfield.
Is there truly a "magic bullet" to getting this shot working 100%? I'd really like to find out myself. I've read all the threads and tried all the tips - and I've spent hours trying to get there. I think it really varies from game to game, IMHO.
Quoted from WonkoTSane:I would say that it also very much depends on the speed of the plunge. A full plunge will most often NOT get clear to the top of the ramp. If the ball is going too fast it will hit something along the way that will cause the "rattle" before the ramp and the ball will drop in to the pops.
Quoted from Von_Drehle:For some reason on mine, the 20,000 top hole is the rarest and hardest to get, so I get more excited these days seing it twirl around all the way to the top than getting the 100K skillshot
Actually, a full shot on mine will slam the very top of the spiral hard and it often returns down the spiral to the 5K hole most often. I repaired my spiral with metal and epoxy so it is not likely to ever break. It's the finesse shot of getting the 100K that is the most difficult. On some days it seems I can nail it on nearly every shot, on other days I can't find 100K to save my life.
Quoted from calvin12:Funny, most competitive players never have an issue with the skill shot as they don't want to go into the pops so they soft plunge and dont even want the skillshot.
Huh, really? That's just weird to me, because the skill shot is the way to massive points, almost more so than the Solar Value. Not making the skill shot almost guarantees that I won't be able to roll it over.
Quoted from Darcy:Soft plunge missing the pop bumpers. Catch the ball with the flippers. With the first shot hit the Visor Target that is lit. Opens Visor. Lock ball right away.
Isn't the highest scoring opportunity building the vortex shot up and repeatedy collecting it, up to 100k x 10x x 2x (if in multiball) for 2M points. Once you've collected the solar value it's reset, right? To me it seems like soft plunge misses the opportunity to get the building of the vortex multiplier rolling, but I don't play tournaments so what do I know?
Quoted from Tanooki:I've got an opportunity to potentially get a Pinbot table. I was curious what I should expect to pay locally for one of these in good condition. I don't know any more details than a few non-helpful pictures at this point.
I think $1200 is about the going rate for a decent "average" PB that boots and plays in the midwest, maybe a little less if it needs repairs, or has table wear, or other issues.
Quoted from Tanooki:also home owned for 20+ years
Make sure if there are batteries are on the MPU board, there are no signs of corrosion. A game can be home use, even look perfectly clean - just don't forget to check "under the hood"
Quoted from Its_me_aj:In switch test mode, the ramp and slings do not work.
In gameplay do they work? In test mode they don't fire or register on the display?
Quoted from Its_me_aj:Also all,of my back box lights are out except the flashers.
Separate branch line and connectors for backbox GI, each branch has own fuse. Could be bad or burned GI connector pin @CPU board as well. I'm just not at my game so I am unsure of which color is the backbox GI circuits.
Quoted from Its_me_aj:The left eye socket kick out ejects but will not go down
Hmmm...Return spring? Compare to the right eye mechanism.
pbGI.JPGQuoted from meatpile:I also noticed that sometimes I get awarded planets seemingly at random. Once, before I even launched ball one, it suddenly gave me pluto and Neptune. Is this a random feature? I thought maybe the drop targets were too sensitive and all the movement of parts at game startup made them drop.
See adjustment #34 "planets memory" in the manual first. If it is set to "Yes" (default) then the planets are stored for the next ball, if it is set to "No" then the lamps are turned off at the start of the next ball.
1 week later
Quoted from mainelycoasters:I do not see a normally closed switch on 2. I run switch test and still do not find a closed switch on 2.
Suggestions??
Not sure what you are getting at. With all balls out of the game and in switch test, no switches should be closed. Then advance to switch edge test and operate each switch and they should close when operated.
More info on switch problems here:
http://techniek.flipperwinkel.nl/wms11/index3.htm#switch
Quoted from mainelycoasters:A normally closed switch would be one like ball trough. If a ball is there it would be closed during play. Say its column 2 row 2 in the matrix. If a bad diode was also in row 2 then it could feed a whole new column.
I see what you are saying, but it's still technically a normally open switch. Switch tests are performed without the balls in the machine to make certain they are all open, then edge testing shows that a ball can properly close the switch when active, whether that be a playfield switch, rollover, trough or even shooter lane.
So, back to your original problem, one step at a time.. You are saying that with a ball in the game switch #2 does not register - so start there. From the repair guide:
If a switch does not work, check these things:
On the top side of the playfield, make sure the bad switch contacts haven't been bashed together by an errant air pinball.
