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Quoted from too-many-pins:Bottom line is Tim has been doing pretty darn good for over 50 years I really don't think he needs advice how to run an arcade.
You forget, this IS Pinside, we are full of know it all's and presumptive advice.
Quoted from flynnibus:I think the ceiling height is a air movement/cooling thing... the datacenters are are built like this now too. BUTTT.. you heard how loud it was in there just with him and a few things going on in there. Can you imagine what it would be like with 400+ arcade games going on?? Hope there is a plan how that will be handled.
I would assume hanging acoustic tiles or the ceiling covered in that acoustic foam?
Quoted from iceman44:When I go to Vegas it’s not to play pinball
Sorry, no offense. I have plenty of pins at home
That said I donated to the cause
Nothing for anyone to be offended about. 99% of the people who go to Vegas are not going there to play pinball. But guess what? When they read the tourist guides of things to do, that's one of the places they end up. That thing is in every single hotel room in the Vegas area.
I go to Vegas every year in Sept to bet on Football and play 3 days of poker tournaments. Somehow, I always find 2 to 4 hours to spend at PHOF.
Tim,
I have a very serious recommendation that could potentially solve ALL the money woes.
How about selling the naming rights to the PHOF? Say a 5 or 10 year deal? To a Casino? To Amazon? To The Sands Corp.?????. They get to write it off as advertising. Could be a hell of a boost for traffic into the door as well?
The History Channel Pinball Hall Of Fame? I think you get the idea.
Jack
Quoted from chad:I like the idea, but it would feel like Tim sold out. When arenas have cool names then they change to some insurance or phone company name.
I wouldn't care if it was PHOF brought to you by Tampax. As long as the place gets open I and get to play that massive collection.
Quoted from unigroove:Here's hoping one of the bigger pinball manufacturing companies will see the potenial in the above. "Welcome to the [brand name] Pinball Hall of Fame." The sponsor pays for the signage as well. They can use the wall space on the outside by placing massive LED billboards promoting their latest games. That will make loads of people aware of the existance of such games, as well as that there is a PHOF. To a lesser extend, the same goes for the wall space on the inside and it has a decorative element to it as well.
Or maybe a big videogame manufacturer could be interested, under the condition all their games end up on the floor in a special section(provided by the manufacturer of course)? It may not be completely in line with the current plans, but to most pinheads I don't think it will make a huge difference whether there are 700 pinball machines in there, or 600 and a huge section of arcade games by the company that sponsors the location for the first 5 years or so. Fact is, whether there are 600 or 700 pinball machines in there, most people only spend one day of their visit to Vegas at the PHOF. They can't play all games during such visit. By having a videogame manufacturer as a sponsor, you might bring in a whole new audience as well.
Well, we know Gottlieb won't be one of them!
This is exactly the point of a sponsorship for the name on the building. That's all it is. They own nothing of the PHOF other than naming rights.
Quoted from mikepin:maybe borrow some money from salvation army...You gave them alot over the years. you could now use it for the building
Are you that dense?
My donation is in. We are all going to help make this happen.
I want to live to have Tim yell at me another day! I walked into PHOF one afternoon with an In N Out iced tea. As soon as my 1st quarter dropped Tim walked right up and said you need to get rid off that right now. I did feel like an idiot.
Quoted from too-many-pins:I am really sad to see there isn't much money coming in each day over the past week or so. People need to understand hitting 1/2 the goal is kind of like having enough gas to make it 1/2 way to an appointment. Yes it does help but you are still not going to make that appointment ON TIME if you have to walk the second 1/2 of the way.
Tim really needs EVERYONE who can to DIG DEEP and donate as much as possible. Coming up "a little short" isn't an option - coming up short will delay the move or kill the PHOF completely.
If I am understanding "the math" delaying moving in could cost PHOF tens of thousands of dollars a month. First off they will not be open to have revenue coming in, second they will be paying a mortgage, utilities, taxes, etc on a NEW building they can not move into, and lastly they will have to move all the machines at least two times. (Once from PHOF old location to storage then again from storage then again from storage to the new PHOF - if it ever opens). On top of that they will also have to cost of moving those machines twice and storage rent WITHOUT income coming in. PLUS the added expense of moving a couple hundred machines twice.
