Quoted from scruffypinball:Whaddaya reckon a nice restore paragon is going for these days with a clear coated PF?
My last one:
https://pinside.com/pinball/market/classifieds/archive/112979
Quoted from scruffypinball:Whaddaya reckon a nice restore paragon is going for these days with a clear coated PF?
My last one:
https://pinside.com/pinball/market/classifieds/archive/112979
Quoted from pinballslave:Is that your actual game? Playfield looks amazing!!
Yes - thanks.
Quoted from pinballslave:Is that an original playfield by the way?
Yep - it was touched up and clear coated by a previous owner.
Quoted from Tuna_Delight:it was touched up and clear coated by a previous owner.
Well, he sure did an excellent job of it!!
I could use some advice...
I've finished my PF swap on my Paragon and have one problem that continues to plague me ... The upper right flipper on the bottom is lame most of the time. Note that I did a complete flipper rebuild with a new coil about a year ago but with the PF swap I replaced the flippers to a nice shiny new set. I've checked the gaps a couple of times on the switches and they seem to be reasonable. Just when I think that it is always lame, it surprises me and gives a nice kick. The lower right flipper in the set is always strong. I have confirmed that the bats are tight (set screws are tight) and are gapped the right distance from the top of the field.
Any suggestions?
Quoted from toebes:Any suggestions?
Suggest looking for a poor connection. Also, did you replace the EOS switches? If not, suggest you do, or check the resistance of them, or clean them (again). Maybe the switches are just not making good contact.
Quoted from JethroP:Suggest looking for a poor connection. Also, did you replace the EOS switches? If not, suggest you do, or check the resistance of them, or clean them (again). Maybe the switches are just not making good contact.
Good suggestion. I didn't replace them, but that's certainly next on the list. I just cleaned them again for the 5th time... but I may just pull them off completely and give them a real once over to see if it has an impact. After robotics I'll pull out the meter to see what they are like.
Quoted from toebes:Good suggestion. I didn't replace them, but that's certainly next on the list. I just cleaned them again for the 5th time... but I may just pull them off completely and give them a real once over to see if it has an impact. After robotics I'll pull out the meter to see what they are like.
After more cleaning I'm getting different inconsistent behavior so I pulled the trigger and ordered EOS switches to replace them all.
Has anyone ever encountered this?
While playing on the PF swapped machine, my wife managed to hit the ball and have it jump over the second drop down target. I don't recall ever doing that before and am curious if anyone else has seen it or knows of something I may have missed in the repopulation of the playfield.
Quoted from toebes:Has anyone ever encountered this?
While playing on the PF swapped machine, my wife managed to hit the ball and have it jump over the second drop down target. I don't recall ever doing that before and am curious if anyone else has seen it or knows of something I may have missed in the repopulation of the playfield.
[quoted image]
This has happened to me a couple times. I bet your flippers are good and strong
Quoted from Eightball88:This has happened to me a couple times. I bet your flippers are good and strong
*phew* one less thing to worry about. Now all I need to do is replace a few of the EOS switches and clean the door so I can claim victory!
Quoted from toebes:Has anyone ever encountered this?
I can't tell for sure from your photo, but is the first downed target cresting a little above the playfield?
I have wanted a Paragon for a long time but just did not have the skills to make it happen. Then about two years ago my awesome and very talented pin buddy Bill mentioned he would be willing to climb the mountain and restore a Paragon. We spent a year or so looking for a Paragon that would be suitable found it last Fall spent the last 7-8 months on it he did 99% of the work I tried to stay out of his way. I really enjoyed stenciling the cabinet as I had never done that before and a tip of the hat to pinball pimp for making an awesome product. Paragon is now ready for prime time and playing great here are a few pics from the climb up the mountain.
paragon10 (resized).jpgparagon11 (resized).jpgparagon11 (2) (resized).jpgHas anyone tried to do that reprogramming thing to add multi-ball to Paragon? It would be cool if that Treasure Chamber Saucer could lock a ball and then kick it out for multi-ball later.
Quoted from DanMarino:Has anyone tried to do that reprogramming thing to add multi-ball to Paragon? It would be cool if that Treasure Chamber Saucer could lock a ball and then kick it out for multi-ball later.
Not for Paragon but it's been done for other games that are similar. (Nitro groundshaker, Flash, Flash Gordon, Alien Poker, probably others...)
To decide if it's 'fun' in multiball toss a second ball onto the playfield and play it a little (of course, it won't 'work' properly, but at least you can see if it shoots right)
FWIW Flash was zero fun to me in this situation (that's the only one of the 3 I played). Some games just don't lend themselves to MB due to layout.
As a bonus you can learn the arduino add on coding and do it yourself (well, you could learn 6800 assembly, too, but that's a much steeper learning curve for a lot of people.... at least 2 people that are accomplished modern programmers looked at the 6800 assemblies for various classic stern games and they just glazed over....)
