(Topic ID: 70838)

Pinbot Fans and Owners Club!

By wayout440

10 years ago


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  • Latest reply 37 hours ago by RCA1
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There are 6,055 posts in this topic. You are on page 74 of 122.
#3651 4 years ago

What chip holds the system clock?

Restoring Pinbot and having weird symptoms I am hoping you can diagnose. There is some faulty logic going on somewhere in the boards I think. Machine boots up fine, press start, game does welcoming sounds and ramp, 3 bank reset, but ball does not show in in shooter for a long time (30 seconds - 2 minutes). If I drop a ball in the machine manually during that time, I can score points but the ball cannot end, and the extra ball hole won't pop the ball back out. After a 30 seconds to 2 minutes, the ball will pop into the shooter land and I can play normally. You'd think it was the roms, but I have 2 sets of U26 and U27 (I have a donor machine) and they have the exact same symptoms. I am on a Rottendog replacement board. I am guessing that one of the chips is faulty, but don't know which one. If I had to guess, I'd say there was something wrong with the system clock. The first ball will take anywhere from 30 seconds to 3 minutes to go into the shooter, and then the next two take exactly 28 seconds... is there an adjustment somewhere I'm missing? I've done factory resets. Thanks!

#3652 4 years ago
Quoted from SantaEatsCheese:

is there an adjustment somewhere I'm missing?

Check the ball switches for both balls.

#3653 4 years ago
Quoted from GRUMPY:

Check the ball switches for both balls.

Both work in the test menu.

#3654 4 years ago
Quoted from SantaEatsCheese:

Both work in the test menu.

Place in switch test, then remove the balls. Does any switches show up on the display?

#3655 4 years ago
Quoted from SantaEatsCheese:

What chip holds the system clock?

Editted.. Didnt read the full original..

#3656 4 years ago

Are you saying you are running a Rottendog replacement system 11 board and having problems with that? I thought those weren't recommended for Pinbot. Or, do you have a real Williams board and an aftermarket power board?

If you are having problems with a Rottendog MPU then best to contact them.

Quoted from SantaEatsCheese:

What chip holds the system clock?
Restoring Pinbot and having weird symptoms I am hoping you can diagnose. There is some faulty logic going on somewhere in the boards I think. Machine boots up fine, press start, game does welcoming sounds and ramp, 3 bank reset, but ball does not show in in shooter for a long time (30 seconds - 2 minutes). If I drop a ball in the machine manually during that time, I can score points but the ball cannot end, and the extra ball hole won't pop the ball back out. After a 30 seconds to 2 minutes, the ball will pop into the shooter land and I can play normally. You'd think it was the roms, but I have 2 sets of U26 and U27 (I have a donor machine) and they have the exact same symptoms. I am on a Rottendog replacement board. I am guessing that one of the chips is faulty, but don't know which one. If I had to guess, I'd say there was something wrong with the system clock. The first ball will take anywhere from 30 seconds to 3 minutes to go into the shooter, and then the next two take exactly 28 seconds... is there an adjustment somewhere I'm missing? I've done factory resets. Thanks!

#3657 4 years ago

Well,

This guy looks to have had the exact same problem I did. I wish he explains what he did to fix it a little more.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/pinbot-help-outhole-and-knocker?hl=vesly

After looking at his post, my knocker is disconnected too. I am going to trace both back when they get home and see if I can identify the problem. I may also try running a new wire from the CPU board to the outlane kicker and see if that does anything.

Racking my brain on this.

I am also trying to figure out if these could be related to the "Note" below. Knocker and Outlane kicker seem to share a lot of wiring according to this table.

If I can't fix it my 2 pinbots may be going back on the marketplace.

O well.

Solenoid Note (resized).pngSolenoid Note (resized).pngSolenoid Table (resized).pngSolenoid Table (resized).png
#3658 4 years ago
Quoted from Robotworkshop:

Are you saying you are running a Rottendog replacement system 11 board and having problems with that? I thought those weren't recommended for Pinbot. Or, do you have a real Williams board and an aftermarket power board?
If you are having problems with a Rottendog MPU then best to contact them.

Why are rottendog boards not suggested for Pinbot? I’m just curious. Is that the old 11 or the new 9-11 or is it just for both? I know there are sound issues with some of the boards but I had not heard they didn’t work with a specific game

#3659 4 years ago
Quoted from jmountjoy111:

Why are rottendog boards not suggested for Pinbot? I’m just curious. Is that the old 11 or the new 9-11 or is it just for both? I know there are sound issues with some of the boards but I had not heard they didn’t work with a specific game

There were sound issues that I heard about and there may have been other issues as well. At one point when I was looking for a replacement I looked at them and was told they didn't recommend it for Pinbot. That was a couple years ago so perhaps they have changed their stance on that.

