(Topic ID: 26628)

New Predator Info Thread

By SkitBPinball

10 years ago


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#6651 9 years ago
Quoted from loren3233:

I am full but looking forward to jamming it in somewhere. Kevin, is the paypal payment plan still up?

The paypal payment plan is still up for now. Only Kevin can answer when it will be closing, but I remember him saying it was getting close.

#6652 9 years ago

Dude, take that link down.

#6653 9 years ago
Quoted from nephasth:

Dude, take that link down.

Oops. Sorry. Was just trying to help. My bad.

#6654 9 years ago

I am full too but I will find a place for it.

#6655 9 years ago

This is going to be a huge accomplishment for SkitB. I'm sure Kevin is getting as exited to deliver these things as we are to receive them. Can't wait to see a production game video.

#6656 9 years ago

Email received!

#6657 9 years ago

What's the word on the swinging body?

#6658 9 years ago
Quoted from rai:

What's the word on the swinging body?

I'm thinking all our questions will be answered very soon...

#6659 9 years ago
Quoted from Betelgeuse:

I'm thinking all our questions will be answered very soon...

What questions are really left at this point? We're in the middle of a blizzard up here, so answering a couple questions might be fun.

#6661 9 years ago

Whats next for SkitB??

#6662 9 years ago

What... is your name?

What... is your quest?

What... is your favourite color?

#6663 9 years ago

Picture of hanging body and is the ball going to hit body or not?

#6664 9 years ago

Is there a good chance of growing more chest hair playing this game?

#6665 9 years ago

what is the scheduled release date again?

#6666 9 years ago

there isn't one to my knowledge

#6667 9 years ago

How many licks does it take to get to the center of a tootsie pop?

#34

#6668 9 years ago
Quoted from Perspex:

Is there a good chance of growing more chest hair playing this game?

I certainly hope not.

#6669 9 years ago
Quoted from blondetall:

I certainly hope not.

LMAO. In your case we hope it would be grow some and not grow more!

#6671 9 years ago
Quoted from blondetall:

I certainly hope not.

I dunno, some dudes could be into that. rule #34

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=rule+34

#6672 9 years ago

Yes, it would have to be "grow some hair" and not "grow more" for me... lol. Either way... eww, no.

Actual question:
I think it's got a Fidelity speaker system now, and I've heard the sound system is great, but would there be any need to hook a sub to it? Just asking because I'm trying to figure out if I want Predator to have its own spot, or share the primo location with Spiderman and therefore share the powered sub there. Either I've got to move a 300000 pound Stargate or a NGG, and just trying to figure out my decorating areas and what to hook to what sub.

#6673 9 years ago
Quoted from Jcamm:

What... is your name?

What... is your quest?

What... is your favourite color?

Ted
To find the Predator machine
Red................no, blue!!
Aaarrrgghhh!

monty-python-and-the-holy-grail.jpg
#6674 9 years ago
Quoted from SkitBPinball:

What questions are really left at this point? We're in the middle of a blizzard up here, so answering a couple questions might be fun

Kevin, I was referring more to the final video in response to the questions about last minute details... like the swinging body. Has there been a determination on how that's going to work in the final game?

I'm also hoping the new ramps work out as expected, the skull/spine on the VUK mounts properly and that there's no other unexpected setbacks. I'm just excited to see this final video and hoping for the best. You have done a fantastic job of keeping us informed these past few months!

#6675 9 years ago

The only thing leftbat this point is to see the final build.

Assuming the spine, ramps, hanging body tweaks are all done, I CAN NOT WAIT TO SEE THE FINAL BUILD!!!!

#6676 9 years ago

I think this thread should be published as a booklet and included in each goodie bag

#6677 9 years ago

could we get some time table? I mean if say the production will start in 30 to 90 days and how long will it take to reach 100 or 200 games into production?

I am asking, in case we have to make plans such as buying another game or making room in a particular time frame.

For example, if I have a MMR in the pipeline for Spring/Summer 2014 is Predator is also due out then? or will Predator be looking at Winter/Spring 2014/2015 if I'm 200 games deep in the que?

#6678 9 years ago
Quoted from PinPatch:

Whats next for SkitB??

Working closely with some pretty awesome people and properties to bring you another game that is very likely to blow you all away

Quoted from Jcamm:

What... is your name?
What... is your quest?
What... is your favourite color?

http://style.org/unladenswallow/

Quoted from rai:

Picture of hanging body and is the ball going to hit body or not?

