Bad Cats
Williams, 1989
Black Knight
Williams, 1980
Blackout
Williams, 1980
Comet
Williams, 1985
Eight Ball Deluxe
Bally, 1981
Evel Knievel
Bally, 1977
Fireball II
Bally, 1981
Firepower
Williams, 1980Quoted from radium:Did you read the info on their site? I’d follow that or email them instead of random advice here.
[quoted image]
If you love the machine and want to do a great job, just follow the vid1900 guide where he hardtops a Comet (which I’m too lazy to look up for you).
Screw it. I'm not wet sanding either.
Quoted from Mr_Outlane:So, if going the non clearcoat route for playfield, the wet sanding on a bare sanded playfield is OK? What about water raising the grain?
Wet sanding is when you are using very fine sandpaper and the soapy water keeps the dust from clogging the sandpaper (often 800 grit or finer)
You would not be using any sandpaper that fine when prepping bare maple
Even when I work on something like a fine flame maple guitar neck, I would only sand to 400 grit before shooting the clearcoat. No wet sanding on 400g
IMG_20210925_204345__01__01 (resized).jpg
I dry sanded the inserts on my HS. I didn't wet sand in fear of raising the wood grain. I first started with 220 to remove the artwork and then when to 320 and then 400 on the entire PF. For the inserts I started at 600 and went all the way to 3000. Since the inserts on HS are jeweled or facetted, I wanted them to pop after clearing them with Spray Max and they did. The HT has such a glossy and perfect finish, I wanted the inserts to look the best they could be.
I cant imagine not 1000-grit wet-sanding the inserts prior to polishing. Wet-sanding removes a lot of scratching, is easy to do, and makes the polishing easier and faster. You end up with a very smooth and shiny insert in the end. Also in my experience, this process does not raise the grain in any significant way.
But in my case, my PF is clear-coated before working on the inserts, so there is no possible way for the water to get into the wood in the first place.
I guess it depends on your approach and how you do things. My inserts were still hazy before the clear coat. After clear the inserts they looked nice and clear. It's actually surprising how they change with clear coat. Non faceted inserts will probably need more attention.
Quoted from vid1900:Wet sanding is when you are using very fine sandpaper and the soapy water keeps the dust from clogging the sandpaper (often 800 grit or finer)
You would not be using any sandpaper that fine when prepping bare maple
Even when I work on something like a fine flame maple guitar neck, I would only sand to 400 grit before shooting the clearcoat. No wet sanding on 400g
[quoted image]
No, no. Sorry vid. I was talking about the inserts only. I just finished sanding and got the inserts to 1000 grit. Now I'm going to hit them with Rustoleum Painter's Touch 2X clear gloss.
Prepped for some acrylic paint around the inserts and the light clearing on the shooter and saucer. I didn't go as wild on polishing as some of you do, opting to only go up to my Dremel Versa with some Ultimate Polish. I think I used my much more powerful corded 6" DA on my high speed. I'm hoping to have this thing stuck down this weekend and fully reassembled shortly thereafter. It's dragged on for way too long and I want to start the second one.
20220303_150345 (resized).jpg20220303_151145 (resized).jpg20220303_151156 (resized).jpg
Quoted from Mr_Outlane:WOW, the clear really brings inserts to life!!
Just make sure you let them outgas COMPLETELY before sticking the hardtop down. Still makes me paranoid.
Quoted from KSUWildcatFan:Just make sure you let them outgas COMPLETELY before sticking the hardtop down. Still makes me paranoid.
Ya, they say 72Hrs. I'll wait a full week or more. Gonna be gone anyway. 
Can't rush this stuff. Always remember, Rome wasn't built in a day!
Quoted from Mr_Outlane:Ya, they say 72Hrs. I'll wait a full week or more. Gonna be gone anyway. Can't rush this stuff. Always remember, Rome wasn't built in a day!
Hell, wait a month. 
Stuff makes me nervous lol. What I hear is as long as it no longer smells you're good, but...... I'd rather not be wrong.
Quoted from Mr_Outlane:Sounds like you're doing a playfield restoration rather than a Hard Top prep?
Correct, I do a couple light coats of clear if I'm doing a hard top. I also want to make sure I have the shooter lane restored. I sand most of the stains out of it, and then make sure the wood grain is sealed.
Quoted from eabundy:Correct, I do a couple light coats of clear if I'm doing a hard top. I also want to make sure I have the shooter lane restored. I sand most of the stains out of it, and then make sure the wood grain is sealed.
Ya, shooter lane is a bitch! Mine was so bad I just tried to match paint color to wood but no luck so I just cleared it. It would have removed way too much wood to try to get it clean. I have no idea HTF to color match paint to this wood. 
Quoted from Mr_Outlane:Ya, shooter lane is a bitch! Mine was so bad I just tried to match paint color to wood but no luck so I just cleared it. It would have removed way too much wood to try to get it clean. I have no idea HTF to color match paint to this wood.
Man...I tried that with my High Speed and it was just....bad. I'm sure someone who isn't all thumbs can execute it better than me. Your example looks great. 
lol
That's great vid! Thanks. Maybe next time though because I already cleared it. I learned a lot of things for 'next time'! 
Quoted from radium:If you install hardtop WITHOUT CLEAR, what do you do about your shooter lane?
who cares, you already ruined the game.
Quoted from pinballizfun:who cares, you already ruined the game.
Get wrecked.
Quoted from pinballizfun:who cares, you already ruined the game.
Come play my Taxi and call it “ruined” 
Quoted from pinballizfun:who cares, you already ruined the game.
Lol. Weirdo.
