I hope I feel the same when I get my Wolvie in. Because it's taking ALL my willpower to not ditch it and go for ACDC Premium

Wow, I honestly can NOT agree with anything you just said, were you sober while playing it (you did refrence capt n coke)???
I am sorry for being so blunt, but comparing this game to Spiderman is an absolute slap in the face to Ritchie and Lyman and I am not a big Spiderman pinball fan.
I would say BBH> has the edge on Xmen right now.

Releasing the game with probably a fraction of the code done is not usually a good sign of it ever being completed... take that for what its worth...
Tight shots is an understatement, if you think Gem shot in Tron is a an unapealling frustrating shot, that is a good description of the tight shots in Xmen. Rogue shot is so tight and has such a quick turn, that the ball will richochette out from hitting the ball guide that is supposed to help guide the ball around the loop.
Yes, I got "night crawler" and wont even go there.

What could of been done better,
Starters, some time less is better. Creating a few more shot at the expense of sacrificing over-all good geometry and feel of a shot, is not a good thing. Take, Tron for example Every shot (except Gem) in Tron feels like butter; thats not so in Xmen.
- flippers seemed under powered for the iceman ramp, which isnt fun.
- nigh crawler, should of been a series of pop up drop targets that could pop up all over the playfield including the lanes, and could face the 3rd flipper so you could make that usefull during that mode.
Code, I would never, ever, release a game with such minimal code being done, I was definately taken back by this.
I will stop here........

good luck for all that bought one, I hope at the very least your code gets finished. Polished??, even more good luck sent to you my way.
Scott
Detroit Pinball

Wow I'm in your boat Gorilla, I got on the preorder but quickly cancelled mine after picture were released. Was happy as a clam till I went over to markmon's house and played his. After a couple of games and his magneto, i was sold.
I just hope the code lives up to this machine's appearance.

What ever you are smoking stop....crack kills.

Every Stern title that is released is unfinished. You have AC/DC, you should know.

Actually the Rogue shot is easier to hit then the Gem shot for me. I have no problems hitting the Rogue shot or the ball locking.

There are some tough shots but Tron is similar. Quorra is a tight shot, shoting loop through bumpers, Gem shot. I do agree X-Men has some tight shots. Not impossible though.

Check every ACDC thread about the code, also see Tron update.
You act like the game has no code at all, yet ACDC doesn't even have complete code as well. No Encore Multiball. Code will be updated for both. X-Men maybe even this coming week.

I ddin;t think rogue shot was as hard as Gem.

I think once the code gets update and hopefully they do a good job it will be killer. The one thing I think they could have left off all together was the swinging ramp. Other than that I like the variety of shots an seems like a fun game that will stick around for a long time.

Forgot to ask...does everyone has a Mylar strip coming out of the blackbird scoop? Didn't notice until I was taking a good look at it today before tonight's make over....LEDs, mirror blades, change up the domes, rubbers and external sub

Yeah pretty pointless.

That was exactly what I thought. Stargate had it right with the wireform. Game looks cool though regardless.

The Rogue shot is exponentially easier to hit than the GEM shot. I can routinely shoot the first 3 balls of the game directly to Rogue for locks. Try that with 3 GEM shots in a row. Maybe we have a user problem here.

Are just not that good. Sorry but ritchie's games are on the bottom of the pile in my house.

Thanks Tom for educating me on Stern code, I guess I wouldnt know in the 12 years I have been collecting Stern pins including WOF.

Thanks for assuming that I feel that AC/DC has the code finished. Just for the record I assure you that it isnt and its unexceptable at this point, most of the game was complete on release and unfortunately it did take me some time (weeks) to figure out what was done and what wasnt.
Ritchies promise and knowing Lymans track record is the only reason I have let this slide, so far; and yes, its still unexceptable and I would not encourage anyone to buy an AC/DC untill the features in the game all work.

Also, I dont believe I ever mentioned that any of the shots on Xmen are impossible, just not fun, and yes I feel the Gem shot is not fun, not because its tough, it just feels miss aligned.
As Xmen and Tron being similar- Borg had to take the shots in Tron, and make them narrower and tighter to fit more shots on xmen. As I stated above, it tooks something that felt silky smooth, to something clunky.

I have just stated that the code has a long ways to go, llllloooooonnnggg, I would call it basically a shell of a game right now. and I am not feeling as confindent as you to give this a recomend to someone shelling out $5000 of their hard earned bucks without some guarantee that the code will be finished within a reasonable time frame, and that also goes for AC/DC, if that helps you put things in perspective.
I absolutely hope it gets finished, and I hope you are happy with your game.

just my .02 cents, and many many happy updates to you!
Scott
Detroit Pinball

sounds like somebody just sucks at pinball and can't make tough shots very often.

But it's never been seen in a pin before!

It does seem pointless. Does it really accomplish anything other than letting you know the iceman mode is running?

I feel your pain, not personally but through my friends who own WOF.