The body placement and movement will be showcased in the video. Matt strongly recommended against having the ball hit it directly, so we had to change it up a little bit. The upside is that it moves much more naturally this way.

Quoted from Perspex:

Is there a good chance of growing more chest hair playing this game?

In our tests this has only been observed after using select Old Spice care products.

Quoted from pinnaf:

what is the scheduled release date again?

I hope I don't regret saying this, but April 7th is our target release date.

Quoted from DrStarkweather:

there isn't one to my knowledge

There is now

Quoted from vster23:

How many licks does it take to get to the center of a tootsie pop?
#34

252, on average.

Quoted from DrStarkweather:

I dunno, some dudes could be into that. rule #34

I'm not a moderator by any means, but let's not let this thread involve any rule 34 :-/

Quoted from blondetall:

I think it's got a Fidelity speaker system now, and I've heard the sound system is great, but would there be any need to hook a sub to it?

I think it would sound great with another subwoofer. The game uses all high-sampled cd-quality music and our amplifier has a built-in crossover to send just the right stuff to a sub. Also, the crossover frequency is adjustable so you can only isolate the really low tones, if you wanted to.

Quoted from Betelgeuse:

I'm also hoping the new ramps work out as expected, the skull/spine on the VUK mounts properly and that there's no other unexpected setbacks. I'm just excited to see this final video and hoping for the best. You have done a fantastic job of keeping us informed these past few months!

Thanks The skull/spine turned out to be a pretty simple issue of playfield mounting, so that was pretty easy to take care of. I like to think we've run into just about every problem that could have happened already, so aside from any manufacturing mishaps along the way, we should be pretty smooth sailing from here.

Quoted from Whysnow:

I CAN NOT WAIT TO SEE THE FINAL BUILD!!!!

You and I both, buddy

Quoted from Don1:

I think this thread should be published as a booklet and included in each goodie bag

It would be a best-seller if we could get that orange chick from Jersey Shore to sign off on it.

#6679 9 years ago

Here's a question.
Who will you guys be using for shipping/delivery?

I'm gonna have to figure out how to get this bad boy into Canada pretty soon.

#6680 9 years ago
Quoted from SkitBPinball:

I hope I don't regret saying this, but April 7th is our target release date.

You won't regret it until April 8th....

#6681 9 years ago
Quoted from SkitBPinball:

I like to think we've run into just about every problem that could have happened already, so aside from any manufacturing mishaps along the way, we should be pretty smooth sailing from here.

Isn't that what the captain of the Titanic said right before . . .

I do hope it is smooth sailing for you from here.

#6682 9 years ago
Quoted from rai:

could we get some time table? I mean if say the production will start in 30 to 90 days and how long will it take to reach 100 or 200 games into production?

This post deserved its own reply, so here goes. By the end of this post, it should be fairly obvious to see why it is so difficult to nail down a solid release date, and why the date I've given is a little further out than the arithmetic would imply.

The development cycle is virtually complete, save for testing and minute observation, which is fantastic because without any further hiccups on certain part designs, that makes the remaining times much more predictable. Just to over-state, whenever something doesn't work or doesn't fit exactly right or needs to be redesigned for whatever reason, that adds at least 3~4 weeks of dev-time for the new designs to come back to us in a physical form. That's not aggregate, so having 2 parts or 200 parts that need to be redesigned would still take 3~4 weeks. That was fine when I was having 10~15 parts tweaked at a time, but now we're down to only TWO that we can't be 100% sure of at this point (due to low amounts of testing, but so far, so good). Now it seems like everything hangs in the balance of these two parts, which cost literally thousands to prototype and still have that 3~4 week overhead. That being said, we've brought in some pretty talented veterans to make sure those waits and costs won't happen again.

All of the contractors we have lined up have given production schedule estimates ranging between 6 and 12 weeks from the time we order parts to when we receive them, save for cabinets and toys (cabinets take almost as long as the rest of the game to assemble, and the toys are essentially ready when we are). So that's anywhere from a month and a half to three solid months just for all of the parts to arrive.

Once all the parts are in, we start assembling. Personally, I can ALMOST do two playfields a day, at my last checked speed (yes, we keep track of stuff like that), and after doing a bunch of them over time, two a day might not be a pace to be measured against, but it's certainly a possibility. We have a handful of very skilled builders, so it should only be a few weeks before we have our whole shop doing 20~25 machines per week without any trouble, making it another 10~12 weeks for production time. Once we get to the point of actual game production, there shouldn't be a significant time difference between machine #25 and machine #250 to go out the door. I don't think anyone will be looking at 2015 at all. With our release date set in April, and our build schedule continuing at a good pace, the entire build process should be well over with by October.