Not making the May 6th deadline would likely kill this project complete just based on added cost of being shut down without any revenue coming in. Originally I kept thinking - so what if they open a month or two later. Then the more I thought about it the more I realized just how bad that could end up being.
WHAT A MESS! It seems like if Tim can't come up with the needed funds this might truly be the end of his mission and the dream of moving into the great new location. All over less than the cost of a couple new pick up trucks or a dozen new pinball machines. Hard to believe this small of a percentage of the cost of the total project could spell the end of PHOF.
Sad - VERY SAD!
Someone please explain to Lassie that Timmy can only fall in the well so many times.
Folks,
I love the Pinball Hall of Fame and think Tim Arnold is a pretty damn straightforward person. He is also one hell of a shrewd businessman. Cheap by design and frugal by nature. There is no way in the blazing Las Vegas Sun that Tim is going to allow this venture to fail. Just isn't going to happen. What he is doing is using an unconventional way to raise another needed $200K, and now at this point, it's down to a $100K. If you understand business, finances and the true "costs of money" and combine that with Tim's personal version of business prowess, then you understand Tim's whole concept and reasons for this particular Go Fund Me. Standing ovation and the cover of Money magazine if he pulls this off.
All the credit in the world to Tim on this one and hey, he got my donation. I just happen to believe in his plight
Quoted from too-many-pins:Tim was also "quoted" on a recent podcast saying if he can not raise the funds the move might be dead in the water. Originally when I was reading everything posted here my first thoughts were "no big deal" but yesterday I realized this shortfall COULD actually be a huge deal for the future of PHOF.
I know I tend to post WAY TOO MUCH on some topics sometimes but my thought process is new people are always seeing a topic for the first time and only look back a few post. For anyone sick of seeing my post they can always just skip over them or hide what I am posting.
The main thing at this point is to help Tim get the money he needs to make the move ON TIME. Those who love PHOF (or what Tim does for charity) should do all they can to help. The people who really don't give a shit are likely not looking at this topic anyway.
I wish Tim & PHOF all the best. I know Tim has spent most of the past 20 years doing what he can to "give back" and I respect that more than I can put into words. There are so many selfish people in the world today it is refreshing to see someone devote the time he does (for free) and giving as much as he has to charity. He is a great example of how much one person can make a big difference.
RELAX!!
PHOF is going to happen just fine. Tim is a very smart man.
Quoted from too-many-pins:Tim isn't asking for money so he can keep that money he is asking to "borrow that money" for a short term so he can turn it into a bigger donation down the road
This $200K is 100% not borrowed, it is GIFTED money.
Definition of Borrowed Funds:
Money one has received from another party with the agreement that it will be repaid. Most borrowed funds are repaid with interest, meaning the borrower pays a certain percentage of the principal amount to the lender as compensation for borrowing.
A Go Fund Me is asking for a "GIFT" of money. Tim will not be repaying ANY of us that have donated. What Tim will do is put the money to good use so that after the debt that is owed to the lenders he has BORROWED from is paid off, he can start giving to charities again.
Are you SURE you don't have a political past?
Quoted from timarnold:the 38 foot tall word PINBALL across the front can be installed and lit.
This will be awesome to see at night time. It's just far enough south on the strip that it wont get lost with all the other lights.
Quoted from too-many-pins:But I have never seen anyone do it better and my hat is off to him for that.
Yep
Quoted from RoyF:Never been to LV. The Strip just isn't an attraction for me. But the one thing I'd really like to see in LV is the PHOF! Donation sent.
Just walk the strip and people watch. That is pure entertainment on it's own.
Quoted from MrBally:One need not go on Las Vegas Boulevard / The Strip to have fun there. There is Industrial Road, Highland Drive and Paradise Avenue to name a few other streets that can be attractive to some....
Those are the empty your wallet places.....no thanks
Quoted from too-many-pins:If I remember correctly most of the "loan money" (money borrowed for construction) was put up by Tim personally. So if PHOF falls behind with making payments it will just be money going back to Tim's account anyway.
Wait a second, back up the horse & buggy. Are you saying the $1.7 million that the PHOF has borrowed to complete this project was money loaned from Tim personally? No outside banks what so ever?
