(Topic ID: 228077)

Oktoberfest Pricing $ 7,400 w/ Art Blades - PinballSTAR taking orders

By PinballSTAR

5 years ago


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  • Latest reply 5 years ago by Zablon
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#401 5 years ago
Quoted from RA77:

What is going down on AP's facebook at the moment is irritating , there are stupid comments of "rape" now from a cartoon monkey !
WTF you gotta be kidding me. The whole episode has been blown out of proportion.

I was shocked after reading that Facebook thread and it's probably over 1000 comments now however I couldn't take it anymore. This is why Stern deletes negative posts and blocks people on Facebook.

Quoted from Aurich:

I designed a new translite for ACDC featuring a big pair of scantily clad demon boobs with erect nipples

This is also just a mod and nobody is up arms about that guy on ebay who sells alternative translates with naked chicks. I like how yours looks but think if AP released AC/DC now with your art on it I bet you would get plenty of shit about it.

#402 5 years ago
Quoted from BoJo:

I was shocked after reading that Facebook thread and it's probably over 1000 comments now however I couldn't take it anymore. This is why Stern deletes negative posts and blocks people on Facebook.

103 comments. It tells you how many right at the top.

#403 5 years ago
Quoted from tamoore:

103 comments. It tells you how many right at the top.

I said the Facebook thread, not Pinside

#404 5 years ago
Quoted from BoJo:

I said the Facebook thread, not Pinside.

103 on facebook. It says so right at the top.

#405 5 years ago
Quoted from tamoore:

103 on facebook. It says so right at the top.

It was in the 800's (think 893) when I was on there a few days ago. They might have deleted and started a new one.

#406 5 years ago
Quoted from BoJo:

It was in the 800's (think 893) when I was on there a few days ago. They might have deleted and started a new one.

Oh... Maybe I'm just seeing their apology one....

103 (resized).jpg103 (resized).jpg
10
#407 5 years ago
Quoted from MonsieurCS:

You're not getting it. Your marginalizing the very real statements of actual pinball playing woman, who aren't just "remotely teeny bit offended by something", but reminded of traumatic experiences in their lives.
Unless you're some sort of sociopath who doesn't care about your fellow human beings, it doesn't seem to make a whole lot of logical sense to fight a battle (for comedy?), where people end up feeling hurt. And all just for a laugh?
Everyone, including the monkey (at this point an avatar for American Pinball), should lead by example; it's why some people even "start crusades", as you said, to do the right thing.
And when you're speaking of people not showing tolerance, you just mean you want them to be tolerant of the fact that you get laughs from a monkey grabbing a woman's butt, regardless of the fact that you know it makes people upset. Think about the cruelty in what you're saying. And why some people might be "intolerant" of that way of thought.

I really was done on this topic, but let me ask you it this way:

If 1 person is offended by something, then should it be banned/removed?

Is 1 persons opinion greater than everyone else's?

If not 1 person, what is the magic #?

If it isn't the majority, then should everyone be expected to cater to the more vocal minority when they have no actual stake in it?

Unfortunately, this subject is too nuanced to solve over a web forum, and in no way am I trying to offend or belittle anyone's experiences or feelings. I do feel the person has some responsibility in cases such as these. You can choose not to buy the product. Plain and simple. A monkey on a backglass is not going to cause sexual assualt any more than a car causes people to road rage, etc. Bad people are going to do bad things, with or without. The mentality that you are going to stop bad things because you stamp out ideas (movies, music, art, games, tools) is fruitless. The idea that everyone should be without so you don't feel uncomfortable is selfish. You might say it's selfish to think that way, but again, I refer to the above questions. There has to be a limit, or it is just a constant downward spiral.

For one, I don't think black lesbian females are represented enough on this machine and it offends me. Should I go get a group who agree with me and plaster their fb and demand they be represented? Discuss.

#408 5 years ago
Quoted from tamoore:

Oh... Maybe I'm just seeing their apology one....
[quoted image]

FFS is it that important. Maybe it was another thread or you always need to be right. All I know is there was a lot of posts and it was painful to read.