Rai, you always seem to ask the big questions, so I hope this is a complete enough answer for you I also hope this will help the rest of you insiders understand the scheduling a little better.

#6683 9 years ago

When do you think you will have the next video?

#6684 9 years ago
Quoted from Drano:

Here's a question.
Who will you guys be using for shipping/delivery?
I'm gonna have to figure out how to get this bad boy into Canada pretty soon.

You and about 40 other people We have deals with a couple shipping companies, but we see a recurrence of R&L being the best balance of price and reliability. After dealing with a few distributors in Europe and Australia, we have been toying with the idea of hooking up with a distributor in Ontario to help with all of these Canadian games.

Quoted from spfxted:

You won't regret it until April 8th....

Nah, we got this

Quoted from rosh:

Isn't that what the captain of the Titanic said right before . . .

It was all smooth sailing for the good Captain Smith after he said that. I haven't heard a complaint from him since!

#6685 9 years ago
Quoted from SkitBPinball:

Rai, you always seem to ask the big questions, so I hope this is a complete enough answer for you I also hope this will help the rest of you insiders understand the scheduling a little better.

Yes, good to know, I have to work on the space time aspect of this +/- MMR.

Could you fill me in on one other thing. Not having seen or played your beautiful game, I had one concern. I notice that close shoots seem to be more deadly for drains and the two standup targets are close to the flippers and near center. Is this an area to avoid or a danger shot?

Glad to hear about the bodies not being in contact with the ball that was another concern.

Hope all is well, for the new year etc..

#6686 9 years ago

I would like to pay for my machine by check. Could you pm or email me the address to send it to and make it out to.

thanks,
#34

#6687 9 years ago

thanks for that lengthy post. helps.
pretty anxious to get the game, finally!

Will there be a significant price increase from Predator for your next title? SHooting for $8500??

#6688 9 years ago
Quoted from marksf123:

When do you think you will have the next video?

Working out all of the little bugs right now. Whenever that is finished, there will be a big video update.

Quoted from rai:

I notice that close shoots seem to be more deadly for drains and I happen to notice the two standup targets are close and near center. Is this an area to avoid or a danger shot?

I get this question a lot, but it's surprising how rarely it actually happens. When someone asks me if the center targets are a death shot, I usually say "the center targets are to be respected, not feared." What I mean is this: If you just shoot at them like they're "just targets" and you aren't sure of how the ball will react after hitting them, you are definitely going to have to deal with that and risk a drain situation. That being said, if you "respect" them as a real shot and aim for specific placement of your shot, you can predict how the ball will come off of them and keep playing just fine. They are designed at a pretty stiff angle to toss the ball more to the side than straight back down at you, so SDTM drains are extremely rare from the center targets. Even if I only need to hit one of them, I always shoot for dead center to hit both targets to give double the dampening effect of the targets themselves and to use as much of that angle as I can. The movement of the ball is still damned fast, but it almost never throws it STDM or out the side, making it easily reactable.

#6689 9 years ago

Are there ever questions that make you think "[email protected]#k this guy, and his question"?

This question included.

#6690 9 years ago
Quoted from Drano:

Here's a question.
Who will you guys be using for shipping/delivery?
I'm gonna have to figure out how to get this bad boy into Canada pretty soon.

I hear Kevin is delivering them personally!

#6691 9 years ago

Not to be too much of a pessimist, but whenever I hear someone estimating the time it will take to finish a project, especially one as large and with as many hard to control factors as Predator, I'm reminded of this procedure I once heard.

1) Take the time you think it will require to finish.

2) Double it.

3) Change the unit.

That might be a bit much but I think reality usually falls between steps two and three.

Kevin, I wish you guys all the best of luck in the completion of the design and in the manufacturing of the machine. From what I've gathered by your responses, I don't mind waiting patiently until you get it finished to your satisfaction.

13
#6692 9 years ago
Quoted from vster23:

I would like to pay for my machine by check. Could you pm or email me the address to send it to and make it out to.

PM Sent. I didn't re-include that information in the latest email to go out, so if anyone else needs it please email me or PM or whatever.

Quoted from dgoett:

Will there be a significant price increase from Predator for your next title? SHooting for $8500??

