(Topic ID: 216399)

Pinball Arcade announces it won't carry Bally/Williams Tables


By uncivil_engineer

1 year ago



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  • Latest reply 1 year ago by D-Gottlieb
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There are 340 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 7.
#51 1 year ago

Time to take a backup of my games on iOS then...

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#52 1 year ago

TPA promised cabinet support & never delivered so I can’t they will be missed.

#53 1 year ago

So sad, the program is great. I literally purchased a MMR based solely on loving it so much on pinball arcade and knowing the shots are fun virtually, there going to be fun in real life. You know what I was right game is fantastic and I made tremendous mistakes before not playing games and buying and hating them. Pinball Arcade at least with old games tells me most of what I need to know.

Have most of the packs on ps4 and ios and now thinking about buying them on Steam because flat out I want to play this program for years to come.

Wish they would have a sale before this ends and somebody tell me how to get Banzai Run on some other platform than IOS or Android.

#54 1 year ago
Quoted from NeilMcRae:

So this is the license that they are taking about which I believe is PPS!

PPS collects royalties for ROMs, reproduction parts (that aren't generic), anything with WMS art on it, etc. so it's hard to believe it's not them in this case, though I'm sure there could be some exclusion for digital reproduction.

#55 1 year ago
Quoted from PW79:

TPA promised cabinet support & never delivered so I can’t they will be missed.

Werent' they pushing some proprietary cabinet?

#56 1 year ago

Odds are another developer picked up the license

Why else would someone turn down TPA?

#57 1 year ago
Quoted from cocomonkeh:

Werent' they pushing some proprietary cabinet?

Yes. Arcooda had an agreement with Farsight to use Pinball Arcade games in their cabinet. That was supposed to have happened last year but never materialized.

https://www.arcooda.com/our-software/arcooda-pinball-arcade/

#58 1 year ago
Quoted from JJHLH:

Yes. Arcooda had an agreement with Farsight to use Pinball Arcade games in their cabinet. That was supposed to have happened last year but never materialized.
https://www.arcooda.com/our-software/arcooda-pinball-arcade/

That IMO makes it even more likley someone somewhere closed a deal recently.

Bet we see a new coin op Ultrapin style game.

#59 1 year ago

Maybe the new pinball fx cabinets doing the show tour? Maybe they’ll go real tables to help sell units?

#60 1 year ago

I have played the demo tables a few times on PC and XBOX - but haven't pulled the trigger to buy a table. For those that have the game I have a few quick questions:

1. When you create an account can you login to your account and play the tables you bought on any supported device? (like PC and XBOX ONE for example)?
2. Do they have support for running the table in a way that would allow a Virtual Pin type of setup?

Thanks!

#61 1 year ago

Bummer. Who owns the Williams Bally pinball licenses?

#62 1 year ago
Quoted from Goronic:

I have played the demo tables a few times on PC and XBOX - but haven't pulled the trigger to buy a table. For those that have the game I have a few quick questions:
1. When you create an account can you login to your account and play the tables you bought on any supported device? (like PC and XBOX ONE for example)?
2. Do they have support for running the table in a way that would allow a Virtual Pin type of setup?
Thanks!

Table purchases are specific to platform. So if you want to play on PC and XBone, you need to pay twice.

Cabinet support isn't available except through the Camera Mod. They were working on it, then decided to sign an exclusive deal with another outfit for whatever reason, basically meaning that if you wanted cabinet support, you had to buy theirs. (That it hasn't come out yet is concerning on a number of levels.)

Arcooda may have just been screwed over even worse than Farsight.

Regarding potential reasons for licensing being pulled without a chance for negotiation:

Unhappy with how TPA was being handled in general. Potentially unhappy with the Arcooda deal.

This could also have been a factor if the money coming in was slowing to a trickle. It doesn't even have to get into unprofitable for the licensor, just so less profitable than before that they wonder if it's worth the hassle. Again, the Arcooda thing may have added to that. Do note that when you license something, someone at the licensor has to approve the products the licensee puts out, and that deal may well have meant more work without an expected added royalty.

It could also be that they've found another company that will give better terms, or that the company making the remakes wants less competition in the space to do additional remakes.

-1
#63 1 year ago
Quoted from InfiniteLives:

lol, dumbest post ive read in awhile. Most people playing TPA cant afford a MMr dudeee

I was referring to upcoming VR. You only quoted half my post.

#64 1 year ago
Quoted from pinballshark:

I was referring to upcoming VR. You only quoted half my post.

The other half of your post was even more idiotic, he was doing you a favor.