If it's a micro-switch, check the actuator arm. Make sure it's adjusted properly. Listen for the micro-switch's "click" when activating. No click usually means the switch is mis-adjusted or broken.
Check that the wires going to the switch are soldered well, and haven't fallen off.
Check the continuity (using your DMM's continuity setting) of the wire between this switch and another working switch in the same column (white wire) or row (green wire).
If it's a blade or leaf style switch, check the contacts for proper closure. Clean the switch contacts with a business card (do NOT use a file as the contacts are gold plated). Put the card between the contacts, close the contacts, and pull the card through the contacts. This is all that is needed to clean gold plated switch contacts.
Check the switch to make sure it works. Use your DMM's continuity setting, and put one lead on the "common" lug (the lug to which the banded end of the diode connects) of the switch. Put the other lead on the green (normally open) switch lug. Your meter should only beep when the switch is activated, and not beep when the switch is de-activated. Move the DMM's lead from the green to the white wire (normally closed) switch lug. Your meter should beep when the switch is de-activated, and NOT beep when activated.
Check the diode on the switch. Make sure the diode is connected properly, and is working (see below).
Check other switches in that switch's row or column. Two 4041 chips control rows, and 2N3904 transistors and 74LS244 at U40 control columns. Both rows and columns are controlled by a 6821 PIA at U38.
Quoted from mainelycoasters:other way around I am getting switches that were not hit. like a tilt from the top drop target. Or a vortex from the pop bumpers area. an outlane from the right sling.
Start here then:
Phantom Switch Closures: a Shorted Switch.
It's a strange problem. You're playing a game, and when the ball goes down the right inlane, the left slingshot fires! Or when you make a ramp shot, the game slam tilts. One switch closes, but a completely unrelated event than occurs.
This is a classic problem of a shorted switch. It confuses the switch matrix into thinking something else has occurred. This can happen from an "air" pinball, that bashes an above playfield switch's contacts together, causing a short. Also a bad switch diode can do this too. In either case, you need to find the shorted switch. Unfortunately, it won't be obvious. The switch matrix is confused, so any diagnostics the game provides will be of limited help.
First, try and find the switch that causes something unrelated ("phantom") to happen. Take the playfield glass off, and start a game. Activate the switches with your hand, and find the switch which activates the phantom (unrelated) switch. Once you have found the switch, go to the game manual and find the switch's number, row number, and column number. Say for example, switch 53 (column 7, row 5) is causing the phantom closure. Now you need to get the other three switches that make up the "square" of this row and column. First get the reverse switch number, switch 39 (column 5, row 7). Then get the other two switches: switch 37 (column 5, row 5), and switch 55 (column 7, row 7). Your switch short will probably be one of these four switches.
If you are having problems figuring out if the short is in the playfield or the CPU board, try this. Remove connectors 1J10 and 1J8 from the CPU board. Then put the game in switch edge test. Using the manual, find which row and column of the switch that is causing the phantom closure. Then cross this row and column directly on the CPU board (with wire and alligator clips, and a diode, as described below in the "testing the switch columns/rows"). The row and column numbers for each pin of connectors 1J10 and 1J8 are listed below. If the phantom switch does not activate, the problem is in the playfield. If the phantom closure still works, you have a CPU board problem.
If your phantom switch problem is on the CPU board, don't forget to look at the 1k ohm resistor pack SR10 on the CPU board. When this resistor pack goes bad, it can cause intermittent phantom switch closures. Use your ohm meter, and test the resistor pack. If in doubt, just replace it.
2 months later
Quoted from Its_me_aj:Ran into a problem during game play today. As soon as the ball drains it doesn't recognize it, the found out that none of the drain lanes, the advance planet lane or the lites effect lane is doing anything. Went into switch test and none of them work.
I'm have no idea what to do
Check for loose row or column wiring at the IDC connectors for the switches (1J6 and 1J7 at the bottom of the CPU board) then read the PinWiki on how to perform switch matrix row and column testing to determine if the problem is on the CPU board, or the playfield wiring.
2 months later
1 week later
Quoted from Plumonium:Joined the club last week! It's a player's condition Pinbot. Original mylar, rough but solid cab and head. Matching board numbers. Dirty. 100% led, broken vortex, few broken plastics. Fun Fun Fun. Good memories of stealing my money quarters after quarters... No more baby, I'm owning your ass!
