(Topic ID: 38508)

pinball is back big time.


By mrgone

6 years ago



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  • 95 posts
  • 42 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 6 years ago by scooter
  • Topic is favorited by 3 Pinsiders

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    11
    #1 6 years ago

    with the wonderful news from charlie about his new pinball venture,it got me thinking.
    there are now more companys/groups manufacturing games than any time since the 1950,s.

    now,some of you,will say they have not produced a game yet. this is true.however,there will be games coming this year from 2-3 new groups that have not released a game before. there are some who will say location pinball is dead. this might be true.but the more games that are released and the more people that buy games for the home the better it is for pinball.
    its a win win for all uf us and i feel the best of pinball has yet to be seen.
    fwiw, im the most excited about charlie,s game. the 1st original,unlicenced game in 14 years.

    #2 6 years ago

    One thing for sure. The last few years have been awesome compared to late 1999.

    And seem to keep getting better.

    Uncle Willy would be proud.

    LTG : )

    #3 6 years ago

    long live the silver ball

    #4 6 years ago
    Quoted from mrgone:

    its a win win for all uf us and i feel the best of pinball has yet to be seen.

    Indeed - exciting times! Hope most or all of them will make it and deliver their products as promised, otherwise it will be hard for the future new manufacturers to convince buyers to sign up.

    Quoted from mrgone:

    fwiw, im the most excited about charlie,s game. the 1st original,unlicenced game in 14 years.

    If I'am correct Quetzal Nemo is unlicenced as well! Hopefully in my home within a few months.

    #5 6 years ago

    i believe you are correct,both nemo and the new game from heighway pinball are unlicenced themes. good times for us pinheads.

    #6 6 years ago

    It's like 1934! Jpop

    #7 6 years ago

    I certainly have to agree, pins are slowly but assurredly coming back. What we really need is for the costs of these machines to make it desirable to Ops big and small to aquire and route. Either way it's a win/win situation for all pinheads.

    arcade.jpg

    #8 6 years ago

    Agree we are seeing a resurgence of the silver ball. But as the OP stated, these guys need to not only produce games, but sell them. It's also coming back with a different target. Two decades ago these games were made and targeted towards operators. Now I don't think that a ton of ops are looking to drop $7k on a WoZ. Some, yes.

    So it's coming back, but it's coming back for folks with disposable income. But the important thing is it's got more momentum than in decades!

    -1
    #9 6 years ago

    Good to see any surge. Would be better if it was operator driven, but what can you do, those days are over for good.

    #10 6 years ago
    Quoted from frolic:

    Good to see any surge. Would be better if it was operator driven, but what can you do, those days are over for good.

    maybe,maybe not. there are new arcade/bar cades opening all over the country. it is a different business model than the traditional arcade that we grew up with but its happening. i agree that we most likely will never see pins at the local 7/11 again but your local bar and grill may soon have a woz,avengers,and a jpop,heighway,or spooky pin. the best thing we as pinheads can do to help this along is to spread the news. talk to management at your local watering hole. if you belong to a pin club get your members to go anywhere that pins are. let local ops know if they have pins and keep em clean and running you will put lots of money in to them. there is a local bar and grill near me that got 1 pin in. everytime i would go in there to play i would talk to the bar tender about getting more games. he said he was getting so much good feed back that after 2 months he got 2 more games in.if pinball is going to stay active in public we have to make it happen.

    #11 6 years ago

    Why would anyone give the original post a thumbs down?

    #12 6 years ago

    Yep and with competitions growing it could be that we are only at the tip of the iceberg. If pinball gets coverage on TV like darts etc and the mainstream appreciates and understands the game then it could really take off. Pretty everyone except enthusiasts just dont know how to play, what is or where pinballs at these days.

    #13 6 years ago
    Quoted from LTG:

    One thing for sure. The last few years have been awesome compared to late 1999.
    And seem to keep getting better.
    Uncle Willy would be proud.
    LTG : )

    David Gottlieb, Ray Moloney, Harry Williams, Sam Stern and Bill O'Donnell as well.

    #14 6 years ago
    Quoted from LTG:

    One thing for sure. The last few years have been awesome compared to late 1999.
    And seem to keep getting better.
    Uncle Willy would be proud.
    LTG : )

    So you are saying Stern has been awesome? I'm assuming this is what you are saying since they are the only ones who have actually been shipping pins "the last few years".

    I'm excited about the new manufacturer's too, but I don't think we can call them "awesome" until they actually ship the pins.

    #15 6 years ago
    Quoted from RobT:

    I'm excited about the new manufacturer's too, but I don't think we can call them "awesome" until they actually ship the pins.

