i've had people slide save a game in my living room and then look at me like oh shit sorry dude and i just tell them what i tell everyone- if you'd hit it too hard, it'd have tilted. nice save

also, the feeling you get from going on to have a great ball after shaking a ball back out of an outlane is spectacular. some of the best things i've ever done while playing haven't been winning or high scores but sick outlane or stdm saves

You can even get it without nudging if you deactivate the magnet at the right time. Double flip just as the ball finishes moving from right to left to alley-oop it into the lane.

You will be fine…most importantly just have fun…people forget that is the reason most of us got into this hobby is to have fun.

It’s a good discussion for new players to learn what is acceptable and what is not. When it’s your game you can do what ever you like..I hear some people like throwing games off buildings. But seriously nudging, slap saves and other ball control techniques are true skills to learn. Death/slide saves are a little extreme and not a bad thing to learn for fun. They are just not habits you want to use if you plan on being a tournament player. Death save/bang backs are truly illegal. Slide saves are debatable…depending on the floor surface an inch or two on smooth concrete or wood/laminate etc. and doesn’t tilt is not a huge deal. But a six inch or foot shove of the machine is not cool. If a game is on carpet then excessive force may be needed to “shove it” a few inches and probably not cool.

I've never been to a tournament - and I've played in a 100 or so - where "slide saves" were illegal. Generally, slide saves will cause a tilt, or at least 2 warnings, on a properly set up machine.

Also, those rubber feet things generally eliminate this move if that's what's desired.

So you like JP? Take a look who designed it. Its the goat of pinball- Keith Elwin himself. His nudging skills are incredible, and he uses it ALL THE TIME.
You are just a rude big mouth, coming here thinking you know everything better than the veterans.

Tough but fair!

Op, if you're unsure about nudging your games, I'd recommend getting Pinball FX 3 or The Pinball Arcade and messing with the nudging in those games. Should give you a good understanding of how nudging affects the ball and can be used to control it, and you can experiment without having to worry about damaging anything. Once you warm up to it digitally I think you'll warm up to it IRL pretty quickly.

I vividly remember Keith Elwin’s amazing speech about JP being the end of nudging! He promised operators and home collectors alike that from now on, games will be un-nudgeable and will tilt if you breathe too hard.

(Hard Sarcasm warning for those without a sense of humor)

I hope nobody has made this analogy, as I haven't read all responses yet. Calling nudging slop in pinball is like calling sliding into a base slop in baseball.

Is this thread is some sort of weird conversation starter?

Pinball is nudging. Otherwise just play dialed in via Bluetooth.

Nobody has made that analogy because it doesn't involve cars, and therefore, makes absolutely zero sense.

Please try again!

This thread made me realize, we've all been playing pool wrong. We need to start bumping the pool tables for close-but-not-quite shots.

Nudge controls are in literally every digital pinball game:

Pinball FX1, 2, 3
Pinball FX VR
Pinball Arcade
Zaccaria Pinball
Visual Pinball
Future Pinball

Even those cheap Arcade 1UP pinball machines have nudging.

All of these games are essentially software that emulates pinball.

They emulate the flippers, the DMDs, the sounds, and yes, the nudging.

People who think nudging is cheating probably think it’s cheating to smile when you have a bad hand in poker

I have a pool table, it weighs 1200 pounds, I wish you the best of luck trying to "nudge" it.

I’m one of those new players who still hasn’t learned to nudge or tilt. Are there any good tutorials out there?

Exactly on the slide saves if the tilt is set right…you can only shove a game so much…..so basically a slide save isn’t “illegal “ but the tilt is gonna get ya. You may get a way with a subtle slide from time to time….but in most situations it’s not worth the risk of the tilt depending on how it’s set up. There have been occasions where players notice a loose tilt and will be more liberal with a slide save….most of us have seen that.

Last comment I will say on the whole slide issue is usually what many people have seen is the guy who loses a ball and then out of RAGE shoves a game violently or pounds the glass……we all know that guy LOL!

See post #45 on page one..there is a bunch of threads on nudging. Tons of tips/tutorials if you look.

Why do I remember my coach saying “ Don’t be sloppy- if you can get there standing up, get there standing up..”
It was also legal at one time to use anything on the baseball or bat- until it wasn’t legal.

People seem to be confusing skillful nudging at tournament play with obnoxious behavior at conventions and bars. When the majority decide no more sliding, all tourney pins will have rubber feet. I’ve been in the hobby for 30 years. Haven’t changed my opinion. When pins cost $500 or now at $15k, it don’t seem right to be throwing it all over the place. To each their own.

….It’s like a guy with a fancy, manual sports car not having the finesse to find the gear. Grind it til you find it!

Is that like an animal in your attic?

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And some of us still cannot fathom how others see us as a bunch of assholes.

Shimying a ball out of and outlane is sublime!

chuckwurt linked a few videos but check out all of ABE_FLIPS tutorials. They are so well done and concise enough to not overwhelm you with info. Couple mins to get in and out and you will have some knowledge to demonstrate in your very next game.

You call things like a foosball hitting the goalie's foot cheating but it's only cheating if it's against the rules. You can set any rules for yourself but don't expect everyone else to follow the rules you want. Nudging is so well established in this game that it's not even worth discussing. These rules are not going to change.

I gave a thumbs down for not using basic paragraph breaks. Shame.

No, more like you should learn that if you come in uninformed, and then refuse knowledge offered, you aren't going to get a good response.

Ok, but you could stop thinking that now that you’ve taken part in this discussion and been presented with facts that you perhaps weren’t aware of previously.