Haha, no. Not counting Predator, obviously, or some weird and specific scenarios, I've never paid more than $1750 for a pin. Even if someone made my favorite license and it was the best game ever made, $8500 still equals at least four other pins for me. The market is a lot different now, not to mention the economy and general inflation over the years, but we used to get NIB games all the time back in the day for around $1500, including FunHouse and other big names. Despite the fact that I am notoriously cheap when buying games, I could picture paying $5k for a Predator, and that's kind of where the thought ended. I doubt it will change much, if at all, with the next machine.

#6693 9 years ago
Quoted from sammiesguys:

Are there ever questions that make you think "[email protected]#k this guy, and his question"?
This question included.

Questions? No, not really. Comments? Sometimes...

Quoted from hollywood:

I hear Kevin is delivering them personally!

Still honestly considering it, actually. The Skit-B Pinball Canadian Tour might be a damned fun time, and those MAACA guys know how to party

Quoted from Jvspin:

1) Take the time you think it will take to finish.
2) Double it.
3) Change the unit.

You know, at first I laughed, but if I think back to when I was first thinking of how long this would take...
April 2012 I figured it would only take "like a month" to get the unit we had to "complete" status and start getting some rolling out. (Naive, for sure, but oh well)
So we double it to two months and change the unit to years, that would put us exactly where we are right now: Looking at an April 2014 official release.

You, sir, are a genius.

#6694 9 years ago

Kevin, will the people that are purchasing Predator have first shot at purchasing the next game before it is offered to others? Hoping for another killer theme.

#6695 9 years ago
Quoted from SkitBPinball:

I don't think anyone will be looking at 2015 at all. With our release date set in April, and our build schedule continuing at a good pace, the entire build process should be well over with by October.

Skit, glad to see things rocking along and can't wait to see the new video.

Not that you guys can't do it without a hiccup but since I'm likely in the "October" group and living through the Woz experience and all the resources that they have do you guys really feel that confident that you can do a better job than JJP of cranking out these 250 pins? I hope so

#6696 9 years ago

Huge thanks for the uptick in great communication!

P U M P E D ! , ! , !

#6697 9 years ago

Kevin, Have you ever seen "Event Horizon"? What's your 3 top horror films?event_horizon_sphere.jpg

#6698 9 years ago

predator isn't mechanically complex as woz. 5 flippers vs. 2. 1 playfield versus 3.
assembly would be WAY faster than a woz. i'm dreading the day a worn out woz comes thru the shop for refurbishing.

#6699 9 years ago
Quoted from dgoett:

predator isn't mechanically complex as woz. 5 flippers vs. 2. 1 playfield versus 3.
assembly would be WAY faster than a woz. i'm dreading the day a worn out woz comes thru the shop for refurbishing.

Good point, assembly should be a whole lot easier, right Kevin I'm referring to things really more out of their control like supplier issues and unknown problems like power supply once production has begun.

#6700 9 years ago
Quoted from sensfreak:

Kevin, will the people that are purchasing Predator have first shot at purchasing the next game before it is offered to others? Hoping for another killer theme.

Still trying to think of a classy way to do this without seeming like a sales push, but yes, everyone who gets a game from us will have a shot at it and their previous production number before anyone else.

Quoted from iceman44:

living through the Woz experience and all the resources that they have do you guys really feel that confident that you can do a better job than JJP of cranking out these 250 pins? I hope so

At this point, Iceman, this is almost a philosophical question We get compared to Jack quite a bit, and Jack has also fallen under a lot of criticism in the last year or so, but at the end of the day we are very different not only in what we do but how we do it. Let's also not forget that there are some WoZ games out there now and they seem to be doing pretty well, and, while I've only played it a couple of times, the game is a marvel to look at (admittedly, I still know very little about how to play it).
Do I feel confident that we'll be able to knock out 250 units? Absolutely. Comparing our resources to Jack's is apples to oranges, but our big difference isn't in our resources, it's in our resource management. We only keep one working prototype at a time for lots of reasons, but one of the big reasons is simply cost. At one point in development, Jack had dozens of machines going to certain shows and expos around the country, when it wasn't even complete and I'll never totally understand that. We also have a workshop that is only a few thousand square feet, compared to Jack's multi-million dollar factory. Much of it has to do with the scale and scope of what we do, but anything more than what we need is just too much.
The biggest difference between what Jack and I do comes from the fact that all of their hardware is proprietary as far as their boards go, and that has been where most of the problems he's been having have come from. We use the tried-and-true P-ROC and its driver boards, and I work pretty closely with Gerry whenever I try to do something off-the-wall to make sure everything always works as it should. If JJP used P-ROC, it wouldn't have had the issues it had, bottom line.

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