I wouldn't say it's like a shell of a game. The code needs some work no doubt about it.
I also don't judge games on a first code released. If you have 12 years collecting Stern games, I would imagine you would feel the same way. Let's hope for some stellar updates.

AS for the code on XMEN, from what I've read/played it's completely horrible. And to blow Stern and say everything will be ok is more than niave....of course IF you own it I assume you have to tell yourself everything will work out ok...please lord

I hate bringing code issues up because they seem so...well easy. If someone has just spent, what, 8Gs on a pinball machine that DOESN'T score in multiballs or modes of the game, and they're telling you it's great, then I don't know what to say.

Well it helps light the blackbird launch on the left side which you can't do on the right.

Was there an update already? Can it score in Multiballs and modes yet?

So when the scoring works then what?

Then it's a pinball machine. I mean seriously...is this a real question?

Do you think every game comes from the factory comes without a code revision for scoring problems or other problems? Seriously.

Please, just answer my original question, I really don;t know as I've been off pinside for a few days.

As for your questions, which I am more than happy to discuss, No, I do not think games come from the factory without needing scoring/rules adjustments.
You own a lot more games than I do so let me ask another question. Do machines usually come from a factory without being able to score points in multiballs or modes? Maybe it's a known issue...it would be new to me but I don't know everything.

EDIT: I mean a pinball machine it a game of amusement that is based off scoring points and all. I don;t think I'm too far out of line here.

All Stern machines get code updates. So did the B/W games. How many games are in your game room running ver. 1.0 code? Good lord.

Totally agree...and I wasn't buying games or paying attention to code revisions in the 90s...that's why I'm asking these questions.

How man X-Men machines are out thus far? Seriously? Maybe 100? This is the code ironing that normally happens on the pro runs sent to Europe. Collectors don't start caring about Stern releases usually for two months, after a revision or two has been released. Damned of you do, damned of you don't.

How do you update a game? Total noob question. I've never updated one in the past

The code is 1.1 on mine. No new release but I would expect one in a week or two to fix the scoring problem.

Here's an example to your question from Family Guy:

V 1.01 - 2-Feb-2007
====================

Family Guy Changes
-----------
- Stewie Multiball miniplayfield shots now score and make sounds when not giving jackpot

System Changes
-----------
none

V 1.00 - 1-Feb-2007
====================

ALSO POTC:

POTC V1.04 - Monday July 24, 2006
SYS 1.12
Changes from 1.03:
- FIX - Heart Multiball Super Jackpot now awards during the grace period.
- FIX - Four Winds total now displays the correct amount.
- FIX - Bonus Multiplier Held now works correctly.

I ran across an old RGP Archive thread (pre Google Group, actually) around the Addams Family release a few weeks back. It was from 1992. They were really bitching about scoring glitches and how the game code was terrible, and this game was never going to be any good. We all know they never ironed that disaster of a game out, now don't we?

Yes. Very easy. Use a USB memory stick, and it takes 3 minutes.

Stern's Sam Board (newer games) You download to files from Stern's website, unzip them on a USB drive. Then plug the usb drive into to cpu.
If it's an older game, pre SAM board you have to change out the cpu chip with one with the new code

OMG....on a Bally/WMS. Say it ain't so, Gambit. Say it ain't so!

Not really a fan of TAF but obviously, it turned out well
Again, I just wanted to know, seemed like a big deal to me, seems not to be.

In case you all didn't see my posts from other threads I played the game and had a hoot. ACDC was very bland to me but this one seems to have some chops to it. Just confused as to why I hit 20+ jackpots and ended up with a 4 million score

Classic conundrum: release the game and work out code bugs and ruleset down the line vs. Hold on to the game until all code is finished and miss out on production that is otherwise ready to begin. Stern makes updates easy, so they go with option 1. Some are ok with it, some hate it. X-Men needs ironing out on the scoring. There are also features and modes not in it yet, that need implemented. I believe that will happen on this game. Mostly, because the interest was so great. LEs sold out in days and they plan on selling a butt load of Pros of this title. They need everything to work for that to happen, especially with the Pro run cooing later on this title.

As long as they do. I know ACDC still doesn't have the Wizard mode yet right? I mean I'm not a buyer so what i think doesn;t really matter...as long as people are fine with it that's the way it will go. I know RBION didn't have a wizard mode upon release.

EDIT: Of course looking at the dates RBION seems to have had at least 8 updates in 2 months. Guess they aren't as quick anymore.

I'm really not trying to bust your balls so I hope you laugh at this. It took about a year for RBION.

CPU Release Version 1.01
Date March 24, 2004

CPU Release Version 3.20
Date February 22, 2005

Sorry had to go there. lol

Gambit,
Just for the record, I dont think you should compare CODE on todays Stern to yesterdays Williams pins.
Without showing dis-respect to the new code guy for Stern on Xmen, but please, some of you have been comparing code work and updates to TAF, that was designed by Pat Lawlor and also designed/programmed by Larry Demar, I dont think I would be going out on a limb by saying they are both "Legends in the industry".
Taking a leap of faith on the code on TAF, would pail in comparison.