Like all the way back at post #6, when the thread ended, see below.

And it was elaborated that a number of games award you additional tilt warnings through regular play. Godzilla was mentioned, and I just read today that if you use up all your tilt warnings on TNA then the mystery award will always be an additional tilt warning.

I don’t know how you can continue to see it as a matter of opinion if you have absorbed this new information. At this point, it’s just incorrect to say it’s not intended. Playing it off as simply an opinion “contrary to the masses,” is just not correct.

If you’re seriously going to stick to your guns on this, you’re saying that every game designer of the last 40 years is doing it wrong.

(I’m enjoying tone in this thread, I feel like we’re all having fun, so I hope this doesn’t read as bashing)

Stop!!! Just Stop!!! Nudging is Pinball, Period.

OP, is this you?

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Not only the tilt mechanisms, warnings etc, but have a bit of a peek at the design of the playfield. Ask yourself why the designer has gone to the trouble of adding all those little jutting edges, small ledges and posts in strategic spots? Why is that ledge there i wonders?
Why has the designer put a rubber in, instead of a simpler, no maintenance metal rail?

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And to agree that the original pinballs without flippers were designed to nudge, and then to switch to your own opinion by saying you know that pinball moved on from that design?

You will find your self without pinheads to play with at home. Everyone has their own standards as to what is acceptable on their machines, i don't care if you slide a machine a foot across the floor, it's a skill to do it without tilting. But if you rage tilt, or abuse a machine after the ball is heading out of play, you'll be sidelined.

You’ve been into pinball all of two months, and you don’t think this is how it was intended?

“Modern Jackass” comes to mind.

This American Life did a podcast on the phenomenon of the modern jackass, ie, someone who likes to claim authority on a subject while knowing very little about it. It all ties into the Dunning Kruger effect, and not knowing how much you don’t know about something.

Taking a contrarian stance on nudging when you have almost zero experience is squarely inside the “mount stupid” zone
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It's really just the dumbest shit I've ever seen around here, which is why it kind of feels like a troll. Even civilians who know almost nothing about pinball know about "tilting," and how it's a huge part of pinball.

It's in the goddamn Who song after all!!! Dear lord. He's a pinball wizard because he "never tilts at all," not because he "never nudges at all." There are arcades, companies, and movies with "tilt" in their names.

I'll never understand why once a year someone chooses to bring this up. I guess it's a good way to get attention, like declaring the pinball machines shouldn't have flippers any more, or asking why we need to keep score during a pinball game.

“Civilians”? Are you implying those who don’t play pinball are more civil than us pinsiders??

Also say's 'he stand's like a statue'......That's why he never tilts.

But that's mythical characters for you.

Can’t help but think some of this stems from being a bit overprotective of the game given the cost. Remember these are designed to be beat on for 1000s of hours in arcades. Don’t be Cameron’s dad in Ferris Buehler.

No reason to be a jerk to the guy. He said he’s new. Teach him kindly and be on your merry way.

Pins are meant to be put in bars and have the unwashed masses pump money in and play them. They are made of tougher stuff than most people think. If your on laminate floor you really should use rubber feet to make sure they don’t slide out and damage the floor or bump into walls and other machines. Pinball resource is an excellent source for these (one of the cheaper suppliers)
These are not items to be kept in their packages and wiped down with diapers IMHO they are meant to be played. If your concerned about excessive nudging tighten the tilt bob. If your worried a few slaps and shoves will damage your work of art you probably shouldn’t play them at all with the risk dimpling your playfield each time you airball a shot. However that being said it’s your game do what you want with it but for me as long as you keep 4 legs on the floor I say play on player. I have never damaged any of my games with slap saves and pushes and I regularly host tournaments with over 50 players at my garage. All of my games have the tilt set so that the player can get one good save with a warning or two but excessive nudges will tilt. Nudging is always been a part of pinball even in the era when they sell for over 10k.

We tried that and it didn't go well!

Time to move on to negative reinforcement.

They're civilians, we're citizens.

I just learned about this game called "baseball", and I think it's cheating when a pitcher throws a "curveball".

Things should only be thrown in a straight line. You never see the shortstop throw a curve ball to the first-baseman...

If you find yourself angry at the machine, are you really having fun? Nudging is fine as long as you don’t “take it out” on the machine.

Just saw this behaviour at a comp recently. People shouting and raging at a machine because the ball went down the outlanes.

That's what the fucking machine is designed to do. How can you be angry with an object that is functioning perfectly as designed?

There's so many people in the world that have no capacity for thought, and no control over their own brain.

Well 10 percent agree so higher than I thought! Guessing those are the selling my 4 year old game with 58 plays guys..

How was imposter designed to be nudge only.. are you actually trying to shake the ball off the magnet? The flippers will release as per 2nd quote, unless some unskippable animations are backed up...

Deadpool has an insider achievement for tilting away so much bonus also has a highscore tilt champion for offline as well!

You can have unpopular opinions no problem, there's a whole thread for that. Saying that you think nudging is cheating isn't an opinion, it's just flat out wrong. The rules of pinball are determined by the people who design the game. Stern, Jersey Jack, American, Spooky, etc. They have the authority to determine the rules on their games. Email these companies, contact the game designers, ask them if nudging is cheating or part of the game. They will all tell you that it's absolutely part of the game. If you still think it's cheating after this, then at that point you're just being stubborn with nothing to back up your argument.

Is anyone out there like me, where they WANT to nudge or tilt but just end up staring like a deer in headlights as the ball drains straight down the middle?

Only after two brownies.

Although my mate Johnny does. We call it a Johnny when you watch it roll off a flipper round here.