Luckily I was able to find an original board for mine without battery damage that I was able to rebuild. If original boards are available I'd prefer to rebuild those vs installing any after market board unless I can't avoid it.

#3660 4 years ago
Quoted from Robotworkshop:

There were sound issues that I heard about and there may have been other issues as well. At one point when I was looking for a replacement I looked at them and was told they didn't recommend it for Pinbot. That was a couple years ago so perhaps they have changed their stance on that.
Luckily I was able to find an original board for mine without battery damage that I was able to rebuild. If original boards are available I'd prefer to rebuild those vs installing any after market board unless I can't avoid it.

I see what you’re saying. Replacement boards aren’t always the best choice. I haven’t heard them say that the new 9-11 board was not suitable for Pinbot. I hadn’t heard that about the older version either. I was well aware of the sound issues though. Of course an original board is always preferred. A ton of those 11 boards are completely destroyed. I have had a few that the battery damage had covered close to half the board

#3661 4 years ago

Send cpu out for repair. Coin op cauldron.

#3662 4 years ago

Ugh, we desperately need some more folks that can do work at Clive's level. He's fantastic, does great work and is absolutely my go to guy, but as more and more boards are going belly up his turnaround time is getting longer and longer. No slam at all on Clive, he's just doing what it humanly possible, but there's definitely room for someone else in this field who can do board work as thoroughly and reliably as he does.

#3663 4 years ago

My biggest advise to newly infected pinball zombies from space... now there's a title for ya, is to learn to do your own board repair, basic soldering, replacing transistors, resistors, diodes, IC’s and capacitors, learn how to use a meter to check for shorts and grounds and diodes, how to use heat shrink the right way (put it on BEFORE you solder...), how to troubleshoot a simple electronic circuit using half splitting and simple continuity checks, how to read a schematic, how to manufacture simple brackets and mounts, how to re-rubber , relamp, and wax a playfield, how to rebuild flipper mechs, how to read resistor markings, how to troubleshoot lamp and switch matrices. How to sand, buff, polish, flame polish, chem polish, sand blast, wire wheel, grind, hammer, screw, unscrew, bend, twist, cuss, and spit. That and how to tear a machine down, move it, and set it up again, level it and make sure it is working, use the service menu, make adjustments to game parameters, clear audits, factory reset, change the custom message, set it on free play, how and when to change batteries, how to open the lock bar, how to turn a machine on and off (Gottlieb tap anyone?), how to raise the playfield (please pull the shooter back), how to remove the backglass (where the fuck are the backbox keys? Bueller?), how to clean and clear coin mechs, what that handy tray full of dead rubber, burnt out lamps, and fried coils really is (the coin box you dolt!), how to remove a top hat insert, re-level it, and redecal it, how to remove mylar glue quickly and safely, how to touch up your fuckups from slipped screwdrivers and dropped tools on the playfield. Did I miss any? Edit- yes I forgot applying decals to cabinets/backbox and sourcing replacement parts, and how to adjust all switches- EOS, jets, slings, flippers, rollovers, drop targets, standups, limit, and spinners.

#3664 4 years ago
Quoted from Bublehead:

My biggest advise to newly infected pinball zombies from space... now there's a title for ya, is to learn to do your own board repair, basic soldering, replacing transistors, resistors, diodes, IC’s and capacitors, learn how to use a meter to check for shorts and grounds and diodes, how to use heat shrink the right way (put it on BEFORE you solder...), how to troubleshoot a simple electronic circuit using half splitting and simple continuity checks, how to read a schematic, how to manufacture simple brackets and mounts, how to re-rubber , relamp, and wax a playfield, how to rebuild flipper mechs, how to read resistor markings, how to troubleshoot lamp and switch matrices. How to sand, buff, polish, flame polish, chem polish, sand blast, wire wheel, grind, hammer, screw, unscrew, bend, twist, cuss, and spit. That and how to tear a machine down, move it, and set it up again, level it and make sure it is working, use the service menu, make adjustments to game parameters, clear audits, factory reset, change the custom message, set it on free play, how and when to change batteries, how to open the lock bar, how to turn a machine on and off (Gottlieb tap anyone?), how to raise the playfield (please pull the shooter back), how to remove the backglass (where the fuck are the backbox keys? Bueller?), how to clean and clear coin mechs, what that handy tray full of dead rubber, burnt out lamps, and fried coils really is (the coin box you dolt!), how to remove a top hat insert, re-level it, and redecal it, how to remove mylar glue quickly and safely, how to touch up your fuckups from slipped screwdrivers and dropped tools on the playfield. Did I miss any? Edit- yes I forgot applying decals to cabinets/backbox and sourcing replacement parts, and how to adjust all switches- EOS, jets, slings, flippers, rollovers, drop targets, standups, limit, and spinners.

