Maybe not a huge cost when you only look at raw material costs. But you have to pay someone to design alternate armor, develop alternate BG and cabinet artwork, write software to utilize multicolored LEDs and kickbacks and lasers, develop new CAD drawings for placement of new items, etc. I guarantee you their "cost" is higher than $200/game on an LE.

But that's not really the point - the cost for the consumer to add those same features as aftermarket mods is going to be darn close to $1500-$2000...and you can't simply install a kickback or a laser - it has to be done at a software level. Not to mention that mod costs aren't going to hold value near as much as an LE base model.

But that's the cool thing about the pro/LE model - some people pay more for the bling and some people don't. It's no different than car makers who offer multiple package levels for different buyers.

the point was, for them it's $200 in extra stuff. Of course it would cost you more than that to do it yourself. but they charge you $2k more. So that's 10X's profit margin for them to sell you an LE over a pro. when the LE/premium could have been made for the same cost of the pro in the first place. The LE/premium business model is bullshit from the start. Should never have come to this in the first place. People were just fine with one model and modding it out how they wanted.

This is so beyond off topic now. No more cliché Stern rants.

Back to Pinball Circus, please!

The most intricate and longest wireform ramp of any pinball machine ever has been completed!! Made completely by hand and we have the burn blisters from spot welding to prove it.:

circus.jpg

PS: You can watch the video on the circus maximus's facebook page

You killed the naked ballerina.

LTG : )

how it is possible to pre-order this pinball?

Its not.

Or

You put $500 in a savings account every month, then when its released in (xx) months you purchase one.

Tha ball drops very hard onto the the playfield,while leaving the ramp.

maybe this could be solved with a kind of a seesaw mechanism..

Looks pretty much like the exit of STTNGs ball entry ramp. Isn't a problem on STTNG, shouldn't be a problem here.

This quote about the wireform drop is from Pinball Inc.'s recent Facebook post: "The drop at the very bottom is going to feed into the right ramp (last one to be made) so it's a bit bumpy at the end".

It looks like this will be addressed by the drop feeding into the ramp they mention.

We actually jumped the gun and shot the video before we installed the last wireform that the long wireform feeds into.

So it does have a more gentle egress to the playfield than is shown in the video.

We will have the game at Allentown in a couple weeks, and then again at the Southern Fried Gameroom Expo in Atlanta which we are speaking at in June.

And Fingers crossed, at Pintastic in July

And in production by years end

chris

This made my day!

Looking forward to seeing you there Paul!

Chris

Just curious - and I guess this goes for all games, not just this one. Once a wireform is created, how is it mass produced so that every piece is bent and shaped correctly? Is a mold made? I've always wondered.

I believe they make a bunch of jigs for bending and welding.

We have a copy of the purchase order for the original jig tooling for Pinball Circus and it indicated a cost of around 50k just for the wireform tooling.

We have 1 scale engineering drawings of the wireforms, so we were hand bending and cutting them and setting the wires on top of the drawings to check the bends/welds, etc.

Time consuming, but it worked out pretty well after we figured out the details of it.

Just the way we like it. Preorders are for chumps.

Its what i do,I hope that by then,the Canadian dollar will be stronger

If you have 3D models then a CNC wire former will have no problem bending them. Then they just have to be jigged and welded together.

Edit - question was already asked, ignore this!

I really don't like the concept of forced exclusivity. Python had it right. Someone with real passion wants to share that passion with as many people as possible, even if it's their own downfall.

Someone who wants to feel superior to other people would see limited runs as a chance to "hang a painting on the wall". That's fine if you like that kind of stuff, just don't expect a lot of support from the 99%.

Oh snap, will we get to play something at SFGE?!!?!

Because it's stupid. They're big giant f*cking games. Play them. If you buy these big cumbersome games and don't play them...you make zero sense as a person and should immediately seek therapy. You might as well collect useless things like baseball cards and stamps, not intricate playable pieces of machinery.

I don't have the LE. I have a Premium. Mass produced, no limit. Stern games aren't something you buy to be different....there are thousands of Premiums. There's no forced exclusivity - Stern markets different models for different customers and their needs.

That's fine....but I wouldn't insult a company and their product if they chose not to. Forcing a limit is a marketing gimmick - there's no guarantee of collectibility. I have more respect for a game that doesn't have an artificial limit - that means the maker has enough confidence in the product to sell as many as there is demand for. If it becomes a collectible later down the road, so be it. Collectibles are rarely predicted to be collectible.

Once again, wrong. I didn't want something "different". Stern offered 3 variations. Pro, Premium and LE. I chose Premium because the LE was sold out and I wanted the full version, not the economy model...not because it had any kind of brag factor. There are probably more Premiums than Pros, anyway...I have the most common version. You could just as easily say someone bought the Pro to be "different"...that still doesn't make it true.

I guess that's the only thing I can agree with you on...we both want Pinball Circus, right?

-You want Pinball Circus to stare at and never play....and you don't want any one else to have it so that you may brag about yours and its value.

-I want Pinball Circus to play thousands of times with friends and family.

....and now that there's no way you can possibly have anything else to say about this...BACK TO PINBALL CIRCUS! WooooOOOOooOOoo!!!!!

I see. You live in a world where you believe everyone should get the same treatments and receive the same services and healthcare.

In your world, nothing should be privileged: No VIP, no First Class Flights, no "Fast Pass" at amusement parks, no private schools, etc, etc....

