That used to be a "go to" prank call back in the day.

"Hello.."
"Hello. I have a question for you"
"What's that?"
"Is your TV (or fridge, your choice..) running?"
"Yes"
"You better go chase it then!!"
Slam!

Those were simpler times.

rd

Regardless of the price, regardless of any issues coming in shipping, the ad says " FULL MUSEUM QUALITY RESTORATION". If I received this game, with some of the issues listed I wouldn't be thrilled either.

The game looks amazing but as stated, it should have been gone through better. ( flippers/re-flow/etc )

How exactly do you reheat boards anyway, Pre heat the oven to 350 and bake for 20 minutes? That's what I've been doing...

Depends on whether you're using a conventional or a convection oven...

Don't forget combi ovens....they steam clean the boards as they bake

Heres my two cents...... Who the fk cares what pinball pimp has into the game with his time!!!

Could have been 10k and it has no bearing on the fact that Joe paid 3200 dollars for a game thats typically on the market of 1200/1500.

So would I be pissed .... damb right !!!

Dont know Jeff , but I have dealt with Joe and he expects the best. For that kind of price the game should be perfect. Really makes me laugh when you guys jump to defend someone when its not even your cash at stake.

Also just wondering if the repair cost was overinflated what was the # offered to make things right at that point.

Also in after looking in the archive, the add states. " FULL MUSEUM QUALITY RESTORATION "

Pretty damb strong statement...... WTF . Must say it looks great from the photos though.

I think if you let someone else repair it you should always ask what you are exactly paying for. Especially when you have to communicate this towards the person you bought it from. From the P.I.M.P himself I made out that he asked for this. I wouldn't just pay someone 400 dollars if they said I let someone fix it, this is what is costs. Was this the whole problem?

interesting bit of info.

that's pretty damn funny

It's a 40-year-old game with mostly 40-year-old parts still in it traveling 1,000 miles. If you want everything to work on a 40-year-old pinball machine every time it's turned on, much less if it has traveled half way across the country, you need to find a new hobby. The old saying, "If it ain't broke, it ain't pinball" came about for a reason...

I think if you were cosmetically happy with it, then it seems pretty fair and pretty fair price. On a side note, if a tech charged you $400 for three hours of work, I need to up my rates and could actually make some money on the side repairing these things.

I used to have a jukebox rigged up the same way.

Heeeyyyyyyyyyy

For $400, you could have bought a whole new set of Altek boards and the thing would go forever.

rd

Have any of these callout threads turned out well for the OP? Lol

Everyone works themselves up into a frenzy when they feel they were somehow slighted.

It's a totally human reaction.

I've shipped games and had stuff shake loose, bulbs pop out, or solder joints break.

One guy was pissed that I had left a few screws stuck to the speaker magnet in the bottom of the cab.

Another guy was angry that the coin door was missing the Susan B Anthony coin mech (and I did not even have one to send him).

I even once sent out a set of new leg levelers that had a mismatched disc. "You don't notice this kind of thing?????"

I make mistakes, stuff happens in shipping, and I have not seen a SBA Dollar in decades.

Once people vent, everything settles down, and it's usually not a big deal.

I know Jeff personally. He's never done me wrong and I wouldn't hesitate using him for a restore.
Knowing the work that Jeff does and based upon the price you paid (shipping included) I think you received a fair deal.
You might disagree but based on current pin prices, rarity, and this kind of condition, obviously you thought so too.

I've had machines restored by Jeff and he does immaculate work and the machines are stunning.
He's always been more than fair to me and I am so picky his work always meets my standards and beyond.
I restore machines and arcades also and I know the amount of work and time that goes into these at this level.
It's a tremendous amount of work and prep and then precision execution and Jeff is an artist.
Usually they are not money makers especially at this price point.

The only failure I see here is the description of the game as "museum restored quality." If that is the case it is up to the buyer to confirm what has been done and verify it before making the purchase, no?
To call Jeff a fraud is harsh, especially when he was willing and still is to work with you. I can understand you calling him a fraud if he made no effort to reconcile any of this.

What struck me most is that the buyer complained after the fact of the price he paid with shipping - $3600, for a game even he described as cosmetically perfect (yet that buyer had no issues paying $400 for repairs).
His description of his game: "when it arrived it looked perfect. Cabinet and head were perfect."

Yet, buyer is publicly slamming the restorer as a fraud and a sham.

Joefoxx22, work it out.

Here's my little take on this. 1: Don't known Jeff but have been collecting early modle SS games for 20 years. Probably went through well over 100 Bally pins alone. The last game I sold was a Bally KOS. Had it completely torn down, flippers rebuilt, all lights working and game playing great. The guy that bought it played it once a month during my monthly pinball parties. I even delivered it to his house 8 blocks away. At least a dozen lights were out and two switches didn't work. They were all just a little tweaking to get working but you can see how easy shit happens.

I restored a FishTales for a friend. Complete tear down , re-paint, decals, powdercoating, boardwork, etc, etc.