Now see it to 5 ball, loosen up those tilts, and start reclaiming those quarters!
Quoted from PurpleActivator:the ramp on switch has a bad solder joint....My only question so far is how should I go about fixing the ramp on switch?
It seems you identified the problem. If you can't solder it, perhaps you can find someone you know that knows some soldering who could help?
Quoted from Its_me_aj:So I rebuilt my pop bumpers and have had a problem since. The left pop bumper will work for a game but then stop working. I checked the switches and the coil and everything works fine. Could this be a problem in the boards? In switch test mode it will work fine for a bit and go out as well.
My thoughts:
> If it was working and this is a new problem that cropped up since the rebuild, there is a good chance it was something you did then. Mechanically you need to verify there is no resistance in the motion of the mechanisms (something could be binding, for example) Electrically, you could have a failed solder joint or something similar. If it is consistently the same pop that is failing, and the mechanicals and soldering check out, I would be suspicious of a failing transistor, possibly failing as it gets warm.
Switches for the pops should report in switch test if the pop fires correctly. If the pop doesn't fire, mechanically it won't activate the switch that reports it in the switch test.
I don't think I have ever seen a repro vortex ramp. If yours is damaged at the top it is repairable, though. I did mine and it is not noticeable, and way stronger than the original.
2 weeks later
Quoted from SpaceWar:I do have a question about some lights in the head (backglass), there are 5 lights below Pinbot's eye lights that correspond with the colors on the playfield chest array. They never seem to come on. Anyone know what triggers them, or are they simply GI lighting?
The lights you are talking about are controlled lamps, not GI. They are the column 1 lamp matrix "mouth" lamps. Do the match, game over, and ball in play lamps light? (they are also in that column)
Quoted from SpaceWar:Also, when in the adjustments menu, I am trying to change the game to free play. I find the option but I cannot for the life of me discover how to select the option. I tried the start button, flipper buttons, other buttons on the user switch panel, nothing worked. I can get to the adjustments, but cannot select any...!
Should be selectable with the credit (start) button. Odd, can you start a game? You also should check the flippers can change lanes for when the extra ball is lit.
Quoted from Plumonium:Outlane drain = Pinbot. Pinbot = Outlane drain. Why would you want to change that? The beauty of Pinbot is having a super long ball time like outlane drain was not a thing. You really feel you are owning the machine those times. Next ball, you get immediate drain... That's Pinbot...
Spot on, man, spot on.
1 week later
Quoted from pinheadpierre:I have discovered that the Bot can be so fast that it is possible to catch enough air off the ramp that you could actually get the ball stuck up behind the flashers if the post was not there!
A really odd coincidence. Seemingly out of nowhere, 50% or so of my ramp shots are flying up and smacking the glass, often the ball running all the way up to those flashers and rolling down the plastics. It's so frequent that it is annoying. i can't for the life of me figure out what has changed. I'm good with electronics, but no so good with the high speed physics that won;t allow me to determine if something needs to be fixed. Anyone else run into this problem?
Quoted from blowback1976:K's Arcade sells the three point one for under the visor. May have issues finding the long blue one though.
I have not seen the long one in a year since I last saw it in a full set. I just couldn't justify the price.
2 weeks later
1 week later
Quoted from jibmums:Has anyone who's done the red/blue GI thing taken a count of the number of bulb required of each color? I was thinking that since I prefer the look of incandescents, I'd order some boxes of red & blue #47's, but my 'Bot is stored right now so I've no idea how many boxes to order.
Mine has 11 blue in the left playfield, 7 red in the right playfield. 6 of each color for the arms on the backglass.
1 week later
Quoted from ryandimx:Does anyone have a proper flasher lamp layout as to which are 89's and which are 1251's?
All but 3 are blown on mine and I'm gonna guess the previous owner didn't know which bulbs were proper to go where.
Thanks
Last column of the solenoid table
1 week later
1 week later
Quoted from pinheadpierre:I have one. I replaced all my plastics with CPR stuff. Not sure if it is intact, though. The tips of that piece tend to take a beating. I will dig it out and take a look in the next day or two.
Thanks to you, Pinheadpierre, I now have MY PRECIOUS!
Quoted from woody76:Could this be multiple things or just chip replacement? Where can one purchase a U-38 PIA chip?