    +1 Yep, the proof will be in the pudding.

    #16 6 years ago

    Lots of new start-ups. That's for sure.

    #17 6 years ago

    Must have been a lot of pent up demand to create new games. When there have been ~30 games in the last 10 years or so. Lots of people have been put on hold while there was only one company making pins.

    -3
    #18 6 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    Why would anyone give the original post a thumbs down?

    Punctuation.

    #19 6 years ago
    Quoted from mrgone:

    im the most excited about charlie,s game. the 1st original,unlicenced game in 14 years.

    Me too! It's the only one (based on description) that might finally get me to buy a NIB.

    Substance>Style

    #21 6 years ago

    And to think they were outlawed at one time.

    #22 6 years ago
    Quoted from redmamanora:

    And to think they were outlawed at one time.

    They are of the Devil.

    #23 6 years ago
    Quoted from NJGecko:

    Two decades ago these games were made and targeted towards operators. Now I don't think that a ton of ops are looking to drop $7k on a WoZ.

    Two decades ago all the machines were the equivalent of Premium/LE-featured games, and now that the op-centered games are the cut down basic versions Stern is still seeing their op sales decline while enthusiast sales increase, so something is a little off there.

    In the end, for an op, price doesn't matter as long as it returns the original investment plus enough to make it worth while.

    #24 6 years ago
    Quoted from RobT:

    So you are saying Stern has been awesome? I'm assuming this is what you are saying since they are the only ones who have actually been shipping pins "the last few years".

    I've been saying that for years.

    Probably more true now than ever before.

    From Striker Extreme on, in the worst period in coin op and pinball ever. Stern managed to build some of the greatest pins ever. ( TSPP, LOTR, SM ).

    But I wasn't only thinking whole machines either. When Williams closed we wondered if we'd still be able to get basics like rubber rings and light bulbs.

    But now, thanks in large part to the hobby. More parts and whatnot are available now, than ever before.

    Hence the "and seem to be getting better".

    These are glorious times and we get to witness them.

    LTG : )

    #25 6 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    Why would anyone give the original post a thumbs down?

    It wasn't me, but it could've been. The original poster declares that pinball is back big time. Is it really? Stern shipped around 5000 games last year. During the 90's, more than half a million NIB games were sold. Over 100,000 in 1992 alone. 5000 games a year is hardly big time.

    Secondly, the poster suggests location pinball dying off is no big deal. Home buyers will fill the void. That's simply not true. Having a pin at home is luxury item most people in this country can't afford, let alone the rest of the world. Pinball will never fully recover without the location player. For more than 80 years, people have known pinball as something that is done socially away from the home. Now you usually do it alone in your basement. That's big time? I find it depressing.

    If you want pinball to come back big time, play on location regularly. If there are no good locations in your area, either put your games out or move.

    #26 6 years ago
    Quoted from LTG:

    I've been saying that for years.
    Probably more true now than ever before.
    From Striker Extreme on, in the worst period in coin op and pinball ever. Stern managed to build some of the greatest pins ever. ( TSPP, LOTR, SM ).
    But I wasn't only thinking whole machines either. When Williams closed we wondered if we'd still be able to get basics like rubber rings and light bulbs.
    But now, thanks in large part to the hobby. More parts and whatnot are available now, than ever before.
    Hence the "and seem to be getting better".
    These are glorious times and we get to witness them.
    LTG : )

    I enjoy your attitude, Lloyd.

    #27 6 years ago

    If competition leads to innovation, I can only imagine what sort of wonderful toys are yet to come.

    #28 6 years ago
    Quoted from wizzardz:

    If competition leads to innovation, I can only imagine what sort of wonderful toys are yet to come.

    That has always driven American industry.

    So I hope for all involved. Manufacturers, collectors/hobbyists, operators. Every success.

    LTG : )

    #29 6 years ago
    Quoted from phishrace:

    It wasn't me, but it could've been. The original poster declares that pinball is back big time. Is it really? Stern shipped around 5000 games last year. During the 90's, more than half a million NIB games were sold. Over 100,000 in 1992 alone. 5000 games a year is hardly big time.
    Secondly, the poster suggests location pinball dying off is no big deal. Home buyers will fill the void. That's simply not true. Having a pin at home is luxury item most people in this country can't afford, let alone the rest of the world. Pinball will never fully recover without the location player. For more than 80 years, people have known pinball as something that is done socially away from the home. Now you usually do it alone in your basement. That's big time? I find it depressing.
    If you want pinball to come back big time, play on location regularly. If there are no good locations in your area, either put your games out or move.

