(Topic ID: 190715)

NOS/NEW Playfields Available for sept.


By kruzman

2 years ago



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  • Latest reply 1 year ago by dothedoo
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    #1 2 years ago

    ARCHIVED

    Archived ad

    Pinside keeps a record of old ads in its Market Archive, for historical purposes and as a price reference. This ad has been ended by its seller and is now archived.


    Price

    $ 800 (OBO)

    Open for offers


    for sale

    NOS/NEW Playfields Available for sept.

    Added: June 6th, 2017 Re-listed: 2 times (September 11th, 2017) Ended: October 24th, 2017
    Condition: New

    Item description

    Here is the list of new and nos pf's available for right now. Everything is stock finish unless noted. The prices change daily, so if you are interested in a title you can feel free to email me for info. Also every pf has a diffrent condition that I will describe thoroughly, and I can fix and or clear all of them.

    NOS Star trek Next Gen. Perfected and cleared, backsealed, sold
    Centaur. cpr perfected and cleared, amazing. pic on page 5 sold
    NOS Twilight zone sold
    Knockout Gottlieb repro
    Corvette NOS and cpr gold plus plastic set
    No FEAR
    Joker poker cpr gold
    Transformers
    AC/DC both pro and preimum
    Rolling Stones LE stern
    Fish Tales cpr
    Bumper pool
    wwf Royal Rumble set
    Batman Forever
    NBA Fastbreak cleared by bill davis $575
    Team ONE
    Indy Jones 4
    Game show
    Wheel of Fortune
    Batman Dark Knight
    Lucky Strike/Gold strike
    Car hop
    Harley Davidson stern
    CSI
    JackBot sold
    Contact williams
    Wizard of OZ
    Fire nos
    Judge dread
    Popeye
    Speak Easy
    Monte Carlo
    Strikes and spares nos $500
    Tales of arabian nights cpr
    Star Wars DE
    Simpsons pin party set $975 for set
    spring break
    Playboy Bally cpr beautiful sold
    world Champ
    Star Wars Episode1 pin 2000
    Nitro Ground shaker gold

    I am always interested in buying or trading for other nos/new pf's and games, and world wide shipping is available.

    Lastly My studio is accepting clearcoat as well as Drill/dimple jobs right now.

    Thank you for your support


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    Note! This is an archived ad. No longer for sale!


    Listing result

    The seller marked this ad as "not sold". The item did not sell through Pinside so there's no listing result.

    Item location

    Galesburg, MI, US


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    #2 2 years ago

    Impressive list! Just out of curiosity I was wondering if you have ever tried to clearcoat an ACDC Premium? If so, was there any issue with the window and how is it holding up with play?

    #3 2 years ago

    great question. I have one in line to experiment with right now. I will publish the results.
    Thank you for asking

    #4 2 years ago

    At the Allentown show I checked out quite a few playfields in different vendors booths and noticed many had "camber" or a "hump"of approx 1/2"-3/4" if you sighted the top edge from front to back. A this due to umproper storage? If so, once it happens is it irreversible? You seem to be one of the highest regarded pinsiders as far as playfield restoration/ clear coating goes so I figured I'd ask you.

    #5 2 years ago

    Very common question on the warping of pf's. They are made of plywood which is always moving. because it has a bunch of plys at 90 degree differences. It moves even more than just wood alone. The good thing is they took the material in to account when designing the games. They even tried using plastics/composits.
    If you have a warp even over an inch on the length of the pf, worry not. Not at all. first you just use gravity and old text books to help it back, changing temps humidity and pressure effect it also.
    The side rails are fixed on with almost 2 inch screws and they really straighten them out right away. also the way the pf sits in the machine and they points where it contacts is designed to deal with the wood movement and warping. lastly. if you have ever picked up a populated pf, you realize they are quite heavy. once installed with the parts and put in the machine, the design is the pf sits on spots so the weight pulls it down and keeps the shape.

    sometimes when a pf gets cupped from side to side, I use old side rails, or you can make any wood, but you dont want to use a soft wood, you want a hard wood, and dont use the board flat, use the edges of the boards for strength and screw them on the back of the pf, starting at the top edge. dont tighten all of the way until they are all spaced and started, then start tightening like lug nuts. once you let that set for a while with environmental factors it makes a large difference.