PIA ICs can fail. If it is socketed, you can try reseating it in the socket (often corrects the phenomena known as "chip creep" replacement PIAs can be ordered from most electronics and Pinball parts distributors, such as Marco Specialties
1 month later
Quoted from paynemic:So I had my playfield replaced with a cpr. Ever since then the skill shot is doing crazy random things. Very unlikely to even make the start of the vortex. Sometimes even hitting the edge of the bride playfield (ouch). Tinkered and tightened everything I can think of. The only thing I can think of trying now is new whole shooter assembly. Do they even make those any more?
After going 'round and 'round trying many things including adjusting the shooter and replacing bushing and springs (also had already tried adjusting vortex, pf rubbers, gate, etc...) I concluded that some of the "randomness" was introduced by the final position of the shooter rod tip which has some amount of play in it - even after replacing the bushing. I also replaced the whole shooter assembly. It did improve it some, but certainly not a "magic bullet" to making this shot work 100% of the time. I think I bought the assembly from Marco.
Quoted from floyd1977:I'm having a similar problem with mine after installing a CPR playfield. I ended up getting it pretty consistent by adjusting the shooter rod. I even put a small piece of cardboard behind one side of the metal plate on the outside of the cabinet to angle the rod slightly away from the right rail. Much better, but it still gets hung up occasionally.
I am wondering if the old playfields had a wear pattern that guided the ball straight toward the skill shot whereas the new playfield is perfectly smooth.
I also have a little play in the shooter rod, but I noticed that all of my games are that way.
Hmmm...you sort of answered a question for me. Mine is an old playfield. The lamp grid was worn down to the wood even. The big red energy flasher insert was somewhat melted, probably from flash lamps being stuck on at one point. The flasher is a little wavy, like a frozen ripple on a pond. The ball travels over this flasher on its way to the vortex, and I was wondering if this might be playing some havoc with the skill shot. I was figuring the only way to fix it would be to replace the flasher insert or the playfield. So you have a nice flat CPR playfield and still have issues with it means quite possibly that replacing the playfield on my game would likely not improve things much.
Quoted from TheOnlyest:Have you guys had someone stand on the side of the machine to look at where the ball seems to be deflected or obstructed?
The problem is not likely the shooter, unless the sleeve is wasted or missing, or you're using the completely wrong (too weak) spring. If the ball even makes it to the energy flasher insert, you'll want to be looking at 2 things... the ball gate and the long rubber opposite of the pop bumpers. Try removing the ball gate and see how that goes, if it helps, try putting a thick washer under each mounting point to raise it up a tad, or replace it. make sure you're using a 3.5" rubber opposite the pop bumpers (and yes, it is stretched to the absolute limit), if that rubber is too long, it will extend too far left and interfere with the ball passing by it to the vortex... There is no margin for error there.
Yes, looked at all that. Decided I would need a very high speed camera to really analyze it that well. Have not tried that washer trick though. The gate can be part of it, because I know with the gate gone it improves a bit - but has the counter effect of letting the ball back into the shooter lane. It's a toughie because I can have it operating perfectly and then 20 shots or so later after putting it back together I get a muffed shot. It's one of the most finicky aspects of adjustments in any game I have ever seen. IMO it's kind of silly that the ball exits the shooter lane via a gate to cross the playfield and enter the vortex to begin with. I wish it was a full length shooter lane, but who am I to argue design with the great Python Anghelo?
1 month later
Quoted from cyris69:Was contemplating replacing all the lights with LED's but not sure if there is a cheap kit or if anyone can assist what LED's I should snag to do a full back and playfield upgrade.
There are kits (not necessarily cheap!) but I would recommend simply counting the bulbs and estimating your colors needed and then add some extras so you can tweak them later.
Quoted from erak:Personally they should be white.
"Personally" is about the answer. For some people, the thought of even putting in LEDs is preposterous. Of those that do, some of them abhor the red/blue scheme. Those that do the red/blue scheme like myself have not created it on their own, they've seen it somewhere else and copied it. I did not think to use white in that spot because I wanted the two colors to be contiguous from the top to the bottom of the playfield, and I'm not planning to run right out and change it because of your suggestion. I have a color changer behind a planet and in another secret spot on the backbox. There's only hundreds of ways to alter the lighting on these games.
All my inserts are incandescent. I feel the LEDs look too strong there, and this is backasswards from the "norm" which is many folks LEDs the inserts and leave the GI regular incans. So what - it's my personal preference.
Quoted from erak:As far as the Inserts go. I would change them to Leds. Pinbot are notorious for the mylar bubbling. And incandescent bulbs heat are the reason this happens.
