New! Pincoder Adapter

After fighting to get the sticker off, the chip isn't even an eprom. I can't find a listing in my GQ 4x4 for this prom. It is a MOS 5341-09554 4780. On the bottom it says Korea 4863(sorry for the crappy pics). Any advice? Thanks.

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It's likely a masked rom and that # is the williams part #. Just burn a new eprom and replace, making sure your board is jumpered for the correct eprom.

Thanks. I'm not sure about jumper settings, but I'll look into it. Does anyone know if this is a reputable place for eproms: https://www.twistywristarcade.com/eproms/118-2532-eprom.html ?

Never bought eproms from them but have purchased other things from them over the years.

It’s legit. I highly recommend them! I have bought multiple parts from him including Eproms.

Thanks for the replies.

Small update: I was able to verify check the 2 game roms as they are eproms and they came out ok. I couldn't verify check the 2 flipper roms as they are masked roms and are not listed in the GQ-4x4 database. I was also able to verify check the sound rom and 3 out of 4 speech roms. One of the speech roms has a leg that is broken off,(I think it's still in the socket. The sticker on it says "5T-5002" and the file is "Speech 5.532". So I believe I need two 2532 eproms, one for the speech rom and one for the flipper rom and one 2716 eprom for the other flipper rom, and a few sockets just in case. Correct?

Would it be this one?

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I received my eproms. I was able to write the 2 flipper roms successfully(1 to the 2532 and 1 to the 2716), but was not able to write the speech to the other 2532. During the write cycle, it goes all the way to 100% and then fails right after during the verify process(screenshot below). I've tried to put the eprom in the eraser for roughly a half an hour. It shows it is blank but I still can't write to it. Any suggestions? Thanks.

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I did not read all of your posts but keep in mind WMS really screwed up on the labeling of system 7 ROM chips around Black Knight era. The stickers almost never match what the board layout / ROM dump labeling. I forget which is mixed up, but at least two usually are. So if you have one not verifying right check the data against other ROM images.

Also, some ROMs have to be written to several times before they will verify. I'm not sure why but it has worked for me at least a few times.

Means the chip is bad.
Try dropping speed to "-2", and try "Double Write". If it still throws an error after that - chip is bad. Toss it, get another.

Thanks for the tips everyone. I'll keep trying to write.
As for the process stalling, I don't see any slow down during the write process. It goes up to 100% at a decent rate(says 12.17 seconds).

If the GQ-4X seems to burn a chip really slow and/or all the bits not stay flipped typically means the Vpp is too low. Usually this means you are trying to burn a 25vpp chip at 21vpp but also could be you need an external power supply and not just USB power.

All the M2732 (M2716 too) out of china are marked with A suffix. A good portion of them are 25v chips and some even 12.5v. When you burn the 25v type at 21v expect GQ-4x to take way longer than usual and you may have to repeatedly burn it over and over to get all the bits to stay right. When I pick the right Vpp it burns quick and right the first time.

If you burn a 12.5vpp chip at 21, or 25vpp it gets killed.
If you are not sure Vpp of dodgy china remark start at 12.5 (2732B) and go up until it seems to work.

The chip I'm trying to burn is a TMS2532A-45JL. The other one(same exact chip), burned and verified with no issues. Same thing with the 2716 I burned, no issues. Both burned pretty fast too. So I tried to burn the same file that worked with the other 2532 and it still wouldn't burn. These were all done with a powered USB hub. I may have a power supply laying around here somewhere and have to look for it, but so far it's looking like the chip is bad

On one happy note: after I put in the 2 new flipper roms I burnt, my game now boots!

probably just a bad EPROM if you can do other identical chips. Powered USB hub should be good enough as it is for the laptop I use to burn with. It has to boost 5v usb up to 25v for these old chips.

I have not had good luck reusing TMS2532. Even some that are working, I erase them, and then they refuse to take another burn. HN462532 has usually been more reliable to me for what its worth. I go with 2732 whenever possible, but not possible on system 7 mpu without cutting and jumping a few traces.

Thank you. Can you please point to a reliable source for the HN462532? Would appreciate it.

Funkward Tech is usually a good source for obsolete eproms.

ebay.com link: HITACHI 462532 2532 HN462532G UV EPROM 32Kbit x 5PCS

Thank you.

Created another quick test video using the pincoder adapter on a WMS 4 MPU (Flash). This is the LED, Blanking, CMOS19, RAM13, RAM16, and Displays tests

I'd really love to see some videos using these to troubleshoot non-booting boards. I have a couple I would donate to the person who was willing to do them

I spoke with Cheddar yesterday, and will try and contribute some videos, too. Glad to help where I can.

After using the adapter to troubleshoot my boards, I believe a series of videos would be great. The videos from Cheddar were helpful as to what to look for for a successful test. But I think if you made some in depth step by step videos, that would really help out new, (and maybe old) troubleshooters. Videos about like what you mentioned and then some: how to orient and where to plug in the adapter, how to set the jumpers, what other connectors should be plugged/unplugged from your boards, what fuses should be removed/added during tests, what a successful/failed test looks like, what to do when a test fails...etc. For me, watching the videos and reading the text file included with the adapter got me pointed in the right direction. Once I was able to understand the 1st test and how it works, I was off and running with the rest of the tests. Your adapter was very useful and helped me get my machine back up and running.

