(Topic ID: 140609)

Picked up Atilla the Hun at a yard sale, everything works except...

By GeoMetry

8 years ago


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#1 8 years ago

...the left flipper. When I press the left button nothing happens except it blows the 24 volt 10 amp fuse in the PSU. I read that "This fuse will blow if the associated bridge rectifier shorts, or if there is a locked-on coil from a shorted driver transistor." I don't think the problem is the bridge rectifier because the other flipper works correctly. What does it mean to have a "Locked-on coil" how do I test for that? and how do I locate and test the driver transistor to see if it is shorted?

This is my second pin and my first post.

Thanks.

#2 8 years ago

If the fuse blows when activating the flipper, you need to look there. I would suspect one of the following:

1) The left flipper wiring (check for shorts to the frame in the switch area, and the wiring leading to/from the switch)
2) The left flipper coil
3) The left flipper coil diode has failed shorted or is installed backwards
4) The End of Stroke (EOS) switch is shorting to the metal flipper frame

#3 8 years ago

This is not a helpful reply, but I think we would like to hear about the garage sale find.

#4 8 years ago

While examining and testing the flipper mechanisms I noticed an inconsistency in the way they are wired. On the non-working flipper the second wire from the end of stroke switch is connected to the same terminal as the three gray wires and the striped end of the diode. On the working flipper the second wire from the EOS switch is connected with the striped wires to the other end of the diode. So my question is; Is this a legitimate left/right difference or something that needs to be corrected?

I think I may have exaggerated a bit when I said everything works except one flipper. There are a few burnt out bulbs, and the tilt ball is missing. I also found one wire related to the tilt mechanism disconnected at one if the connectors. The volume control rheostat crackles when adjusted and there is a very noticeable hum coming from the speaker. On the plus side the battery on the MPU is intact so I will cut that off ASAP. I paid $250 and the seller delivered it to my house. Cosmetically, the back glass is perfect but the playfield is definitely not and the cabinet is kinda scuffed up. DSC03793.jpgDSC03793.jpg

#5 8 years ago

I don't think that is the problem. While those 2 flipper coils are wired differently, the end effect is the same. If you wanted to make them the same, you would swap the grey and stripped wires. Of couse, then you would have to swap the diode direction too.

The EOS wiring you are pointing to needs to go on the terminals that allow it to short out the "hold" coil while the flipper is first engaged. It doesn't really matter which terminal the power and ground is applied (grey vs stripped wires).

Have you confirmed the rating of the fuse you are using is correct?

Use a meter to measure the resistance of the coil with the power turned off. Measure the resistance between the outside lugs and compare to the working coil. Measure twice, once with the black lead on one lug and the other time with the black lead on the other lug. This will also tell us if the diode is working. Post your measurements.

#6 8 years ago

First let me admit that I am not sure how I should set the Digital Multi Meter to check the ohms. There are several options (2M, 200K, 20K, 2K, 200 and a diode setting) I set it at 200 because all the higher settings seemed to yield zero. The result on the good (right) side was 1.5 both ways. On the bad (left) side 0.2 both ways. In all cases it took a few seconds to settle down to the reading I reported.

The Fuses I am using are Buss AGC 10 amp 250volt.

#7 8 years ago

I pulled the coil from the left flipper. I cut one end of the diode. Using the diode setting on the DMM the diode reads .000 in both directions. With the diode disconnected using the 200 setting on the DMM to test resistance on the coil it reads 23.3 across the outside lugs. Center lug to the lug with the fine wire reads 22.1. Center lug to the lug with the thicker wire reads 1.3. I'm not sure what that tells me. The one thing that seems odd to me is that there is any conductivity across the outside lugs. Each outside lug is for a separate winding, right? Is it normal to see conductivity between the outside lugs with the diode disconnected?

#8 8 years ago

On the picture to the left there is a white and gray wire together and on the left lug. On the right there is gray wire on the right lug with out a white wire from the eos switch. Usually these coils have the same lugs no matter if it's left or right because they both use the same coil.

So I'm guessing on the left coil the red wire and the gray wires are on opposite lugs. Normally if you solder the wires incorrectly like that it will fry the diode and blow the fuse. Which seems to be what happened to you. The coil should still be fine. But you would need a new diode and fuse if this was the case.

#9 8 years ago

If the diode measured 0.0 ohms in both directions, it failed shorted. Since you cut the diode out, did you try the flipper to see if it still blows the fuse? You can test it a few times without the diode in there without wrecking anything.

When you replace the diode, you can swap the wires around on the terminals if you like, just make sure to install the new diode with the band towards the grey wire.

#10 8 years ago

What do I need to know to order diodes? Specifications, recommended sellers?

#11 8 years ago
Quoted from GeoMetry:

What do I need to know to order diodes? Specifications, recommended sellers?

A 1N4004 should do it. Pretty much every electronics and pinball electronics supplier has them.

https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/proddetail.asp?prod=1N4004
http://bigdaddy-enterprises.com/electronics/e_diodes.htm

#12 8 years ago

I ordered the diodes, some bulbs and a new ball from The Pinball Resource. It seems like a very unusual business model to me. They don't take orders on their web site I had to call them on the phone, and they are sending me the parts before I pay for them.

#13 8 years ago

I replaced the diode and rewired it to match the right side flipper and it works!

Is there a reason why I should not use spade connectors and/or wire nuts when working on this (or any other) pinball machine?

#14 8 years ago
Quoted from GeoMetry:

Is there a reason why I should not use spade connectors and/or wire nuts when working on this (or any other) pinball machine?

You're just introducing a potential problem in between the wire and the coil (or whatever you're connecting). Maybe doesn't matter either way for home use, but soldering is quicker than crimping a connector anyway, so no reason not to solder. If I saw crimped connectors on a game I brought home I'd snip them off and solder to be sure its good.

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