#65 1 year ago

Hey, that's great. Thanks.

#66 1 year ago
Quoted from bobukcat:

PPS collects royalties for ROMs, reproduction parts (that aren't generic), anything with WMS art on it, etc. so it's hard to believe it's not them in this case, though I'm sure there could be some exclusion for digital reproduction.

It has nothing to do with PPS they are a licensee of mechanical pinball and merchandise only

#67 1 year ago
Quoted from gtxjoe:

Bummer. Who owns the Williams Bally pinball licenses?

Different people for different products have licenses

Bally itself have shoes, casinos, handbags heaps of licensees of many products, look at the guys who did the phone apps, ultrapin etc

#68 1 year ago
Quoted from starbase:

So sad, the program is great. I literally purchased a MMR based solely on loving it so much on pinball arcade and knowing the shots are fun virtually, there going to be fun in real life. You know what I was right game is fantastic and I made tremendous mistakes before not playing games and buying and hating them. Pinball Arcade at least with old games tells me most of what I need to know.
Have most of the packs on ps4 and ios and now thinking about buying them on Steam because flat out I want to play this program for years to come.
Wish they would have a sale before this ends and somebody tell me how to get Banzai Run on some other platform than IOS or Android.

Banzai Run was supposed to be live with an update to TPA on PS4 yesterday. Haven't checked yet , though.

#69 1 year ago

I purchased a bunch of these Pinball Arcade "tables" on iOS but they have disappeared from my app. I have have restored my purchases from the settings, and despite it saying that the restore is complete, they are still missing. Now it seems I may never get them back with this recent news. I have emailed Farsight, but no reply yet. Anyone have any suggestions?

#70 1 year ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

They stated on FB that when it comes back to Switch, it won’t have the WMS games. I wonder if the pack I bought already will get wiped.
This sucks. Why would PPS do this!?

This is DISGUSTING!!!!!! I hate PPS, very stupid and selfish!

#71 1 year ago

Did Rick tell Farsight to put their big boy pants on?

#72 1 year ago
Quoted from Joeplainfield:

According to Farsight’s FAQ page, none of the Williams or Bally tables will go on sale bafore the license expires due to the terms of their licensing contract. There’s a story here somewhere we’ll all eventually hear.

I was under the impression that was part of their contractual agreement

#73 1 year ago
Quoted from Plungemaster:

This is DISGUSTING!!!!!! I hate PPS, very stupid and selfish!

It appears it is not PPS but Scientific Games itself (which used to be Williams)

#74 1 year ago

Did you guys go to school or just plain can't understand english

If you have a problem with your ford, would you blame Nissan

PPS have nothing to do with this stuff, they didn't license farsight, the wms rights owners did

#75 1 year ago

Does anyone know of a repository of the text instruction from the TPA machines? would be interested in getting a hold of those before the B/W games are no longer available.

#76 1 year ago

Honestly, at first I was upset and disappointed. After a few minutes to digest, is this really a bad thing? The Pinball arcade is mediocre at best. The physics are weak, the tournaments never work correctly, the graphics could be so much better. The sounds are incomplete and don't play correctly on many games, they miss simple details like correct coin doors, etc.

If these licenses went to the Pinball FX3 engine, we would finally have some amazing and CORRECTLY playing versions of these games. I have been a huge supporter of Farsight through the years buying this same broken game on PSP, Wii, Xbox 360, XBOX 1, PS4. But I think it is time to say goodbye and see what a new dev can do with this IP.

#77 1 year ago
Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

It appears it is not PPS but Scientific Games itself (which used to be Williams)

The only thing that makes me still question this is that pps hasn't chimed in to say it's not him and to make sure people aren't blaming him for it.

#78 1 year ago

Because its not his fight and nothing to do with him, he wouldn't get anything done, if he had to read every post about fake news
Just blame trump

-21
#79 1 year ago

Really don't understand what everybody is whining about.

1. It's shitty video pinball and it sucks and you shouldn't be playing it
2. you still have TWO goddamn months to stock up on all the glitchy crappy williams tables you want so you can have a completely unsatisfying fake pinball experience on your phone.

Don't really see the problem here. And we have so much to bitch about when it comes to REAL pinball stuff!

#80 1 year ago
Quoted from Blitzburgh99:

How about Scratch and Sniff stickers? Remember those?

