(Topic ID: 222797)

NEW! Williams System 3-7 In-Game Test ROMs

By pincoder

3 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 277 posts
  • 41 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 months ago by pincoder
  • Topic is favorited by 64 Pinsiders

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Topic poll

“Which test ROMs have been the most useful for you?”

  • 01a-leds 2 votes
    13%
  • 01b-bus 0 votes
  • 01c-transceivers 0 votes
  • 02-blanking 0 votes
  • 03-cmos-IC19 4 votes
    25%
  • 04-ram-IC13 3 votes
    19%
  • 04-ram-IC16 3 votes
    19%
  • 05-displays 2 votes
    13%
  • 06-switches 1 vote
    6%
  • 07-bounce 0 votes
  • 08-interrupts 1 vote
    6%
  • 09-lamps 0 votes
  • 10-solenoids 0 votes
  • 11-sounds 0 votes
  • 12-sounds2 0 votes
  • clear_cmos 0 votes
  • edit_cmos 0 votes
  • init_cmos 0 votes

(Multiple choice - 16 votes by 5 Pinsiders)

This poll has been closed.

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7C15D61E-AA9B-4F81-A8B8-2D2704E2C616 (resized).jpeg
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There are 277 posts in this topic. You are on page 6 of 6.
#251 7 months ago
Quoted from JT-Pinball:

As for the controller add me to the mailing list for release! I'm interested!

Down the road I'll be sending out a call for beta testers at a discounted rate - to everyone via email who has purchased the adapter, as well as creating an announcement here. No ETA on that yet either but it is a huge priority of mine - I just need to get some quality time to work on it.

Thank you to all who have encouraged me to get the controller done, and to all who have shown your support with your adapter purchases and your donations!

JT-Pinball Thanks also for following up with your results. It helps others too!

#252 7 months ago
Quoted from pincoder:

Down the road I'll be sending out a call for beta testers at a discounted rate - to everyone via email who has purchased the adapter, as well as creating an announcement here. No ETA on that yet either but it is a huge priority of mine - I just need to get some quality time to work on it.
Thank you to all who have encouraged me to get the controller done, and to all who have shown your support with your adapter purchases and your donations!
jt-pinball Thanks also for following up with your results. It helps others too!

Please do! I would love to help test out new stuff!

As for the Tri Zone... After replacing IC 11 I left the game running the led test for about an hour and it never stopped. I decided to just replace the other shit AMI PIA at IC10. I powered up the board on the bench and all seemed well. Put the board back in the game and totally dead. I chased my tail for a minute and then put the test Roms back in the game. Would not even pas led test. No cpu... Checked voltages and the power connector for the board had a bad pin. I have not had a chance to repin the whole game and plenty of connectors on this game are crap. Repined the power connectors and, THIS GAME NOW BOOTS TO ATTRACT!!!!! These test Roms and your help made this possible!!!! Thanks Craig! Thanks pincoder

#253 7 months ago

That's freaking awesome!! I love it when a game comes back to life! Nice work!!

I will definitely keep you posted on the beta testing

#254 7 months ago

Hi everyone, I got some new TDA2003 amplifier chips in today and thought it would be nice to include a free one with each adapter order from now until Feb 28th 2021. While supplies last of course. These are the amplifier chips used in Williams 3-7 games (and quite likely others, including other pinball manufacturers of the era).

You can find more about it here:

https://pincoder.ca/index.php/2021/02/09/free-tda2003-audio-amplifier-chip/

It never hurts to have a spare chip on hand!

If I'd had them sooner I would have included them with past orders - Sorry if you missed getting one. Orders that went out today already have the bonus amplifier chip included.

3 weeks later
#255 6 months ago

I got a new GQ-4X and a logic probe yesterday. I’ve been learning as I’m going. I’m working on a locked up MPU on a System 4 Flash. I’ve downloaded the roms and made it to test 2. Both leds appear to light but the test point doesn’t go high (I’m checking that at pin 37 on the interconect, is that correct?). PIA1 pin 4, pins 10, 9, and 8 on IC7, and pin 12 on IC23 are all not pulsing either. According to the notes for this test, I should replace PIA1, IC7, and Q5. Am I reading that right?