#409 5 years ago

Yeah I was on there promoting "Rape Culture" I guess.... So yeah that facebook comment section got a bit out of hand. I had to take a shower.

For the record, they can delete the monkey. It isn't even that funny. But I learned that people are very sensitive.

#410 5 years ago
Quoted from Zablon:

I really was done on this topic, but let me ask you it this way:
If 1 person is offended by something, then should it be banned/removed?
Is 1 persons opinion greater than everyone else's?
If not 1 person, what is the magic #?
If it isn't the majority, then should everyone be expected to cater to the more vocal minority when they have no actual stake in it?
Unfortunately, this subject is too nuanced to solve over a web forum, and in no way am I trying to offend or belittle anyone's experiences or feelings. I do feel the person has some responsibility in cases such as these. You can choose not to buy the product. Plain and simple. A monkey on a backglass is not going to cause sexual assualt any more than a car causes people to road rage, etc. Bad people are going to do bad things, with or without. The mentality that you are going to stop bad things because you stamp out ideas (movies, music, art, games, tools) is fruitless. The idea that everyone should be without so you don't feel uncomfortable is selfish. You might say it's selfish to think that way, but again, I refer to the above questions. There has to be a limit, or it is just a constant downward spiral.
For one, I don't think black lesbian females are represented enough on this machine and it offends me. Discuss.

I think if you did a survey of a 1000 people, split male/female, pretty likely you would get a majority that the monkey just isn't funny and is offensive to some people.

Someone do a survey!

#411 5 years ago

a couple anti fist up ass comments and here we are.

just delete the poor saps FS thread and the 20-1 majority of oppressed white males can head to some political site where they can vent endlessly about their new messiah fisto the monkey getting the shaft and ending their life as we know it. $8000 for a man toy, hold my beer said the totally not privileged person. GIVE ME MY MONKEY FISTING PICS DAMN YOU!!

#412 5 years ago

This entire thread is pretty pathetic....do people really make their purchase decisions based on cabinet art? I for one could really care less unless its so ugly that its hard to even look at....in this case its hardly the case....the game looks pretty fun with a nice layout and very cool ramps/toys/wire forms, etc....

#413 5 years ago
Quoted from BoJo:

FFS is it that important. Maybe it was another thread or you always need to be right. All I know is there was a lot of posts and it was painful to read.

I don't always have to be right, I just like the record to reflect accuracy without a lot of hyperbole and exaggeration. That 1000 post thread must have been deleted. I was just showing you the one I saw.

#414 5 years ago
Quoted from BoJo:

FFS is it that important. Maybe it was another thread or you always need to be right. All I know is there was a lot of posts and it was painful to read.

I don't think anything on this thread is important with the exception of PinballSTAR is just trying to sell these machines and we took this way off track.

#415 5 years ago

Im offended by this!

Cheryls Sheeshier She Shed, and the Limp Hosed Emasculated Husband!

pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png

#416 5 years ago
Quoted from Captain-Flint:

I don't think anything on this thread is important with the exception of PinballSTAR is just trying to sell these machines and we took this way off track.

These are the best kind of threads when selling a game. He already got 400+ bumps so it's free advertising. Plus with so many threads this stays close to the top.

Someone interested in the title is not going to read this thread and decide to not buy it from Joe or get one from someone else now. He could have easily asked a mod to close it down and then start another if needed.

#417 5 years ago
Quoted from Zablon:

If 1 person is offended by something, then should it be banned/removed?

No. Of course not. But this groping monkey was in poor taste and generally off-putting to a good chunk of the community. As a new company trying to get market share this was a really bad creative decision - especially on a supposedly "family friendly" product. I don't want to live in a world where we can't enjoy beautiful women; you can be sexy without being offensive.

API has handled this very well. You apologize and move on.

#418 5 years ago
Quoted from konjurer:

you can be sexy without being offensive.
API has handled this very well. You apologize and move on.