    There are pf's like safe cracker where at one point in the pf more than 75% of the wood is cut out, side to side. so this title has probs with warping. I have a used one in the studio right now that I am straightening with side rails, and I have seen many people make under pf supports of metal and wood. used where ever they can get some distance without hitting any part.These are made to stay on the pf during use.

    All and all, I do not stress pf warping at all. I have seen really warped pf's installed in a weekend and at the end of the job they were true.

    One of the things in my super secret process is I seal the back side and as much of the cut outs so that it will be less effected by moisture in the future. Not because of warping but planking..

    Hope that answers the question and helps someone.
    cheers, kruzman

    #6 2 years ago

    Buy with confidence! My NOS Funhouse DiamondPlate and Monster Bash look fantastic!

    #7 2 years ago
    Quoted from Defender:

    Buy with confidence! My NOS Funhouse DiamondPlate and Monster Bash look fantastic!

    That was a fascinating post Kruzman-

    Can't wait to see my MB play field too! Would love to send you my DW soon

    #8 2 years ago

    Thank you for the answer to my question!

    #9 2 years ago

    answering good questions is the fun part of the job for sure. Hope it helps someone.
    sorry how long the MB is taking, just by the luck of the draw it was the last pf in a large group. so I am on it. Hopefully life is long.
    cheers

    #10 2 years ago

    What's your opinion on sterns newer playfields. At Allentown all the distributors showing newer sterns machines had playfields with what I consider pretty severe cratering/dents. Is this due to a change in the Baltic birch plywood-used or?It Looked really bad even without using light reflection to see it. For the record I'm not talking about minor dimpling that occur and even out on new games.

    #11 2 years ago

    stern pf's wear really fast for 3 reasons.
    stern still designs the games to be used as income tools
    they only do 2 thin coats of clear, this is to make assembly easier, you dont have to be careful drilling it wont crack, chip, halo.
    Almost all wood is really crappy now. I have access to dutch people here in west michigan from when I was a finish carpenter who make hardwood products, and it is amazing stuff, but starting in the 90's wood started going down hill (if you are old you will remember the spotted owl in the bush sr years)and getting worse and worse every year as the price went up. For some reason pf makers dont want to use the good stuff. some say it cant be found others say it is too expensive. Wade tells me he pays for the best he can find but I have never installed one of his planks. Back in the old days he used to make his own laminate!

    I sell a lo tac mylar that comes in 8x11 sheets that I started using for games that I took to shows and get played 400 games a day, then I realized my metallica pf was wearing. acdc also. so I make mylars for between the pops, the shooter lane kick out and anywhere that it is obvious it is going to wear. the stuff comes off easy, and it last about 3 years before I replace it. I cut it so the edges are on a black line, and if I can get an edge to go under a plastic I do. it cant be seen or noticed for the most part unless it is in the middle of the pf. also invest in your mantis cliffy protectors, (of course).

    Lastly with the sterns I suggest to people to pick up an extra nos pf for each game you are going to keep and hang it on the wall. that way you have one when or if you decide you need it, and of course get it professionaly cleared before install. stern pf's used to be $225. I am really bad on years but until about 2012 maybe later. I think they raised them because cpr was selling pfs for 799.

    I hope that answers your questions

    #12 2 years ago

    If I was to buy your TZ playfield, Do I have to install rails on it? Planning on starting the TZ playfield swap until I'm done restoring my IJ. Maybe 2 or 3 months. Thanks!