Certainly do. We use to get them at the doctors and dentist office as a treat for being good little boys. Heres one I remembered recently and when I explained them to my younger cousins that looked at me like I was nuts. Pogs. The little cardboard discs that had pictures on them. you would stack them up, half from your stash and half from your opponents. Then smash them with a thick steel Pog called a Slammer. LMAO you cant make this shit up. I remember how pissed people were when you took their favorite Pog.

Thanks
Blake

#81 1 year ago

If you have never tried the zaccaria simulation, you should. Barely even play far sight anymore. The zaccaria has so many modes and features. All classic games and tons of newly created fictious ones as well.

#82 1 year ago
Quoted from PinSinner:

I purchased a bunch of these Pinball Arcade "tables" on iOS but they have disappeared from my app. I have have restored my purchases from the settings, and despite it saying that the restore is complete, they are still missing. Now it seems I may never get them back with this recent news. I have emailed Farsight, but no reply yet. Anyone have any suggestions?

Farsight pushed out an iOS update today with new menus that fixes this issue.

I had the same issue you described on iOS and emailed them. The tables didn’t actually disappear, but due to a bug in the software they were off the screen when you hold your device in landscape. If you rotate your device to portrait, you will see the missing tables. Shouldn’t be an issue anymore though.

26
#83 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Really don't understand what everybody is whining about.
1. It's shitty video pinball and it sucks and you shouldn't be playing it
2. you still have TWO goddamn months to stock up on all the glitchy crappy williams tables you want so you can have a completely unsatisfying fake pinball experience on your phone.
Don't really see the problem here. And we have so much to bitch about when it comes to REAL pinball stuff!

I play it all the time. You can't take a pinball machine with you when you're traveling, out somewhere, in the John, or wherever else.

Plus, not everyone can afford or has access to every title available in TPA. I probably won't ever own a MM, CV, TOTAN, MB, CC or whatnot, simply because of the crazy price tags on those games. At least I can fire up TPA and play them whenever and wherever I feel like it.

#84 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

1. It's shitty video pinball and it sucks and you shouldn't be playing it

I really enjoyed playing it on my Switch on a 5 hr plane trip. How else could I have played T2, Whitewater, Champ Pub and more on a plane?

I PM’d Farsight and they said my purchased tables will still be on the Switch version when it relaunches - unfortunately since it’s not up now, I can’t buy more games I like. I prob would have bought another pack or two.

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#85 1 year ago
Quoted from bobukcat:

The only thing that makes me still question this is that pps hasn't chimed in to say it's not him and to make sure people aren't blaming him for it.

it's not PPS. that is not how the rights works

#86 1 year ago

That sucks. Unless the right holders have other plans for virtual pinball, I think it's a big mistake. I'm one of those guys that got into pinball because of Pinball Arcade. I discovered all kinds of pins I never knew existed and was hooked. Before long, I bought my first pin. Once you start buying pins then you usually start buying parts, mods, and accessories. That's money in the pocket for all those involved with pinball.

#87 1 year ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

I probably won't ever own a MM, CV, TOTAN, MB, CC or whatnot, simply because of the crazy price tags on those games. At least I can fire up TPA and play them whenever and wherever I feel like it.

With 51 games in your collection, I'm sure you could if you really wanted to : ).

Not trying to be an ass - just kind of funny to see you say that with that many games in a collection.

#88 1 year ago

It could be as simple as Scientific games wanting more money than they previously had since "pinball is so hot right now" and Farsight just didn't see enough value in it to increase what they were paying. I know the Farsight statement was something along the lines for "they (scientific games) chose not to renew" but the end of that sentence could easily be "... at the original rate"

#89 1 year ago
Quoted from NPO:

With 51 games in your collection, I'm sure you could if you really wanted to : ).
Not trying to be an ass - just kind of funny to see you say that with that many games in a collection.

Yeah, I could probably weed out some. Most don't even break the $1k mark individually, though.

Mainly, I cringe at the prospect of dropping $8-$10k on just a single game.

#90 1 year ago
Quoted from epthegeek:

It could be as simple as Scientific games wanting more money than they previously had since "pinball is so hot right now" and Farsight just didn't see enough value in it to increase what they were paying. I know the Farsight statement was something along the lines for "they (scientific games) chose not to renew" but the end of that sentence could easily be "... at the original rate"

Speculation seems to be that they did a test run with Zen Arcade a few years ago ("Williams Classics" or something like that) and the experience (or $$$) was better than with TPA

#91 1 year ago
Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

Speculation seems to be that they did a test run with Zen Arcade a few years ago ("Williams Classics" or something like that) and the experience (or $$$) was better than with TPA

Williams Pinball Classics/Williams Pinball Hall of Fame was a Crave/Farsight production, not Zen. Where did you hear this speculation?