I have no mylar on my Pinbot, so no worries. It's been running for some 30 years with incandescent and it will continue to do so without melting the inserts. I have LEDs under inserts on some games, it's just that on Pinbot, bright LEDs drown out the etched starburst patterns on the insert lenses and I don't like that.
1 month later
Quoted from pinheadpierre:I love this! It confirms a suspicion I have had for awhile that machines tend to "evolve" (or devolve) slowly over time due to operator error or unavailable parts. Without original photographs or diagrams from the time of production showing every little part in a machine, those little errors and omissions get copied and perpetuated until most people have forgotten how it was originally meant to be put together.
In my experience, if you are are not doing a complete tear down to the wood, and using good known doc, photos and reference material for reassembly, you'll have a hard time coming up with the 100% actual, original game. Add to this that the manufacturers often had different versions or changes in production, and with hundreds of parts in a machine - some hard to find - it gets mind boggling to fill in all these little details. I've had occasions pop up where I'd tear something apart and find out long after that a tiny part had been wrong or incorrect for a very long time that I had never noticed before.
Quoted from Budman:Guys
I'm a newcomer to the hobby with very little EM knowledge and not all that mechanically inclined but willing to learn. I am considering the purchase of a restored PinBot. What can I expect in the way of breakdowns and how often, particular to this title?
Thanks!
You said "very little EM knowledge"...well, you don't need that because Pinbot is a solid state! 
Breakdowns? Hard question to answer without knowing your starting point - the initial condition of the game. Once you go through it and do the basic overhaul and bulletproofing, any of these system 11 based games are real tanks. They really hold up quite well. You've got to get them there first.
* Noticed it says restored...it it truly is gone through well electronically and mechanically as a part of a restoration, there should be very few problems at all.
2 weeks later
Quoted from sethbenjamin:Hey all, have any of you had success in installing the modified ROMs for PinBot (which reset Solar Value after each game, rather than having it accumulate from one game to the next)? I've tried twice now, using the download from IPDB; the first time I was given an insufficient ROM chip (not enough capacity). The second time I had the ROMs made while I watched by a tech guy who is really reliable; he installed them on a board and it kicked on just fine. So, I bring them home, ground myself before touching the ROMs, pull the old ones, install the new, aaaaaannnnd....when I turn the game on, it gave me the bootup ding, but only the GI lights came on. Turn off game. Turn on game. Now no ding. Just GI lights. Sad now.
Pull new ROMs. Put old ones back. Huh, now the flashers don't work. Remain calm. Play second game. Now everything seems to be working fine.
WHAT THE HELL.
I would suggest PM'ing Pinsider ChadH, seems he has done some tweaking of this ROM code, and perhaps could help. The thing that bothers me is that you had a problem after reverting to the original ROMs suggests you may have another problem, maybe flaky socket or even elsewhere such as cabling.
4 weeks later
Quoted from wylcot:The only obvious one is the fact that the lower displays (p3 and 4) and those for credits and match don't work.
If you have any idea of a reason, or a link to a thread about it, I'd enjoy it too.
Congrats on your Pinbot!
As far as the lower displays, they are possibly outgassed (simply end of life) that's pretty common. Another common point is to reflow the connector pins for the glass as these often develop crack solder connections. More info here as well:
http://techniek.flipperwinkel.nl/wms11/index3.htm#display
Quoted from wylcot:Thank you! I was actually re-reading this page as i fixed flickering displays on a Rollergames a couple of years ago...
I'll try to test these on another one, I think...
Hey! Are you a Kidforce member??
Your welcome. I played Kidforce league the first year they ran tournaments. I still pop in occasionally for some freeplay.
Quoted from SunMonkeyAZ:I want to LED my pinbot I picked up fairly recently. I will probably not do the 1251's at first because of the cost per bulb. Instead of getting a kit I want to order the LEDs individually. Thought I'd ask if anyone has a bulb count done already as far as types and colors? I like the red and blue split I've seen here. Just checking before I go through it. Not looking for an exact count as I'll buy packs of various ones. Just don't want to get too many of one type and be short on another.
You'll need about 8 of each color for the playfield, plus a few of each for the backbox (you won't want to use all red and blue behind the art) and a few of each for spares. So around 13 of each red and blue. Get a few white and assorted colors to tweak the backglass art the way you like. Do not bother with LEDs for the 89 and 1251 flashers.
