Opinion: adult-themed topics should be in a private sub-forum

(Topic ID: 113848)

Opinion: adult-themed topics should be in a private sub-forum


By bkerins

4 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 845 posts
  • 153 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 years ago by Xerico
  • Topic is favorited by 6 Pinsiders

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    There are 845 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 17.
    #1 4 years ago

    I posted this to the "Hottest Girls in Pinball" topic, but I realize a lot of people may not be reading that topic for various reasons. I'd love to hear your opinions, and thanks.

    Quoted from vid1900:

    I attend many of the biggest pinball shows. I can count the number of women who are there alone (not babysitting their husbands), on one hand.

    I feel this is changing, rather quickly. The level of diversity at pinball events isn't ideal, but it's way more balanced now than it was 5 or 10 years ago. My best guess is that about 100 women will be competing at Pinburgh 2015 (http://replayfx.org/competitions/pinburgh). None of those women will be there to babysit anyone.

    Is it really true that the prevailing attitude among Pinsiders is that of vid1900's: "Good, don't get them involved"?

    I know that I can "drain" a topic, but that doesn't change its visibility to others. In my opinion, topics with "adult" content should not be visible as part of the main forum.

    When topics that frequently includes nudity and misogyny are repeatedly visible on the top page, it gives the public impression that nudity and misogyny is tolerated or encouraged. I know several people who have left Pinside completely because of this.

    In its current state, I can't recommend Pinside to anyone due to adult content. Topics with adult content, including this one, should be in a sub-forum that is not visible to the general site visitor.

    Thanks for listening to my opinion.

    #2 4 years ago

    Though I agree with you, I believe this has been requested and denied. Well spoken post.

    #3 4 years ago

    I disagree.

    OP: how would you propose thread derails such as the "Machines woman love" that was started three weeks ago should be handled? I'm referring to where sex toys were referenced among pinball machines.

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    #4 4 years ago

    What I absolutely don't agree with is the idea that if someone does not like something then everyone else should be 'protected' from it. Lots of far more offensive things out there then pinside. If you don't like something ignore it.

    #5 4 years ago

    It doesn't matter to me where it is posted.

    #6 4 years ago

    I usually filter out the EM stuff and find it useful that its in its own subforum. Its not that I'm offended by EM topics, but I have the option to keep it off my list of topics...

    Sounds like bowen is suggesting a NSFW sub-topic.

    click it on if you wanna see it, click it off if you don't.

    I think that makes sense.

    15
    #7 4 years ago

    Well I had skipped that topic because it seemed stupid, but if Bowen says there is nudity in there...

    #8 4 years ago

    I posted this in the other thread, but it is relevant here.

    Quoted from alveolus:

    The problem would be the innumerable legit threads that will have the random t&a posts. It would be very difficult for moderators to police this themselves I think. It would probably require self-policing with punitive consequences to keep "public Pinside" clean.
    It would be interesting if there were a way know how many potential Pinside users have been "run-off" as a result of the pockets of general adult and sexist content of Pinside. There is certainly merit to the discussion.
    Post edited by alveolus: Clarification

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    #9 4 years ago

    Why do we need adult threads on a pinball site? Isn't that what xtube is for?

    #10 4 years ago

    I totally agree.

    I am seeing pinball becoming more family oriented, which means more kids and more moms/wives involved at shows, tourneys, local gatherings and of course on the online forums.

    Some of language and subject matter in the posts is not helping promote pinball in a family friendly light.

    I completely understand the free speech aspect, but being circumspect with one's posts and words and respecting that others might not care for the language or subject matter does not mean one is giving up the right to express those ideas in other arenas.

    Thanks for speaking out about it. Coming from someone of your stature hopefully will carry some weight in the community.

    #11 4 years ago
    Quoted from MrBally:

    I disagree.
    OP: how would you propose thread derails such as the "Machines woman love" that was started three weeks ago should be handled? I'm referring to where sex toys were referenced among pinball machines.

    Use NSFW tags that black out images or text unless you, the reader, enable them. If you don't use them, you get warned/suspended/banned/whatever seems necessary.

    36
    #12 4 years ago

    More censorship is just what this world needs. Maybe they should also remove swearing and half naked ladies from pinball machines too.

    #13 4 years ago

    No but, it's a pinball website.