The 40 pin connector is new. The board has been converted to three ROMs and was working and then all of a sudden it wasn't as far as I've been told. Occasionally, it will go into a really weak attract mode and will start a game but even when it does, only some of the feature lights light. Then I think it tilts and ends the game shortly after starting.

#256 6 months ago

I need a clarification from the group. I am running the CMOS IC19 test on a 6a and it says I need to have the coin door open. I'm running these tests on the bench so no coin door connected. I have the little siegecraft board that simulates the coin door switches and was able to do it with the reset high score switch off, but I was curious about doing this without that board. Ground pin 1 of 1J4 or connect to 5V?

#257 6 months ago
Quoted from Cheddar:

I need a clarification from the group. I am running the CMOS IC19 test on a 6a and it says I need to have the coin door open. I'm running these tests on the bench so no coin door connected. I have the little siegecraft board that simulates the coin door switches and was able to do it with the reset high score switch off, but I was curious about doing this without that board. Ground pin 1 of 1J4 or connect to 5V?

Cheddar if you have a look at the far left side of the CPU board assembly drawing in the Gorgar manual, it shows pin 9 on IC12 to be TP3. 5V with door closed, 0V with door open.

https://www.ipdb.org/files/1062/Gorgar_Manual.pdf

#258 6 months ago
Quoted from johnboy1313:

cheddar if you have a look at the far left side of the CPU board assembly drawing in the Gorgar manual, it shows pin 9 on IC12 to be TP3. 5V with door closed, 0V with door open.
https://www.ipdb.org/files/1062/Gorgar_Manual.pdf

Nice Catch!

#259 6 months ago

Odd, pinside didn't show this thread as having new posts! I didn't see the last four until just now. The coin door needs to be open on 6, and 7 as well. Not sure about 3 and 4, but I would imagine so.

#260 6 months ago
Quoted from pincoder:

Odd, pinside didn't show this thread as having new posts! I didn't see the last four until just now. The coin door needs to be open on 6, and 7 as well. Not sure about 3 and 4, but I would imagine so.

Funny you bring this up. I am having a hard time getting into the diagnostics with white flipper roms on a 6a board (hot tip).

I can do it but the exact sequence still eludes me. Funny thing is some combination of switches and button presses on the coin door switches (3 button instead of 2) makes the machine reboot.

#261 6 months ago
Quoted from Cheddar:

Funny you bring this up. I am having a hard time getting into the diagnostics with white flipper roms on a 6a board (hot tip).
I can do it but the exact sequence still eludes me. Funny thing is some combination of switches and button presses on the coin door switches (3 button instead of 2) makes the machine reboot.

Could something be shorting out or incorrectly grounding when you do that?

How do the Pincoder ROMs behave when you do that? Ie LEDs test.

#262 6 months ago

Also, just a guess, but I'm assuming that since the only real difference between a 6 and a 6a is the introduction of seven digit displays, my bet is that the only difference between green and white flipper roms is the white roms have an updated display "driver".

This is also true for the Pincoder ROMs. The sys6a rom set is functionally the same, except for the display driver.

As far as the Pincoder display driver goes, it just uses a different software matrix/table to decide what order to run the strobe and bcd output.

#263 6 months ago
Quoted from pincoder:

Could something be shorting out or incorrectly grounding when you do that?
How do the Pincoder ROMs behave when you do that? Ie LEDs test.

I haven't tried with the pincoder rom. I'm getting better at it but still don't know the exact scenario

1 week later
#264 6 months ago

Hi All,

The current version of pincoder ROMs incorrectly contains the PATT2048.bin and PATT512.bin files. There is also mention of them in the README.txt file. These files go with the 12-rom-IC** tests which were removed from the suite of tests because they require a (second) 2716 chip and a chip programmer. The biggest reason however is that if you suspect bad sockets it is much easier to just replace them than it is to test and then replace.

However, because the current version still makes reference to these files, I have had requests for these tests. While I still dont think they are worth including, you can download the latest Release version that includes the 12-rom-*.bin files. I have added an extra link in the download menu on the https://pincoder.ca website for you if you'd like to run the tests.

Here is that link as well:

https://pincoder.ca/ccn/roms/pincoder_roms_2019.12.26.2048.zip

Note that this version does NOT contain an image for use with the Pincoder Adapter so you will have to manually add it to your adapter, or write the 12-rom-IC**.bin file to a 2716 chip and place it in IC17.