But see that has been my point all along. You can't. Someone will be offended by cleavage, etc. It's just a matter of if they feel like being vocal about it. The post about the AC/DC translite is an example. It objectifies women, and guarantee if the right person saw it and/or he was an actual company, there would be people with pitchforks demanding something change. Most likely the majority of women wouldn't have a problem with it, but the last few years have shown us it only takes a small vocal few to turn things upside down over little of nothing.

I agree AP handled it well. It will be interesting to see what the real fallout of this will be. You can guarantee other pinball companies have been watching this play out and decisions going forward will be impacted by this turn of events. I think many have misunderstood my argument though, I don't really care if the monkey is there or not. It's more about the over the top reactions to something harmless (that is being perceived as harmful) and the precedent.

It is why I made the comparison to Big Bang Bar, and someone else mentioned Scared Stiff. Those would not fly in today's environment and anyone who has an issue with this is hypocritical if they don't have an issue with those.

-2
#419 5 years ago

The problem is not the monkey people. The problem is the decision to include it. The artist, the designer, and all the other API management that were involved in making the decision to include the image on a product that they were promoting as “Fun and Family Friendly”.

And I am not saying that they did this intentionally, that they sat around and went “What kind of innocent sight gag can we include in the art package that will get a laugh out of people?” And then brain storm and toss out all kinds of rude, crude, and socially unacceptable ideas until they centered on innocent pet monkey, who is clueless, runs around patting girls on the bottom and tries to push up the skirts of their dirndls. That is not how this image ended up on the backglass.

This image probably started as the thought that at Oktoberfest, it is not uncommon to see drunk men goosing the bottoms of young frauleins in drindls, but we can’t put a lecherous old drunk dude doing that on here, hmmm... what if we made him a stupid cartoonish monkey? One that is just anthropomorphic enough to make the connection, but innocent enough because, you know, its just a monkey. Here, we will put him next to these two sexy girls right in the middle of the backglass and we will make the girls smile, you know, so no one thinks the monkey is doing this without their consent. Yeah, thats not too un-PC. That should be just fine.

And then it was forgotten, or if not forgotton, it was looked at by a bunch of men, who thought, ha ha, stupid monkey... and thought nothing else about it. They all said “looks good to me Bob, ship that puppy!” And the art package went to the silk screener and the image was screened onto a few sample pieces and sent back and installed in the 3 prototypes, and they worked real hard, and built us a nice game, with lots to do, some neat toys, and a Beer drinking theme. What more could the public want?

Fast forward to now. We have women now looking at our beautiful machine, and they see this image of a monkey grabbing a poor work staff’s butt and they have to relive the thought of every man who has grabbed them on the ass while they just tried to do their job, waiting tables at a bar, or serving drunk men drinking beer in tents. Then these women see the hand of the monkey up the poor girl’s skirt, and they are reminded of all the men who have tried to take advantage of them with their unwanted touchy feely advances. Suddenly they do not really like this machine, the company who built it, and the people promoting it as “family friendly pinball fun”. And now we have a very real image problem on our hands.

What do we do? As a company who wants to be a good societal member, and doesn't want to gain a reputation as being mysoginistic and tone deaf, what can we do?

Well, first of all,we need to publicly appologize to all of our customers, that we made a mistake, and we need to get rid of the monkey. And secondly, we need to educate our design staff to be a little more thoughtful and inclusive and less male centric when developing content for the “family friendly” company image that we have been promoting. And thirdly, the next artist, designer, or employee who puts a monkey on one of our machines will be looking for new employment.

Now, I think API made all the right moves after the fact. But the vacuum of male cluelessness on their part is the mill stone around their necks that will take a lot longer time to wriggle out of. Maybe with their next version of the art package we will see some improvement to their tone, and hopefully by the time their next machine comes out, all of this can be remembered as some growing pains for API.