    #14 4 years ago
    Quoted from o-din:

    More censorship is just what this world needs. Maybe they should also remove swearing and half naked ladies from pinball machines too.

    It's not censorship if the content is available to the people that want it.

    #15 4 years ago

    Personally I like the TnA
    No worse than non-cable TV imo.
    I don't have Cable or anything but I recently say an advertisement on Nickalodeon promoting their NYE special to children and there was a crazy amount of TnA. The worlds view on acceptance of TnA is changing I can't see fighting the changes as working but as a compromise I will be more aware of what I post.

    Maybe Pinside needs a children mode, though that sounds like a huge headache to implement

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    15
    #17 4 years ago
    Quoted from Pdxmonkey:

    I don't have Cable or anything but I recently say an advertisement on Nickalodeon promoting their NYE special to children and there was a crazy amount of TnA.

    Not to mention ads promoting four hour erections during just about any TV show.

    #18 4 years ago
    Quoted from pinballcorpse:

    I
    Thanks for speaking out about it. Coming from someone of your stature hopefully will carry some weight in the community.

    What if exactly one other individual of equal or greater stature says the opposite?

    Also, exactly how is this stature gained; by pinball high scores? Running tournaments?

    #19 4 years ago
    Quoted from MrBally:

    I disagree.
    OP: how would you propose thread derails such as the "Machines woman love" that was started three weeks ago should be handled? I'm referring to where sex toys were referenced among pinball machines.

    Posts like that have no relationship to pinball and do not belong in a pinball forum. They should be deleted or moved to a sub-forum for off-topic adult content.

    What's the minimum age you would want someone reading Pinside? Based on what can be posted anywhere currently, the minimum age appears to be 18+.

    I suggest a sub-forum similar to the current "Off-Topic Bar", but which is "off" by default to new users or those without logins.

    10
    #20 4 years ago
    Quoted from pinballcorpse:

    Thanks for speaking out about it. Coming from someone of your stature hopefully will carry some weight in the community.

    I would hope my opinion carries just as much weight as anyone else's, and no more.

    23
    #21 4 years ago

    18+?
    Way to high imo, at 18 you can smoke and join the army.

    Have you see a PG 13 movie lately? Way heavier than Pinside.

    #22 4 years ago

    I don't think there are a lot of sub 13 year olds on pinside...I think those of us on here can handle it...

    #23 4 years ago

    tilt warnings is maybe a good idea.

    #24 4 years ago

    It's tough to censorship everything nowadays...

    #25 4 years ago

    Thinking some more about it. If I was a kid I would probably go straight to any 'adult only' threads and they would probably go way beyond what we see now so would that make it worse?

    I have two daughters and I know I can't shelter them from what is out there but I do need to be sure they are prepared to deal with what is out there.

    16
    #26 4 years ago
    Quoted from bkerins:

    Posts like that have no relationship to pinball and do not belong in a pinball forum. They should be deleted or moved to a sub-forum for off-topic adult content.
    What's the minimum age you would want someone reading Pinside? Based on what can be posted anywhere currently, the minimum age appears to be 18+.
    I suggest a sub-forum similar to the current "Off-Topic Bar", but which is "off" by default to new users or those without logins.

    I don't want to restrict pinside to anyone. Bowen, do you have children? I have two. They learned about all of the stuff you are concerned with without ever viewing Pinside. By age 14 at the latest. Hard to shield them from everything.

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    #27 4 years ago

    Isn't this why we have tilt warnings? If you don't trust your kids not to look at the occasional boob on the internet, maybe it's time to take it away, because I can assure you, they are not coming to pinside for the adult content. If your child has a genuine interest in pinball, share the internet experience with them and be a better parent for it. To expect a largely middle aged, largely male community to keep things clean enough for you is an exercise in futility. If you are a middle aged male and have a problem with the occasional breast, it's time to take stock of your life. If you're a woman, it's nothing you haven't seen before and I'm sure you'll be fine.

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    17
    #29 4 years ago

    The problem isn't with the women, it's usually with the same old people posting some random photo that has no relation to the topic at hand. It's like hanging out with a bunch of horny 12-year-olds at times and it's embarrassing browsing this site at work(on my break).

    #30 4 years ago

    I came for the pinball, I stayed for the boobie gifs.

    #31 4 years ago

    Hi roffels, welcome to the internet. First time here? Want to see a menu?