    #13 2 years ago
    Quoted from kruzman:

    answering good questions is the fun part of the job for sure. Hope it helps someone.
    sorry how long the MB is taking, just by the luck of the draw it was the last pf in a large group. so I am on it. Hopefully life is long.
    cheers

    Yeah baby!

    #14 2 years ago

    thank you for sharing your knowledge! Not trying to start a fight or be negative about any specific manufacturer but I'm curious what you think of other new playfields from Jersey J , spooky,cpr , marco? From what I've seen all seem to hold up better than stern.

    #15 2 years ago

    Maybe I asked the wrong question....
    Who is currently making playfields?
    And for whom?

    #16 2 years ago
    Quoted from ultimategameroom:

    Maybe I asked the wrong question....
    Who is currently making playfields?
    And for whom?

    The ones I know of -
    CPR,
    Mirco,
    Peter.

    #17 2 years ago

    My opinion Peter has the best quality. His Bop PF was really nice. Micro would be second followed by CPR's newer PF's.

    12
    #18 2 years ago

    since it is very complicated, and some manufactures have made great stuff and crap. Not to mention if I say anything about one of them the owner will disect every sentence I write and make me look like an idiot.
    Obviously some people are making better than others, but everyone is making plenty good enough to work with. pinball is like any other restoration. You can slap parts on and its restored, or you can make it something to show off and be proud of. there is room for everything in between.For me it is an unhealthy obsession with perfection that fuels my drive to continue my career.

    Its my opinion that stern and all of the repro pf's are good enough to do when they were designed which is make a tool to earn quarters. If you want something more than that you can find people like me (or the many others) to make it a reflection of your opinion of functional art. Everyone knows I am very opinated, although that dosent mean I vote down party lines, and I will gladly change my opinion, when things change. I am just trying to say I am not being PC about this. Its is actually how I feel without bringing in personal opinions of people I may dislike.
    So if you ask what to expect from a xyz title made by abc I will share my experience and suggestion, though it will be best in a PM.

    Long answer short: Restoring an old game or tweeking , perfecting a new one is a reflection of ones self, capablities, imagination, devotion, and all of that is mother fu#*#g AWESOME, and I respect it at whatever level. I am not getting rich here, and I just sold a pf at a loss to make my morg, but man I love it. (this hobby)

    #19 2 years ago

    Spoken like a true gentleman!

    #20 2 years ago

    It looks like the dirty Harry pf is spoken for. If anyone has a used version that I can borrow to make a dimple template for the new owner, I can pay rent on it, of course pay the shipping, or I can send it back in one of my shiping crates for the favor, or if you want to sell it.
    I hate to have a customer install a undimpled pf on his first attempt.

    Thank you, ron

    #21 2 years ago

    If you plan on installing a pf soon, I have developed 2 kits that I designed to help with common problems with installing pf's especially clearcoated.
    The first is 8 or 9 diffrent shaped and sized diamond dremmil bits. you use them at low speed and remove the clear before drilling thru it. also there is special ones for the pop bumper nail screws, to remove the clear so you can get them to sit flush with the surface.
    If you have ever done a MB and tried to get the creech swamp on the left to sit level, there is a special bit for that. What I did was go thru over 200 bits available and picked the ones that solve problems with pf applications, and bought 12 dozen of each and put them together in a kit for $40. I highly suggest to my customers. I hate hawking more product to them after spending a lot of money allready, but I wouldnt if they were not so helpful.
    The second kit, I just put together after drilling a cleared pf and many of the holes had halos around them, from the clear getting hot or lifting. this kit is really thin glue and hypo needles where you just apply a drop on every hole drilled. it gets rid of the halo and it immediatly soaks in to the wood and under the edges of the hole and glues it down. This is great because chances are you will have to pull the screw or post at least once, just in the population process, not to mention in the next 10 years. I love it, it makes everything look better, and it gives piece of mind for securing everything. the glue kit is $25.

