Just buy a transformer easiest way.

I doubt it. Chicago Gaming made and expanded their own assembly line. They have produced a lot of games since the first run of MMR's.

When it was announced I believe the plan was to have two lines for American Pinball ( new game and previous game ) and a line for people to make a small run of their own game like Wrath of Olympus or something. Which I thought was a brilliant idea. A game like TNA hits the line and looks amazing, American Pinball could secure rights to mass produce it.

LTG : )

No idea what #3 is. But if revealed at Expo, maybe sooner than next year.

LTG : )

Josh ( ROSH on Pinside ) needed/wanted his own office.

LTG : )
Disclaimer : They did outgrow their previous space.

Not even close. Wonka is leaps and bounds better. As the code evolves this will be a very tough pin to beat.

I own them both.

Had Oktoberfest on location, really enjoyed the gameplay and it didn't need much attention either. I have played Oktoberfest over a hundreds of times and think it would be a great home game. Only played Willy Wonka a couple of dozen times, fun game but I like Oktoberfest better. Plus, Wonka has required much more attention to keep it up and running.

I think I can speak for most people, we don't want a Sherlock Holmes pinball game unless its based on the Warner Brothers movie with clips. If they make Sherlock Holmes that will be another disaster, and to me is almost like doing a sequel to Houdini because they're both from the same timeframes (over 100 years ago). I don't know why these guys can't get out there and license something, they spend all the money on a new factory but can't spend anything on a license. I'm not sure I'm buying this... if they ever want to break out they're going to need a license. Look at Stern, Black Knight is a total disaster the worst selling game in their modern history. THat should send a message to the folks at American Pinball, NO ONE WANTS original themes. Dialed In was a success but look how much work they put into that game. If their long term game plan is to keep selling 200 to 400 games then yes by all means do Sherlock Holmes.

Let me tell you if you're plan is to do Sherlock Holmes as your next game, then there are bigger plans going on. There is NO WAY these guys need a factory that big to make Octoberfest, Sherlock Holmes and Octoberfest. NO WAY! There is something else going on here... like taking over some production from Chicago Gaming, Making Big Lebowskis, Aliens, or something. I heard this was part of their plans... so we'll see what happens. If there is a company out there that can mass produce games for you, all you have to do is make the first one, then I would say that is great for the pinball industry.

They don't need two lines for their games, the demand isn't there. I think American Pinball which is owned by a bigger company who makes electronic parts or something, has geared up to produce games for other companies. Short of them doing licenses for their own future games, they won't be making more than a couple hundred of new games.

They do a good job with the cabinets, making a pinball machine, but their CGI ability is not good, so I don't see how they're going ot break out with a unique title like Dialed In without improvement there.

I never undrestood why these 2 games are always compared? Perhaps they came out around the same time. Wonka is a fun game. People who complain about the animations on Oktoberfest spend too much time waiting in line. You barely notice them if you are a player. It wouldnt make sense to spend money on high quality CGI of I guy eating during food frenzy? Does it?
You can complain about the theme all you want but when it comes to quality and customer service AP is the winner. No issues with their playfields and when people complained about sounds call outs etc they made the changes and really now have an awesome game.
Or their is Wonka with problems once again and no one to get a hold of. That awful guys voice of the call outs that gives me nightmares,JJ said,"nope, you get what you get,not changing a thing" I wouldnt think about owning that game after how they brushed everyone off.

Not until I started sharing his!

Ha! While your listening Dan, lets assume there is a game called Sherlock Holmes. Using the design,assets,layout etc set forth could it be turned into Jack the Ripper or something called Sinister? Same time period,premises,solving murders, london etc. Outlanes become dark alleys and use some of those mini flickering candles and have police whistle sounds and horse carriages. Like Bram Stokers dracula!
I like how AP has real names to relate to like Houdini. Sherlock was fictional and only exists in books if you read them. I liked how you guys did the research on Houdini! Best of Luck either way.