PM me if you would like to see the 12-rom-* tests included again in the next pincoder release. If there are enough votes I will put them back in

1 week later
#265 5 months ago

pincoder

Question about the Documentation for 01-LED on System 7.

4) Check that PIA1 pin 39 (CA2) is high and that IC2 pin 1 is low. If not IC2 will not
light the LEDs. There is an inverter (IC7 Pins 11:high, 10:low) between these two points
that performs the signal transition here. Isn't IC 2 Pin 1 tied to the 5VDC rail through R20?

5) Check that pin 15 on IC2 is low enough to be considered a logic 0 and that SW2 is
open. Check that R19 is 4.7k and is connecting to ground on one side. I think IC 2 only has 14 pins.

I could be way off with both of those but thought i'd throw it out there. Also, still loving the ROMS man, looking forward to the new controller!

#266 5 months ago

Hi everyone, I've added a new ROM to the pincoder software and generated a new Release version:

https://pincoder.ca/ccn/roms/pincoder_roms_2021.03.31.1434.zip

Future orders of Pincoder Adapters will contain this version. If you already have an adapter you can update it with a chip programmer using the "pincoder_adapter.bin" file in this release. Adapter users without a chip programmer can PM me to order an updated EEPROM for $15 CAD plus the usual shipping.

Note that the DIP and jumper settings for the adapter have slightly changed as a result so you will need to refer to the updated "pincoder_adapter.txt" file.

Changes since the last Release version:

* Updated 09-lamps to include a DELAY feature.
* Renumbered the ROMs to accomodate the new 12-flippers ROM.

Thanks to Cheddar and troxel for pre-testing the new 12-flippers ROM! It's nice to have people willing to check my work

Happy Troubleshooting!

#267 5 months ago

Updated my ROM last night and created another video showing off the 12-flippers test. I really like this one! I added it the the previous playlist that Cheddar created.

pincoder thanks for all the work on this. Made fixing the MPU and driver board a breeze.

#268 5 months ago
Quoted from troxel:

Updated my ROM last night and created another video showing off the 12-flippers test. I really like this one! I added it the the previous playlist that Cheddar created.
pincoder thanks for all the work on this. Made fixing the MPU and driver board a breeze.

troxel and Cheddar: Thanks for making these how to videos and managing them on YouTube.

For those looking for the entire collection, you can always find them by going to https://pincoder.ca and under the Support menu select "Community Usage Videos - YouTube".

#269 5 months ago
Quoted from perry1670:

pincoder
Question about the Documentation for 01-LED on System 7.
4) Check that PIA1 pin 39 (CA2) is high and that IC2 pin 1 is low. If not IC2 will not
light the LEDs. There is an inverter (IC7 Pins 11:high, 10:low) between these two points
that performs the signal transition here. Isn't IC 2 Pin 1 tied to the 5VDC rail through R20?
5) Check that pin 15 on IC2 is low enough to be considered a logic 0 and that SW2 is
open. Check that R19 is 4.7k and is connecting to ground on one side. I think IC 2 only has 14 pins.
I could be way off with both of those but thought i'd throw it out there. Also, still loving the ROMS man, looking forward to the new controller!

perry1670 Nice catch! - and sorry for the late reply.

There are some very subtle differences between system 7 and pre-system 7 boards, especially when it comes to the onboard LEDs. I have updated the documentation and rebuilt the zip file from yesterday.

Points 4 and 5 in the sys346 and sys6a 01a-leds.txt file now read:

4) Check that IC18 pin 39 (PIA1-CA2) is high and that IC7 pin 10 is low. If not IC2 will
not light the LEDs.

5) Check that IC2 pin 15 is low enough to be considered a logic 0 and that SW2 is
open. Check that R19 is 4.7k and is connecting to ground on one side.

The sys7 version now contains:

4) Check that IC18 pin 39 (PIA1-CA2) is high and that IC7 pin 2 is low. If not IC33 will
not light the LEDs.

5) Check that IC2 pins 1,4,10,13 is high enough to be considered a logic 1 and that SW2 is
open. Check that R20 is 1k and is connecting to +5v on one side.

I must have been asleep at the wheel that day. Thanks for pointing it out!