-7
#92 1 year ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

I play it all the time. You can't take a pinball machine with you when you're traveling, out somewhere, in the John, or wherever else.
Plus, not everyone can afford or has access to every title available in TPA. I probably won't ever own a MM, CV, TOTAN, MB, CC or whatnot, simply because of the crazy price tags on those games. At least I can fire up TPA and play them whenever and wherever I feel like it.

I dig it. I just don't see the need to play fake unsatisfying pinball when I'm on the John, on a plane, etc. I also don't see how it helps anybody who can't afford a TOTAN to have a weird fake TOTAN simulation on their phone that isn't the same thing as playing TOTAN. I am currently unable to date Kate Upton, and buying the Sports Illustrated swimsuit issue was a pretty poor simulation.

But I must concede that clearly many people DO like this novelty, so I'll just have to bitch on the sidelines.

The two month's notice should be more than enough time for everybody to buy all their favorite Williams simulations, right? What do they cost 5 bucks each? And I'm sure it should surprise nobody if they somehow magically renew this license in the not-so-distant future. It can't be rocket science.

#93 1 year ago
Quoted from epthegeek:

It could be as simple as Scientific games wanting more money than they previously had since "pinball is so hot right now" and Farsight just didn't see enough value in it to increase what they were paying.

I'm sure like anything, those tables sold well at first, then sales tapered off; so it was not worth paying an increase to renew.

So the truth might be closer to "Pinball was not hot enough right now" , or something like that.....

#94 1 year ago
Quoted from vid1900:

I'm sure like anything, those tables sold well at first, then sales tapered off; so it was not worth paying an increase to renew.
So the truth might be closer to "Pinball was not hot enough right now" , or something like that.....

Yeah, I agree with that. That also means it's unlikely that they will invest much time in maintaining and fixing these tables (they've been pretty bad at it even before...). Seems risky to buy these tables now...

10
#95 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

I dig it. I just don't see the need to play fake unsatisfying pinball when I'm on the John, on a plane, etc. I also don't see how it helps anybody who can't afford a TOTAN to have a weird fake TOTAN simulation on their phone that isn't the same thing as playing TOTAN. I am currently unable to date Kate Upton, and buying the Sports Illustrated swimsuit issue was a pretty poor simulation.
But I must concede that clearly many people DO like this novelty, so I'll just have to bitch on the sidelines.
The two month's notice should be more than enough time for everybody to buy all their favorite Williams simulations, right? What do they cost 5 bucks each? And I'm sure it should surprise nobody if they somehow magically renew this license in the not-so-distant future. It can't be rocket science.

many people play them to learn rulesets and correct decision making on the fly. Most understand that they are nothing even remotely like real pinball.
I have also used them to check for expected play mechanics when diagnosing odd things I was not sure were correct or not.

#96 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

he two month's notice should be more than enough time for everybody to buy all their favorite Williams simulations, right? What do they cost 5 bucks each? And I'm sure it should surprise nobody if they somehow magically renew this license in the not-so-distant future. It can't be rocket science.

Can’t do it on Switch cuz they pulled The Pinball Arcade within hours of launch. This is a real shame, as it’s prob the best way to play pinball on the go. Vertical orientation is great & HD rumble from the joy-cons gives you some realistic tactile feedback.

#97 1 year ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

the best way to play pinball on the go.

I agree (TPA as software being "portable"). I take my portable TPA rig to parties often, where it's constantly used for hours and hours...

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#98 1 year ago
Quoted from westofrome:

Williams Pinball Classics/Williams Pinball Hall of Fame was a Crave/Farsight production, not Zen. Where did you hear this speculation?

Hm, looking for it again, I have no idea. I must have dreamed it - I retract my post!

#99 1 year ago
Quoted from Bendit:

I agree (TPA as software being "portable"). I take my portable TPA rig to parties often, where it's constantly used for hours and hours...

GB might be the one game that plays better on a video simulation ...lol. (Just guessing it doesn't have the airballs and outlane hops...I won't buy it to find out)

#100 1 year ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

Yeah, I could probably weed out some. Most don't even break the $1k mark individually, though.
Mainly, I cringe at the prospect of dropping $8-$10k on just a single game.

When the $/sqft of real estate reaches $400 or more like it has here in the Seattle area, it'd cost you $10k to add enough space for one more pinball machine. From that standpoint, I'd cringe at finding room for a $1k machine at all. Might as well spend $10k, to maximize your value per square foot!

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