(Topic ID: 294709)

Old Chicago playfield swap, Kruzman clearcoat

By EMsInKC

9 days ago



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  • 8 posts
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  • Latest reply 6 days ago by EMsInKC
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    #1 9 days ago

    I will later this summer be doing my first playfield swap of a Kruzman clearcoated playfield.

    I was looking for any advice on drilling out the holes before screwing down posts etc. Ron says he removes clear from hole edges before pre-drilling the holes. I've done plenty of playfield swaps but never on one of his creations.

    Any advice anyone has would be much appreciated.

    #2 9 days ago

    Is it an original playfield that has been restored/clearcoated? If so, it shouldn't need much. The screw holes should match up and the bit of clear that gets into them should not interfere. Maybe where there are wire forms to push into the PF you might want to predrill the holes but only slightly smaller than the wire.

    If it is a new CPR PF then you may want to look at predrilling the screw holes. I have never done a new CPR playfield so I don't know from experience the size they drill and how tight that makes it for the screws. On the one Wade playfield I did for my QD Ken said to predrill the screw holes. I forgot the drill bit size he uses but it was perfect with his advice. Otherwise he said you could expect to break off screws in the new playfield because the holes are undersized. This was on a clearcoated new reproduction playfield and I didn't prepare it special in any way and had no issues with chipping.

    The biggest issue is the quality of plywood that is being used in repro playfields is better/denser than the originals from back in the day. So the holes have to be limited in how undersized they are for a balanced fit.

    #3 9 days ago
    Quoted from MikeO:

    Is it an original playfield that has been restored/clearcoated? If so, it shouldn't need much. The screw holes should match up and the bit of clear that gets into them should not interfere. Maybe where there are wire forms to push into the PF you might want to predrill the holes but only slightly smaller than the wire.
    If it is a new CPR PF then you may want to look at predrilling the screw holes. I have never done a new CPR playfield so I don't know from experience the size they drill and how tight that makes it for the screws. On the one Wade playfield I did for my QD Ken said to predrill the screw holes. I forgot the drill bit size he uses but it was perfect with his advice. Otherwise he said you could expect to break off screws in the new playfield because the holes are undersized. This was on a clearcoated new reproduction playfield and I didn't prepare it special in any way and had no issues with chipping.
    The biggest issue is the quality of plywood that is being used in repro playfields is better/denser than the originals from back in the day. So the holes have to be limited in how undersized they are for a balanced fit.

    It's a CPR Mike. That's good info on the hole size.

    On the originals I've done I had no issues and I've had no issues on Wade playfields. Running the screws in by hand you can feel if it's too tight and back off before something breaks.

    I'll match up the bit size. In fact I'll probably buy a new bit so it's sharp. I did that first time i drilled out target faces to re-rivet new ones on.

    I'll contact Ken to see if he remembers the bit size.

    Thanks for chiming in.

    #4 9 days ago

    Ron sells a kit with dremel bits for cutting through the clear and glue/syringes to seal newly drilled spots. I would definitely recommend it. And agree completely on new drill bits. Sharp is good. Along with the bits, it’s a 3-step process if I recall: dremel the clear, drill, seal with glue/syringe.

    #5 9 days ago
    Quoted from Aeolus7:

    Ron sells a kit with dremel bits for cutting through the clear and glue/syringes to seal newly drilled spots. I would definitely recommend it. And agree completely on new drill bits. Sharp is good. Along with the bits, it’s a 3-step process if I recall: dremel the clear, drill, seal with glue/syringe.

    I got the kit so I'm good there.

    I can remove a touch of clear from the hole edges no problem. One real question is this game uses those through the playfield nails that attach the bumper bracket. You think I'd be ok drilling it out but having the head of that nail tightening down on the clear on the top side?

    #6 8 days ago
    Quoted from EMsInKC:

    I got the kit so I'm good there.
    I can remove a touch of clear from the hole edges no problem. One real question is this game uses those through the playfield nails that attach the bumper bracket. You think I'd be ok drilling it out but having the head of that nail tightening down on the clear on the top side?

    Gotcha, I havent worked on a game from this era, but I’ve done this both ways with System 11 & WPC playfields. Assuming they use the same type of setup (fin screws or similar?) I believe the best practice is to cut the clear just enough so the top of the screw head is flush with the top of the clear using the Kruzman bits.

    #7 8 days ago
    Quoted from EMsInKC:

    I got the kit so I'm good there.
    I can remove a touch of clear from the hole edges no problem. One real question is this game uses those through the playfield nails that attach the bumper bracket. You think I'd be ok drilling it out but having the head of that nail tightening down on the clear on the top side?

    As noted above you will want to slsightly countersink the surface.

    Then push/hammer the screw through enough for a washer and nut to catch it on the back side. Continue to tighten the nut until it bottoms out. If not all the way seated on the top add a few more washers on the back side and continue to wrench the nut until fully seated on the top side.

    #8 6 days ago
    Quoted from Aeolus7:

    Gotcha, I havent worked on a game from this era, but I’ve done this both ways with System 11 & WPC playfields. Assuming they use the same type of setup (fin screws or similar?) I believe the best practice is to cut the clear just enough so the top of the screw head is flush with the top of the clear using the Kruzman bits.

    Quoted from MikeO:

    As noted above you will want to slsightly countersink the surface.
    Then push/hammer the screw through enough for a washer and nut to catch it on the back side. Continue to tighten the nut until it bottoms out. If not all the way seated on the top add a few more washers on the back side and continue to wrench the nut until fully seated on the top side.

    This was really the crux of what I was going for. I've never down a playfield restore with those screw nails involved. Always screws going in from the underside which obviously is a totally different situation. Thanks to both you guys for the advice.

    The touchy part on this is the game has five bumpers, so 15 of those things have to be installed. Hopefully I get good at it fast. When I installed a hardtop on the Wizard, there are 8 star rollovers on that, and you have to use a drum sander on a Dremel to open up the hardtop so you can get the insert in the proper location. Took it slow and easy and they all came out great. Hope this works the same.

    Thanks again.

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