    #32 4 years ago

    No more censorship period. Let it ride. Censorship is against the constitution.

    #33 4 years ago

    It is a reasonable suggestion to move adult-oriented threads to a sub-forum, where people can permanently ignore the sub-forum as needed or be auto filtered based on age or preference at signup. However we see many instances of NSFW material in an otherwise useful thread, so it is impossible to filter out all content, for which there is the ability to "tilt" a post which works well to hide individual NSFW posts.

    Beyond that, there have been endless debates about what should/shouldn't be censored on this and other pinball related message forums, but the free speech crowd usually wins, and is it really surprising considering we have decades of pinball artwork with overt exploitation, usually of women?

    Bottom line, we are seeing an increase in participation by women and children in the hobby, so some prudence will go a long way toward expansion of the hobby beyond the core demographic, and Pinside is no longer a niche forum, it is the world-wide focal point of the hobby, er, an industry with hundreds of millions in annual revenue.

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    #34 4 years ago

    I wouldn't mind having all the "my wife won't let me " posts grouped together where those of us that are happily un-married would never have to see them again.

    #35 4 years ago
    Quoted from MrBally:

    I don't want to restrict pinside to anyone. Bowen, do you have children? I have two. They learned about all of the stuff you are concerned with without ever viewing Pinside. By age 14 at the latest. Hard to shield them from everything.

    I have a 6-year-old who loves pinball and loves to read. Do I expect him to learn about boobs by age 14... hell yes. At 6 I'm not leaving him alone to read anything on the Internet, but when it's time to give him more flexibility to read and learn on his own, Pinside is not now a community that I would want him learning from. And that sucks, because there are a lot of great people to learn from, some who are here, some who have left here, some who have never come here due to its reputation.

    Quoted from bkerins:

    When topics that frequently includes nudity and misogyny are repeatedly visible on the top page, it gives the public impression that nudity and misogyny is tolerated or encouraged. I know several people who have left Pinside completely because of this.

    In its current state, I can't recommend Pinside to anyone due to adult content.

    #36 4 years ago

    maybe we can have a womens only day each week.

    #37 4 years ago
    Quoted from bkerins:

    Do I expect him to learn about boobs by age 14

    Most of us learned about them at birth.

    #38 4 years ago
    Quoted from Baiter:

    It is a reasonable suggestion to move adult-oriented threads to a sub-forum, where people can permanently ignore the sub-forum as needed or be auto filtered based on age or preference at signup. However we see many instances of NSFW material in an otherwise useful thread, so it is impossible to filter out all content, for which there is the ability to "tilt" a post which works well to hide individual NSFW posts.
    Beyond that, there have been endless debates about what should/shouldn't be censored on this and other pinball related message forums, but the free speech crowd usually wins, and is it really surprising considering we have decades of pinball artwork with overt exploitation, usually of women?
    Bottom line, we are seeing an increase in participation by women and children in the hobby, so some prudence will go a long way toward expansion of the hobby beyond the core demographic, and Pinside is no longer a niche forum, it is the world-wide focal point of the hobby, er, an industry with hundreds of millions in annual revenue.

    You're damn right the free speech crowd usually wins, and you'd better hope that not only here, but everywhere, that it continues to do so. (Yes, I know, North Korea, most of the Middle East.) Yes, there are millions of dollars in pinball revenue per year, but pinside ain't it. The pinside admins are great folks for allowing us to have a forum to do so, but I'm sure they aren't starving to keep the site up. You have seen a decrease in the last few decades of exploitative backglasses and playfields, so call it a win. I can't believe I got dragged into a damn debate on the internet, but where free speech is concerned I'll fight to the last.

    #39 4 years ago
    Quoted from clg:

    What I absolutely don't agree with is the idea that if someone does not like something then everyone else should be 'protected' from it. Lots of far more offensive things out there then pinside. If you don't like something ignore it.

    Sigh, everywhere I look today is a straw man argument.

    No one is saying that people need to be protected from the particular culture of Pinside. It's a statement that the culture pushes people away that don't get giddy from posting animated gifs of bouncing boobies and misogynist "jokes". Not that I don't like boobies, but I come to Pinside for pinball. I have other outlets in my life for other interests.

    I certainly don't think I have the right to tell anyone else to act differently. But I think it's at least worth admitting that the culture of Pinside in general is not shared by many of the people in the hobby, and not shared by many people who could possibly enter the hobby. If people value their jokes and boobie pictures more than being inclusive of everyone who enjoys the hobby, that's fine, but be honest in what you're doing and what you want Pinside to be.