And let me be the first to euologize poor Mr Monkey, he had a short life, but boy wasn't he cute? I hope all of those who sided with you, Mr Monkey, I hope the secondary market will fill the void and provide all the monkey love that some on here have been craving. Good luck Mr Monkey. We are going to miss you.

#420 5 years ago
Quoted from Zablon:

I really was done on this topic, but let me ask you it this way:
If 1 person is offended by something, then should it be banned/removed?
Is 1 persons opinion greater than everyone else's?
If not 1 person, what is the magic #?
If it isn't the majority, then should everyone be expected to cater to the more vocal minority when they have no actual stake in it?
The idea that everyone should be without so you don't feel uncomfortable is selfish.

It's not a numbers thing though. The distinction lies in the magnitude of difference between the feeling of "being offended", by something and "being marginalized".

Quoted from Zablon:

A monkey on a backglass is not going to cause sexual assualt any more than a car causes people to road rage, etc. Bad people are going to do bad things, with or without. The mentality that you are going to stop bad things because you stamp out ideas (movies, music, art, games, tools) is fruitless.

I agree, but again there's a practical difference of applicable ideas here. Banning violent imagery in video games or movies, for example, probably isn't going to cause the instances of violence to decrease; however, perpetuating racial stereotypes, such as in blackface or minstrel shows, definitively causes a culture of pervasive racism to exist, feeding into people feeling marginalized rather than them simply "being offended'.

Quoted from Zablon:

You can choose not to buy the product. Plain and simple.

While you can always vote directly with your dollars, that doesn't mean that woman can avoid the imagery being thrust into their faces unexpectedly in a large pinball tournament such as Pinburgh or even just going over to someone's house to play in their basement. That argument about dollars only goes so far practically speaking. You wouldn't put violent imagery on your television, for example, if someone you knew who had just been involved in a violence was coming over to your house.

Think about how many women carry this sort of experience with them throughout their lives, as you weigh whether it's worth the personal laughs.

#421 5 years ago
Quoted from tamoore:

I don't always have to be right, I just like the record to reflect accuracy without a lot of hyperbole and exaggeration. That 1000 post thread must have been deleted. I was just showing you the one I saw.

I'll clarify it for both of you.
The original rant post/thread was deleted and was close to 900 posts last time I saw it. The thread that is now showing is their apology thread.

#422 5 years ago
Quoted from Bublehead:

The problem is not the monkey people. The problem is the decision to include it. The artist, the designer, and all the other API management that were involved in making the decision to include the image on a product that they were promoting as “Fun and Family Friendly”.

You mean this guy?

https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffbuschcreative/

His facebook banner image is interesting.. given the topic..
Screen Shot 2018-10-28 at 8.41.54 PM (resized).pngScreen Shot 2018-10-28 at 8.41.54 PM (resized).png

#423 5 years ago
Quoted from arcademojo:

I'll clarify it for both of you.
The original rant post/thread was deleted and was close to 900 posts last time I saw it. The thread that is now showing is their apology thread.

Thanks for the confirmation. Hyperbole and exaggeration is not my style.

17
#424 5 years ago
Quoted from Bublehead:

The problem is not the monkey people. The problem is the decision to include it. The artist, the designer, and all the other API management that were involved in making the decision to include the image on a product that they were promoting as “Fun and Family Friendly”.
And I am not saying that they did this intentionally, that they sat around and went “What kind of innocent sight gag can we include in the art package that will get a laugh out of people?” And then brain storm and toss out all kinds of rude, crude, and socially unacceptable ideas until they centered on innocent pet monkey, who is clueless, runs around patting girls on the bottom and tries to push up the skirts of their dirndls. That is not how this image ended up on the backglass.
This image probably started as the thought that at Oktoberfest, it is not uncommon to see drunk men goosing the bottoms of young frauleins in drindls, but we can’t put a lecherous old drunk dude doing that on here, hmmm... what if we made him a stupid cartoonish monkey? One that is just anthropomorphic enough to make the connection, but innocent enough because, you know, its just a monkey. Here, we will put him next to these two sexy girls right in the middle of the backglass and we will make the girls smile, you know, so no one thinks the monkey is doing this without their consent. Yeah, thats not too un-PC. That should be just fine.
And then it was forgotten, or if not forgotton, it was looked at by a bunch of men, who thought, ha ha, stupid monkey... and thought nothing else about it. They all said “looks good to me Bob, ship that puppy!” And the art package went to the silk screener and the image was screened onto a few sample pieces and sent back and installed in the 3 prototypes, and they worked real hard, and built us a nice game, with lots to do, some neat toys, and a Beer drinking theme. What more could the public want?
Fast forward to now. We have women now looking at our beautiful machine, and they see this image of a monkey grabbing a poor work staff’s butt and they have to relive the thought of every man who has grabbed them on the ass while they just tried to do their job, waiting tables at a bar, or serving drunk men drinking beer in tents. Then these women see the hand of the monkey up the poor girl’s skirt, and they are reminded of all the men who have tried to take advantage of them with their unwanted touchy feely advances. Suddenly they do not really like this machine, the company who built it, and the people promoting it as “family friendly pinball fun”. And now we have a very real image problem on our hands.
What do we do? As a company who wants to be a good societal member, and doesn't want to gain a reputation as being mysoginistic and tone deaf, what can we do?
Well, first of all,we need to publicly appologize to all of our customers, that we made a mistake, and we need to get rid of the monkey. And secondly, we need to educate our design staff to be a little more thoughtful and inclusive and less male centric when developing content for the “family friendly” company image that we have been promoting. And thirdly, the next artist, designer, or employee who puts a monkey on one of our machines will be looking for new employment.
Now, I think API made all the right moves after the fact. But the vacuum of male cluelessness on their part is the mill stone around their necks that will take a lot longer time to wriggle out of. Maybe with their next version of the art package we will see some improvement to their tone, and hopefully by the time their next machine comes out, all of this can be remembered as some growing pains for API.
And let me be the first to euologize poor Mr Monkey, he had a short life, but boy wasn't he cute? I hope all of those who sided with you, Mr Monkey, I hope the secondary market will fill the void and provide all the monkey love that some on here have been craving. Good luck Mr Monkey. We are going to miss you.

Dear God that was the Longest story about Nothing!!! Who cares, step away from the podium and play pinball.

#425 5 years ago
Quoted from BoJo:

It was in the 800's (think 893) when I was on there a few days ago. They might have deleted and started a new one.

892 of them were one post by Bublehead.

#426 5 years ago
Quoted from Bublehead:

The problem is not the monkey people. The problem is the decision to include it. The artist, the designer, and all the other API management that were involved in making the decision to include the image on a product that they were promoting as “Fun and Family Friendly”.
And I am not saying that they did this intentionally, that they sat around and went “What kind of innocent sight gag can we include in the art package that will get a laugh out of people?” And then brain storm and toss out all kinds of rude, crude, and socially unacceptable ideas until they centered on innocent pet monkey, who is clueless, runs around patting girls on the bottom and tries to push up the skirts of their dirndls. That is not how this image ended up on the backglass.
This image probably started as the thought that at Oktoberfest, it is not uncommon to see drunk men goosing the bottoms of young frauleins in drindls, but we can’t put a lecherous old drunk dude doing that on here, hmmm... what if we made him a stupid cartoonish monkey? One that is just anthropomorphic enough to make the connection, but innocent enough because, you know, its just a monkey. Here, we will put him next to these two sexy girls right in the middle of the backglass and we will make the girls smile, you know, so no one thinks the monkey is doing this without their consent. Yeah, thats not too un-PC. That should be just fine.
And then it was forgotten, or if not forgotton, it was looked at by a bunch of men, who thought, ha ha, stupid monkey... and thought nothing else about it. They all said “looks good to me Bob, ship that puppy!” And the art package went to the silk screener and the image was screened onto a few sample pieces and sent back and installed in the 3 prototypes, and they worked real hard, and built us a nice game, with lots to do, some neat toys, and a Beer drinking theme. What more could the public want?
Fast forward to now. We have women now looking at our beautiful machine, and they see this image of a monkey grabbing a poor work staff’s butt and they have to relive the thought of every man who has grabbed them on the ass while they just tried to do their job, waiting tables at a bar, or serving drunk men drinking beer in tents. Then these women see the hand of the monkey up the poor girl’s skirt, and they are reminded of all the men who have tried to take advantage of them with their unwanted touchy feely advances. Suddenly they do not really like this machine, the company who built it, and the people promoting it as “family friendly pinball fun”. And now we have a very real image problem on our hands.
What do we do? As a company who wants to be a good societal member, and doesn't want to gain a reputation as being mysoginistic and tone deaf, what can we do?
Well, first of all,we need to publicly appologize to all of our customers, that we made a mistake, and we need to get rid of the monkey. And secondly, we need to educate our design staff to be a little more thoughtful and inclusive and less male centric when developing content for the “family friendly” company image that we have been promoting. And thirdly, the next artist, designer, or employee who puts a monkey on one of our machines will be looking for new employment.
Now, I think API made all the right moves after the fact. But the vacuum of male cluelessness on their part is the mill stone around their necks that will take a lot longer time to wriggle out of. Maybe with their next version of the art package we will see some improvement to their tone, and hopefully by the time their next machine comes out, all of this can be remembered as some growing pains for API.
And let me be the first to euologize poor Mr Monkey, he had a short life, but boy wasn't he cute? I hope all of those who sided with you, Mr Monkey, I hope the secondary market will fill the void and provide all the monkey love that some on here have been craving. Good luck Mr Monkey. We are going to miss you.

who cares....if u don't like the art work than don't buy the game....

#427 5 years ago
Quoted from tamoore:

103 on facebook.

I deleted my two posts there. One mentioning AP was changing it, and was questioned if I was okay with the monkey ( that person has offensive stuff on their Facebook page, though ) and one where I questioned why at the events aren't those running it or other players, taking care of the safety of the players ? Once I got the mad face emoji I deleted my post and blocked the person.

I hope in some of these instances of assault, if the place or organizer doesn't do something about it. The victim calls the police and files charges.

Pinball should be fun, not a scary place to go to if you want to play of compete.

LTG : )

-22
#428 5 years ago

What people are missing is the relevancy of all of this to the sale of pinball machines. Because thats what this is really about. And it is what is really important to Joe, to API, to you, me, and everyone else in this hobby/industry.

So yeah, lets talk about selling pinball machines... you want to buy one with a creepy, lecherous, skirt flipping monkey on it?, he’s real cute and not too over the top. I got just the machine for you. Who makes it you ask?, why American Pinball of course.

13
#429 5 years ago
Quoted from Bublehead:

What people are missing is the relevancy of all of this to the sale of pinball machines. Because thats what this is really about. And it is what is really important to Joe, to API, to you, me, and everyone else in this hobby/industry.
So yeah, lets talk about selling pinball machines... you want to buy one with a creepy, lecherous, skirt flipping monkey on it?, he’s real cute and not too over the top. I got just the machine for you. Who makes it you ask?, why American Pinball of course.

Do you Ever just drop it? You win, your right, your smart, what do you need to hear to Just move on already???

#430 5 years ago

I guess on a pinball forum anyone has the right to an opinion.....I find this particular one somewhat ridiculous ....I get the premise, but give me a break.... I guess us AC/DC fans are lucky u weren't around when the Lucy version came out (for the record I'm not a fan), but get why some are....to each their own

#431 5 years ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

I guess us AC/DC fans are lucky u weren't around when the Lucy version came out

I still want one for my business. Premium or Luci. Someday.

LTG : )

#432 5 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

I still want one for my business. Premium or Luci. Someday.
LTG : )

its a great game....

