(Topic ID: 180877)

*NEW* SDTM: Toy Story 4 Pinball Review

By ZMeny

5 years ago


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  • 5,953 posts
  • 496 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 19 hours ago by Gunnut40
  • Topic is favorited by 169 Pinsiders

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“*NEW* SDTM: Toy Story 4 Pinball Review”

  • Team Greg 116 votes
    32%
  • Team Zach 72 votes
    20%
  • Neither 57 votes
    15%
  • One cannot pick between Abbott or Costello 123 votes
    33%

(368 votes)

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There are 5,953 posts in this topic. You are on page 118 of 120.
#5851 50 days ago

Always enjoy the content, but thought the Elvira comparison was odd. Elvira has one of the biggest/crazy mechs in pinball. I’ve never dealt like their was nothing really in there.

#5852 49 days ago

Always appreciate the content from SDTM, it's very fun to watch. Thank you for the video.

I'll say this about Toy Story 4 and that is people are not arguing over fun factor. I'm sure it's fun, pretty much all modern pinballs are. The issue for many is value and what customers are receiving for $12k - $15k. The value just isn't there with Toy Story 4 IMO and I say that as someone who has bought every JJP NIB. There are zero mechanical toys in the back 1/3 of the game, this may be a first for a modern pin and is bizarre to see. Mini LCD screens by JJP have been used to compliment a game and represent something from the theme. What does a 10" LCD, that takes up space typically used for a mechanical toy, represent from the Toy Story world? I can't think of anything.

The underside of Toy Story 4 speaks for itself and there isn't really much to speak about sadly. Hell, even the pop up Benson posts, which are referred to as a gameplay feature, seem there to simply prevent wild airballs off the pop up ramp. Overall fun factor alone IMO isn't worth $12k - $15k as the features, code, and overall theme (Toy Story 4 versus Toy Story) isn't there with this title. Speaking of code where's the mini wizard modes? There are none which is another odd and disappointing first from JJP.

I wish money was no object as I would buy a TS4 in a heartbeat, sadly that isn't the case and this will likely be the first JJP title I pass on for the reasons above. I need and want more for my money (mechs and code) then what is being offered.

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#5853 49 days ago

Zach and Greg, you guys are the best! I love how excited and enthusiastic you are about the hobby and about new games! Watching your video helped me decide on getting my TS4 and I can't wait!

#5854 49 days ago

The game looks fun. I'm having flashbacks to discussions years back when people were comparing 'fun factor' and value with Stern's lack of BOM machines to JJP's loaded machines.

#5855 49 days ago

It is an interesting thought exercise in that most people bitch when there are no assets or weak assets. This one has stellar assets perhaps at the expense of some crazier toys. Give me fun + stellar assets any day of the week!

16
#5856 49 days ago
Quoted from Jvspin:I'm having flashbacks to discussions years back when people were comparing 'fun factor' and value with Stern's lack of BOM machines

I remember Clay posting a photo of the Ironman under playfield - looks as barren as TS4 - and ripping it a new one. “There’s nothing here!!”

Ironman was still a blast to play. As I’m sure TS4 probably is.

The big difference was - Ironman was $4000 bucks, give or take.

This thing is TWELVE THOOOOOOUSAND DOOOOLARS. Or $15,000 if you’re particularly insane.

Which is exactly why I am priced out of the NIB market. Hey - yeah, I can afford to buy them. But I won’t.

rd

#5857 49 days ago
Quoted from Vitty:

This one has stellar assets perhaps at the expense of some crazier toys.

Stellar assets on the wrong movie...wah wah wahhhhhh

#5858 49 days ago
Quoted from rotordave:

Which is exactly why I am priced out of the NIB market.

You could leverage a couple of your older machines to buy a new one in the equally insane used market.

#5859 49 days ago

One thing I've always liked about JJP games is their playfields tend to be designed around the theme from the start rather than taking a game design and adding the theme after, as they typically did in the 90's.

The TS4 playfield seems like a bit of a throwback and somewhat generic with no specific TS4 mechs, insert shapes, etc..like Pat did with Family Guy/Shrek.

There's no way you could take GNR's playfield and turn it into a POTC.

#5860 49 days ago
Quoted from Jvspin:

You could leverage a couple of your older machines to buy a new one in the equally insane used market.

This is true.

But to pay the $20,000 NZD dollars to get a TS4 LE, here’s what I’d have to sell.

Either:

1/ 3x “a grade” shopped up system 11 titles like Diner, Whirlwind, Taxi. I get around $7000-8000 NZD each for a mint example of those here.

2/ 5x or 6x 77-85 solid state titles. I get $3000-4000 NZD for those when they’re nice and tidy. Xenon, Paragon, Nitro Groundshaker - games like that.