1 week later
Quoted from sethbenjamin:Do any of you know a good method for adjusting the kickout mechanisms? Beginning of multiball quite often sends the ball SDTM or very nearly so; I've played others that serve the ball right to the flipper. Also the kickout to the left of the visor is kind of erratic but should be sending the ball straight to the RH flipper. I replaced the red saucer plastics a while ago, and cleaned the kickout arms so that they move freely. But I've never been able to figure a way to adjust them.
In my experience, 99% of this adjustment is through the leg levelers.
2 weeks later
Quoted from paynemic:I don't claim to know everything on politics but I have every right to say what I want where I want.
Uh...no, you don't. Read the Pinside community guidelines:
Discuss Politics and religion: Each to their own when it comes to these hot-button topics, but they have absolutely no place in the world of pinball. Please discuss them elsewhere.
3 weeks later
Quoted from Insane:i also am having an issue with the target assembly. It doesn't seem to go all the way down. I checked the adjustment screws, and its not hitting them. i can manually push it down the last little bit. After the ball rolls over it a couple of times, it gets pushed down. Also it seems to tilt a little bit front to back, so when its flush at the front, its still up a little at the back. suggestions?? Do i need to somehow shim under the back to try to adjust for the tilt?
Sounds to me like the guide brackets are bent a little bit. I'd suggest the guide "forks" that mount the assembly to the playfield (indicated in the diagram) need to be bent down slightly in a vise to get the assembly straight. Then test to see if that makes it level, if it is but still isn't going down all the way perhaps the stop switch is being activated a little too soon? Just a guess.
Quoted from pinheadpierre:the tech fits your machine with a little device that causes the game to malfunction if you attempt to trade or sell it. Sorry, I thought you knew.
You guys absolutely jinxed me...or you are telling the truth. 
Quoted from Sticky:How do you guys feel about this pinbot for sale? orangecounty.craigslist.org link
Looks to be in poor condition. I'm thinking about picking it up but maybe it's better to just pay more for a better example?
I don't know what you are specifically seeing as poor condition, as it is really tough to see in the photographs. That said, I sold mine just a few days ago for $1500...mine was most certainly in better condition than that one is, on just a hunch.
Quoted from Sticky:I'm seeing a cabinet in poor condition, faded playfield, and beat up rails?
Maybe it's worth it to buy to revamp at a discount of the asking price but I don't really know anything about restoration.
What I interpret from what you are saying is you really are not interested in doing restoration. If that same game were in better exterior condition, it would likely be priced a little higher too. IMHO is this example priced high for its condition? Yes, but not extremely. My advice would be to wait for another example to cone around that better suits you.
I'm kind of in the same boat, as I am looking for another game myself. I have also passed on examples that were not quite what I am desiring. Even though I want the titles badly, I am not going to rush in to buying something that I can't be happy with. Sometimes you just need to walk away.
2 weeks later
Quoted from paynemic:I will definitely try that out. I have an old PinGuy friend that insists that I never use any kind of lube. But I'm desperate
Yeah, lube is a no-no. Dust sticks to anything moist, and shortly you will be looking at cleaning and reapplying - over and over frequently. Replace the nylon bushing. Should shoot smooth and fast, if it doesn't you have a problem with your shooter rod/housing. Pinbot should only require about half a pull to get it in the 100K hole, full plunges slam the top, resulting in the all-too-common broken vortex top over time. I had repaired mine using Steve Channels method http://www.stevechannel.com/pinbot.htm
Quoted from Milltown:Was this,ever suppose to be every time 100.000 ?.it is the skill shot.... I replaced my entire shooter assembly.and pUT a medium spring.. blue I belive ? No play at all and still once in a while it won't go up the vortex .. I'm cool with it.. like 25 bucks threw marco..
For a good player in the right conditions, probably pretty close to every time. There's just too many variables (shooter adjustments, shooter rod, springs, rubber, vortex and adjustments, gate, table warp, leveling) I think the skillshot would have been much, much more accurate if it had it's own complete lane up the right of the table. Coming out of the gate, across the table and back in to the vortex adds some of those variables.