So here it is, PHOF has been built and about to be opened all on a cash basis and internal personal loans. On top of that , a go fund me to finish it all off. All in the name of charity and non-profit. Not a dime of interest paid to a financial institution.
Good god Tim should be in charge of finances for this country! I really don't ever want to see another post on how Tim should run his business. The guy is an absolute financial genius.
Bravo Tim, Bravo! I can't wait to shake his hand in Sept and tell him job well done.
Now, think for a moment of the kind of cash these operators were making in the heyday from '79 to the early 80's. Tim found a way to keep it going in the tourist city of the world.
Quoted from Clizifer:Just seen this on YouTube
Listen, I love all the "urgency" Tim has created and everyone that is helping him hit that 200K goal. However, the sky is not falling as the above blogger video suggests. Time is of the essence, that is for sure. Tim is at needing less then $78K on the go fund me, and that doesn't account for private donations.
Yes, every dollar helps and I have donated a couple of times myself. To call the project bankrupt is a bit of a reach and kind of an insult to the people you are asking money from.
Quoted from mikepin:I am slightly confused.
You ain't kidding
Obviously there are a lot of assumptions going on here based on a single tax return. Tim said all along during the building phases of the new location that donations were going to be at a bare minimum.
That being said, PHOF will never see another dime from me for completely different reasons.
Quoted from PtownPin:He clearly was never running out of money...his earnings are very high yet from what I can see he hasn't donated much money....hmmm
I will never use the term con man, but what Tim did and how he did it to get the new location built and paid for goes beyond masterful.
Quoted from Aurich:I'm not an accounting expert. But when I read this I see two things:
Revenue less expenses was $2,693,736
Net assets are $7,670,528
Can anyone explain to me how they're making $2.6 million a year, and yet every time I hear about someone stopping in they report back that half the games are broken and out of service? Is that not enough money for a couple of full time techs?
Very simple, they changed locations, not procedures.
Quoted from Aurich:That's fair.
I have no ill will towards PHOF, that would be dumb, but it makes me sad when people go and everything is broken.
This is why a full time, competent service technician needs to be hired and moved to Las Vegas with his expenses paid.
Then, guys who work on machines that want to come in for 2 to 4 weeks at time, could be brought in for pay and their expenses.
Quoted from flynnibus:I swear no one reads the PHOF threads before giving their views, even tho they have been around the entire time. It's so freaky.
PHOF used to help bring in volunteers in stints including helping with a place to stay. That went away with the old facilities. People also report getting trust from Tim is difficult. Tim reports tons of people don't actually know what they are doing and therefore picky
So there is this standoff where Tim can't get volunteers that he trusts to stick around long enough to make a sustained impact. They claim they can't get new blood in to learn because of the poor work ethics and basically lack of interest/commitment into this finite role.
The truth is probably somewhere in the middle. Impossible to find someone dedicated enough to live like Tim does... get paid peanuts.. be good enough to win Tim's trust.. and not burn up trying to keep up with a mountain of work.
Maintaining hundreds of games isn't a one man show. You need a good handful of people who can work on all generations, be willing to do so for peanuts, and be willing to face a 365 day operation. It's a tall order.
But even if you can't get a winner... they should at least be trying to make some progress. Spend and get at least some work out of it and stop expecting everyone to be like Tim. There aren't enough to go around who can afford to be that.
Absolutely. Hire a lead tech, pay him well, and let him bring aboard the rest of a crew and pay them well too. The better the experience and quality of the games from the consumer's perspective will raise the revenues to cover the expenses of the techs. It's a win-win that Tim will make every excuse not to do it. It's a control thing on his part.
Every machine that is turned off is a lost opportunity for a coin drop.
Quoted from Luckydogg420:How about 10% of income is dedicated to employees. So $200k for a couple (2-3) we’ll trained techs. I’m sure someone would do the job for $60k a year.
I was thinking more along the lines of $80 to $90K for a top tech.
As a businessman , my projections would be that if the PHOF could keep a 90% working machine percentage, they would see an immediate 25% increase of revenues. That would more than pay for a crew without a blink of an eye.
Very tough to convince an old school operater new ways of thinking.
