That woz has not worked (had any lights) for at least the last year...but I do love the PHOF

I hear a lot of excuses about why all the games at the PHOF are broken all the time, but plenty of places with dozens of games on the floor manage to keep them clean and functional, so those excuses sound like bullshit to me.

I always enjoy it, but sometimes you just have to make the best of it. I kind of enjoyed playing badly tilted to the side Spiderman and TAF, but I'll only play them once.

My experience was about the same. I would see a pin I really wanted to play, like MM, put money in it and it was sooo broken that I would just walk away. A lot of games weren't even leveled correctly. It's such a great place but could be soooo much better. If I lived in LV, I would actually trade my repair time for free play. I'm no maestro by any means but I can replace rubbers, level a machine, replace bulbs, solder and document other issues with different pins so a plan could be developed (sorry, I'm a Proj Mgr) to get them up and running. I bet if he were to do some kind of quartlerly all-hands, techs from the adjoining states would come down for a fixing-drinking-playing weekend. Just my .02.

I went there in 2012 and 2013 and there were a LOT of down games (not just pis). But When I went in October 2014 most of the games were up. Even Going Nuts was working.

I was there two weeks ago. Same experience with WOZ. I was there 3 different days and nobody was playing it when I'd walk down that aisle except 1 time. The fact that the lights aren't working surely doesn't help.

Did you play Big Juicy Melons? I played that more than any other pin while I was there.

I just got back from Vegas a couple weeks ago. Due to the reviews of the place I skipped going. I did find a really nice arcade in the New York, New York Casino. It was right by the roller coaster. They had:
- WWE Pro
- WOZ
- AC/DC Pro
- Mustang Pro
- Iron Man
- Avatar LE
-TF LE
- ST LE

I may be forgetting one or two as well. Right on the strip so easy to get to. All of the games were in really nice shape as well and were working 100%.

If you're even in Pittsburgh, head up to the Pennsylvania Coin-Op Hall of Fame in Hopewell. One fee, unlimited free games on all the machines, and the pinball are largely in amazing shape. I'm honored to help the two full time techs maintain the pins, and haven't seen anything wonky that goes unrepaired for more than a day or two. Even if a bulb's out, we're obsessed enough to fix it. I wish my experience here locally was the same as PHOF in Vegas. My experience was the same, and this thread has been rehashed 100 times. What an amazing place it would be, with exponentially more income (charity, whatever), if games were functional and attractively lit.

Was not aware NY NY had an arcade. I haven't been in there in 3 years (and that was only in the casino area). I'll have to check it out next time I'm there.

I didn't know that either and I go vegas every year. I was in NEW YORK NEW YORK last year. they were doing construction there. I won 200 bucks and moved on to the next casino. I do make it to the hall of fame but don't make it a point to. there more fun things in vegas to do. Soif your making a trip to go see it, pass. save your money. but I did buy a bag of weed from a guy in the video game store next door

Woz lights were out when I went approx 9 mos ago. Ironically, one of their service techs told me that jjp tech support is top notch and they'll have the lighting working soon enough. After reading the posts in this thread, makes me wonder hmmmmm

thank you! I'm staying at NYNY on business early October; hope these are still working then.

TOTAN was rough, the lamp didn't want to spin. Star Wars and Goldeneye took my money.. But yeah I still enjoyed it atleast

I confirm this, as I was there 3 weeks ago.....brutally tough to get the lightning lamp going. Mata Hari reset before I was done with ball two. Taxi played pretty good, it had purple Super Bands on it, but still good game play. AFM looks rough, but played well. EBD had a wonky flipper, but was still playable, probably played more games in it than anything else there.

A lot of their DMD games are set to 5 ball, which I think Nate says is cheating.

Taxi_PHOF.JPG

As someone who has never been to the PHoF but always wanted to go, I think my interest in going to the PHoF is mostly dead.

After playing the PAPA games at Pinburgh, and even more so, Clays games at the VFW... it would likely be a huge disappointment playing at the PHoF.

I've played 6 or 7 different WOZ's and both the machine setup and software completely define whether I enjoy the experience or not. On a fully functioning machine that is set up well, has newer/latest software, has strong flippers, I love the game. On one where any of those things are not true (setup is off somehow, software is old, or flippers are weak (maybe soft is a better description?)) then I've walked away.

My personal opinion I love the game and want to own one... but I can see how if someone only has limited experience with versions that are not maintained or setup well they can really dislike it. WOZ enjoyment seems to be more dependent on setup than any other game I've played (for minor setup issues).

Not really. In fact I'd expect a "pinball hall of fame" to have only older titles. How can a new game be Hall of Fame material yet?

It is disappointing if the games there are a mess, I'd hope at least the EMs are playable?

If you took the word "WOZ" out of this review it would describe all of location pinball. When you find games that are working well, they are fun. And when you find poorly maintained games that are broken, you don't enjoy it. I disagree with your statement that WOZ seems more dependent on that. And if you disagree, there is a Monopoly about an hour from my house that you must play to prove you can enjoy other poorly maintained games.