1 week later
Quoted from tilted81:So because mines all torn apart I tried this w/ some 12v led flashers and the sockets next to the eyeballs stay lit until you lock the second ball... in less than 10 seconds the leds started smoking! I quickly pulled em out and they were pretty warm! I do not reccomend putting leds in the 1251 spots unless they are rated
3 weeks later
1 week later
Quoted from awarner:<soapbox>Not being an LED fan at all, could I make a suggestion? Use white for GI and colors for inserts. Classic games NEVER used anything but white lights for GI. Every game I've seen with colors in GI look wrong. Even Stern doesn't do this now. </soapbox>
I never even realized that the red and blue coloring on the playfield art defined Pinbots "arms" running down the sides of the playfield until I saw this game with red and blue in the GI at a show. It also had the split red/blue displays. It was quite stunning, and that is why I also did mine that way. I don't know who started it, but it seems to be a contagious and common color selection for this game.
I do prefer white in the GI and colors in the inserts for most games. That is how I did my Maverick. I actually have a majority of my classic games incandescent bulbs and now I tend to keep them stock. I just can't stand Bally Space Invaders with anything but classic bulbs in it. Some games can look good with colorized GI when picked appropriately, but a vast majority are slapped together looking like rainbow puke. The nice thing is, it's an easy mod to alter if you want to freshen things up...or return to a classic look.
2 weeks later
Quoted from Plumonium:That fuse is a mod right? The bulletproofing method recommended by Vid? If so, he suggests an 8 amp fast blow if I remember correctly.
No, the line fuse at the power switch is not a mod. The anti-fire bridge mods that your speaking of are in the backbox. All three of these fuse values should be 8A SB.
1 week later
i usually just clean posts, screws, etc....with isopropryl alcohol. Sometimes soaking parts or scrubbing with a toothbrush. Really bad parts such as rust or faded plastic really just warrants replacement if you are really OCD about it. I've moved to a new philosophy of keeping things original where possible. I can usually find screws that are at least close to what they should be in my shop. I'm just not that critical of something that small that I won't really notice when playing the game.
LED flashes are not necessary IMO. I think regular flashers are quite bright. My F-14 Tomcat was so bright with standard incandescent flashers and LED everywhere else that I simply could not play it with the lights off. It was blinding and easy to lose track of the ball.
2 weeks later
Quoted from mtgedney:Any ideas on how I can improve exit ramp and enter ramp switch response? They rarely register in game play.
Usually cleaning the switch contacts and adjusting the switch blades (using a ball, not your finger) is enough. If it isn't, the switches have probably lost spring tension and need to be replaced.
1 month later
Quoted from shesmovedon:Mine came without a bracket but it has holes from a bracket. I plan to add one since the upper cabinet wobbles more than I would like it to.
Ah, I think she should be rock solid with the head bolts fastened securely. The latch does next to nothing to stop wobble, it's only used to temporarily hold the head while you install the bolts. I didn't know there were even supposed to be head bolts on the very first game we had, a Cyclone. The latch came out (really short wood screws!) during game play. Scare the bejeezus out of us. Dented the front rails and blew out the mystery wheel and knocked some other parts out. Everything was repairable. I've been an expert in securing heads and replacing side rails ever since. 
2 months later
Quoted from dudah:Trying to figure out my backglass LED's, but my game is all in pieces.
Anyone care to share a translite on/translite off picture to give me an idea of what they look like? Thanks!
I dont have my game anymore, but I had color changers behind the small spaceship with Windows and one of the planets. Kick a$$
I used Steve Channels repair, covering the steel with epoxy putty and shaping it, then painting it and apply decals. Indestructible. You can use any spring on it and slam the shooter full bore and it won't ever break.
4 weeks later
Quoted from Robotworkshop:One of the first things I'd check is for proper power.
Definitely check power supply with a DMM, especially the +5VDC, and AC ripple voltage. Connectors for cables from power supply to CPU board as well, so test the +5VDC on the MPU boards test point.
See "Game Just Won't Power On Consistently." Low +5 volts from the Power Supply board.
http://techniek.flipperwinkel.nl/wms11/index2.htm
1 month later
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Quoted from wizard_mode:The most effective way to keep your spiral ramp from breaking is to install the correct shooter rod spring to keep the ball from blasting up there like a bullet!