There's a guy on fb (I'm aware he's not alone) who just RAILS on hardtops constantly. But here's the deal... original wood and paint in 1986 vs now, mylar in 1986 vs now, new clearcoat, non-clearcoated reproductions, hardtops..none of them play the same. You can say you don't like the "feel" of the PETG if you want (and I've liked it better on some games than others) but the fact remains that all the variables in play mean there isn't one "true" answer. A hardtop is far better IMO than an uneven 30+ year old playfield with wear spots down to bare wood. Others may not agree and that's fine. I don't care to try to convince them that they're "wrong". Play what you want, don't play what you don't, move on with your life. It really is that simple.
Quoted from Blenderhead:Come play my Taxi and call it “ruined”
why would i want to pay a lousy plastic game?
Quoted from pinballizfun:why would i want to pay a lousy plastic game?
So I can show you how much you suck at pinball and make up lame excuses 
Quoted from pinballizfun:why would i want to pay a lousy plastic game?
Dude, if you have something constructive to add to the thread, please do, otherwise do us all a favor and save it for Facebook.
Quoted from pinballizfun:who cares, you already ruined the game.
You’ve obviously never played one.
Quoted from scampcamp:Has anyone read/heard anything about a Whirlwind being made?
Current hint is for an Elektra. We don't really know beyond that.
Problem is PPS may have a deal with CPR and Mirco for no telling how long before a Hardtop can become available for Whirlwind.
Have yet to notice any difference in play on my Xenon Hardtop vs my original wood Power Play. I'm sure there is if I look hard enough but the deteriorated playfield of my Xenon was far more distracting than any perceived play difference.
HT is a great product! The only negative I have is they can't bring out new titles fast enough.
20210731_125923 (resized).jpg20210825_132549 (resized).jpgQuoted from scampcamp:Has anyone read/heard anything about a Whirlwind being made?
Would be a smart choice with the new Whirlwind 2.0 in the works. im sure those games will be snatched up quick and prices increasing like funhouses were.
Quoted from Ceckitti:Would be a smart choice with the new Whirlwind 2.0 in the works. im sure those games will be snatched up quick and prices increasing like funhouses were.
When will these be for sale? I need a whirlwind playfield or overlay!
Quoted from Dee-Bow:When will these be for sale? I need a whirlwind playfield or overlay!
The WW2.0? No idea. I just saw and played the prototype at the Louisville arcade expo last weekend.
I’ve never been a fan of whirlwind…but this kit/upgrade could def change that. Looked super cool.
551419B9-C27B-4215-86E6-18D4E0C0E3D9 (resized).jpeg003AEDEB-958F-4DD0-B1FC-5E4E3C312092 (resized).jpeg27F708AF-4F5C-44CF-A8AD-295332E43B61 (resized).jpeg4A716FC4-18FD-4CB2-A1A3-41CA2843D35F (resized).jpeg55129790-CAD2-414E-A142-B1A99CBA1635 (resized).jpeg7E22BACB-5F56-47A8-9B7A-E3BFCAC75AE5 (resized).jpegQuoted from PinballManiac40:Current hint is for an Elektra. We don't really know beyond that.
Problem is PPS may have a deal with CPR and Mirco for no telling how long before a Hardtop can become available for Whirlwind.
I keep checking their site for when orders for Elektra open up. Mine definitely needs a set!
Quoted from Robotworkshop:I keep checking their site for when orders for Elektra open up. Mine definitely needs a set!
No telling how busy they are in between releases. Seems between the last 2 releases was about a month difference. So we so may see something soon, possibly.
How many of you guys had to trim off the hard top at the shooter lane because it was too far to one side? My Gorgar is over hanging on the left side?
Quoted from Mr_Outlane:How many of you guys had to trim off the hard top at the shooter lane because it was too far to one side? My Gorgar is over hanging on the left side?
I had to do this on my Blackout. Trim the Hardtop BEFORE you adhere it. I learned that the hard way. Also, I've never noticed any ball jumping in the shooter lane.
Quoted from Mr_Outlane:How many of you guys had to trim off the hard top at the shooter lane because it was too far to one side? My Gorgar is over hanging on the left side?
On my Xenon, I had to trim the 1-4 holes on top for the role over buttons to fit.
Quoted from pyrotech:On my Xenon, I had to trim the 1-4 holes on top for the role over buttons to fit.
That’s intentional.
Quoted from Clytor:I had to do this on my Blackout. Trim the Hardtop BEFORE you adhere it. I learned that the hard way. Also, I've never noticed any ball jumping in the shooter lane.
I found it quite easy to do in place with a sharp razor blade.
Quoted from Mr_Outlane:How many of you guys had to trim off the hard top at the shooter lane because it was too far to one side? My Gorgar is over hanging on the left side?
Sounds normal.
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-hardtop-restoration-comet#post-4470075
Quoted from Mr_Outlane:That worked perfect for trimming the edges!
[quoted image]
Yup, block plane for the outside edge.
So... I'm conflicted on what to do here. The pop base screw holes don't line up..although they didn't apparently line up with the original bases either. I'm afraid to punch new holes so close to the ones that are there, in the event that it blows out and drifts over causing the whole assembly to wobble. Thoughts?
20220319_170848 (resized).jpg20220319_180226 (resized).jpgQuoted from KSUWildcatFan:So... I'm conflicted on what to do here. The pop base screw holes don't line up..although they didn't apparently line up with the original bases either. I'm afraid to punch new holes so close to the ones that are there, in the event that it blows out and drifts over causing the whole assembly to wobble. Thoughts?
[quoted image][quoted image]
Ask vid1900
Quoted from Apinjunkie:Ask vid1900
If it was me, I would fill the holes that are not aligned and redrill. But first I would ask vid
Quoted from vid1900:Is that base supposed to be rotated 90° ?
No amount of rotation seemed to matter but I'll take another look to be sure.
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Sana'a
Carneys Point Township, NJ
Regina, SK