I dont want to take this thread any farther but to answer the question for Tom and Gambit, to what "the Law" has asked, just my personal experience of playing new Stern titles over the last 12 years, yes, almost always the code wasnt finished. (Just my opinion, take it or leave it) The difference to me, and I have been burned before when games were 80% finished and only needed 20% more to go, so to speak....
In my history I havent played a game that was released that I thought was only maybe 25% complete, I noticed this in the first couple balls of playing. I am concerned that Stern will give up on the game before they put the 75% more that it needs to go, plus the polish; so to speak. You dont have to be a pinball guru to notice this.
Since there is no guarantee's, I dont why they just didnt hold up on the release a few weeks, it would make them and their product look so much more professional and reputable.

but hey, its your $5000 grand, do what you want....

Scott
Detroit Pinball

At first I was interested in what you had to say, but you lost all credibility with me with that statement.

And what's with putting Ritchie on such a high pedestal? He's a great designer, but Borg has proven himself.. it's not designer vs designer anyways, what makes you even think that?

I personally had a SM for 9 months, it was a great game, but long ball times after that amount of ownership had me trading it for something else. I also think X-men is a better game, and while the code isn't finished you can get a good enough feel for it- enough to convince me that it's a kick ass game.

25% complete is a pretty absurd statement. It's a game that already has 16 functioning modes with rules, dots and sounds, plus a main multi. (Seriously, how many complete games have that many?) Yes, the scoring tabulation issue needs to be worked out, and there's a missing multi and a hope for some more stacking. We'll see what develops from here, but 25% is pure hyperbole.

This guy talks in hyperbole, exclusively! 25%? Genius!

/endgivingashit

If this game is only 25% done, it will be an amazing game at 100% and would absolutely surpass the super dooper, Ritchie designed SM! OH NOOOOOO!!!

Perhaps you should pass on this title and get a 24? You may impress Steve even more when you tell him you have one at the next pinball festival.

Wow, 25% done only? Now I will ignore the rest of his post.

Somewhat back on topic, just to jump in with my $.02 worth....

I read all the threads and was getting caught up in all the excitement for this thing pre-release. Heard of all the cool stuff this game was going to have. Enough so that I seriously considered making X-Men my first NIB. Waited breathlessly for the initial pictures. Waited some more. And then waited some more.

When they finally released the photos, it was total "anticipointment" for me. The artwork looked cobbled together. The figures looked huge and ridiculous. The Iceman ramp seemed tacky. I totally was turned off by the way the thing looked.

Fast forward to today, and I finally got to play a Wolverine LE. I have to agree with Jason that this machine is pretty freaking cool. In person, the artwork just clicks. It's like playing a giant comic book. The animations were cool, and I liked a lot of the shots and the speed.

At first, I thought the LE would be so much better than the Pro due to the spinning disk. In actuality, I found that I didn't notice the disk all that much during gameplay. However, count me as one that's surprised with how much I do like the moving ramp. It really gave me a visceral feel that, "Hey, I'm getting somewhere. The ramp is moving." Yeah, it's a mostly a show-off piece, but it's a fun one.

All in all (and QC/program issues aside), I think Stern's got another hit on their hands with X-Men. Am I sorry that I didn't decide to get one? No.

I'm all in for the P3....

...and truly isn't that the best measure of a product? The one that can separate me from my hard earned $$$ ?

Later,
EV

the game scores perfectly fine in modes of the game. The mode bug is that the score presented is wrong but the mode scoring is added correctly.

24 is a very good game. Dont knock it. Since its final code update, it got very complete. Great flow, tight shots, hurry up aspect keeps you on edge etc.

Mine had the mylar in front of the scoop and also surprisingly where the ball drops off the ramp on the right (but not the left side).

I feel for everyone as we all do not know if they will ever finish the code or leave us with something incomplete.

AC/DC takes about 30 minutes to update if you verify the image

What I really want to know without any BS and with a minimal amount of buyers just hyping up their LE purchases, is the LE really that much better than the Pro? I was in for an LE but pulled out after the initial pictures as I did not like the LE art packages compared to the awesome art of the Pro. I've watched all the gameplay videos posted here on pinside and rgp so far and the ramp looks a little lackluster as I thought it would be, but surprisingly the spinning disk looks very underpowered and not like I imagined it would be like seen in Twister and Lost in Space. Since I'm seriously considering a pro just wondered what peoples honest opinions of the LE features in action are?

I think the spinning disc has a bit more impact on gameplay than it's gotten press for on the board, but it isn't critical. The ramp is cool but a minor contributor to gameplay, and the nightcrawlers are, well, they are an extra mode. Cool to see, yet not going to impact the overall experience much.

I'd say the biggest difference in the experience will be the lightshow. The color changing GI makes a big difference in the wow factor (and I know because mine's not working at the moment). In short, if I had to put a number on it, the pro will be 85% of the experience at 66% of the price. (Resale value not withstanding, because who knows what direction that'll go.) Though I'm happy to have gone LE, I don't think the pro owners will feel shortchanged.