don't know if consensus is the right word... would say logical after MM and AFM
However if this is MBr it wouldn't be the most useful choice right now, not as much as CC or BBB.
just my 2 cents.
I'm more impatient for a revealed game than a released game!

Out of curiosity, why is Indy discounted as a likely remake? License?
Stern got a license for both Indy and Star Wars. JJP is working with Disney. After that last movie, the Indy franchise is probably the least expensive, particularly for a remake/license-extension. The pinball game is known-good and will only help the franchise.

Message on Facebook from manufacturer:

« Like a fine wine, a pinball is not done till it’s done. We have elected to delay the introduction of Pinball #3. Originally we were scheduled to introduce our next pin at the Texas Pinball Festival in Dallas, Texas on March 16-18th. Additional features are being added while deploying some newer technologies. While we know this will disappoint a few people, we are confident that once they see the final product that they will be blown away. Chicago Gaming will still be present at the Texas Pinball Festival regardless. More information on PIN # 3 in the weeks to come »

It is disappointing..
Anyways it sounds more CC or BBB than MB that seems to me a completed game.

License must be acquired from Disney. People deal with them but they're rumored to be difficult negotiators. Pinball Arcade said it was too much of a PITA working with Disney to remake IJ digitally, and they've pulled off a number of A-list licensed tables (T2, STNG, Addams Family, etc.).

Also, might need to separately negotiate likeness rights for a bunch of famous actors that appear all over the translate and playfield (this might not be an issue if the underlying movie contracts for all three films signed away likeness rights to the studio). This is what held up Addams Family in Pinball Arcade for years, and they ended up making the game with altered Fester and Pugsley art b/c they couldn't get the likeness rights from those actors.

None of that means it's impossible that IJ will ever be remade, and if they can get the rights it would certainly make CGC/PPS some money. But IJ is a proven tough (and presumably expensive) license to acquire, which is why IJ is seen as a long-shot.

Major bummer that CGC won’t be revealing remake #3 at TPF. I’ve been looking forward to that for the better part of a year. It’s also bad for them since TPF is a great place to reveal a game.

Maybe, or maybe they're messing around with the color display, or a new topper, or something else? It's all tea leaves at this point. My $$ is still on MB, it just seems like the safest choice for their next game with the lowest cost to implement.

Well that's a bummer. I think a lot of people going to Texas were really expecting to see the game.

I was hoping to see it at Texas..

yea, it takes a little excitement out of going, but TPF is awesome regardless.

Color display? If you mean LCD display maybe you are right but color display they already did it right with MM and AFM.
It sounds more gameplay code enhancement.

Well thats a bummer. I was really looking forward to seeing #3 in Texas... it was a one of the factors in our decision to go.

Still looking forward to the show though.

Newer technologies...hmm.

Ugh I can't wait for this announcement. I have been told by someone in the Chicago community that it is CC. But I sure hope it's MB.

I had a dream last night that their first original theme is Xenon 2: Return to Xenon. Susan Ciani called back to active duty. We can all dream.

I'm holding out for New Chicago. Extra widebody. Four lower pop bumpers baby. Every time you play a game an Italian cries.

about 6 months ago, someone posted this exact comment but said they are "sure it's MB" lol . This is crazy!

My bets are still very much on Cactus Canyon. I've met so many who think they have some insider secret including the one who bought my original Cactus Canyon last year... so I really don't believe anyone anymore... but as a business move I would think Cactus Canyon would be the smartest option to release first since less people own the original which would make it potentially a better selling machine.

Maybe, although there's also risk with CC or BBB since so much of the value is in the rarity (vs. MM and AFM, which had pretty standard runs but are just super-beloved and seem to be selling very well for CC). And then people complain about the CC code so if they try to redo or expand it that's an additional expense and time commitment, plus people will inevitably compare it to CCC and if it doesn't measure up, could impact sales.

But who knows!?!

That's what I am waiting to see! They could really have some fun with the code in this one! That's probably why they are having issues and had to cancel the reveal. Code issues can be cumbersome. They take time to resolve without causing another issue somewhere else.

Lol, I think u r referring to my comment, I got it from owner of a major pinball retailer in Chicago who told me it is official just not to the public yet.