#433 5 years ago

Wait I thought AP was removing the monkey from the backglass? Why are you still discussing this?
Its boring to go on and on and on about something that was just changed.

How about discussing the rules of the game? or the 4 magnets (2 are controllable by flipper - that's innovative)
or the animations? or the steins? or the 2 physical ball locks? thats what I want to discuss

#434 5 years ago

Gotta love all this phony misguided outrage

These people obviously don’t watch TV, listen to music, go to movies or otherwise live in the real world

Bunch of BS whining about nothing

#435 5 years ago

Show me the Monkey!

#436 5 years ago
Quoted from Zablon:

It is why I made the comparison to Big Bang Bar, and someone else mentioned Scared Stiff. Those would not fly in today's environment and anyone who has an issue with this is hypocritical if they don't have an issue with those.

I disagree, it's not hypocritical at all. I have an Elvira pinball tattoo on my arm with massive cleavage and have a problem with the monkey. I think the people freaking out about the decision to change the art aren't getting the basic argument against it.

Sex = awesome!
Sexy pinball art = fine!
Non consensual grabbing in-person or in artwork = not good, it's creepy, it sends a bad message!

It's all about consent. It's no slippery slope, it doesn't mean people won't make sexy art, it just means people probably won't do art with women getting grabbed or punched in it. Isn't that a good thing?

#437 5 years ago
Quoted from nwpinball:

I disagree, it's not hypocritical at all. I have an Elvira pinball tattoo on my arm with massive cleavage and have a problem with the monkey. I think the people freaking out about the decision to change the art aren't getting the basic argument against it.
Sex = awesome!
Sexy pinball art = fine!
Non consensual grabbing in-person or in artwork = not good, it's creepy, it sends a bad message!
It's all about consent. It's no slippery slope, it doesn't mean people won't make sexy art, it just means people probably won't do art with women getting grabbed or punched in it. Isn't that a good thing?

I didn't realize the monkey was actually groping anyone before reading the thread, going back at the picture and looking at it again. I thought he was jumping to reach something. I'm not sure they intended to make him a groping monkey, I think they had so much to do to get the prototype ready for the show that they didn't pay attention to it.

#438 5 years ago
Quoted from nwpinball:

I disagree, it's not hypocritical at all. I have an Elvira pinball tattoo on my arm with massive cleavage and have a problem with the monkey. I think the people freaking out about the decision to change the art aren't getting the basic argument against it.
Sex = awesome!
Sexy pinball art = fine!
Non consensual grabbing in-person or in artwork = not good, it's creepy, it sends a bad message!
It's all about consent. It's no slippery slope, it doesn't mean people won't make sexy art, it just means people probably won't do art with women getting grabbed or punched in it. Isn't that a good thing?

Consent...how do we know these women...um, cartoons...haven’t signed a letter of consent. Maybe these are hired actress’s that have consented to the image.
I’m not belittling the heinous act of assault...but if we are going to make assumptions, then all assumptions are possible.

I quoted the wrong comment...should be the one above...sorry

#439 5 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Gotta love all this phony misguided outrage

are you talking about the anti anti monkey people or the anti monkey people or the people that claim they want to discuss the magnets...seems like it could go either way. my money is on the anti anti monkeys they are leading at least 20-1 compared to the anti monkeys in clutch the pearls to your chest drama posts. Way more outrage at the outrage than the original non outrage. This is outrageous.

Outrage (resized).jpgOutrage (resized).jpg
#440 5 years ago

Don't forget to call Joe at Pinball Star for your Octoberfest pin.

You too Ritchie Wrench. By now you should be calling and texting him at 3am every night.

LTG : )

#441 5 years ago

I just hope everyone get's monkey-gate out of there system come an owners thread.

#442 5 years ago
Quoted from Ericpinballfan:

I just hope everyone get's monkey-gate out of there system come an owners thread.

Did you get a monkey backglass ? No. Did you ?