After living in places like Syria and Afghanistan, I always kiss the exclusive privileged ground of America every time the plane lands back here. I will always demand exclusivity, because I have that freedom.

Oh, you mean someone like me who has 12 pinball machines on free play at six youth centers in order to recruit the younger generation to pinball? What have you passionately done for your community in regards to pinball?

1. It is very arrogant to tell someone what to do with their money.

2. It is very arrogant to think that you speak for the entire pinball community.

If I was making this game I'd add a plaque to the apron, call it an LE, and sell it to suckers like you for twice the price.

There is this thing called a "hobby" where people collect stupid shit that they will never use.

Nobody insulted Circus Maximus. Like I mentioned before, Paul and I had a friendly discussion about this 'concern' last year.

If "forcing a limit" is a marketing gimmick, then why do so many hundreds keep falling for it every time Stern or JJP does it? Apparently others want something that is unique from standard as well.

All of my machines get played, just maybe not to the extent of your satisfaction.

My "bragging" comes from my travels around the world where true "value" exists.

One day you will wake up and learn that there is more to life than just a pinball collection.

.....Another reason why I don't play them that much.

Oh, you mean like this one? But who would fall for that?

MMR Plaque.jpg

I forgot you're still bitter about your MM dropping in value by half...you also forget that MMr is half the price MM was going for, so that little LE plaque saved people about $8000. Plus it's upgraded and brand new with better sound and lighting! LOL! Sorry your semi-exclusive MM club got destroyed.

hehe thats not very nice. The MMr is a fake anyway.. Williams didn't make it so its clearly a fake.
Would you by a fake rolex made by a diff company or a fake Ferrari made by Toyota?

hope Pinball Circus is better repro than MMr lowcost
how electronic board conception are inside ?
saving money or not, that's the question..

If it performed like the original I would not care. I would drive the piss out of it knowing I paid less for about the same thing.

I definitely believe everyone should have access to the same healthcare. No child should suffer because their parents can't afford it.

My world? Sorry man, but you don't know shit about me. I actually agree with VIP, First Class Flights, etc.....

However, I don't agree with the selfish notion that basic services should be based on income. Access to healthcare, basic foods, etc... are required by human life. VIP service and pinball machines are a luxury. That's the BIG difference. Buy as many first class tickets as you want, but enjoy your wakeup call when I sit next to you. Not everyone who can afford it likes to rub it in people's faces.

Great for you man. So underprivileged kids can have access to your pinballs, just not your doctors? Got it. What have I done? Probably nothing, and not the topic of the discussion anyway.

I'm not telling you how to spend your money. Stop twisting the argument away from the original one. I'm telling you that your desire to somehow be superior to other pinheads purely through money and forced exclusivity is a position that I don't respect at all.

You want Pinball Circus to have a limited run so that you could brag about having one. That's what I take issue with.

I don't speak for the entire community, and you aren't the only person that collects things the way you do. I speak only for myself, and I think being selfish isn't cool, end of story.

Yep. It will have limited play at Allentown since we still have the playfields that were signed by Python in it, but at the SFGE we plan to swap them out for a different set of playfields so that it can be played much more frequently.

We are also speaking at the SFGE about the project during one of the seminars.

Sweet!! Looking forward to it.

Wow. Are you serious?

I'm in agreement for those who believe that this is a game for the games sake. I love it. I always have. It may not be the best player in the world, but it dang sure is the coolest. Paul, You guys keep up the good work. I'm so excited to see Pythons original vision come to fruition. A Mad mans dream is always the most exciting.

I'll probably get chewed out for saying this, but this game is being built for Python above all others. He had a dream and he worked on the dream for years after the original protos were built. "You ain't seen nothin' yet!"

Can't wait to see this and the crew at Allentown! One of the highlights for me, for sure.

Put a credit in for me. I'll be there catching up with Paul for sure. Hard to believe it's been a year already....

-Jim

This game is going to be a b*tch to shop out.

Why would you get chewed out for that? That's the beautiful part about this project. And the crux of this whole stupid argument.

This game is being built to honor the legacy of one of our pinball heroes. I never met Python, but I'd like to think he would be happy to know it was being done with so much love, and that as many people as possible would be able to enjoy it. Maybe that's not true, but it's how I'm going to believe it.

Love all the updates, skip the drama guys, you're doing awesome work!

If they build it like the original. It is easy. The front opens up and playfield slides out. You can get at everything easily.

LTG : )
Disclaimer : Pinball Circus Cleaner and Fixer

As LTG said, it's not as bad as you'd think.

We've taken this thing apart dozens of times while test fitting parts and tweaking things and it isn't bad at all.

It's just freaking heavy. When we transport it in the trailer, we transport the cabinet and playfields separately at the moment.

We rolled it through the corridors at Expo last year all together and it's not too bad, we just don't trust it bouncing around in a trailer yet until we finalize the playfield mounting brackets, etc.

So, will you guys be at Allentown on Saturday, or just Friday? (Or both?) Saturday is the only day I'll be there and I'd really like to be able to try this game out, but if you're not going to be there Saturday I'd rather get my hopes down now rather than keeping them up and then being disappointed to find out you guys are gone on Saturday!

Both.

Yay!

How about PAGG?

Maybe put some collapsible wheels in the bottom so you can roll it around.

It actually has some wheels in the back that engage when you tip it up on it's back a little. That's what we used when wheeling it through the back alleys at Expo this year. Worked pretty darn good.