Hats off to CGC/PPS if they go that route instead of just cashing in with MB exactly as they've done with MM and AFM. It would be cool to see what they're capable of, and if they dip their toes in the water with coding maybe one day we'll get revised code for other B/W machines as Rick was talking about a few years back ...

Technological innovations... new code... Maybe a complete curveball out of left field like Wizard Blocks?

Yeah That would be cool... maybe have some more video modes.

How about new code for early B/W DMDs that let you flip to the score screen?

Fingers super tightly crossed it's Cactus Canyon. Been there and done that on Monster Bash and personally feel Cactus Canyon is so much more fun as a game overall... and this is coming from a horror maniac .

However, on a bigger/slightly more controversial topic, I am kinda sad about the remake world anyways. With all the gaming talent out there, and the resources to make new ideas come to life, wouldn't it be far more exciting to see a slew of brand new tables or previously cancelled games getting the funding to come back to life? I respect (and have also purchased) these remakes, but right after each sale my satisfaction level really wasn't there. Plus I've always felt it's kinda shattered the collectors market and given owners who searched high and low for the originals this sense of urgency to sell before the value drops, rather than looking at those games and feeling amazing about them. When companies like Spooky Pinball attempt to try new things/sometimes failing/sometimes blowing us away I've felt so much more excited about those purchases... It's just a remake world these days in entertainment as a whole, and I'm just hoping to see a new generation of talent pushing the envelope on new ideas.

Did you buy Dialed In? That was a pretty big gamble by Jack on completely new IP that has paid off. But if you want more original titles, supporting him will send the message you want to send. After Dialed In, at least the next three-four JJP pins are licensed (jj PotC, Toy Story, Willy Wonka, GnR?), so it may be a while before we get another original title at that level. More support to reward the risk taken will bring another from JJP and/or others.

CGC

takemymoney (resized).jpg

I really appreciate the remakes. If it wasn't for the remakes I wouldn't have been able to find and afford to buy my original MM, CC and MB Thanks guys and keep up the good work! PS (CV soon!)

Should change thread title to: No More Speculation, We're Still Speculating.

GNR? That's news to me... do tell!

It came up in one of the other threads and with the JJP sending pins for Slash to play on tour it has a ring of truth. Having a JJP-level GnR pin would be AWESOME.

WOW... I'm staying tuned to that one.

BTW: I do love my DE GnR's... but JJP could / would knock that one out of the park!

It will not be here anytime soon, though. Likely late 2019 or early 2020 unless Jack ramps up to his ultimate goal of 3 pins a year quickly. He's just about to 2 pins a year now, but it's taken like 5 years to get to this point. But yeah, I'd LOVE to have a JJP GnR pin. Axl Meltdown Multiball, Groupie Multiball, Arraignment Mode...the possibilities are endless.

Just to pass on some information from a friend of Rick's (Michael Lee) who posted on FB (can be accessed by entering CACTUS CANYON) who said THIS several months ago:

"I just finished helping Rick around the shop and all I can say is: Cactus Canyon is NOT the next remake. Oh, and I can say that the next one will be announced this year."

When I politely called him out on this saying something along the lines that I am still praying they reverse course and bring out CACTUS CANYON for the next remake, he placed a laughing symbol, as if to say I am dreaming. Again I politely responded and he said bluntly it will be difficult to change course when production is already underway. I have strong reason now to believe we will very soon be hearing it will be MB (which I still love and may purchase) but my heart here is with CC and then BBB. Down the line I pray too for CIRQUS VOLTAIRE and TALES OF THE ARABIAN NIGHTS, two of the most beautiful games ever produced. I once owned the latter.

As to re-makes vs. new ideas I must say I am completely in agreement with the strategy to make these elusive pinball masterpieces available to fans who for so long are unable to secure them BEFORE focusing solely on a more creative path. the 7, 8 or 9 promised remakes of some of the greatest machines ever should rightly be the prime focus, as it is. The opportunity to own CC, BBB, CV and ToTAN should be priority at least from where I am standing.

If remake #3 will be CC, I sure hope it will offer the option to choose between CC rules and CCC rules. Not sure whether that is realistic, but it would be nice.

Pretty sure that's been shot down. CCC is its own thing.

hmm.. Seems like there is money to be made as a bookie for those that think either side of the MB vs CC is a sure thing.