LTG : )

#443 5 years ago

I sat through the API presentation as well as played the game a few times at Expo does anyone how the player controlled magnets work? Is it similar to Black Night like a ball save or a TV flip the ball setup? Not sure this feature code was on at Expo but I could be wrong?

-1
#444 5 years ago

@luvthatapex2, wasnt there a player controlled magnet in World Cup Soccer? I love mangnets in a game, but not “lets throw it anywhere” magnets like GB or <Insert almost any modern Stern title with a magnet here>. Magna-saves and magnetic accelerators and diverters like TG:HSII and TOM Split ring, or TZ Spiral magnets offer interesting game play that is not just a “sling it down an outlane” drain monster. And the invisible flippers on TZ have always confounded me, but I still liked them. I was not the most “on point” player trying to use the ones on OKF, but I can see them growing on me.

#445 5 years ago

WCS had a magnet near the lower flippers that would grab the ball so you could hit with the left flipper. Did Oktoberfest grab the ball or pulse the ball when you pressed the second button?

Quoted from Bublehead:

@luvthatapex2, wasnt there a player controlled magnet in World Cup Soccer? I love mangnets in a game, but not “lets throw it anywhere” magnets like GB or &lt;Insert almost any modern Stern title with a magnet here&gt;. Magna-saves and magnetic accelerators and diverters like TG:HSII and TOM Split ring, or TZ Spiral magnets offer interesting game play that is not just a “sling it down an outlane” drain monster. And the invisible flippers on TZ have always confounded me, but I still liked them. I was not the most “on point” player trying to use the ones on OKF, but I can see them growing on me.

#446 5 years ago
Quoted from adol75:

I didn't realize the monkey was actually groping anyone before reading the thread, going back at the picture and looking at it again. I thought he was jumping to reach something. I'm not sure they intended to make him a groping monkey, I think they had so much to do to get the prototype ready for the show that they didn't pay attention to it.

There is no way an artist doing that backglass didn't purposefully make the monkeys hand go up the skirt. No way whatsoever. I'm sure it was done as a joke, but definitely doesn't belong.

Having said that, this is just one of those topics where it might as well be a political discussion. While I think the monkey was in bad taste, I also think that making a comparison to women being assaulted and bringing back that memory is also just not comparable at all. Because how many pinball machines have guns on them - there's a ton of people affected by gun violence in one way or another, but you can't take guns out of them all now. I personally don't think anyone is going to see a monkey reaching up a skirt and have flashbacks of being assaulted - and if there is, it's going to be so incredibly rare. Much more rare than a person seeing a gun and being reminded of something bad in their life. But there's quite a few people, myself included, that wouldn't want family members or even some friends to come over and see that on one of my pins.

I personally wouldn't have a problem with them making it as an alternative backglass, but then again, that's a Pandora's box right there. They start doing that, and the obvious connection is that they are profiting off of their mistake and perhaps being encouraged to do it again.

#447 5 years ago
Quoted from Eryeal:

this is just one of those topics where it might as well be a political discussion.

Politics aren't allowed on Pinside.

I hope monkeys still are.

LTG : )

#448 5 years ago

There is pulsing of the magnet, so you control how long it is on. Hold it longer to get more magna save like action, or pulse it to redirect ball path. AP rep said you dont need to use the magnets to advance so you can ignore the extra buttons if you want.

#449 5 years ago
Quoted from Bublehead:

There is pulsing of the magnet, so you control how long it is on. Hold it longer to get more magna save like action, or pulse it to redirect ball path. AP rep said you dont need to use the magnets to advance so you can ignore the extra buttons if you want.

is it the 3rd button, or the normal flipper buttons? does one button control the 2 player controlled?

#450 5 years ago

Well thats cool. You can either get the HOLD BALL action or the PULSE BALL action. Sounds fun

Quoted from Bublehead:

There is pulsing of the magnet, so you control how long it is on. Hold it longer to get more magna save like action, or pulse it to redirect ball path. AP rep said you dont need to use the magnets to advance so you can ignore the extra buttons if you want.

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