    The last product I push is for non cleared pf's, and for ball drops on cleared pf's. Its a lo tac mylar. I discovered it by needing something for shows when my games were getting 400 games a day. I have it on all of my new stern games between the pops and in the shooter kick out. Its nice and thin, and I custom cut mine so it ends right on a black line, and if I can get it to go under a plastic so you dont notice an edge I always do. Once installed, it is very hard to notice. It seems to last 2-3 years of home use no problem at all. if you want to remove comes off without freeze or heat. 2 8x11 sheets for 5 bucks.

    halo 1 (resized).jpg

    halo 2 (resized).jpg

    #22 2 years ago

    The vampire and bride pfs are sold. One sold at cost and the other was a $45 dollar profit before I spend the 2 hours packing and driving to fed ex.
    My point is, it never hurts to make an offer if it is a pf you want. Sometimes I need the cash flow

    I have a fathom bronze to add to the list

    #23 2 years ago

    Kruzman, what's the avg cost to clear a pf with you?

    #24 2 years ago

    I just spent a half hour describing everything in detail. I hit send post and nothing. It dissapeared. this has happened a couple other times. sorry I will try again when I have the time. I bet this one will post

    #26 2 years ago
    Quoted from kruzman:

    I just spent a half hour describing everything in detail. I hit send post and nothing. It dissapeared. this has happened a couple other times. sorry I will try again when I have the time. I bet this one will post

    are you typing on a mobile device or a computer? If you're on a mobile device, you'll need to hit the submit button twice.

    #27 2 years ago

    Related question, Ron -
    If someone is going to send you a playfield that you do NOT have a divot guide for and can divot - meaning I would have to do it BEFORE or AFTER clearcoating,
    What is better? Before or after sending it out to you?

    #28 2 years ago

    This week I needed to divit/dimple a dirty harry pf and I didnt have a template or used pf for it. In the past I have bought a used pf to make it, and people here on pinside have sent me a used pf for free (8 ball delux) but also I have a good friend with a large collection that he uses for decorative purposes. Its a huge pain in in butt, pulling them down, but he was kind enough to do me the favor. since he didnt charge me, I was able to do it for the lowest price for the customer.

    Now to answer your question, its better to drill and dimple it first before the clear coat. Not by much, but then I dont have to clamp my plexiglass on the surface or handle the pf after it has been cleared. Like when I use the drill press for countersinking the side rail holes, I have to tape protective paper on the pf, as not to scuff it.
    Lastly mistakes can happen, so in anything you do the finish last. So I would always drill and dimple before the clear.

    #29 2 years ago

    This week I needed to divit/dimple a dirty harry pf and I didnt have a template or used pf for it. In the past I have bought a used pf to make it, and people here on pinside have sent me a used pf for free (8 ball delux) but also I have a good friend with a large collection that he uses for decorative purposes. Its a huge pain in in butt, pulling them down, but he was kind enough to do me the favor. since he didnt charge me, I was able to do it for the lowest price for the customer.

    Now to answer your question, its better to drill and dimple it first before the clear coat. Not by much, but then I dont have to clamp my plexiglass on the surface or handle the pf after it has been cleared. Like when I use the drill press for countersinking the side rail holes, I have to tape protective paper on the pf, as not to scuff it.
    Lastly mistakes can happen, so in anything you do the finish last. So I would always drill and dimple before the clear.

    #30 2 years ago

    Ah, good to know then. I have plans on getting two PF's cleared, but can't have you do the dimpling. (One, because there's only 52 of them, and you do NOT have a template, and there are so few holes that it wouldn't be worth sending to you, and Two, because the PF getting cleared/installed is a prototype, and things are mounted in different positions.)

    So, hence why I was wondereing if it's something I should take care of before sending it off, or after.

    17
    #31 2 years ago

    I will try this again. My clear process is $575. Here is a description of what you get.