I know where I'd put my money. And I think it's a 100% sure thing bet.

Groupie multiballs. Yeuggh

Ok I'll be blunt. The remakes are better than the originals and I will buy them ALL

Exactly. Some of their groupie stories are gnarly. I'm sure Groupie Multiball would be pandemonium.

I would say the most appealing and potentially best-selling of the re-makes in order could be something along these lines:

1. Big Bang Bar
2. Cactus Canyon
3. Cirqus Voltaire
4. Tales of the Arabian Nights
5. Monster Bash

That’s an interesting take. You’ve had a few interesting posts in your first week on Pinside. I’m guessing from your knowledge of the machines and your other posts that you’ve been in the hobby for a while now even though only on Pinside for a short time. I think you’ve got #1 and #5 on your list reversed though if your talking about sales numbers. And 3 and 4 are probably a toss up though I have TOTAN slightly edging out CV.

1. Big Bang Bar
2. Monster Bash
3. Cirqus Voltaire
4. Tales of the Arabian Nights
5. Cactus Canyon

Is that your personal ranking Ted? Or the ones you believe would sell the most?

My Personal wishlist

1. Monster Bash
2. Cactus Canyon with updated code
3. Big Bang Bar
4/5. CV and TOTAN depending on code.

My guess at sales...

1. Monster Bash
2. Cactus Canyon
3/4. CV or TOTAN
5. Big Bang Bar (played Lloyds a lot at SS Billiards and don’t think it has the marketing draw for the general public).

Thank you so much "Pinzap!" Couldn't imagine getting a nicer welcome here. Really appreciate that. Yes I have collected machines for years but never signed up to comment at this site, though I had voted on the Top 100 years back. I once had 13 machines, but I had to liquidate to pay 22 K so my wife could take administrative courses to become a grammar school principal in our hometown Fairview, N.J. district (right across the Hudson River from Manhattan) where I am a 63 year old veteran teacher. Being a maniacal lifelong cinephile and collector of blu rays, DVDs, previously LDs and Beta as well as classical and opera CDs complicated my pinball obsession too! Ha! We have five teenage kids of which two are big pinball fans. I once owned ToTAN, ST: TNG; MM; MB; Dracula; TZ; IJ; Creature; ToM; Phantom of the Opera; LotR; No Fear and Addams Family all at the same time.........now we have only TWO: Elvis and the aforementioned Addams Family. I intend on obtaining MM again (re-make) and am thinking CC, BBB and MB for sure as well as the hoped-for remake from CGC of ToTAN and CV. I agree the latter two are about equal in their allure and breathtaking beauty, hard for me to put one over the other.

I greatly respect your obvious expertise in pinball and agree with almost all you have said. Yet I still am seeing BBB as a huge seller with the private collectors, which I am thinking comprises the significant majority of the re-made machines. Being a great game with the alluring adult theme, and because it was a massive rarity for so long would seem to insure big sales, and I know for some it is the holy grail they have dreamed about for so long. If the vast majority of these machines were bought by arcades for public use perhaps I'd agree, but I think the collectors aspect will insure big returns. Any machine that has fetched 25K seems a certainly to sell big at that assumed 7K price point. My Top 5 was actually a combination of popularity and sales, not exclusively one of the other. In any case like you I am really hoping to see CACTUS CANYON ASAP! Thanks again! (please let me know if you are on FB) -Sam J.

Well, since I did fail to say Welcome in my last post, let me say that now. Welcome to Pinside!!

Sounds like you have had quite the collection over the years... and like you, I have had pins since long before coming to Pinside (12-13 years before in fact) so I definitely meant no disrespect. Adding to that, I will say that even though I’ve played since the mid-70’s and collected since about 2002 I can assure you that I have absolutely no expertise and am still learning every day.

Edit: just noticed that there must have been a bug when you quoted me, as I said nothing about AFMr or my kids. Hmmm... weird.

Oh God no I didn't take a single word you said as even remotely disrespectful, I was so thrilled to get such a fabulous red carpet welcome. In any case you have a long association with pinball and I look forward to continued discussion here. Thank you!

Kingpin should be #1.

Vireland, I'd absolutely LOVE to see Kingpin re-made too!

100% agreed!

great theme from a great era!