Quoted from TreyBo69:As a land developer, that’s an insane fuck up by the surveyor. The civil engineer on record and municipal reviewers should have also noticed. Like checking the lot size, dimensions, and bearings to match the legal description and any other title research is literally the first thing you do when you setup the initial drawing.
You make an excellent point. How many hands did this pass through with approvals without even checking? In place like Vegas, especially along the airport, there should have been at minimum, 3 surveys.
Quoted from TreyBo69:I don’t think it needs all that. But whatever firm that used that survey data should have done its own title research and rechecked.
Some municipalities ask for a mathematical closure of the survey for this reason. It forces someone to punch in all the data and show an exact square footage within a certain probability, which can than be cross referenced with a city assessor/clerk
It’s also wild they would allow zero sidelot clearance for a building. Like think about it. One person builds out to their property line. How do they do that without crossing the property line? How would the neighbor ever be capable of building out to their property line? (But maybe this is just about a fence, which can be built on a property line but is often preferred to be on one side to avoid future disputes on maintenance). That’s why 5 foot is almost always the bare minimum of a side setback for a permanent structure.
FAA guidelines on properties bordering an airport. McCarren should have at least had a property line survey done from A to B.
Quoted from TreyBo69:Interesting. I've worked for an airport authority as a consultant, but never did development adjacent to an airport. Always learning new regulations...
Typical corner cutting. McCarren probably said Ok, your survey is good enough and went with it. There are all sorts of restriction on the building concerning height, lighting, entrances, everything because it's next to the airport. That's why Tim couldn't park his trailers there, FAA will not allow it post 9-11 rules.
Quoted from timarnold:I spent a lovely afternoon yesterday at the office of our architecth discussing the next step in trying to get our property line back. This is after last week where I spent a whole day going from the research collection at the library to the County Recorders office to request more documents. This is all time that should have gone into improving our product that was wasted on a mistake made by others.
As far as training and trying to get new people involved to lift some of the duties away from me, I have spent a LOT of time in the last six months getting 3 newbies up to speed on basic cleaning and flipper bumper-skills. One of them had to sell his house and move to California to care for a sick relitive. Another decided that there wasn't enough "active seniors" in his condo complex and he moved to Florida. The third, a student at the local University in Electronics got a free trip to Japan and won't be back until the middle of January.
The fact you are having to spend your time on this DOES suck. I do hope in the long run, you are compensated for the mistakes.
However, this should 100% prove to you that it is time to hire a full time head pinball technician. Pay him a proper salary and give that person the trust and reins to create a crew. You trying to train green peas while running that place is absolutely time wasted of your talents and business needs. This new facility, now more than ever, needs you to be an owner and director, not a hands on repairman or facilitator. Something has to give.
Quoted from TheOnlyest:I don't usually get involved in this kind of drama, and I wont speak ill of Tim, I certainly don't envy all the BS he has to deal with, but...
I live in Las Vegas, and I have 30 years of (SS) pinball tech experience, including becoming Bally/Williams factory trained and certified back in 1992. Plus I have a degree in electronics engineering. I was also the lead tech at the NY-NY hotel/casino arcade for just short of 4 years (2014-2018). I even have 12 B/W games of my own, all 100% clean, maintained and functional!
There have been multiple discussions over the past 6-7 years between myself and Tim, Beth, and another highly respected (but powerless) individual at PHoF, about me working full-time over there, and I've been blown off by Tim and Beth on the follow-up on every single occasion. And I feel pretty rear-ended over all of it.
I am 55 now, and this would have been a dream career change for me, and I would LOVE to get out of the casino/resort environment. But I can't and wont work for free, especially not for millionaires! I have bills to pay, and Las Vegas is a VERY expensive place to live! I must maintain at least a $75K/year salary (I am currently making more than that) to live comfortably.
Before the new building was even blueprinted, I was told they were going to shift to a for-profit model and have a paid staff, And I would be at the top of the list for lead tech. Obviously none of that was true or happened. I strongly believe, and apparently most of you guys agree, that this change of course would have certainly reversed the stigma of the PHoF being something of a pinball graveyard of dead games... Every time I think about what I could, and would have done to help that place be even more successful... I default to the text-book definition of "insanity".
I will step out on the limb and say 2 things. I believe Tim is afraid of giving up ANY control, and he is frugal.
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Crystal Lake, IL
timarnold