One thing to keep in mind is that other than the owner and his son, everyone you see working at the PHoF is a volunteer. Many of them have little to no experience repairing pins. They are there because they love pinball. The owners say that the money put in the machines goes to cover the operating costs and what is left over is donated to charity. I am not sure how much they donate per year but it would be nice to see some of that go back in to keeping the games fully working. It is a difficult and time consuming job to keep pins working. It is nearly a full time job for me to keep up 26 of them. I could not imagine the effort for as many as they have there.

To the people complaining about the PHOF,

Really?

Whine and complain about a room with hundreds of pinball games in it because the one you wanted wasn't in perfect shape?

Really?

"Oh, well... when I went there I really wanted to play game x, but it was broken. And for some reason I couldn't find a game next to the rows of dozens of others next to the dozens of others of pinball games that were there."

Really?

What is your major malfunction?!? Can't you see the heavenly incandescent glow surrounding you? Are you so narrowly focused that you can't bring yourself to play a woodrail for once? If you can't pick one, I recommend Lady Robin Hood. Sexy Amazon archers will take your mind off of the beetching and moaning that you seem to preoccupy yourselves with.

Please, feel free to go somewhere else in Las Vegas that lets you in the door for free, has a minimal cost for the amount of CONCENTRATED SHEER FRIKKIN' AWESOMENESS that few spots on this planet can try to offer. Yes... you can go to PAPA and get in free and pay for tokens... on one of the few days of the year that it is open to the general public. Yeah... maybe that's why the games at PAPA play so well. Their traffic is limited to (now) one big pinball event a year. Now Tim keeps this place open for NO PROFIT and has a support crew of VOLUNTEERS to help take care of this incredible collection all year long. Letting the PHOF crew know that a specific game is OoO helps because that's who really needs to know that a game is in need of repair/maintenance is a good thing. But instead some boneheads choose to sniveling about it... here. So, instead of being a little debbie downer... Please consider offering your repair skills or make a monetary donation to help them offset costs to repair and maintain these pin-decks. Yeah the place operates on a string. Yeah it's kind of a mess. Yeah, some of the games are not working or could be in better shape. When you have hundreds of pinball games in your collection and they are all in tip-top shape and playing perfectly... THEN you have a soapbox to stand on. In the meantime, give the people at the PHOF a break. For real. These are the good guys. This string makes me mad. So... Imma gonna go and fix one of the 40 some-odd games in my place for the next party. Goodness knows I have enough trouble keeping up with all of them as it is.

If you do not like this POV, which you are entitled to... please block/ignore my account from here forward. I am happy to wear my "Team Timmah" T-shirt all day long. By no means is this rant a negative POV regarding the PHOF or the PAPA facility. Those joints are two of the destinations for the pin-faithful. So gits yer silverball jihad on and don't forget to... HAVE FUN!

The_whiners.jpg

verucasalt.jpg

Ooooh a steakument!

I would rather have the PHOF in the state it is in now rather than no PHOF at all.....

What we're saying is how the hell does an 11 year member of Pinside NOT KNOW what the PHOF is going to be like? I mean even in a happy year 4 threads a year X 11 you've had to have known this was coming!

Facts about PHOF

First & most importantly Tim has put his personal collection out for the public to play and charges no admission charge. How many people offer their games to the public to play?

Second - 100% of the profits from PHOF go to charity and if I understand correctly Tim doesn't take a dime out for himself just money to cover operation expenses. How many of us would work 7 days a week for nothing?

Third - Tim's first love is EM machines and if you go to PHOF this shows. The best playing machine in the place are the EM's.

Fourth - anyone having a collection of 10 machines (or more) likely has machines in their line up that are not 100%. Think about what it takes to keep over 200 machines up and running.

I give Tim a lot of credit for what he does and I think he is doing his personal best for both the charities he supports & for the people interested in these machines. Could things be done better - for sure - but you can't compare PHOF to a place like VFW that is only open to the public a couple times a year. Clay has done a great job with VFW but it is like comparing apples with grapefruit.

Bottom line - anyone that knows Tim knows he doesn't give a rats ass what anyone thinks. Tim has always done it Tim's way and that will never change.

The SAD thing - if I am understanding things correctly - is PHOF will be gone once Tim is no longer willing or able to run it. He does not have a plan in place to keep it open as far as I understand and that is really sad.

Agree that any game which is not maintained reasonably well will not be fun to play. What I'm suggesting based upon my experience playing many different WOZ's is that even games which are maintained reasonably well but have a few minor things off (e.g. left to right leveling) can damage the fun factor of the game much more rapidly that other games (which are more forgiving in the fun factor for such minor things). If you don't agree that is fine... I'm just providing my opinion not saying it is universal to all.

If I am remembering correctly, they have a banner over the coin changers that says they donated $400,000.00 to the Salvation Army. Big props to Tim and PHOF....I will not hesitate to visit when I am in that area. Plenty of variety of games to play

I think what people are trying to get at is if Tim spent $35,000 or whatever per year a tech costs. That the increased quality would create more revenue, thus allowing him to donate even more money to charity.