I'm in and willing to help. I could make a quick how to set up for testing video.

Just a couple but once a board is booting it can almost always be saved. If it doesn't boot it's just a brick to me and I'd like to add that knowledge

As requested here is a video of a bench setup and running the first test on a williams system 7 board.

Very good stuff...im digging the videos

I received my pincoder today. It was packaged well. The board seems to be assembled well. With everything disconnected except the displays, I was quickly able to run through tests 1-6 by watching the video Cheddar made for YouTube. My board failed test #2 for blanking. Both leds appear to light but the test point doesn’t go high (I’m checking that at pin 37 on the interconect, is that correct?). PIA1 pin 4, pins 10, 9, and 8 on IC7, and pin 12 on IC23 are all not pulsing either. According to the notes for this test, I should replace PIA1, IC7, and Q5. Am I reading that right?

The 40 pin connector is newer but was installed by the previous owner. The board has been converted to three ROMs and was working and then all of a sudden it wasn't as far as I've been told. Occasionally, it will go into a really weak attract mode and will start a game but even when it does, only some of the feature lights light. Then I think it tilts and ends the game shortly after starting. Most of the time it just shows the game number and ROM version on the #1 display.

EDIT: I pulled the batteries and tried test #2 again. This time it passed but the game still won’t boot. I also notice that the newer (not scanbe) socket at IC17 that was holding the pincoder adapter is now not wanting to take the eprom as tightly as it was before. I’m going to replace this socket and have a look at some other things and report back tomorrow.
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It's for a Flash. I tried the sockets but they don't stay put. As soon as I let them go, they fall out as if the legs aren't long enough to actually seat into the existing socket.

I replaced the socket for IC17. It’s still doing the same thing. When running the blanking test, TP4 starts low at power on, then immediately goes high, and stays high. Pin 4 on PIA1 pulses. Pins 8, 9, and 10 on IC7 pulse. Pin 12 on IC23 starts high at power on but then shows nothing at all, neither high nor low.

I edited the first post at the end. I originally ran test #2 with your individual ROMs before the adapter arrived. At that time, I also checked the PIA and ICs. The first part of that post was what I was seeing at first but then, when I used the adapter, something changed and pin 37 (which I thought was TP4 by the way, apparently I got bad info) started to respond appropriately to the first part of test #2. I didn’t think to check the PIA or any other the ICs again until I had already posted. When I thought about it, I pulled the batteries, checked those pins again, and saw different results. Test #1 passes every time but I haven't checked the PIA or IC pins during test #1.

In regards to the weak attract mode, I mean one or two of the feature lights work and a couple lamps in the backbox will flash in attract mode, when I can get that far. I really have to work for it to get it to even do that. The lamp test on the adapter lights almost all of the feature lights. Most of the time, the machine barely does anything when first turned on. The GI circuit comes on and the two LEDs on the mpu flash once. Nothing else works. If I turn it off and back on one time, it will then also produce the startup sound and will continue to make that sound at power up until I let it sit for a few minutes, then I have to cycle the power one time again. Sometimes the displays work fully, sometimes they show a few digits, sometimes they show the ROM number, sometimes they flash at first but then go blank. The display test passes every time. If I keep cycling the power, eventually one or two feature lights will come on for attract mode but it’s a rare occurrence. When it will go into that weak attract mode, pressing the diagnostic button on the mpu gets the top LED to light and stay on, otherwise pressing that diagnostic button gets no response. If I mess with the start button as I’m cycling the power, I can eventually get a game started but it always makes the tilt sound and dies in the middle of the first ball.

There is always about 4.95v and 11.95v at the connector on the MPU every time I turn it on. The power supply seems to be pretty solid.

Sorry for the confusion.

pincoder I tried this and it appears my adapter gave up the ghost. With the adapter set to test 1 and the LEDs alternating accordingly, the moment I touched PIA1 pin 4 with the logic probe, a game sound came from the machine, the top LED locked off, and the bottom LED locked on. I shut the machine off and turned it back on, the machine emits a different game sound, and now the top LED locks on. Setting the adapter to any other setting yields the same results. I have the positive clip of the logic probe on the bottom lead of C23 and the negative clip on the top lead. Everything on the adapter was working until I touched pin 4 on IC18 while running test 1a-leds.

Ive even tried running clear_cmos. It ran as designed but tests 1-6 don’t function at all anymore.

Putting the game ROM back in the boards puts the game back to the same state it was in before I got the adapter. Not sure what happened.

Any advice?

Looking at the schematic for system 4 MPUs it looks like the positive lead on C23 is the top lead and ground is the bottom lead.

Fix this, remove the driver board and the other roms and try it again

Cheddar you gave me this file. Bottom lead shows to be positive and top lead negative. This is the way I’ve been running all of the other tests successfully. Up until now.

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can you post a pic of C23?

I removed the other ROMs and cleared the cmos and the adapter seems to be working again.

Cheddar Here you go. Bottom lead is tied to 5V and top lead is tied to ground.

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This has me concerned (From the Flash Schematics). It appears there may be 2 different layouts for this board (although this one has test points on it so it's not a system 4).pasted_image (resized).png

Can you remove the probes so we can see the markings on the board?

Sorry this happened. I'll put a note on the graphic to verify the markings on the board