    I sand off the original clear, its either old, or it is not as good as my material, plus I dont do paint on top of clear, which many do, and it looks horrible, like it is floating on an eigth of clear, which it is. So I sand it down to level it, and most of the time there are several inserts that are lifted, and you dont know because of the clear. So the paint around the edge of the inserts that are lifted will get repainted. some nos pf's, its more than half, some reproductions it is zero.
    I sand the back and apply a couple coats of poly which soaks in to the wood and seals out moisture and keeps the back clean. Automotive clear dosent soak in, it dries on top. this is why it is so important to have a good sanded surface.
    I apply 8 coats, 2 at a time. you get a harder surface with many thin coats, and the material is made for only 2 coats, so it is important to allow it to completely cure between sets of coats. So I wait 15 days between. In that time I sand the whole thing level then hand sand all of the low points like shooter lane, ball hole lips, dimples, ect... between each set of coats
    I also seal the inside edges of the cut outs and drill holes, and dimples so I can wet block sand later.
    After I get all of the clear built up, I allow 3-4 weeks for it to be totally cured. what I have found is since many pf's have crappy wood that may not be cured, or just moves around a lot since it is wood, and layers of wood with the grain going in different directions, if I sand and polish and ship right away, some pf's, will over time, have the woodgrain raise and then you can see it in the finish. So now I wait 3-4 weeks, and I sand the entire beautiful, done looking surface, and get it super level. Then I wet block it up to 3000 by hand.
    Now it is time to run a 12 lbs milwaukee buffer over it for 4-10 hours. sometimes I will find imperfections, once the surface starts to get closer to perfection. I either address them individually, or I sand the whole thing with 600 and respray it and wait another 3 weeks. Its hard to find the imperfections until it is almost complete. after using about 5 diffrent buffer heads and 5 diffrent grade compounds, and it is complete and passes inspection, I take it to the house and clean out the holes of compound. even the little holes I run a couple strings thru. This takes about 1.5 hours.
    Then the pf goes back to the studio for a final coat of polymer wax. and wrapped.

    About 50% of pfs need paint work from scratches that did not sand out, or the edges of inserts, or the reproduction forgot some detail that I have to paint in. The first hour of paint work is free. any after that is hourly. the average pf that needs paint work is usually about 70$ on ave.
    Thats the gist of it. The key to a good finish is man hours most important. Then materials, and knowing how to use the material to work. Many many body shops spray right on a pf, especially if has touch up without any prep.

    I used to use the clear material that they use on expensive hot rod paint jobs like house of color, but I found a material that is much harder. That boutique clear is purposely soft so it can be sanded and polished out. I learned most of this stuff from going to manufacture clinics, and demo classes

    #32 2 years ago

    2 clicks is the charm! thank you

    #33 2 years ago

    I also have new repro back glasses for minstral man, knockout, queen of hearts.
    Jurassic Park topper $165
    Nitro ground shaker plastic set, CPR

    Dimple service on almost any nos pf. The average pf has over 250 dimples on the back and about 100 on the front. If you deal with that while doing a pf swap, it will easily double the time it takes. service is 200-300 depends on if I have the template made, and title

    1 week later
    #34 2 years ago

    I found another NOS breakshot stashed under my bed for some reason. drilled and dimpled, mylar patches. perfect. The way I look at the breakshot pf is, it is great wall art because of the 50's style and the pin up girls. It will never be reproduced, and at $475 it is a great investment/ savings acct that looks great on the wall!

    COINS. It would seem that I am developing another addiction, that is coins. So if you have any and want to trade tward pf's, or just want to sell them, feel free to ask

    NOS STTNG and CENTAUR (CPR) Both of these pf's have been perfected, and cleared and all of the other stuff I do to them. Both are going to be ready for the final sand level, then wet block sand, then high polish. so both are for sale. They come with a heavy duty shipping crate, as well as both of my instalation kits. (the diamond dremmil and the glue kit) both pf's represent my best work. Feel free to contact me if interested.

    Thanks to all of my supporters, some of which have been loyal customers for over 10 years!!!

    P5058451 (resized).JPG

    P5058449 (resized).JPG

    #35 2 years ago

    Looking for a Bally Harley Davidson playfield. Do you have any?

