(Topic ID: 257420)

Opening Flight 2000 new software up to the community

By slochar

4 years ago


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  • 520 posts
  • 59 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by slochar
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There are 520 posts in this topic. You are on page 11 of 11.
#501 2 years ago

verified that the files there are good. Are you sure you used all the ones with the .716 extension?

If you want to just verify the chips are good and you're burning correctly just burn the original roms as listed on ipdb and make sure they work in the machine as well. (That's pretty much what I was going for with the test chip burn since it was just one chip to burn and test)

4 months later
#502 2 years ago

Looking forward to implementing this on my F2K in the next couple of weeks!

#503 2 years ago

Adapters to use 27512 eeproms instead of 2532 or 2732 chips:

2732:
http://www.ukvac.com/forum/2708-2716-2732-adapter-to-27512-eeprom_topic379758.html

The gerbers here uploaded fine to JLPCB (I had to enter the overall board size, 23mm x 45 mm). They failed at Oshpark. I don't do pcb design myself so I don't mess with these things - if I did I'd have probably modified the board to just be jumpered all the time for 2732. This board design also will replace 2716 and 2708, but I didn't test either of those. (You can get 2816 eeproms to replace 2716's if needed).

2532:
https://github.com/TheLittleEngineers/27C512E-TO-2532S-V1R1.20.APRIL.2019

The gerbers here uploaded fine to Oshpark as is so that's who I used. This one is nice in that you can select banks in the 512 chip, so if you have the pincoder test rom suite, it should work on this board.

I build several of both of these types of boards, for the 2532 I did some with the jumper headers and some just strapped to use the first 4k bank in the 512. Yes, wasteful of the chip, but as the eproms are getting older they are not programming correctly. You have to reprogram some of them many times to get a good burn. This is all fine if you are only just burning and replacing, but for my purposes I burn and erase 100s of times, and the UV ones just aren't cutting it anymore.

The eeprom version of the 512 I'm using is the winbond one, which I think is discontinued, but still available many places. I got 40 from an amazon seller a couple weeks ago and they are fine.

As things age and we just can't find stuff anymore or the stuff that's found is just too old to be reliable, adapter boards like this are going to be needed more and more.

The 2732 version is nice as well as it has a cutout on the pcb that actually allows it to be mounted on the lever type ZIF socket if needed, the cutout lets the lever engage/disengage properly. I just put the adapter boards on the cpu board sockets and put the 28 pin ZIF socket on the adapter when I'm developing the software. When I'm "done" (ha! rarely.... always tinkering) I can remove the (expensive) ZIF socket and just pop the final version into the adapter. Or use up a 2732/2532 and remove the adapter as well.

2 months later
#504 1 year ago
Quoted from Zzap:

Just did the mod to swap the walker and the coin lockout coil - what a great improvement to multiball!
It was easy to just release the pins at J5-12 and J2-8, and then cut and replace a few cable ties to then swap their positions. I don’t yet have a knocker, but may add one down the track. Oh yeah, and don’t forget dip switch 14

Which board are these pins swapped? MPU or Solenoid driver?

#505 1 year ago
Quoted from DRDAVE:

Which board are these pins swapped? MPU or Solenoid driver?

Solenoid driver

3 months later
#506 1 year ago

I have been reading and will burn the roms for this awesome rule set !
i think i have a 4x 2716 eeprom setup

if i understand correctly i can use these chips (erase and burn) using the code in https://tsqmadness.com/slochar/ZIP/
i did read the instructions and can keep the wiring stock if i want.

do i need to flash a new eeprom for audio board also ?

Thanks

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#507 1 year ago

Yes you have 2716x4. You also need either two 2716 or one 2532 for the speech card.
It will not work correctly if at all without upgrading the speech EPROM.

1 week later
#508 1 year ago

All right !
i got it burned and working,
only one issue, i left the wiring stock and set dip 14 to ON.

but when i send a ball in the walker, it stays there and nothing happens, when i flash the stock rom back on, it all works perfectly,
i wonder what did i miss.

i have version 47 of the files

thanks

#509 1 year ago

your video is private can't see.