I kept the game for 2 months after. Why? Well every night I would play it, and find something else wrong. Coil went bad, game started resetting, plastics were misaligned, bulbs were flickering because of sockets. Etc, etc. I fixed everything as I found the problems.

Finally after 2 months I gave it back. Packed it up and drove 2 hours to deliver it. When I got there 2 more bulbs were flickering. But that was all.

It went to SFGE this year and played 3 days straight with no problems.

My point. After a restore things can and will still go wrong. After delivery things can and will go wrong. And most people don't want their game kept and played for 2 months AFTER the restore. So expect some issues. Their WILL be issues. Learn how to fix things.

Maybe $3600 for three of them, if nice. Even then, it's kind of a boring pin to play.

This has been one of the most informative threads on buying an older machine and the problems that can arise when moving/shipping. Very much appreciate the experiences and details that I would never have considered before a purchase. Thanks everyone for making us more aware of the issues that we can possibly expect.

This is often why people say "wish I was closer" when a sought after game is for sale at a good price... Usually the newer collectors make a statement like that because of shipping cost, often the older players make a statement like that because of not being able to see and play the game and because of shipping risk.

I disagree. I have one and I love it. There are some of us that just like shooting for things to score points and not have to worry about rule sets. Sure, many people like the challenge, but I happen to be one who does not.

I've been playing pinball or about 40 years, and as I'm older, I play now for relaxation, and to try and achieve higher scores. I rather enjoy just batting the ball around and trying to make shots and advance bonus and multipliers to maximize my score. Worrying about completing goals to go to the next level and complete another goal just takes the enjoyment out of it for me.

Back to SBM, I agree it is repetitive, and most of the play time is spent in the lower playfield, but I don't find it boring in the least.

CHOGGARD LIVES!!!

And he complained about that? FREE SCREWS!!!

They still look the same.

IMG_3024 (resized).JPG

Me too. My current go-to game when I want a quick pinball fix.

One of my favorite Restorations by Jeff.....I have only this one picture.
It was a stunning Harlem Globe Trotter.

He added a Basketball Court inside the game!

Blew my mind!!

Harlem-Globetrotters-31 (resized).jpg

Wait! FL minimum wage is $15 per hour?

expecting a top artist to be a top tech seems silly.

How so? The typical game on the market for $1200 has a nicked up cabinet, beat up coin door, rusty legs, faded playfield with wear, off color wavy plastics, chipping backglass. This is far from that... https://pinside.com/pinball/market/classifieds/archive/44458

Well, after you finish re-pinning ALL the connectors of course...

Might as well solder in a beefy new GPE $60 rectifier board while you're at it too.

There, NOW you're bombproof RD!

This^^^

Agreed whole heartedly, thats why i charge ONLY if the problem is actually fixed. Lots of flippers running around ripping people off, you should see some of these games that I've went and fixed that one of the guys passed off at a retail price and a total piece of shit.

I was at Pimp's a few days before that game shipped out and it played flawlessly. Any insinuation of fraud is just slander.

BLUF: The more I read this thread, the more I continue to suspect new owner inexperience.

Very unfortunate, but has become common today.
This is part of the reason certain brokers will not even sell project games at times.

It's a new generation, and times have shifted, especially when someone does not recognize the value in learning why it is important to know basic repair and troubleshooting.

Money does not fix everything, but people with repair skills do.
Attacking long time collectors/restorers offering respectful advice, does not win friendship or support. There was one thing noted correctly. It still is a very small hobbyist world in pinball. Most of us do know each other. Something to consider before publicly berating anyone.

If people are consistently unhappy, the only real solution is to do the restoration work themselves and figure out their problems on their own.

This ^^^

I think more collectors should attempt a higher end restoration of a pinball machine or arcade and see the work, time, and money that goes into it all.
Then maybe they'll appreciate just what it takes.

Also if someone is legitimately willing to rectify the situation why bash him?

Don't be slammin' the SB.
It got us started.

And the award for dumbest post of the month goes to the black knight.

->>>>>>> QUIT BLAMING THE VICTIM <<<<<<-

The OP bought a terrific looking restored game and it arrived broken.

It did not break because he is the **new generation** of pinball owner, it did not break because **times have shifted**, and it certainly did not break because the op **does not recognize the value of learning**.

Sheesh.

This was not a $900 'needs a fuse', this was $3600 game that looked like dynamite. Since the game was restored, the OP expected a working game.

Everyone can understand why he was disappointed.

-

The Pimp told the OP to get a local tech to fix the game and supply a receipt.

Even if the OP had **some** repair skills, he's not going to risk messing something up and 'voiding the warranty' with the Pimp, so he did as instructed.

(Same as when I take my car to the dealership for a warranty repair. Even if I'm sure I could fix it quicker, I'm not going to risk fixing it myself and voiding my warranty)

^ DO NOT BLAME THE VICTIM for hiring someone, as instructed, with more knowledge than himself ^

----

I have customers in their 80s that no longer have the manual dexterity to even take the glass off.