I could say something but then..I would get yelled at again.

some very cool ideas though!

White Chapel country club.

For a ripping good time.

LTG : )

...but that won't prevent me from responding by posting a lengthy reply.

Im not so sure. Depends on your definition of value I guess.

Everyone is telling me Jurassic Park Pro crushes Wonka in the fun department and it's way cheaper.

And Oktoberfest has more mechanical features and more modes than Wonka.

Personally, I'm not seeing how any version of Wonka is the best value in pinball. Maybe it's the best value in the NIB JJP stable?

I'm getting an Oktoberfest, but I'm placing it in my home and not in my location. I love the theme, but big licences rule when it comes to coin drop.

Original themes don't sell as well. Period. American Pinball seems to be fighting it but it's like trying to keep the sun from rising. They need to wake up and focus on a good theme instead of building a bigger facility.

There was this same thread after Wonka was revealed at MGC , at that time I much preferred Oktoberfest ( the Wonkas were basically prototypes with little coding at that time ) I played them both on location a few weeks ago (same location) and Wonka has come a long way since MGC and I like it much more than my first impression of it but Oktoberfest still wins for me . One of the gentlemen I was playing pinball with preferred Wonka (to each their own ) For me I like Oktoberfest more because it has many unique modes and collecting the steins or mugs helps with the modes , more interesting for me ( I am also a fan of beer so that doesn’t hurt )Oktoberfest is tougher to shoot, but gives you more reasons to shoot for different things . Wonka is easier to shoot but at times I found myself getting bored (this can certainly be remedied with code , but hasn’t completely done so yet) Add in the fact that for the same price you get the only version of Oktoberfest versus a stripped down version of Wonka and Oktoberfest is the clear winner for me .

+1 with the exact same feeling, well talked than

Oktoberfest shoots great. I just dont think it feels as complete of a package as Willy. Especially the display. I can not get over how bad the Oktoberfest display animations and graphics are. It makes my eyes bleed.

I need to see these Octoberfest animations, not hearing good things!

I think the Oktoberfest theme is just fine especially when you consider how many breweries and barcades have games in them now. There are new ones popping up all the time and this theme is perfect for that. If you have any German heritage or just like beer and festivals the theme resonates as well. Look at JP, it's a fun game (so I've heard, not played it yet) but even with a presumably heavy license cost it's really just a dinosaur themed game without any call-outs from the actors and they had to create a generic monster-jeep because they couldn't even license a damned 80s Ford Explorer. It's like JP-light. Fun is fun but I get it that Operators and maybe the general public are attracted to things they know now as opposed to the 80s and 90s when original themes still pulled people in to experience what was created.

Personally I was really disappointed in Wonky, though I tend not to love Lawlor games I expected more. It's pretty and the animations are the best in the business as always but nothing about it made me want to play another game. Oktoberfest I want another shot at getting the coaster MB or Beer Barrel MB going and make sure I have the proper steins collected to maximize points on them.

Heres a taste...enjoy. Reminds me of an 8th graders power point project on their trip to oktoberfest....lol
IMG_1735 (resized).jpgIMG_1737 (resized).jpg

Better Game: Oktoberfest
Better Package: Wonka

Those are old, the new ones aren't going to win any awards but they're fine. Especially since they have probably 10x the screens that Wonka has and Wonka is pretty much full of tiny repeating clips. Here are the new ones:

20190827_104426 (resized).jpg

20190827_104509 (resized).jpg

20190827_104433 (resized).jpg

20190827_104508 (resized).jpg

Gotcha. Still terrible.

Reminds me of my commodore amiga

Oh come on now

I dont get people being so judgy over the display animations. 98% of what counts is under the glass.

From those shots I don;t think it looks that bad, other than the arrows/wedges pointing at things.
Wait, is that bro and frau there the whole time and only that smaller box changes?

Or theme, or a "light show," or the cabinet art, or the backglass art....etc

Around 75% of Pinside.

