(Topic ID: 209108)

Original White Water Foiled Topper


By Cserold

2 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 63 posts
  • 18 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 2 years ago by Djshakes
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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There are 63 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 2.
#51 2 years ago
Quoted from Djshakes:

I still don't get why you need dies, etc. Isn't this a piece of curved plastic with a sticker on it? I would think someone could take an original and replicate.

Hi DJ,

The foil section of the decal on the WH2O waterfall topper is actually somewhat complex. It is stamped with a custom metal die that allows for the waterfall effect when the chase lights illuminate the topper in a specific sequence. I assume that the custom metal die is similar to a lithograph plate that artists use to make lithographs.

If the original custom metal die is indeed lost to time then another artist would likely need to create a new custom metal die. Certainly this could be accomplished, but it must be difficult to do or it likely would have been reproduced by now.

I have one of the WH2O waterfall topper decals that were created by Twisted Pins a few years ago and it looks fine, however the waterfall effect doesn't work at all. The etchings on the foil portion of the waterfall topper decal are not nearly deep enough for the waterfall effect to function correctly.

I was fortunate enough to find an NOS WH2O waterfall topper decal that I purchased from a collector back in February of 2009. Below is a video of my topper in action.

My apologies to the OP for getting a little off-topic in his FS thread.

Gord

#52 2 years ago
Quoted from GRB1959:

Hi DJ,
The foil section of the decal on the WH2O waterfall topper is actually somewhat complex. It is stamped with a custom metal die that allows for the waterfall effect when the chase lights illuminate the topper in specific sequence. I assume that the custom metal die is similar to a lithograph plate that artists use to make lithographs.
If the original custom metal die is indeed lost to time then another artist would likely need to create a new custom metal die. Certainly this could be accomplished, but it must be difficult to do or it likely would have been reproduced by now.
I have one of the WH2O waterfall topper decals that were created by Twisted Pins a few years ago and it looks fine, however the waterfall effect doesn't work at all. The etchings on the foil portion of the waterfall topper decal are not nearly deep enough for the waterfall effect to function correctly.
Fortunately I was able to find an NOS WH2O waterfall topper decal that I purchased from a collector back in February of 2009. Below is a video of my topper in action.
» YouTube video
My apologies to the OP for getting a little off-topic in his FS thread.
Gord

Thanks, I had a white water with a nice topper. Best topper in pinball in my opinion. I just never looked at it closely from a construction perspective. I have access to a lot of resources (graphics companies, manufacturing plants, etc.). Really tempting to explore possibilities with such a high demand.

It's funny, someone compared them to the old hamms signs with the scrolling scenes. I looked up these hamms signs and fell in love. I bought one recently for $1000. Super cool though. The already took it apart. The rippling effect is caused by plexiglass with several vertical lines. As the scroll passes over it the water effect is created.

#53 2 years ago
Quoted from GRB1959:

If the original custom metal die is indeed lost to time then another artist would likely need to create a new custom metal die.

Several years ago, the artist who originally made it said the dies no longer exist.

https://creditdotpinball.com/2014/05/22/mods-foiled-again-the-white-water-topper-reproduction/

From the comments in that article, it sounds like he might be willing to do it again, but it didn't sound like it would be cheap to have done.

Travis of the now defunct TwistedPins attempted to remake the topper, but it wasn't quite like the original. Here's a photo of the embossing die that was made early in the process:

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/announce-whitewater-foil-topper-decal-reproduction#post-865005

#54 2 years ago

The Twistedpins version had no depth. All that work and it needed a steel plate, much like an etching.

#55 2 years ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

From the comments in that article, it sounds like he might be willing to do it again, but it didn't sound like it would be cheap to have done.

How time flies. That was 4 years ago. Wonder if the artist could even be found?

#56 2 years ago
Quoted from Ericpinballfan:

How time flies. That was 4 years ago. Wonder if the artist could even be found?

Sounds like the guy who runs phoenix arcade was in contact with him. I imagine he might be able to get in touch with him again if his contact info didn't change.

#57 2 years ago

I wonder if 3D printing could somehow be used to address this problem, perhaps 3D print some type of relatively thin structure with the depth and detail then spray paint it with a thin, silver reflective paint? I don't really know much about 3D printing but if I did and had a 3D scanner it would be a fun experiment.

#58 2 years ago
Quoted from GRB1959:

Hi DJ,
The foil section of the decal on the WH2O waterfall topper is actually somewhat complex. It is stamped with a custom metal die that allows for the waterfall effect when the chase lights illuminate the topper in a specific sequence. I assume that the custom metal die is similar to a lithograph plate that artists use to make lithographs.
If the original custom metal die is indeed lost to time then another artist would likely need to create a new custom metal die. Certainly this could be accomplished, but it must be difficult to do or it likely would have been reproduced by now.
I have one of the WH2O waterfall topper decals that were created by Twisted Pins a few years ago and it looks fine, however the waterfall effect doesn't work at all. The etchings on the foil portion of the waterfall topper decal are not nearly deep enough for the waterfall effect to function correctly.
I was fortunate enough to find an NOS WH2O waterfall topper decal that I purchased from a collector back in February of 2009. Below is a video of my topper in action.
My apologies to the OP for getting a little off-topic in his FS thread.
Gord
» YouTube video

I own a printing and marketing company. I have all the presses and means to do something like this. If the original dies are gone forever I would need the original art from Phillip Grear or Rick at PPS. Most of the metal dies we make these days are made of copper. They are more durable and last longer. I am not sure what something like this would cost, but I just made a copper die for a foil stamped business card the other day and it was around $200. Twisted Pins had their work done in Germany saying that no one in the US could do something like this. I find that really hard to believe. They key to this is having the original artwork and original die specs.

#59 2 years ago
Quoted from woody76:

I own a printing and marketing company. I have all the presses and means to do something like this. If the original dies are gone forever I would need the original art from Phillip Grear or Rick at PPS. Most of the metal dies we make these days are made of copper. They are more durable and last longer. I am not sure what something like this would cost, but I just made a copper die for a foil stamped business card the other day and it was around $200. Twisted Pins had their work done in Germany saying that no one in the US could do something like this. I find that really hard to believe. They key to this is having the original artwork and original die specs.

Well, try contacting Rick and see if it's something that might be feasable.

#60 2 years ago
Quoted from woody76:

I own a printing and marketing company. I have all the presses and means to do something like this.

mbaumle said the same thing:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/announce-whitewater-foil-topper-decal-reproduction/page/17

But those of us with topper-less White Waters are still waiting for the successful repro or paying big bucks for bubbled used ones. So it must be trickier than it sounds or require a big up-front investment.

#61 2 years ago
Quoted from woody76:

I own a printing and marketing company. I have all the presses and means to do something like this. If the original dies are gone forever I would need the original art from Phillip Grear or Rick at PPS. Most of the metal dies we make these days are made of copper. They are more durable and last longer. I am not sure what something like this would cost, but I just made a copper die for a foil stamped business card the other day and it was around $200. Twisted Pins had their work done in Germany saying that no one in the US could do something like this. I find that really hard to believe. They key to this is having the original artwork and original die specs.

Could the artwork be replicated using an original? Perhaps recreated? Re-drawn?

#62 2 years ago
Quoted from Djshakes:

Could the artwork be replicated using an original? Perhaps recreated? Re-drawn?

I would be scared to try to recreate the artwork. If you did not do it correctly and spend $5000 on a die then you are screwed.

#63 2 years ago

Buy one of the repop decals. Use that to artwork to recreate. I believe it was done by the original artist.

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