    #40 4 years ago

    i don't think any kid was ever harmed by seeing a boob. honestly, anatomy isn't the problem.

    but kids are harmed every day by dudes casually treating women as objects to be oggled, judged, owned, degraded, and so on. remember when you post anything (or say anything) you are invariably teaching others by example what is acceptable. It's a bummer that the easiest way to earn a flurry of thumbs up is to post a non-sequitor shot of some tits. Again, it's not the nudity or suggestiveness i have a problem with - it's the basic misogyny that makes that kind of post popular and acceptable. the retreat it represents from conversation back to the comfort of some basic easy socially-acceptible objectification.

    sexism is so ingrained in this culture that literally nothing is easier, safer, or less risky than posting an image that reinforces it.

    #41 4 years ago

    While at times I think there are posts (rarely threads) which stretch the limit of good taste hey this is pinball. It is made up of a collection of individuals from all corners of the globe, all walks of life, all genders & generally of adult age. Not everyone sees the world or issues as we do as individuals and the moral fabric & future of Pinball will not be determined by a few poor taste posts. I think there are some individuals here who need to lighten up & recognise that this is a world of diverging personalities, tastes & interests and I trust Pinside will continue to represent that reality.

    #42 4 years ago

    Ok. Don't treat objects like women, man. Make it a sticky,

    #43 4 years ago

    I understand Bowen's argument. I help run a forum with 200K+ members and keep it 'PG.' We have free members, paying members and advertisers who expect those standards.

    Here, it's a free forum with no paid advertising, so standards -- maybe I should say "expectations" -- are different. I don't think that would change unless membership explodes or advertisers come in.

    #44 4 years ago

    "In my opinion, topics with "adult" content should not be visible as part of the main forum. . . In its current state, I can't recommend Pinside to anyone due to adult content. " I disagree. If you don't want to recommend pinside then cool, so be it. I don't plan on recommending this website to 9-year-olds either. But I don't see how having ANY visible "adult" content is a problem. If that is your beef then the Elvira games should be "hidden". Pinball machines are not toys for children (children don't buy them, adults do) and by extension would I say a forum and site covering pinball machines for adults is not a place for children. This isn't Barney and Friends.

    #45 4 years ago

    I don't think adult content is a problem.

    However, I would also say that as a new member I was definitely surprised by the number of misogynistic threads/posts. I visit a number of other hobby / interest forums and that type of stuff isn't tolerated on other sites or at least is relegated to a sub-forum.

    #46 4 years ago
    Quoted from bkerins:

    I have a 6-year-old who loves pinball and loves to read. Do I expect him to learn about boobs by age 14... hell yes. At 6 I'm not leaving him alone to read anything on the Internet, but when it's time to give him more flexibility to read and learn on his own, Pinside is not now a community that I would want him learning from. And that sucks, because there are a lot of great people to learn from, some who are here, some who have left here, some who have never come here due to its reputation.

    Personally I'd worry about the trolls more than the boobs. They will cause a lot more psychological damage to a six year old.

    #47 4 years ago

    I've had this thought as well w/r/t an adult-oriented sub-forum.

    Maybe make it so only registered members can access it, and maybe set an age limit on registration? Pretty standard on a lot of sites.

    Obviously these safeguards can be circumvented (as anything can), but I think it would go a long way.

    #48 4 years ago
    Quoted from bkerins:

    I have a 6-year-old who loves pinball and loves to read. Do I expect him to learn about boobs by age 14... hell yes. At 6 I'm not leaving him alone to read anything on the Internet, but when it's time to give him more flexibility to read and learn on his own, Pinside is not now a community that I would want him learning from. And that sucks, because there are a lot of great people to learn from, some who are here, some who have left here, some who have never come here due to its reputation.

    Oh Bowen, You have to teach early and often. You cannot shield your son from this type of stuff anywhere. I understand what you are wanting. It starts at you as the parent. I know you know that. Censorship is not the answer. Parents explaining right and wrong.

    #49 4 years ago

    Is there a thread asking for a xxx-pinside yet?

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    #50 4 years ago
    Quoted from o-din:

    More censorship is just what this world needs.

    Somebody doesn't know what censorship is.

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