You are so right. I always try to fix my own boards. I actually enjoy the work and have repaired a ton of them (most with the help of several here on pinside). There is always someone who enters a repair/tech thread I start and suggests sending the board off for repair. I always appreciate the insight from anyone but honestly if I wanted to send it off I’d have done so already and wouldn’t have a tech thread going. On top of the enjoyment of working on the board and the personal satisfaction I gain from the accomplishment of fixing it, I learn something new with each repair thread. Maybe it’s just me. As for the rest of the post, I tear machines to nothing and go through every part on them. I am on ultrasonic cleaner number 3 at the moment. I may have more fun refurbishing a Machine than playing it at this point in the hobby. Seeing it play as it did when new is a treat for me. All the things you mentioned that need to be learned I also consider essential

#3665 4 years ago

SantaEatsCheese Did you try the original sys11 board that you have from the parts pinbot, in your not for parts pinbot ? Saw your 2 for 1 pinbot sale add today..

#3666 4 years ago
Quoted from sethbenjamin:

Ugh, we desperately need some more folks that can do work at Clive's level. He's fantastic, does great work and is absolutely my go to guy, but as more and more boards are going belly up his turnaround time is getting longer and longer. No slam at all on Clive, he's just doing what it humanly possible, but there's definitely room for someone else in this field who can do board work as thoroughly and reliably as he does.

I do repairs on many of the Pinball boards but limit them to machines that I own or ones close enough that I can run the boards if needed. Also try to keep parts on hand for them. Not fond of dealing with battery damage but just about anything else is ok. Lately a lot of projects were fixing prior repair work where people ripped out through hole plating, pads, and often traces. Lot of system 6 boards, system 11 like Pinbot, WPC CPU, sound boards, some system 80 like Haunted House, and early Bally/Stern including some of the Bally home games.

#3667 4 years ago
Quoted from Zukram:

sataneatscheese Did you try the original sys11 board that you have from the parts pinbot, in your not for parts pinbot ? Saw your 2 for 1 pinbot sale add today..

https://pinside.com/pinball/market/classifieds/ad/79516

I did not. If you look at the board you can see there were a few chips damaged by battery leakage. It may still be repairable with a few dollars in parts and some soldering skills, but that's currently beyond me.

board (resized).jpgboard (resized).jpg
#3668 4 years ago
Quoted from SantaEatsCheese:

https://pinside.com/pinball/market/classifieds/ad/79516
I did not. If you look at the board you can see there were a few chips damaged by battery leakage. It may still be repairable with a few dollars in parts and some soldering skills, but that's currently beyond me.
[quoted image]

Hrmm, I guess I did not see damage from the battery (and not entirely sure what to look for, other than areas where the traces appear corroded).. I see the components src1,2,3,4,5 are missing, would guess need those. And the chip just below the batteries is already socketed, and some of the others as well.. Can you take a pic of the back of the board ? I saw mention when I was looking into mine, that the battery damage could be worse on the back if it happened on these boards..

I had alot of fun actually debugging mine recently and replacing a couple faulty things.. But there got to re-kindle old EE/lab skills, and had the basic tools on hand to do so..

3 weeks later
#3669 4 years ago

Hi everyone! I recently purchased a pinbot, and need to order a new coil for the upper pop bumper on the game. I noticed that the upper pop bumper currently has a "SG-23 850-DC" coil on it, but the other two pop bumpers have an "AE-23 800" coil. I looked in the manual and the pop bumper detail calls out for the "SG-23 850-DC" coil so this is what I am planning on buying, but just wanted to make sure this correct, since it seemed odd that not all pop bumpers have the same coil. Also, I am a total novice and this is my first pin, so thanks for your help!

#3670 4 years ago
Quoted from sixleggeddog:

Hi everyone! I recently purchased a pinbot, and need to order a new coil for the upper pop bumper on the game. I noticed that the upper pop bumper currently has a "SG-23 850-DC" coil on it, but the other two pop bumpers have an "AE-23 800" coil. I looked in the manual and the pop bumper detail calls out for the "SG-23 850-DC" coil so this is what I am planning on buying, but just wanted to make sure this correct, since it seemed odd that not all pop bumpers have the same coil. Also, I am a total novice and this is my first pin, so thanks for your help!

