(Topic ID: 330872)

PBR's stranglehold on Manuals over

By hockeymutt

1 year ago


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Topic Stats

  • 17 posts
  • 13 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by ForceFlow
  • No one calls this topic a favorite

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    -5
    #1 1 year ago

    .
    Bunch of BH floating around

    #3 1 year ago

    I'm an IP attorney and deal daily with federal copyrights, patents, and similar issues. I'm not licensed in New York and do not practice there, so take this with a grain of salt.

    The statute does not appear to be retroactive. It takes effect one year after it's passing. The governor's memo that accompanied its announcement says it only applies to devices manufactured after July 1, 2023. So, more of the status quo for pins.

    https://appleinsider.com/articles/22/12/29/new-york-passes-functionally-toothless-right-to-repair-bill

    #4 1 year ago

    There are a lot of loopholes and exceptions in that law, unfortunately.

    Where PBR is concerned, I think you may have missed the phrase:

    "With respect to documentation, that such documentation is made available by the original equipment manufacturer"

    PBR is not the OEM.

    You would need to contact Gottlieb...which no longer exists as a company/manufacturer.

    #5 1 year ago
    Quoted from vidguy:

    I'm an IP attorney and deal daily with federal copyrights, patents, and similar issues. I'm not licensed in New York and do not practice there, so take this with a grain of salt.
    The statute does not appear to be retroactive. It takes effect one year after it's passing. The governor's memo that accompanied its announcement says it only applies to devices manufactured after July 1, 2023. So, more of the status quo for pins.
    https://appleinsider.com/articles/22/12/29/new-york-passes-functionally-toothless-right-to-repair-bill

    Maybe the argument could be made for schematics for Stern node boards, but technically, those have been made, used, and sold prior to the effective date of the law.

    #6 1 year ago

    Well. At least there is no apostrophe with Manual this time. But, why does the word have the capital letter M?

    19
    #7 1 year ago

    Thank you Steve Young for being in business and making this avocation possible. You are indeed a godsend to this hobby. I am happy to pay you for your schematics and services that you offer. Maybe when I get to the point if not being able to or wanting to pay for these wonderful resources that you have taken time and effort to make available to all of us, I should start liquidating my machines. Once again, thank you Steve Young! What a litigious society we have become. And in my honest opinion, it stinks!

    #8 1 year ago
    Quoted from hockeymutt:

    Not sure why this hasn't been posted up here yet But NYS passed Digital Fair Repair Act (S4104-A/A7006-B), Since steve is based out of NYS, he legally has to allow public request and be made available electronically, ( he can still charge for hard copies ). See bill bellow:
    S. 4104--A 2
    THIS SUBDIVISION WITH AN UNAFFILIATED INDIVIDUAL OR BUSINESS, SHALL BE
    CONSIDERED AN AUTHORIZED REPAIR PROVIDER WITH RESPECT TO SUCH EQUIPMENT.
    (B) "DIGITAL ELECTRONIC EQUIPMENT" OR "EQUIPMENT" MEANS ANY PRODUCT
    WITH A VALUE OVER TEN DOLLARS, ADJUSTED ANNUALLY BY THE RATE OF CHANGE
    IN THE CONSUMER PRICE INDEX AS REPORTED BY THE BUREAU OF LABOR STATIS-
    TICS OF THE UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF LABOR, THAT DEPENDS FOR ITS
    FUNCTIONING, IN WHOLE OR IN PART, ON DIGITAL ELECTRONICS EMBEDDED IN OR
    ATTACHED TO THE PRODUCT.
    (C) "DOCUMENTATION" MEANS ANY MANUAL, DIAGRAM, REPORTING OUTPUT,
    SERVICE CODE DESCRIPTION, SCHEMATIC DIAGRAM, SECURITY CODES, PASSWORDS,
    OR SIMILAR KINDS OF INFORMATION USED IN EFFECTING THE SERVICES OF DIAG-
    NOSIS, MAINTENANCE, OR REPAIR OF DIGITAL ELECTRONIC EQUIPMENT.
    (D) "FAIR AND REASONABLE TERMS" MEANS MAKING AVAILABLE PARTS, TOOLS,
    OR DOCUMENTATION AS FOLLOWS:
    (I) WITH RESPECT TO DOCUMENTATION, THAT SUCH DOCUMENTATION IS MADE
    AVAILABLE BY THE ORIGINAL EQUIPMENT MANUFACTURER AT NO CHARGE, EXCEPT
    THAT, WHEN THE DOCUMENTATION IS REQUESTED IN PHYSICAL PRINTED FORM, A
    CHARGE MAY BE INCLUDED FOR THE REASONABLE ACTUAL COSTS OF PREPARING AND
    SENDING THE COPY.
    Since Steve holds the copy rights/ distribution rights to these items with in the US, he becomes the OEM in this instance. Steve yes is a business, but what he's done to limiting this info to be made public has not been in line with every other company within this Product range, to even go as far to go after a NON-profit to remove his copyrighted material from the ipdb.org.

    Don’t be obtuse. It’s not Steve with a stranglehold on manuals. The company that owns the Gottlieb copyrights are the ones that will piss in your Cheerios.
    Steve is just running his business. He’s being doing it since Gottlieb was still Gottlieb!!! I imagine he probably wasn’t the happiest when they took over and probably had to fight for the rights he has. Those IP holders are a nasty bunch at times.

    At least Gottlieb isn’t like Disney, suing dead children.

    11
    #10 1 year ago

    I wasn’t aware steve had a “stranglehold” on anything. Whenever I’ve needed schematics I can always get one for 20 bucks.

    #11 1 year ago

    Shout out for Steve and PBR. My go-to place for anything Gottlieb. Just bought a set of plastics from him that would have cost 35% more through others.

    #12 1 year ago
    Quoted from hockeymutt:

    Bunch of BH floating around

    What is a BH and why are there bunches of them?

    #13 1 year ago

    .

    #14 1 year ago

    I came in here for some Pabst blue ribbon discussion. Still don’t know what PBR is.

    #15 1 year ago
    Quoted from PoMC:

    I came in here for some paps blue ribbon discussion. Still don’t know what PBR is.

    Just a bunch of cowboys that think it is a good idea to try and ride a cow.

    #16 1 year ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    Maybe the argument could be made for schematics for Stern node boards, but technically, those have been made, used, and sold prior to the effective date of the law.

    Have you even bothered to look for them? Spike II schematics have been available for years. Literally.

    https://sternpinball.com/support/

    Take the time to actually scroll DOWN. It's all there lol.

    #17 1 year ago
    Quoted from MrMikeman:

    Have you even bothered to look for them? Spike II schematics have been available for years. Literally.
    https://sternpinball.com/support/
    Take the time to actually scroll DOWN. It's all there lol.

    Some are, sure. But not all. There's several boards, including the current MPU version, that do not have schematics listed.

    For example: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/stern-spike-schematics-coming-this-month/page/8#post-7394455

    The schematics that are currently available only account for less than half of the different boards that have been produced. The other half have no schematics, parts lists, or troubleshooting info available.

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