    Thanks, Lori

    #36 2 years ago

    Hi lori, I have a stern, but those bally hog pf's are rare. I will keep my eyes open, but I try to buy every pf I can. There was a amazing spiderman up for auction last week. I have one, but I paid a kings ransom for mine, ( 1100 with ship) so I bid 730 in the last second thinking I had it, and in less than a second someone got it for 760 or 770 plus ship of course. point is I try to buy every pf.

    I will let you all in to a peak in to the world of big money pf's
    If I bought that pf for 775 and paid 50 for shipping I would be in too it for825, so it would be nice to sell it for 1000 and make 175 to cover the risk and investment and income tax that I have to pay since I do it for a living (sucks) well it would take years to get a grand for that pf. I know this because I have one, that I have had for years, and cant get what I paid for it. On mine some of the inserts were loose (this is part of the risk I mentioned. there is always a surprise, and I am not the type to pass it on) So if a couple inserts are loose that means they are all going to be loose soon, so I pulled them and epoxied, so now I have to repaint the key lines around the inserts, which means now I have to clear the huge assed thing. so now i have to sell it for 1800 just to break even. I made the pool of possible buyers even smaller. People get sticker shock which I understand. If you have done a couple pf's, you know that nos pf's all need work and need to be cleared, to do it right.
    So now is the time I hear my favorite line "thats more than I paid for the whole game" yep. I bet

    Even if I would have won the auction this week and say I got it for 800 plus ship=850. Since the finish is 40 years old, anyone would be an idiot to install it as is. the finish would wear so fast. Not to mention there are more than likely scratches, and loose inserts, so the clear on a huge pf is 650, not including any work over an hour. I guarantee all of the inserts will be cupped, as well as a crunchy line around all of them. may as well glue them also if you are expecting to get another 30 years of play out of it. We are at 1550 plus the paint and insert work, bringing it up to about 1750. Plus it has to be shipped.

    So this is why you have to be a true lover of pinball to restore the older ones. Of course I know people who will spend 3900 on a restored amazing spiderman with one of my pf's, but your average joe will not.

    So there is a little insight to the life of the lonely pf man

    #37 2 years ago

    And there you have it from the source, a longtime friend in the pinball community...

    Brad

    ron.png

    #38 2 years ago

    kruzman,
    Cool and interesting thread,thanks for the insights and interesting info. on your processes,reasoning and lonliness !! )
    Keep on making pinball a joy to play,1 playfield at a time.
    Until next time,take care friend,Kirk

    #39 2 years ago

    Try this again.
    Does anyone know Jose roberto Kosmel in brazil. He bought a pf and paid with paypal, which I only accept if the customer is outside the country. Of course 2 days later after I spent the money, paypal pulls the money from my acct and says it was an unauthorized use. So the money gets refunded, and the buyer resends the payment within 2 hours, and has a friend from virginia call me to tell me he is a very nice person and it is just a mistake. Now I am waiting to see what happens next. Paypal has not communicated at all except to tell me what I have just stated. I just wrote them to ask when I am safe to ship. I am a bit apprehensive to ship that is for sure. since I have an ad on mr pinball I get a lot of scammers and I am wondering if I am in one now. (and now they have my phone number) I just saw on the news today that a man hacked the iowa and colorado lottery for over 2 mil, so I am wondering how and how much I am getting scammed for.
    If anyone has done business with him, please let me know at least that he is a real person. thanks for any help

    #40 2 years ago

    If I were you I would pass on that deal Ron.

    #41 2 years ago

    I didnt realize until today, that I passed on it a couple months ago, was not thinking. its not worth the hassle. I have 2 pf's up in the air right now.
    cheers

    #42 2 years ago

    PayPal as a seller Is the absolute worst for you unless it's someone you know.