Quick search.... Found this: https://www.pinballmedic.net/coilchart.html

Williams Old Coil Number to New Coil Part Number Cross-Reference Chart
SG-23-850DC = AE-23-800-06

There is *alot* more info on that webpage, /me shrugs otherwise...

#3671 4 years ago
Quoted from Zukram:

Quick search.... Found this: https://www.pinballmedic.net/coilchart.html
Williams Old Coil Number to New Coil Part Number Cross-Reference Chart
SG-23-850DC = AE-23-800-06
There is *alot* more info on that webpage, /me shrugs otherwise...

Ahhhhh, that makes sense. Thanks for the help!

#3672 4 years ago

Anyone ever have issue with the ball triggering the second switch on the ramp? (The one right before the ball enters the bagatelle)

When it doesn’t hit this switch, you don’t get the jackpot!

I tried adjusting it, but it’s the type you can’t really adjust bc both ends of the switch are under the ramp.

Any thoughts?

#3673 4 years ago

You need to remove the ramp...

#3674 4 years ago
Quoted from idealjoker:

You need to remove the ramp...

Annnnnd? Cmon. You’re teasing me.

#3675 4 years ago
Quoted from Blackbeard:

Anyone ever have issue with the ball triggering the second switch on the ramp? (The one right before the ball enters the bagatelle)
When it doesn’t hit this switch, you don’t get the jackpot!
I tried adjusting it, but it’s the type you can’t really adjust bc both ends of the switch are under the ramp.
Any thoughts?

It sucks to adjust these correctly. Lots of trial and error, and it either ends up failing to trigger, or triggers too easily (as in, false triggers from surrounding vibration.)

Wish I had better advice; hopefully someone has discovered the magic trick. I kinda wonder if I could replace the leafs with sub-micros; that might make them more reliable once they're adjusted as they have a more positive make/break.

Richard

#3676 4 years ago
Quoted from Blackbeard:

Annnnnd? Cmon. You’re teasing me.

... and then you have easy access to both ramp switches on the bench ...

Yes, it's a bit of a pain to get it right, but I have not had to adjust my ramp switches at all in the last couple of years. Adjusting the switches in the visor mech was harder. The hardest of all was an inlane switch that I had to adjust over and over but it never worked for more than a few days. In the end I realized that the switch contacts were worn, replaced the switch, and have not had another issue since.

1 week later
#3677 4 years ago

Anyone have any suggestions for automotive paint codes for the cabinet red/yellow?

#3678 4 years ago

Hey guys, got a question. I'm looking at a possible pinbot purchase. Sadly its sight unseen from overseas as part of a container buy. No pictures, description says "topper broken to the half , cabinet ruined one side . playfield ok . Not work , to check , boards seems good but was stopped a lot of years"

Price is going to be around $1000 with shipping.

Seems kind of high for a sight-unseen pinbot that probably won't work but on the other hand pins are getting tough to find. What do you think?

#3679 4 years ago
Quoted from mark532011:

Hey guys, got a question. I'm looking at a possible pinbot purchase. Sadly its sight unseen from overseas as part of a container buy. No pictures, description says "topper broken to the half , cabinet ruined one side . playfield ok . Not work , to check , boards seems good but was stopped a lot of years"
Price is going to be around $1000 with shipping.
Seems kind of high for a sight-unseen pinbot that probably won't work but on the other hand pins are getting tough to find. What do you think?

Could be a nightmare. I would try to insist on pics.

#3680 4 years ago
Quoted from mark532011:

Hey guys, got a question. I'm looking at a possible pinbot purchase. Sadly its sight unseen from overseas as part of a container buy. No pictures, description says "topper broken to the half , cabinet ruined one side . playfield ok . Not work , to check , boards seems good but was stopped a lot of years"
Price is going to be around $1000 with shipping.
Seems kind of high for a sight-unseen pinbot that probably won't work but on the other hand pins are getting tough to find. What do you think?

There are sooo many pinbots out there.

I'd CERTAINLY pass.

#3681 4 years ago

I bought my ww almost like that and cheap. Time I was done could have bought a nicer one cheaper. Never again!