At some point someone will probably mash up one of the 'platforms' like MPF into the bally boardset and would make the framework REALLY easy.
Of course as well there's some hardware you'd have to deal with, adding a multiball trough, wiring, etc.
For an example of 'not fun multiball' that the manufacturers added, look no farther than Xenon. Really hard to attain the MB and there's really no point in it. Lights the spinner.
Quoted from FLASHBALL:What's the preferred method for getting these inserts flush again?
I use small mixes of epoxy and do one insert at a time...
Move lamp socket out of the way...
1) Clean the insert from all soot...
2) Carefully push the insert from the bottom of the playfield.[ not all the away out ]
3) Add fresh epoxy to lip of insert and to underside wood sides...
4) Carefully push back insert into playfield. CLEAN Up the Epoxy ASAP.
4a) Adjust insert, in case it has turned... [ follow clear coat grain on playfield
--- I use an Exacto knife to fine tune the insert/to clear coat grain ]
4b) Keep checking the insert from floating down as the epoxy dries...
Note: Put some wax cleaner on the top playfield to make the cleanup
------- from the epoxy as easy as possible.
Hello Paragon owners, I was hoping some one can post sharp clear pictures of the right playfield gate assemblies...
Many thanks in advance.
Quoted from FLASHBALL:Here's one I took from a few days ago. I had removed one of the wire gates in this picture. If you need a different angle I'd be happy to assist.
[quoted image]
The picture is excellent... @flashball
The top gate is intact ++ Bally #ASE-2250-11
The other two gates is where the problem lies...
Top middle gate is for Paragon only #ASE-2250-59
Bottom middle gate #ASE-2250-25 is only used on two games that I could find...
I am scouring Bally 1960's games to see if it is used again...
#ASE-2250-25 is used on pinball games Four Million BC & Playboy.
Thanks for taking the time from you schedule to post a very clean picture...
very much appreciated.
Quoted from vec-tor:The picture is excellent... FLASHBALL
The top gate is intact ++ Bally #ASE-2250-11
The other two gates is where the problem lies...
Top middle gate is for Paragon only #ASE-2250-59
Bottom middle gate #ASE-2250-25 is only used on two games that I could find...
I am scouring Bally 1960's games to see if it is used again...
#ASE-2250-25 is used on pinball games Four Million BC & Playboy.
Thanks for taking the time from you schedule to post a very clean picture...
very much appreciated.
Do you need a gate? Or just doing research?
Quoted from FLASHBALL:Do you need a gate? Or just doing research?
I have a Paragon that I am fixing, but as times go by, everybody does there own thing to each of there own games and it gets harder to find the correct part /position for all the small little stuff...
So I try and research the parts, and find which games uses the same parts and hope to get a set of accurate pictures of the parts and assemblies.
I put all the pictures together as a visual reference for each assembly.
"Do you need a gate"
I have made the wire forms...
I just recently been able to ID a wire form that I have had for a long time.
The wire form goes to Paragon only #M-1272-35a
which is part of ASE-2250-59 Swing Gate & Wire assembly.
People keep switching the position of the plate brackets for each of the wire forms...
Bally Firecracker uses ASE-2250-25 so that is now three games outside of Paragon that have the
same Swing Gate assembly.
Quoted from FLASHBALL:Do you need a gate? Or just doing research?
I think his answer was "no" do not need a gate...just doing research.
Can anybody post/pm me some pictures of the wiring for the lower right flipper coil wiring/EOS assembly? I think the game I have is mis-wired and I'd like some reference photos of proper working coil/EOS wiring. Much appreciated!
Quoted from PinballHelp:Can anybody post/pm me some pictures of the wiring for the lower right flipper coil wiring/EOS assembly?
Gladly.
20210910_215755 (resized).jpgHere's mine... it looks similarly wired.. but the high power portion of the coil never de-energizes.. I'm having trouble figuring it out and I replaced the coil with a new one with the same results.
I've been looking at this so long, I can't seem to figure it out - am I missing something? Maybe I need a new set of eyes?
If the flipper is held on, the coil heats up very hot - it doesn't switch to the low power loop.
It’s hard to see in your photo, but it looks like you are missing the plastic standoffs between the switch leaves that FLASHBALL’s photo shows.
Quoted from zombywoof:It’s hard to see in your photo, but it looks like you are missing the plastic standoffs between the switch leaves that FLASHBALL’s photo shows.
I have one plastic standoff, but not two like in Flashball's picture. I wonder if there's just an issue with the adjustment and travel? I'll play around with things and see.
It appears to me the very first switch leaf is broken off after the contact.
With the game off, when you manually turn the flipper pawl. Do the first two contacts open up? Then the second two close?
Take a photo with the flipper manually fully extended.
USER_SCOPED_TEMP_DATA_orca-image-1625326531 (resized).jpegThanks for the pictures - very helpful!