    Couldn't agree with you more.

    This is why we are specifically targeting operators and trying to get pinball back out into the public domain again

    Andrew

    #30 6 years ago
    Quoted from HeighwayPinball:

    This is why we are specifically targeting operators and trying to get pinball back out into the public domain again

    You have your work cut out for you then.

    Most operators aren't buying pins. Most operators won't buy from a new company. Worried about parts and tech support later.

    Best wishes. I hope you can do it.

    LTG : )

    #31 6 years ago
    Quoted from NJGecko:

    Agree we are seeing a resurgence of the silver ball. But as the OP stated, these guys need to not only produce games, but sell them. It's also coming back with a different target. Two decades ago these games were made and targeted towards operators. Now I don't think that a ton of ops are looking to drop $7k on a WoZ. Some, yes.
    So it's coming back, but it's coming back for folks with disposable income. But the important thing is it's got more momentum than in decades!

    Charlie's prices are going to be much less for NIB tha the other guys.
    A boon for the average guy and possibly operators (?).

    #32 6 years ago

    the bane of th Woz forum...go figure

    #33 6 years ago

    I actually thought that was a pretty funny answer. Many of us take the thumbs up thumbs down thing too seriously sometimes.

    #34 6 years ago
    Quoted from phishrace:

    It wasn't me, but it could've been. The original poster declares that pinball is back big time. Is it really? Stern shipped around 5000 games last year. During the 90's, more than half a million NIB games were sold. Over 100,000 in 1992 alone. 5000 games a year is hardly big time.
    Secondly, the poster suggests location pinball dying off is no big deal. Home buyers will fill the void. That's simply not true. Having a pin at home is luxury item most people in this country can't afford, let alone the rest of the world. Pinball will never fully recover without the location player. For more than 80 years, people have known pinball as something that is done socially away from the home. Now you usually do it alone in your basement. That's big time? I find it depressing.
    If you want pinball to come back big time, play on location regularly. If there are no good locations in your area, either put your games out or move.

    Geez! The guy is excited about all the new pin makers! Give him a break!
    Too many people nit picking word choices etc here...should be playing pinball!

    #35 6 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    Why would anyone give the original post a thumbs down?

    LOL! I guess Gary Stern does read this board, after all

    #36 6 years ago
    Quoted from PinballCharlie:

    LOL! I guess Gary Stern does read this board, after all

    Good one!

    #37 6 years ago
    Quoted from HeighwayPinball:

    Couldn't agree with you more.

    This is why we are specifically targeting operators and trying to get pinball back out into the public domain again

    Andrew

    Glad to hear it. Thanks for the reply. Best of luck.

    #38 6 years ago

    this is pinball,not english.

    #39 6 years ago
    Quoted from phishrace:

    It wasn't me, but it could've been. The original poster declares that pinball is back big time. Is it really? Stern shipped around 5000 games last year. During the 90's, more than half a million NIB games were sold. Over 100,000 in 1992 alone. 5000 games a year is hardly big time.
    Secondly, the poster suggests location pinball dying off is no big deal. Home buyers will fill the void. That's simply not true. Having a pin at home is luxury item most people in this country can't afford, let alone the rest of the world. Pinball will never fully recover without the location player. For more than 80 years, people have known pinball as something that is done socially away from the home. Now you usually do it alone in your basement. That's big time? I find it depressing.
    If you want pinball to come back big time, play on location regularly. If there are no good locations in your area, either put your games out or move.

    i agree with you on supporting location pinball. i do and everyone here should. if you read my 2nd post i covered that subject. the fact remains that most forms of entertainment that were once location based are now in our home. movies and arcades being the 2 most common.

    #40 6 years ago
    Quoted from LTG:

    You have your work cut out for you then.
    Most operators aren't buying pins. Most operators won't buy from a new company. Worried about parts and tech support later.
    Best wishes. I hope you can do it.
    LTG : )

    And if operators aren't buying pins, how long can collectors sustain the market? They receive next to zero wear and tear in collections, relatively speaking, are rarely dropped/crushed/parted-out or taken back out of the market or dumped out at auction. Basements are only so big, and so many places for pins to trickle out of collections into, while making room for NIB pins. And with all the new companies coming in, the word 'sustain' isn't what they're looking for, it's a word called 'growth.' And it better be a *lot* of growth, or someone is going to be left without a chair when the music stops...

