Rubbing alcohol.

with flour into a paste.

What's the best way to deal with drop targets after a hardtop installation? Did you put a piece of hardtop material on top of each one to make up for the new playfield height, or is it nothing to worry about?

I think most don't worry about the slight change in height.

Sometimes you do have to make adjustments, especially for in-line drop targets (you don't want the ball getting stuck on top of a downed target, or "thumping" when rolling over them). I had to adjust the height of the 2x/3x/4x/5x in-line drop targets on my '84 EBD. Fortunately, you can adjust the height within the drop target mechanism itself on that game, no shims needed.

On my Whirlwind Hardtop... you can see the orange artwork goes up around 8" further on the shooter lane. Is this by design?

Also.... when it's time for the adhesive backing to be removed... there will be a space in in the center going up the shooter lane on the Hardtop. Would you try & match the Hardtop orange & paint that wood part on the shooter lane or just leave it showing the wood underneath?
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No turning back now! Wood is done, just have to smooth out the inserts then put a seal coat on. Hoping to install the hardtop next weekend!

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I've got to do this one, once I get done with all these playfield swaps and and scratch builds...

Do you have this playfield lock in a rockwell jaw horse?

I have one of those and have never even given it a thought.

I've had my chop saw and platform in it so long that i barely remembered what it actually was, lol.

Sure do! It's not a great solution for this honestly. With all the electronics hanging down, you have to get it just right to straddle...and while locking it down I've let it slip and it's hit down on the saw horse...So now I have to triple check all the parts before firing it back up, make sure things aren't touching due to getting bent. Recommendation, use actual sawhorses!

Sanded the inserts today. I already replaced the top white ones. Actually wish I did them all kind of. People made it sound more difficult than it is. But I think it'll be just fine in the end. Clear coat tomorrow!

I realize I'm only one voice, but I would purchase a Paragon hardtop the moment I became aware they existed and would gladly join a list or even prepay.

Definitely Bally Playboy!

Licensed game so probably not going to happen. CPR does a playfield for it though

It was a long process...but SHE LIVES!! The hardtop looks amazing! Plays so much better now too! I have some adjustments to make on the flippers and switches, but it's great to have it back up and running again.

I'm slow, so I'd say it took me 20hrs to complete.

Tips
- Take pictures of EVERYTHING during the stages of tearing down the playfield! I took photos before I started, after removing plastic graphics, after removing posts but placing screws back (to document which screws were where), and before removing any parts (flippers/switches). This saved me multiple times from playing the guessing game.

- Don't attempt to install it alone! I couldn't imagine getting this in place correctly solo.

- Easy with the Dremel. Don't focus on trimming out rollovers or whatever else for more than a second, it heats up and the hardtop will start melting. This will cause lifted edges around your hole, so you'd need to trim back further to get rid of it. Flick off any plastic as you're doing it so it's still warm, before it quickly hardens, making it more difficult to get off to create a smooth and flat edge. Thankfully I realized this early so I didn't run into much of an issue.

Issues I ran into:
- Screw and other holes weren't perfectly aligned. As others told me, the older playfield was made by several people and wasn't done exactly the same between them. So screw holes or bumpers might be just a smidge off. Simply (carefully) trim out where needed. No fault of the Hardtop, the vast majority were perfect.

- Hardtop sticks out around the outside edges (ha!), trim it to avoid various issues. I almost had a catastrophic incident with it sandwiched in my Jawhorse.

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Im not a big fan of colored GI, But that looks fantastic! Great job.

+2

Excited to see the Whirlwind hardtop finally available! When sanding the playfield down after removing everything, what should I put in the open holes to prevent the dust/particles from going into the mechs underneath?

Also, my Whirlwind has some really bad raised inserts, so I'm assuming I'd have to use a C Clamp to push them back down?

I used earplugs in lamp sockets, and then used painters tape on the bottom of the playfield to cover everything else.

Usually I replace all the inserts when doing a HT, probably not 100% necessary, but if you already got it all stripped down, and they have issues, probably worth the time and very cheap. Also gives you the option of changing to starburst or other patterns/colors if you choose. I've also seen people use clear inserts, and then use LEDs to change the color, not everywhere but specific areas.

Earplugs and painters tape worked for me too. I cut earplugs in half so they wouldn't stick up and out as much for sanding. Though a lot flew out during sanding, ha. Made sure to check all of them and painters tape before applying clear coat. Also had to double up earplugs for slightly larger holes, otherwise used painters tape. For bumpers I used four earplugs and stuffed them in. I'm not sure why I didn't just use painters tape for those too, ha.

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So I laid down a little too much clear paint in one or two spots that hasn't dried in over two days. Any suggestions on how to remove the still tacky excess paint or do I just wait it out a few more days until it dries completely? (And then another 72 hours after that to install the hardtop)

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If it was summer I'd say try laying it out int he sun for a while. Maybe sit a box fan next to it and let it blow over the playfield for a day or two,

If any wide body Hardtops get created I think a good candidate would be the Williams Stellar Wars. Seems like a lot of those playfields get trashed.