It turns out there were a combination of things. The wiring wasn't necessarily off but the EOS switch contacts were not properly adjusted. The NC switch would actually bounce a bit and re-fire. The contacts on the EOS were messed up and they arc'd to the point where sometimes the leaves would stick together, and then the heat made some of the switch contacts come loose. It was a combination of several things. I've ordered some new switch contacts from Pinball Life. I guess you can't get the entire assembly all at once.. you need to order the NC and NO sets separately.. so that's what I did.
Pulled and leveled a bunch of loose inserts today. They can be really tricky getting them nice and flush when they want to sink low. But I'm happy with how they turned out.
Now the hard part, waiting 24 hours for the glue to completely dry.
20211003_105605 (resized).jpgreceived_300868318070391 (resized).jpegJoined the club yesterday.
I didn't grow up with pinball and just got a few years back into playing, but Paragon and Mata Hari showed me that older machines are fun and I wanted one ever since. Before I only ever played the new shiny modern machines and walked by older ones.
Super stoked, now i have to practice tap passes
Quoted from T3quila:Joined the club yesterday. Super stoked, now i have to practice tap passes
Living dangerously I see!
Picked up a free Paragon today from a friend of a friend who just wanted it out of his basement. It turns on and starts a game but none of the coils seem to be working. I asked him if he checked the fuses. He said he didn’t think so. He did replace the solenoid board and MPU with brand new boards. The old solenoid board was fried. I’m pretty sure I can diagnose the electrical stuff and get it working.
The playfield is decent with only a bit of insert wear. Needs to be cleaned and shopped. What worries me is that the cabinet is splitting at the seams. The glass is coming out of the track (he never tried taking the glass off), and the back box has some wiggle. I’m worried that the cabinet repair is beyond my abilities.
I told him that if it becomes too much of a project for me, I would sell it and split the money with him. He was just happy someone would get it. He said he would feel bad just throwing it out.
92806C57-8E3E-4A3E-B2B7-EB7D597AB31E (resized).jpeg
E8A608A6-1D73-4C1E-803F-E4B7B7AB8568 (resized).jpeg
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4AEC92E4-598D-4BB0-8C7A-6CAAC70DD69D (resized).jpeg
Quoted from Electronmagic:Very fixable. The playfield looks decent. This will be an awesome project for someone.
Yeah, I hope it’s an awesome project for me. I just have no experience with wood working. But perhaps this will be a chance to learn. I don’t have space for it in my game room, though, so it’s sitting in a living room. I’m not sure how long I have before my wife’s patience runs out.
Quoted from Nokoro:Yeah, I hope it’s an awesome project for me. I just have no experience with wood working. But perhaps this will be a chance to learn. I don’t have space for it in my game room, though, so it’s sitting in a living room. I’m not sure how long I have before my wife’s patience runs out.
Here are different articles on cabinet repair.
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/search?s=1&what=topics&q=Cabinet+repair&topic-machine=&pinsider=&age_days=&subforum=0&sort_by=date&sort_order=DESC#results
Quoted from Nokoro:Picked up a free Paragon today from a friend of a friend who just wanted it out of his basement. It turns on and starts a game but none of the coils seem to be working. I asked him if he checked the fuses. He said he didn’t think so. He did replace the solenoid board and MPU with brand new boards. The old solenoid board was fried. I’m pretty sure I can diagnose the electrical stuff and get it working.
The playfield is decent with only a bit of insert wear. Needs to be cleaned and shopped. What worries me is that the cabinet is splitting at the seams. The glass is coming out of the track (he never tried taking the glass off), and the back box has some wiggle. I’m worried that the cabinet repair is beyond my abilities.
I told him that if it becomes too much of a project for me, I would sell it and split the money with him. He was just happy someone would get it. He said he would feel bad just throwing it out.
Paragon is working!
The main issue was one of the connectors to the rectifier board was off by one pin, so the 43 volts that was supposed to be going to the coils was going to the controlled lamps instead. All lamps were blown, and the coils weren't getting power. Got it all sorted out now and replaced the bulbs. Cleaned the game, put in new rubbers, and just played my first few games. Man, it's brutal. I need to get used to it.
I still have some work to do. Need to fix the cabinet. A few switches need adjustment. Drop targets likely need new springs. A coil needs to be replaced. And, a few sockets are having the typical Bally woes. If I get really motivated, I may try those Yoppsicle LEDs, but we'll see.
For now, I'm just glad I was able to breathe some life into it.
Was Paragon traditionally a 5 or 3 ball game on location? Or did it just depend upon the operator? I have mine set to 3 ball which is what I play on other pins. My games seem to be pretty short on Paragon though.
Quoted from Nokoro:Was Paragon traditionally a 5 or 3 ball game on location?
My city had all games on 5 balls per game til at least the mid 80's when I stopped playing on location. The price increased here before there was a change to 3 balls.
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