#3682 4 years ago

Do not spend a lot on a Pinbot, but in todays market, a $1000 pinbot that is in reasonable shape is a decent purchase, if it is mostly complete. Broke topper, busted Vortex ramp, broken lift ramp flap, mylar bubbles, broken Visor cover, broken visor plastic, broken target carrier... yeah that is the one that I would pass on. But if it has original Vortex orange ramp, no corner broke off, lift ramp in good shape, visor in good shape, topper in good shape, $1000 is a good deal. I bought mine 26 years ago in that shape and paid $750. Mine is 100% original wih the exception of the red and blue LED displays I put in to help bypass the high voltage power supply nightmares that have yet to come.

#3683 4 years ago
Quoted from Bublehead:

but in todays market, a $1000 pinbot that is in reasonable shape is a decent purchase, if it is mostly complete.

I’m not sure you can get a reasonably shaped nonworking Pinbot in today’s market for that. There are a ton of them that is for sure but I don’t see them that low anymore.

#3684 4 years ago

Anyone know where to purchase the support posts for the blue ramp along the back and what size they are? They are the posts that come up they the plastic on the outside of the ramp.

#3685 4 years ago

I've had my Pin*bot since 2006. It was clean and working to start with and I never had a need to do much to it. But I recently shopped the game and my notes can be seen at...

http://www.jeff-z.com/pinball/pinbot/repair/repair.html

004 (resized).jpg004 (resized).jpg

shop-22 (resized).jpgshop-22 (resized).jpg

1 week later
#3687 4 years ago

Can someone post a pic of this relay board? I am trying to figure out why my left side GI is out and saw this. Seems odd that the ground contact is jumped to the pad next to it.
20190706_224523 (resized).jpg20190706_224523 (resized).jpg
It is the one unscrewed in this pic. Top right underside of pf.
20190706_224537 (resized).jpg20190706_224537 (resized).jpg

#3688 4 years ago
0FF93855-7EFF-40A9-83A8-7A5AFD42C789 (resized).jpeg0FF93855-7EFF-40A9-83A8-7A5AFD42C789 (resized).jpegD5B22B4E-7F8F-4D1A-B668-47A16D0E7ED7 (resized).jpegD5B22B4E-7F8F-4D1A-B668-47A16D0E7ED7 (resized).jpeg
#3689 4 years ago

Thank you. I guess that is correct then. Except you have a capacitor soldered in there.

#3690 4 years ago
Quoted from Tomass:

I am trying to figure out why my left side GI is out and saw this.

This is your A/C relay, not a GI relay.

Quoted from Tomass:

Except you have a capacitor soldered in there.

Blackbeard has a snubber relay in place of the A/C relay, the lower pic is the GI relay.

#3691 4 years ago
Quoted from GRUMPY:

This is your A/C relay, not a GI relay.

Blackbeard has a snubber relay in place of the A/C relay, the lower pic is the GI relay.

Is there something wrong w this?

#3692 4 years ago
Quoted from GRUMPY:

This is your A/C relay, not a GI relay.

Blackbeard has a snubber relay in place of the A/C relay, the lower pic is the GI relay.

Thanks! Threw me off when I saw the 2 solder pads jumped.

#3693 4 years ago
Quoted from Tomass:

Thanks! Threw me off when I saw the 2 solder pads jumped.

This is normal for an A/C relay.

#3694 4 years ago
Quoted from Blackbeard:

Is there something wrong w this?

No, not a problem if the cap is installed reversed. But the cap and resistor are not needed.

#3695 4 years ago
Quoted from GRUMPY:

No, not a problem if the cap is installed reversed. But the cap and resistor are not needed.

I’m all belts and suspenders over here Grumpy.

1 week later
#3696 4 years ago
Quoted from lecter:

Here you are. I can take more photos if necessary.
[quoted image]

lecter It appears that the bridge rectifier fuse mod hasn't been done on your machine yet. This could cause a fire! I recommend to install a fuse (4A for 220v or 8A for 110v) before each of the 2 AC lines going to the bridges. If you've already done this please ignore. There are many videos on YouTube showing this...

Good luck!

#3697 4 years ago
Quoted from Blackbeard:

I’m all belts and suspenders over here Grumpy.

???
If it was me I would just cut off the cap. It's not needed in this case.

#3698 4 years ago
Quoted from GRUMPY:

???
If it was me I would just cut off the cap. It's not needed in this case.

Does it do any damage? Only thing I could think of is leakage>

#3699 4 years ago
Quoted from Blackbeard:

Does it do any damage? Only thing I could think of is leakage>

The leakage is just as bad as battery leakage.

#3700 4 years ago
Quoted from GRUMPY:

The leakage is just as bad as battery leakage.

Any idea why someone would put that on here if it's not factory??

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