Future Spa has been done quite a while ago.

I missed that one. Maybe there is hope for Stellar Wars then.

There is Scorpion too

If it hasn't dried in 2 days I'd be concerned that there's some sort of contamination that will affect it long term.

Usually you can test lacquer thinner or alcohol. But ultimately id sand it and reapply a light coat. Why risk finding an adhesion issue after install.

this and at this point in the game, other than the hard to find inserts. Not sure why everyone isn't just replacing the inserts rather than trying to sand and polish/ clear everything. little heat top and bottom and they pop out like butter. 5 min epoxy and send. My first hardtop i went the polish route, did a clear coat job on a game and replaced the inserts this time. way way easier and came out better

Great advice... unless you have a Black Knight with jewel inserts.

If I ever do one again, I'll likely replace all inserts instead of just a few rough looking ones. This time I only replaced regular 4 inserts, plus 5 rollovers. I would once again sand and clear coat it though. I don't want to worry about that old paint peeling up. Get it off and adhere it to a good clean surface.

I just finished up my second hardtop project and can't say enough good things about this product!

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"Replacing inserts" is one of those things that sounds so simple because it can have like what, all of 4 steps to do, but in reality can be a major PITA.

I've replaced at least "some" inserts on 5 games, and replaced all of them on a Firepower. And out of let's say ~150 inserts placed into a playfield, maybe a dozen drop-fit with no grief. ALL of them had to have the mold ID marks sanded off the top. Which SUCKS because kiss that fresh smooth factory gloss surface goodbye: you're right back to sanding and polishing, so... hmm, might should have done that to the insert in the game?

And the vast majority of them were too big to fit the playfield hole. Sometimes by only a hair's width, others by as much as 1mm (or seemingly more). So, yay: now you're sanding down beyond the mold marks, and further into the plastic, to find the narrower taper profile that will fit flush to the PF surface.

Now this may not be an issue when the rest of the pf is trash, and you can just slap the inserts in and sand everything down smooth to your heart's content, reducing surrounding art to bare wood. If you're dealing with a Hardtop, that may well be the case.

But especially on a finished playfield with nice art, it's a REAL bear to do right. So "replacing inserts" is hardly the universal easy pick-and-place process it seems like it should be. Caution is warranted, every situation is unique.

I've played a small handful of Black Knights, but only just the other day finally saw one with the original jeweled inserts. WOW but they do look amazing. I think that's the only version I'd want now.

So I am working on a game for a client and it has a hardtop that from what I understand was part of a bad batch. Outside Edge provided a new hardtop for my client, and my job is to install it. I have installed a few of them at this point, but I have never removed one. Any tips or tricks I should know about?

Sanding the top is a good thing because you want to sand it flush with the playfield surface. Sanding the sides is important for adhesion, but it does really suck when they won’t fit!! I’m doing an F-14 and it is pure misery with those big arrows.

Here's my experience in this area:

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/hardtop-install-and-restoration-for-eight-ball-deluxe/page/3#post-5861443

Requires some strength at first to pull it off, then lots of patience (and GooGone) to scrape up the remaining ink and adhesive residue with a plastic scraper. It's rather tedious work.

Hello,

Any updates from Outside Edge about up coming titles?

I messed up an F-14 and had to pull it off. Heat worked well but the majority of the adhesive stayed on the PF. Then I'd roll the adhesive up in big chunks. After that it's just like peeling mylar, rub flour or baking soda into it hard and use some rubbing alcohol to scrape the rest off.

A real PITA but it worked.

Anyone on here planning to take their Hardtop games to Pinbrew?

Flight 2000!

+1 for Meteor. Would be pretty easy to install because it's mostly drop target game and there are plenty of machines with wear that need them. I'd buy one on day one

Space Station

This. Most every one I see needs some love. Such a great game too!

Chris

Really would like one for Space Station. All the ones I find need a hard top! Did a Space Shuttle hard top and it was awesome!

Bruce,
Please make this happen. Space Station HT will be a big seller. I have turned away jobs because this has not been available. Could have done three by now.
Lets make this happen.
PinDoc.

Also need space station. Mine was a squirrel restroom.

Someone mentioned how easy Meteor would be because it's all drops and TBH I had never looked at it *that* closely to realize..it literally is all drops. Wild. That hardtop would take an afternoon, lol. I've actually got a beautiful, retouched/cleared Meteor CPR playfield ready to swap.

I'm still begging for a Flight 2000. Mine is so unbelievably sad. I'll hardtop it immediately if one gets released for it.

I finally sold my Space Station project. I would have snapped up a hard top.

Doesn’t look like Space Station.

Not a fan ?

…guessing CF???

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