I have customers that are too wealthy/busy to learn to fix a pinball machine. They just want to play, not spend hours repairing.

I have a friend who had a stroke in his 40s, still plays pinball, but sure can't solder (yet!).

I have customers who are operators, and often come across problems that are beyond their employee's skillset.

^ DO NOT BLAME THE VICTIMS because they are unable to fix their games ^

I managed to have a switch stop registering and need adjusting back after moving a game 5 feet across my basement with carpet sliders once, I was pretty impressed with myself!

Damn thats cool.... I can almost hear the squeaky shoes...

It unusual for the seller to pay for shipping. Pinball Pimp screwed up there. All liability would of been on the buyer's shoulder had he left it up to them. I think that's why you always see "for pickup only", "buyer arranges shipping"

I haven't used Pinball Pimp for any of my restorations but know he has a solid reputation. Wouldn't think twice on having him doing a cabinet repaint, playfield swap or a general shop out.

This "review" doesn't change my opinion on the guy.

Popcorn thread of the day

I bought a restored CCC from a very trusted member and a Pinside favorite on here and ended up having multiple issues as well. I spent $14K on the game and the screw from Bart was in the cabinet, the lanes going to the flipper were both too high so the ball jumped, the saloon switch was pressing against the leaf switch so I got drunk multi ball every 5 minutes, the rails weren't stuck tight enough so you could still able to wiggle the rails, etc, etc, etc.

All in all, it cost me $250 to get these and others I haven't included fixed. Also, my guy also basically go told me to fly a kite and that "all new and restored games have problems out of the box." REALLY??

FYI, Jeff (Pinball Pimp) was the one who came over to help me put the in-lanes in their correct position without ruining the perfectly clear coated playfield. Thanks again Pimp!!

I made an agreement with the seller to not publicly disclose his/her name but I feel you OP. Thing is, I think the more expense the game the more perfect the restore should be.

Just my two cents.

when did Pinside merge with Yelp?

Rating: Drama 8 out of 10, will refresh and recommend to others

BLUF: BLUF is the OG TLDR

I didn't know what BLUF(Bottom Line Up Front) stood for so I looked it up.

Now you know. And please don't use it because it's starting to annoy the shit out of me.

Or if you are that kind of person... don't buy games and ship them from remote parties that don't offer service. If you can't setup and fix your own stuff... buy from local shops who provide service.

People want to cut corners and then flail when it bites them in the ass??

Guy lists owning 26 games and 20+ in the past. How on earth does one keep that many games working without basic repair skills? Or having a regular tech on call.

If you have a regular tech and can't do anything yourself - have the common sense to have the tech there to setup and shakedown the game to ensure you have that 'hands free' experience they need.

THAT.

You pay $3600 for a game and it had better darn well arrive in perfect working order. If you think that is an unreasonable request because these games are 40 years old, and transport beats up on them, and "it played perfect when it left my driveway" then you shouldn't be selling high end, museum quality pins, or you should price that lack of service accordingly. If you haven't touched the boards or mechs and most of the changes are cosmetic then state that. Pretty much every dispute I've seen here result from assumed expectations that haven't been discussed. It is up to the buyer and seller to work out some of these "what-ifs" beforehand, but fully understand how that sometime slips thru the cracks. But lets cut to the chase, if a game was advertised on Pinside as being "museum quality" but also stated "one display out, GI not completely working, boards have not been gone thru but seems to function as expected" you wouldn't be getting $3600. It was wrong for the buyer to assume these things, but it is also incumbent upon the seller to be as thorough about what was done, what was not done, what works, what does not work, and what happens once it leaves their driveway. Both parties have some fault here, but I agree blaming the buyer is not going to be a sound way of doing business. It is easy to establish a good reputation when all goes well. It is much harder to keep a good reputation when things do not go well. When I buy from people I look specifically for feedback that says "they took care of me". If I don't see that, I price it in accordingly that the transaction is entirely as-is, where-is. The seller cannot assume if they are going to put out machines at professional seller prices, that their obligation is only supplying a "take it or leave it players condition" pin. The seller does have a good reputation, and one bad incident would not dissuade me from purchasing from them. However, it would cause me to be alot more cautious about verifying more of the "what-ifs" than just assuming they have got my back. And to the seller: if you generously pay for the shipping but make the assumption that however it comes out on the other end is none of your problem without explicitly stating such this will come back to bite you as it has here. Everyone here can communicate better, but that is especially true if the seller is likely to want to do many more transactions with this community.

Don't exactly consider paying $3600 for an early SS pin "cutting corners". Do agree that having 26 pins and no repair skills is going to be problematic and/or very expensive long term. That however is irrelevant to this discussion. The question at hand is 1) what was the warranty - stated or implied - once the pin left sellers possession and 2) what should be the warranty on a pin priced 3X over its normal pinside selling price. At those dollar figures its TNT prices and I'll bet you Todd didn't stay in business all these years saying "hey it worked when it left my shop, what do you expect for a 40 year old pin".