I was forced to repair mine because it was already cracked. I used the Steve Channel repair with steel coated with epoxy putty and I could slam the top full plunge repeatedly without any damage... probably for many many years. IMO, the full plunge should always get it in the top hole and not come up short, the compromise is that it will whack the top occasionally (of course, the top hole is not really what you are after)
2 months later
3 months later
If you are having electrical issues and want to bulletproof, the first thing besides checking the supply and recapping it if needed would be to repin the connectors. I'd choose to replace anything with power circuits with Trifurcon Molex ( http://www.pinrepair.com/connect/ )
2 weeks later
Quoted from Brijam:I measured IJ7 and got these values:
1: 5.1v
2: 5.2v
3: 5.2v
4: 5.1v
6: 7.8v
7: 5.7v
8: 11.2v
9: 5.1v
Obviously one of these is not like the others. You have some problem on column 7 (pin
All bulbs should effectively "see" around 6VAC as they are pulsed. This problem is usually caused by a short between two columns, the column driver staying high or a shorted/reversed diode. Best to start by isolating the problem to MPU or playfield
See "Testing the Lamp Columns" at http://techniek.flipperwinkel.nl/wms11/index2.htm#lamp
1 week later
2 weeks later
Quoted from Muskie82:I've never seen a pinbot with a translight....mine has a backglass that is original to my best knowledge
You'll have to get a razor blade and check an edge. When I first brought home my Taxi I could have swore it was a printed glass...it turned out that the translight plastic was super-stuck to the glass. It'll fake you out.
Quoted from ChrisPINk25:I have the CPR mirrored backglass and I think it is far superior to the translite.
Absolutely. The CPR mirrored version for Taxi also featured an actual mirrored rear view mirror.
TAXI_Backglass_ (resized).png 1 month later
1 month later
Quoted from Aniraf:. When you run LEDs do you cut out all of those boards with those rectangular ceramic things (I don’t know what these are called)?
No, but there are specific rectangular ceramic things to remove (they are called cement resistors or wirewound resistors usually) The ones that would be removed are the warming resistors. Or just don;t change flashers to LED - they are plenty bright. Do some reading before committing yourself to LED flashers
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/adding-led-flashers-to-system-11-games
Quoted from Aniraf:I would also like to know if having a cracked relay cover is dangerous? I have that situation going on.
No, nothing dangerous. You can still play it. Just be careful when working around it. The cover is to protect the delicate mechanisms inside from dirt or things falling inside. Make a note to replace it, but it does not have to be a high priority.
Quoted from Aniraf:Lastly I noticed here are just “extra” wires tied up around the drop target wire harness. Is this normal?
These wires, or at least one of them, correspond to the wire color for a playfield insert flasher solenoid. Its common for some games to have had wiring problems where a defective wire is left in the harness if it has been bypassed by another wire, rather than cut the whole harness apart to remove it. Run your solenoid diagnostics, if flasher 04C works there is a good chance that this was the case.
1 week later
Quoted from Aniraf:Above they said you could unsolder the ground wire on all of the lamp boards. I guess his has the same effect with less damage?
Yes, removing the ground wire is electrically the same as removing the resistor. If you ever want to revert back to original lamps, you can reconnect the wire instead of trying to find where you stored all the warming resistors.
sys11_1b (resized).pngQuoted from kciaccio:Do you think these will work in Pinbot?
I heard Pinbot might have lower caps then normal...
[quoted image]
I think the caps are the normal height, it's just that the bride bagatelle playfield is directly above the caps, so there is little clearance for a cap that is taller. I'm going to guess that these thicker plasma caps are not going to fit.
1 month later
Quoted from JFink8222:My little man and I putting Pinbot back together. New playfield and plastics. Complete rebuild of all other components. The light at the end of the tunnel is getting closer!
[quoted image]
Great pic!....not just because of pinball, but because of family.
Quoted from lecter:Hi guys, I'm considering to buy the PINBOT pinball because the price and quality seems to be OK. The problem is that I've never played this machine. Do you think that I would enjoy plaing it? I know the answer is not so easy (you do not know me) but please try advise me a bit.
As long as everything is working properly, Pinbot is a very fun game. On also has one of the best soundtracks and light shows for this era of Pinball. The rules are evenly spaced between too easy and too complicated....like Goldilocks and the Three Bears, these rules are just right. You can focus on individual tasks and shots such as locking balls and getting multiball or obtaining all the planets. In most cases this game is a long term keeper. It was difficult for me to let go, and if I could have kept them all this is one that I would still have. I say go for it, everyone should own a Pinbot if even for just a little while.
3 years later
Quoted from jackl:Shooting for the special shot to advance a planet is never worth the risk, ever.
In fact, I mostly avoid playing for planets entirely. The bonus applied at the end of each ball just isn’t worth the risk IMO.
Wait until you have owned it for awhile. When I tired of just going for score, sometimes I would play with the sole goal of advancing planets just to amuse myself.
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