2 weeks later
#270 4 months ago

pincoder So I bought one of these pincoders, and im not sure of what you are supposed to look for when you are doing a test in a certain game, meaning once you set all the switches on your pincoder. Say you are testing one of the ICs on the board. You adjust the two jumpers and the dip switches according to the game. Once you power the game on, how do you know if the IC youre testing is good or not? Does something come up on the displays, or the MPU LEDs will light a certain way?I dont see any info on the pincoder website regarding this.

#271 4 months ago
Quoted from daly124:

pincoder So I bought one of these pincoders, and im not sure of what you are supposed to look for when you are doing a test in a certain game, meaning once you set all the switches on your pincoder. Say you are testing one of the ICs on the board. You adjust the two jumpers and the dip switches according to the game. Once you power the game on, how do you know if the IC youre testing is good or not? Does something come up on the displays, or the MPU LEDs will light a certain way?I dont see any info on the pincoder website regarding this.

On the pincoder site download the latest set of roms. You don't need the roms because you have the adapter but it contains a file for each test describing setup and outputs

#272 4 months ago
Quoted from daly124:

pincoder So I bought one of these pincoders, and im not sure of what you are supposed to look for when you are doing a test in a certain game, meaning once you set all the switches on your pincoder. Say you are testing one of the ICs on the board. You adjust the two jumpers and the dip switches according to the game. Once you power the game on, how do you know if the IC youre testing is good or not? Does something come up on the displays, or the MPU LEDs will light a certain way?I dont see any info on the pincoder website regarding this.

Yes, as Cheddar said, the instructions for each test are contained in the software download. You don't need to install the software onto the adapter as it's already loaded - but you do need to download it for the instructions. Just be sure to download the version that is contained on your adapter. Most adapters were shipped with 2020.06.23 and more recent adapters are being shipped with the latest version: 2021.03.31.

Both versions are available under the Download menu on:

https://pincoder.ca

2 weeks later
#273 4 months ago

Hi there

I have 2 old sys3 mpu boards that I would like to get running. Mostly just for fun and learning.

(I'm newbe to mpu repair, so please bear with me)

They are not installed in a pinball machine.
I dont have any sys 3-6 games to test/compare with.

I have replaced the scanbe sockets.
I have a hantek oscilloscope for the testing.

Both mpu boards are running the first test rom "LED" where I get alternate led flashing.
So far so good.

The test rom "Blanking" does nothing - the leds come on and stays on - no blanking pulses 1J1-37, PIA1-4, IC7-10,9,8 or IC23.
I dont think the software is running!
How do I test that it is indeed running?

What more is involved to get from rom "led" to rom "Blanking"?

I tried the Leons testrom also - in one mpu the leds comes on then off efter ½ second
In the other mpu the leds just stays on.

Any ideas?

Regards

#274 4 months ago

If 01a-leds passes, then you should in the very least see a pulse on PIA1-4 when running 02-blanking.

It does sound like the board is not booting the 02-blanking. Are you using the Pincoder Adapter or are you burning your own chips? Does the board run the 03-cmos and 04-ram tests?

Try the 01b-bus test and see if you get the results indicated in the .txt file.

#275 4 months ago
Quoted from pincoder:

If 01a-leds passes, then you should in the very least see a pulse on PIA1-4 when running 02-blanking.
It does sound like the board is not booting the 02-blanking. Are you using the Pincoder Adapter or are you burning your own chips? Does the board run the 03-cmos and 04-ram tests?
Try the 01b-bus test and see if you get the results indicated in the .txt file.

Thx
I'm burning my own roms.
Actually I'm out of 2716 eproms and dont have an uv eraser
Ordered one on amazon yesterday - will be a few weeks before it arrives.
I also ordered some cmos chips as its missing on both boards.

Will get back in a few weeks.

#276 4 months ago
Quoted from mr-zed:

Actually I'm out of 2716 eproms and dont have an uv eraser

Get some 28C16's eeproms and save yourself a lot of hassle..... drop in replacement for them.

#277 4 months ago

You can also order the Pincoder Adapter and save a lot of time by not having to program chips (or order them for that matter):

https://pincoder.ca/index.php/2020/07/10/adapter-2020-06-23-0506/

Since you already have a programmer you'll be able to update the adapter easily when new versions come out.

There are 277 posts in this topic. You are on page 6 of 6.

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