    I think it will be a giant uphill battle for all the new boutique companies soon. I think everyone got the same idea at the same time, about 2-3 years ago, about 2-3 years too late. Stern through the recent LE sales (and JJP through pre-sales) will probably be the only ones who actually bank from the recent hobby explosion. I hope I'm wrong, and it'd be really cool to see location pinball thrive again, and to have the market grow enough to support a dozen thriving pinball companies. I'm rooting for it, but it does seem like a long shot.

    #41 6 years ago
    Quoted from phishrace:

    It wasn't me, but it could've been. The original poster declares that pinball is back big time. Is it really? Stern shipped around 5000 games last year. During the 90's, more than half a million NIB games were sold. Over 100,000 in 1992 alone. 5000 games a year is hardly big time.
    Secondly, the poster suggests location pinball dying off is no big deal. Home buyers will fill the void. That's simply not true. Having a pin at home is luxury item most people in this country can't afford, let alone the rest of the world. Pinball will never fully recover without the location player. For more than 80 years, people have known pinball as something that is done socially away from the home. Now you usually do it alone in your basement. That's big time? I find it depressing.
    If you want pinball to come back big time, play on location regularly. If there are no good locations in your area, either put your games out or move.

    did you even read my post? i never said location pinball dying is no big deal.

    #42 6 years ago

    Neither the Operators or collectors can live without each other. Its a synergistic need. The operators only keep pins on location because they know that if a machine stops making money a home collector will be there for him to recoup some of the cost/loss.

    The home collector needs operators or else the pin companies go out of business.

    So if one side stops, it would be disastrous.

    #43 6 years ago
    Quoted from mechslave:

    And if operators aren't buying pins, how long can collectors sustain the market?

    Well a problem we are already seeing is a lot less used games coming into the market place. Used routed games are disappearing.

    And if a collector has $6K into a new game, and wants to sell it, but get most if not all of his $6K back. Well the next guy with $6K might want the next pin coming, not a model or two old HUO one.

    Some interesting times coming up.

    LTG : )

    #44 6 years ago
    Quoted from Rick471:

    So if one side stops, it would be disastrous.

    If we aren't already close to that now.

    LTG : )

    #45 6 years ago
    Quoted from mrgone:

    the fact remains that most forms of entertainment that were once location based are now in our home. movies and arcades being the 2 most common.

    Is that a good thing? Given the choice, would you rather play minty games on location or at someone's house?

    Quoted from mrgone:

    i never said location pinball dying is no big deal.

    I didn't quote you. You said:

    Quoted from mrgone:

    there are some who will say location pinball is dead. this might be true.but the more games that are released and the more people that buy games for the home the better it is for pinball.

    Not exactly a ringing endorsement for location play.

    I didn't mean to single you out. Which is why I didn't reply directly to you. I didn't want to reply at all until someone wondered why you got a thumbs down. It's extremely frustrating to me to see folks flooding into the collector side of the hobby when the location side of the hobby is dying fast. Playing on location is more fun than playing at home. It also improves a person's social skills. Something that needs practice when you spend too much time at home. d

    #46 6 years ago
    Quoted from LTG:

    Well a problem we are already seeing is a lot less used games coming into the market place. Used routed games are disappearing.
    And if a collector has $6K into a new game, and wants to sell it, but get most if not all of his $6K back. Well the next guy with $6K might want the next pin coming, not a model or two old HUO one.
    Some interesting times coming up.
    LTG : )

    Yeah it could be that the home market will start to flood... If thats the case then will LEs go down in price in the short term.. All depends how many games get released per year from the boutique manufacturers... However given that they are the ones listening to what players/ owner want it will be interesting to see how they go..

    #47 6 years ago
    Quoted from Rick471:

    Neither the Operators or collectors can live without each other.

    Most all of the pin operators that are left are collectors. Very few strictly operator guys left any more.

    #48 6 years ago
    Quoted from mrgone:

    this is pinball,not english.

    +1 You want english?...play pool or billiards

    #49 6 years ago
    Quoted from LTG:

    You have your work cut out for you then.
    Most operators aren't buying pins. Most operators won't buy from a new company. Worried about parts and tech support later.
    Best wishes. I hope you can do it.
    LTG : )

    We don't underestimate the task in hand.

    But with the current total market being less than 10% of what it was in the 90s, and the operators market being well less that 5%, there's huge growth potential.

    Will it take time for us to establish ourselves? Probably. But we are in this for the long haul.

    #50 6 years ago

    The irony is the very thing that killed it off (video games) is a small part of it's renaissance with Ipad apps such as Pinball Arcade.

    Witness the rise in price for RBION after it's App release. Speaking for myself, I had never played it before and now can't wait to play the real deal sometime.

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