At any rate, make sure your entry switch to the walker area comes UP when the ball goes up there. It will do as you described if it does not (stays closed). I never did figure out why that happens, because when you are in multiball and get 2 balls up there at the same time, it works as intended. (even though the switch is held shut).

I think there's some pics in this thread of how it's supposed to look with a ball up in it.

yep here:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/opening-flight-2000-new-software-up-to-the-community/page/8#post-5858074

IIRC the switch can't be down on the new software because the spinner needs to finish its scoring. Dip 14 has no effect in this case. It's a trade off I made because the spinner ripoff fix is more important to me than fooling with the entry switch. Trust me when I say that the rom is full, it's full. Although there are currently more bytes free than the stock rom, it is only that.... bytes. I think 14 free? Not enough to change the switch behavior to any other way.

#510 1 year ago
Quoted from slochar:

your video is private can't see.
At any rate, make sure your entry switch to the walker area comes UP when the ball goes up there. It will do as you described if it does not (stays closed). I never did figure out why that happens, because when you are in multiball and get 2 balls up there at the same time, it works as intended. (even though the switch is held shut).
I think there's some pics in this thread of how it's supposed to look with a ball up in it.
yep here:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/opening-flight-2000-new-software-up-to-the-community/page/8#post-5858074
IIRC the switch can't be down on the new software because the spinner needs to finish its scoring. Dip 14 has no effect in this case. It's a trade off I made because the spinner ripoff fix is more important to me than fooling with the entry switch. Trust me when I say that the rom is full, it's full. Although there are currently more bytes free than the stock rom, it is only that.... bytes. I think 14 free? Not enough to change the switch behavior to any other way.

yes when i have a ball up there, the switch stays closed (switch 39)
here is the video, i changed the private to not listed

thanks

#511 1 year ago
Quoted from slochar:

your video is private can't see.
At any rate, make sure your entry switch to the walker area comes UP when the ball goes up there. It will do as you described if it does not (stays closed). I never did figure out why that happens, because when you are in multiball and get 2 balls up there at the same time, it works as intended. (even though the switch is held shut).
I think there's some pics in this thread of how it's supposed to look with a ball up in it.
yep here:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/opening-flight-2000-new-software-up-to-the-community/page/8#post-5858074
IIRC the switch can't be down on the new software because the spinner needs to finish its scoring. Dip 14 has no effect in this case. It's a trade off I made because the spinner ripoff fix is more important to me than fooling with the entry switch. Trust me when I say that the rom is full, it's full. Although there are currently more bytes free than the stock rom, it is only that.... bytes. I think 14 free? Not enough to change the switch behavior to any other way.

Got it.

You were right
Switch 39 needs to be open after the ball passes.

Works perfect now.
Thanks for your great work

#512 1 year ago

Big night, got my record broken playing with new code.
Build a new rectifier board, my inserts are so colorful now! Old one was toasted.

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2 weeks later
#513 1 year ago

Posting a tip for those running the new code here - make sure your spinners, especially the left ball walker lock one, are TUNED to go to OPEN when they're done spinning!

Some time after I'd put in the new code, a strange condition would begin to appear - I'd launch a ball past the ball lock spinner, it would spin and show the count in the ball in play display, and the ball would land at the top of the walker (properly closing that switch). Then...nothing. I'd wait and wonder when the game was going to drop the ball into the mech and then pop out another ball for play. If I took the ball out of the top of the walker, or rolled it back and then again onto the switch, the gameplay would be destroyed, as the game state around captured/pitted/in-play balls was messed up. The only way to clear it was a reboot, it seemed.