    -1
    #43 2 years ago

    Ron,

    FRIENDLY question so Please no one Assume this is a criticism! I don't understand your posts paying a Kings Ransom for playfields hoping to make a buck or take a lose? Seems like as a playfield Restorer by trade you would leave the less profitable NOS, almost perfect, playfields for the general public to fight over and buy up all the just short of kindling playfields for pennies on the dollar and work your profession magic? I mean, if I had the skill, tools, ability, and time to restore a playfield and make a Bundle why would you want to buy Premium examples at Kings ransom prices and make minimal profit (or lose) as you mention? Just a business observation. Seems like from the referrals you Do have the skills to make Serious money and have a Huge market available to you in the Not so good playfields we would pass on. I am hoping to do business with you in the future and Reminder, this was a business Curiousity question with No insult or criticism intended!!!

    #44 2 years ago

    Ron doesn't really make anything on restoring most playfields when you figure in his time. It's much easier and quicker to clear a NOS playfield and get it right back out the door and hopefully get paid. Ron does tend to over pay at times but that's because he NEEDS that playfield for a customer. Problem is like he's saying that now the deal has fallen apart and he now can't get paid and has to sell this playfield or others for fast cash to pay the mortgage and in the end he MIGHT break even. It's a no win situation unfortunately. To many dead beats that keep reminding him "that's more then I paid for the entire game!!".

    John

    #45 2 years ago
    Quoted from Dayhuff:

    Ron doesn't really make anything on restoring most playfields when you figure in his time. It's much easier and quicker to clear a NOS playfield and get it right back out the door and hopefully get paid. Ron does tend to over pay at times but that's because he NEEDS that playfield for a customer. Problem is like he's saying that now the deal has fallen apart and he now can't get paid and has to sell this playfield or others for fast cash to pay the mortgage and in the end he MIGHT break even. It's a no win situation unfortunately. To many dead beats that keep reminding him "that's more then I paid for the entire game!!".
    John

    Sorry I guess that still doesn't make sense to me? If as an example all the extremely talented high end pin restorers only focused on restoring NIB Stern (other) titles of Coarse they would make no money as their labor has minimal value? As a restorer you are selling your Talent and ability to do what Few could do be it artistic ability, technology, resources, etc. Should a high end pin cost triple the street value? SURE, if that is what the client is willing to pay for your promoted Skill and they agree to it. Your a contracted skilled Artist! Again, not an argument just seems like as the hobby gets older (machines not people!) there is more profit and interest in bringing something back to life. JMO

    #46 2 years ago

    NOS playfields mean a much faster turn around. Most of the playfields that Ron would be restoring is probably in the 60-80 hours bracket I would imagine, EACH. He could clear probably 6-7 NOS playfields in that time, perhaps more? Nobody can touch his restoration work, let alone his clear coat jobs..., he's the best out there hands down. Sure its less money but look at the hours over all and his lack of sanity in doing full blown restorations year after year. It's got to get to him as there seems to be no end/retirement in sight. Remember this is Ron's lively hood, his sole income for paying the mortgage, utilities, car repairs, food .....and anything else that comes along. It comes down to the all mighty time and dollar. The problem as well is that people don't always want to pay for the best and I'm sure that Ron is under cutting his bottom line on those restorations because if he didn't people just wouldn't pay what he'd really want to make a decent living so $10 an hour for instance is better then nothing per hour. Basically it's like I always said, when it comes right down to it there is no money in pinball. And yes I know it's just a hobby but not in Ron's case.

    John

    #47 2 years ago

    JD, explained it better than I could, and I dont take offense. the problem is people wont pay for the amount of time it takes me.

    For me to repaint a pf, and make it so that you cant notice the paint work it takes a serious amount of time. I have to double coat the entire area effected and then I have to do the black around it so that it dosent stick out, since black is the last coat when printing a pf. It is not east to make paint from a brush look like print. as john says, it is about average for me to spend 60-80 hours on a used pf that is not that bad.