I'm the first to admit that I was very critical of the animations. However, there are not that bad and have improved. As someone pointed out, there's a lot more going things of substance going on on the Oktoberfest screen than WW.

The "content" on the WW screen and sound package is not great. I found the theme integration to be TERRIBLE! Why would anyone think it is okay to play movie clips with no sound. What's the point of the movie clips without the sound? After all, its far more likely you'll be listening than watching. Missed opportunity by JJP.

There's a lot more to the Wonka display than appears at first glance.

They are on the backglass, the display is the same size as a Stern.

Unfotunately that screen is the only thing showing 95% of the time on Wonka. The rest are 5 second movie clips that don't have any sound.

Stein Race is one of my favorite modes in any game. My wife played it the other day and asked me what to do. I told her to use both buttons on the right with her right hand and you have to drink your beer in the other while you play. She was cracking up the whole time and almost finished her beer.

Oh duh, thanks.

That is much harder to play then I would have ever imagined, at least for me anyway. Still a lot of fun and a new challenge.

Does the game actually recognise if you managed to finish your beer and award you some victory points if you do?

That's in the next update, plus you can install a mini keg in the cab and a tap in the front.

Personally I see Oktoberfest as the modern MM or CC... but they'll probably be fewer of them... the original theme and the humour being the main comparisons... Oktoberfest does seem to have more going on though... I'm happy I bought one now before AP stop production and the price goes through the roof when people realise what a cool and fun game it is... and with the drinking recognition and beer tap on the front in upcoming updates it will only improve things!!

I know some people can't read much past a comic book, you must fall into that category. If you don't like the response don't read it. To give educated responses takes more than 7 words.

The animations on both Houdini and Octoberfest are both weak at best. The only thing I like about Houdini cgi is the start up with Houdini hovering around, everything else looks very very very basic. As for Octoberfest it appears they swiped footage from youtube of parties, and then turned them kind of black and white to disguise that fact. For American Pinball to take the next step they will need to hire a better animator than what they currently have, and it won't be hard to find. Animators are a dime a dozen now, everyone is learning this trade... I have people who work for me that could do 100 times better than that.

I think this is the problem when you look at say Stern JP, those animations didn't get done overnight. That probably took them six months or more to do that... you have to dedicate more time to it or and here is the OR license some movies.

I think cgi animation is a big start up program for all these companies... Chicago Gaming isn't doing it they're reusing the old stuff and enhancing. This new Cosmic Carnival Game was checking that out it has virtually nothing happening on the screen and American Pinball has very basic presentation.

There needs to be a new company pop up that can provide these services to pinball start up companies so they don't have to employ them year around.

They should look around wouldn't be hard to find.

LASTLY... even the biggest Stern fan has to admit Jersey Jack is the BEST at it hands down not even close. They went out of found someone and so could everyone else.

Time will tell the story on these games... neither Houdini or Octoberfest will sell in great numbers. I predict a final count for Houdini right around 400 machines, and Octoberfest 250. These will be lower than other games that took off in value . Who knows.

I don't think you'll know that answer for 5 years! Five years from now will Octoberfest or Houdini become the new Cactus Canyon? I doubt it but you never know. The production numbers are going to be really low for Octoberfest it could end up being the sleeper game.

I'm pretty sure we have confirmation from some owners of Houdinis with serial numbers in the high 400s, I know that doesn't really mean they made that many but it's a pretty good indication. My guess is they did 500+ of that game but that's just based on activity on the owner's thread, etc.

A few months ago I might have agreed. Stern has really upped their game. BKSOR and JP have pretty good animations. The rendering of the Hell Hand is the coolest thing I've seen on a pinball machine display. JP also has some great (and some wonky) animations. The gap is closing.

I find it shocking that Oktoberfest still leads in this poll. 150+ voters is a significant number of votes. Perhaps WW was not as good as the initial hype train and that Oktoberfest is better than the initial hate train. I hope people take 2nd look at API games. They are way better than they were initially given credit for.