Under more intense scrutiny this holiday season, I decided to really break down the case. I messaged Slochar, and described the condition. He and I agreed the cap at the top switch of the walker, a .05 uf, could stand to be replaced. This had no effect as the issue would come back just as often - in my case, about every six or seven trips up the lane. I decided to look at the spinner itself, since I could not see the code, but assumed that it had to have a routine where it knew the spinner was stopped (to get all the points) before the walker kicked in - how would it know? My guess was that the spinner stopping HAD to stop open, not closed. While the game can and does ignore a closed spinner target switch in play, the walker code needs to be sure of the condition.

Sure enough, the trick to spotting this case is in the ball count display! If your left spinner lands in a closed condition due to tuning/abuse/etc., and it hits the waker top switch and nothing happens - check the ball count display! If it shows spins, vice the ball in play, you can be assured your spinner stopped in a closed state, and the code is waiting for it to open. The spin count is always normally brief, and returns to ball count fairly quickly on either spinner, but if it is stopped, you can address it.

If you want to keep the game playing, and it's not about to multiball, a few gentle spins of the spinner by hand might cause it to land open again, and then walker sequence will proceed. A quick snap of the glass back into place, and you're playing again until you can properly address it. I say not with multiball, because the code is going to empty the walker and you'll be panicking to close the glass and get back into play.

I hate tuning spinners, and I never ever mess with them if they're performing. I just spent days tuning the two bonus X multiplier targets in my Fire!, which have the same switch mech design as spinners - two pieces of copper, one with a spring-like effect that hooks to a line that attaches above to the target. The rest and connection states have to be perfect to keep the mech moving without locking up, or never connecting. When I have to work on them, the playfield is at an angle that is NOT the same as play, so however I tune them, they don't perform with the playfield down - I have to lift and repeat sometimes DOZENS of times to get them to perform flawlessly.

As I told Slochar, I don't consider this a code bug - he did AMAZING work in the very tight memory space he had to work with, and he should not have to tune the routine to fix this case - WE should properly tune our spinners!

Happy New Year to all.

1 month later
#514 1 year ago

installed the 47 version game stops when ball is in the ballwalker doe that switch have to be moved so the game sees it as open

#515 1 year ago

Yes, the ball walker entry switch must activate and then pop up and be open. I think that's the way it was from the factory as the 2 f2k's I've had both did this stock. The code is completely different between stock and the 47 version though, the original code was 566 bytes. About 400 bytes longer than it needed to be.

Oddly, during multiball, if you happen to get 2 balls up there at once, so the switch is closed, it works. I hadn't really thought about why but it has to be because the "in multiball" flag must be checked in that routine and branch off. The normal pre-multiball routine is to wait for the spinner to stop. (You'd think I'd know *exactly* what happens since I wrote the code, but it's been a couple years at this point so it's not top of mind right now. I've probably done 50 rom hacks since then....)

Did you do the walker momentary solenoid to continuous solenoid switch? If so make sure the dip is set correctly as well. If you didn't change any wiring dip 14 needs to be on.

1 week later
#516 1 year ago

I removed the rollover switch and installed a reed switch from M&M creations and it seems to have solved the problem of the entry switch that needs to be openFF27EE49-26E0-41C9-9452-14C4E5105476 (resized).jpegFF27EE49-26E0-41C9-9452-14C4E5105476 (resized).jpeg

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#517 1 year ago
Quoted from rodfone:

I removed the rollover switch and installed a reed switch from M&M creations and it seems to have solved the problem of the entry switch that needs to be open[quoted image]
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Great job!!!

#518 1 year ago

The wall o shoes approves!

2 months later
#519 1 year ago

Anyone set this up like the Roygbev and put on a Arduino yet for plug and play? Or does that not work on this year of stern. Thinking about buying a Flight but would want an easy way to add updated code. I bought the Setup for my Silverball mania, simple plug and play with a separate sound board to drive powered speakers. Fun and easy, let me know if someone does that for flight.. thanks!!

#520 1 year ago

The Arduino works on stern however the software referenced in this thread is original style for the original board.

Someone would have to create the Arduino software... Should be possible to mod one of the other setups if you tackle it.

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