Ok, I'm an outsider. I'm fairly new to the pinball scene. However, this topic comes up often, an here are my thoughts. Keep in mind, I've never been to the PHOF, and I have never met Tim. I am speaking strictly from what I have heard, and I am trying to stay right in the middle.

The good:
Tim has a incredible collection open to the public, one of the best collections in the world.He loves the game, and doesn't do it for the money. Most, if not all profits go to charity.He wants to bring pinball to the general public, and that is great.

The bad:
Tim sounds stubborn. He has a large operation, and it sounds like he is somewhat understaffed. Comparatively, many other similar operations seem to have a better track record regarding pinball maintenance. However, Tim is highly skilled at his trade, and when he fixes a game, it's perfect. He probably has a hard time finding someone he believes is up to his standard.

Consensus:
While stubborn, Tim loves pinball. While we can wish the PHOF was better staffed, we should accept that everyone, be it Tim Arnold, Chuck Norris, or Kate Upton, have there flaws. We should be thankful Tim does his best to get pinball in the public eye.

These PHOP threads come up here and there, and the same old bullshit gets hashed out.

If you don't like the place, DON'T GO. Stop bitching.

Stop being spoiled little princesses and be happy you were able to donate some change to charity.... AND get to play a little pinball in the process.

Well Said!

Bottom line is Tim owns the place and runs it his way. If you don't like it just don't go!

Pinball machines break. If you don't report the problem and turn them off, no one will know.

Someone opening up the game to wax and fix a rubber will never get deep enough into T2 to know the cannon is broken.

-

You can always tell the people brand new to pinball because they expect that every game should have a CPR playfield, a HEP clearcoat, Titan colored rubbers, and a bunch of mods.

The older games at PHOF have been on route for 80 years, 14 hours a day, in a busy town.

Yes, there will be some playfield wear on some games.

Yes, there will be some lights burned out in hard to reach areas.

Yes, there is a repaired ramp on some of the games.

That's what route games looked like for 99% of pinball's existence. It was not until a few years ago that people started doing high end restorations for even the crappiest games ever made.

Look at what the new Pinheads always write about the PHOF. "I went all the way to Vegas and MM was turned off!!!! WTF???" , " PHOF had terrible LED jobs on most games. I like to see all blue or red GI, so the games look fresh. Thumbs down!!!!" , "My AFM looked 1,000,000 times better than the one at PHOF. Even my wife commented. There was wear around the Stroke of Luck hole!!!! You can tell no one cares about pinball there. ." , " Out of 270 games, 14 were totally turned off (yes, I counted)!. All that money and they can't keep their games working. They need to hire some help, or I'm never going back...."

A whole new era of whining has been ushered in...

POF makes $$ hand over fist...all cash.

Get more help, the pins play like shit...sorry, but it's true.

Been there multiple times and I'll go again. But it would be nice to see the pins maintained better. I know its a full time job ++++ though

PHOF is the only place I've ever played CC, Pinball Circus, Safe Cracker, Q*Bert's Quest, Tron LE, and the first place I've ever played a majority of expensive SS machines that you just don't see on route and can only play at shows. Where the heck else are you going to play this stuff? Not to mention maybe 90% of the EMs and woodrails I've only ever played at the PHOF because they're impossible to find on location!

Who cares if T2 and WOZ don't work 100%, you can play them anywhere!

You ever heard the stories of people walking up to Tim to talk to him? They don't always end well. I bet telling him about the issues with his machines wouldn't end much better. Maybe it would? I don't know. He wears a "don't talk to me" face when he's tooling about the place.

And it makes no sense. Shocker.

You seem confused. Someone ELSE was complaining that the newest games WEREN'T there, and I pointed out that a "pinball hall of fame" wouldn't be the place to see the newest stuff.

Last I checked Lebron James isn't in the NBA Hall of Fame. But hey it's just my opinion. Who really cares?!

Even more shocking is the four up votes! Le sigh.

They make enough to pay for full time tech help. The games are in the state they are because Tim *chooses* to have it like that, because he *chooses* to do it all himself or with a few volunteers. I think that's what most people are complaining about.

Pre-PHOF: Tim had pinball passion and personality, now he seems to dislike most people and be overwhelmed with the workload.

Shit, only took me 11 games to get that way

Why go out of the way to fix much of anything if he's just gonna shut it down soon, retire, and walk away? Especially if people are currently happy to go there and play stuff unleveled and in a sometimes semi-working state?

Was there in May. I get with the amount of machines on hand that all of them will not play perfectly. The thing that got me though was 3 out of 4 games I played were not anywhere close to leveled properly. That doesn't seem like something that would be too hard to keep up with. Will definitely visit again the next time I'm in Vegas though.

Oh, and I'm pissed I didn't know about the pins in NYNY! I even stayed there.

Oh yeah.

But if you tell him what game is broken, he will ask if you turned it off, and make note.

Just don't bore him with "There is a place by our house, and they have a........"

Misread it. My bad.