    I could make a killing doing what I call factory work that looks like shit. I could make a lot more money by not describing the flaws in a pf before I sell it even though they guy who sold it to me didnt mention them, but as john said this is what I do for a living. Before this I was running 3 business that I owned and clearing over 125k a year. all in one year I broke my back, got in some legal trouble where the gov seized every single asset and got divorced. So I had to start over, and I decided that chasing the buck was like chasing your tail. I have a MFA, even though drawing and painting is the least of my ablity, I challenged my self to see if I could be the best. I knew, I wouldnt be driving jags and vettes any more, and I would live a simple-er life. In hindsight its not much diffrent, and now I dont think I could go back, physically or mentally.
    It would be so easy to make 3 times the money I make right now, but it would be factory work, and I wouldnt have the reputation, or the respect, or the friends, and it would suck. Do you know what its like to say you are an artist for a living, and you are booked a year back? Its worth a lot to me.

    Like john said doing clearcoats allows pf's to come in and go out so that I can make my morg. I have put 110 hours in to a restoration before which took 2 months and when I submitted the bill for a lousey 1700 total (including materials), I got stiffed. My bank says I dont care pay me. I get this all the time people say why dont you raise your rates, why do you sell your stuff for more money. Trust me except for a couple guys, I am getting the most people will pay, they dont care how perfect it is. I focus on the perfection for my own mental health, the customers only care about the price and it is shinney. look how many people dont understand why anyone would send me a cpr pf. after all their's is "perfect".
    95% of my work is reproduction pf's

    This week I was clearing a mb for a customer it was a repro, and there are cracks around the special inserts on each sides drain. There are no black key lines around the inserts, the art is painted on top of the insert. the crack went thru the yellow, orange and black. Also the black was smeared, and the yellow was transparent. Typical screen flaw. Long story short, I had to repaint the entire top of the torch, all 3 colors on both sides. only one side needed the paint work enough to do it, but once I did one side, I had to do the other to balance it. Because of the way it is printed, the paint didnt look anything like the print unless I painted the entire area. Now it looks perfect like it should. that took 9 hours and I still have to tighten up the black. so how much do you think I can bill the customer to fix the hairline cracks on 2 inserts? studio time is 50 bucks an hour, which is half the price of my furnace guy. so how long will I be in business if I charged 575 for the clear 450 for the touch up, 55 for the shipping crate and 50 for the shipping. The only way I know how to fix something on a pf and the only way I want to is to make the problem unidentifiable. Its going in a mb. a game I will never afford, but work on every week. I couldnt decide weather to leave the cracks as is or do them, so I just did it, since that is why I assume people send them to me.

    so I have forgotten my point, but I get the question. last time a guy didnt understand why I dont do a bunch of pf's and take them to a show and sell them all. He didnt understand that with the time involved, I have to sell a pf before it is done and I have been trying to build up stock for 11 years, and guess how many clearcoated pf's I sell at expo when I take them there? actually just guess how many pf's peroid I sold. maybe 1. maybe at expo!! every year for 5 years. People wont pay for the stuff, but the booth with the bronze cpr's will sell them all.

    I probably shouldnt make my business public, but maybe it will bring some good customers. Every morning I wake up and decide if I want to continue doing this for a living. So far every day I figure its better than digging ditches

    #48 2 years ago

    Here is a before pic of the mb pf I was talking about. the pic sucks because it is a smashed up non smart phone. Use your imagination

    mb insert2 (resized).jpg

    #49 2 years ago

    so here are a couple pics of after painting the 2 sides. I still have to tighten up the black, you can only paint on top of paint so many times before you have to seal it, sand and then paint on top. I dont post work in progress pics any more because competitors, once used them on their website to dis me, but this is just to make a point that probable wont work anyway because of the camera and pics not being tight enough.

    mb4 (resized).jpg

    mb5 (resized).jpg

    mb6 (resized).jpg

    mb7 (resized).jpg

    #50 2 years ago

    That looks FIng awesome. I'll make it worth your while

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