(Those comparisons are also pretty comparable to stateside prices if you convert the dollar amount ..)

So for me, that’s a NO.

I ain’t selling Diner, Taxi AND Whirlwind (every one of those is probably a better game than TS4) to buy “the new shiny thing”

The lustre of the “new shiny thing” dissipated for me some years back when they jacked all the NIB prices up to crazy levels - just because “they could”.

You guys keep on buying them - so you can’t blame them.

Brace yourself for the $8000 Stern Pro - cause that’s just around the corner.

rd

#5861 49 days ago
Quoted from manadams:

Stellar assets on the wrong movie...wah wah wahhhhhh

Nah toy story 4 is a fine choice and an enjoyable movie.

#5862 49 days ago
Quoted from rotordave:

I remember Clay posting a photo of the Ironman under playfield - looks as barren as TS4 - and ripping it a new one. “There’s nothing here!!”
Ironman was still a blast to play. As I’m sure TS4 probably is.
The big difference was - Ironman was $4000 bucks, give or take.
This thing is TWELVE THOOOOOOUSAND DOOOOLARS. Or $15,000 if you’re particularly insane.
Which is exactly why I am priced out of the NIB market. Hey - yeah, I can afford to buy them. But I won’t.
rd

Stern would sell an Ironman LE for $11k today RD

Slap an LCD screen in it and good to go

#5863 49 days ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Stern would sell an Ironman LE for $11k today RD
Slap an LCD screen in it and good to go

And no doubt there’d be plenty of dummies lining up to buy one.

I’m more than happy with my $4000 USD one I bought in 2010.

rd

#5864 48 days ago

Please keep in mind that while Zack/Greg say they will tell it like it is, they still want to move this product. They incorrectly indicate that they got rid of the mushy flipper feel and in my opinion this is not the case at all. Playing toy story the flippers still feel like GnR compared to a Stern.
I played a new toy story on location at the end of the first day where it was played continuously. While you had the power to make the jump ramp, the right flipper was barely able to make it up the left ramp. It is improved? Perhaps on the left flipper, time will tell as these get played over time....
Second, I'm going to speculate on working with Pat on Jjp. Zach indicates he doesn't know pat, but gushes how he is teaching the next generation at JJP. While zach is also speculating, i get the sense at best this is a one way street, and Pat doesn't feel he has anything to learn from other designers. Looking at the hot rails integration, I get the impression these were not Pat's choice to add them to toy story and he certainly did not get Eric's opinion regarding his design. Why do I say this? Look at the metal rails on toy story and compare them to GNR. The metal rails next to the hot rails is minimized to maximize the amount of lighting on the GnR playfield. Look at toy story, metal rails from the top of the hot rails down to the playfield underneath such that the lighting only points up with little effect on the playfield. I don't think there is much collaboration between designers because I think Eric would have noticed and pointed this out.

#5865 48 days ago
Quoted from Jvspin:

One thing I've always liked about JJP games is their playfields tend to be designed around the theme from the start rather than taking a game design and adding the theme after, as they typically did in the 90's.
The TS4 playfield seems like a bit of a throwback and somewhat generic with no specific TS4 mechs, insert shapes, etc..like Pat did with Family Guy/Shrek.
There's no way you could take GNR's playfield and turn it into a POTC.

Totally agree , GNR theme integration is as good as you could want .
You can tell Eric and Slash put their heart into the game .
Like a lot of pins , once they stop making them , people will realise how special it is .
At $15490 Aussie dollars compared to $18750 , I think I got a bargain .

#5866 48 days ago
Quoted from C_S_S:

Please keep in mind that while Zack/Greg say they will tell it like it is, they still want to move this product. They incorrectly indicate that they got rid of the mushy flipper feel and in my opinion this is not the case at all. Playing toy story the flippers still feel like GnR compared to a Stern.
I played a new toy story on location at the end of the first day where it was played continuously. While you had the power to make the jump ramp, the right flipper was barely able to make it up the left ramp. It is improved? Perhaps on the left flipper, time will tell as these get played over time....
Second, I'm going to speculate on working with Pat on Jjp. Zach indicates he doesn't know pat, but gushes how he is teaching the next generation at JJP. While zach is also speculating, i get the sense at best this is a one way street, and Pat doesn't feel he has anything to learn from other designers. Looking at the hot rails integration, I get the impression these were not Pat's choice to add them to toy story and he certainly did not get Eric's opinion regarding his design. Why do I say this? Look at the metal rails on toy story and compare them to GNR. The metal rails next to the hot rails is minimized to maximize the amount of lighting on the GnR playfield. Look at toy story, metal rails from the top of the hot rails down to the playfield underneath such that the lighting only points up with little effect on the playfield. I don't think there is much collaboration between designers because I think Eric would have noticed and pointed this out.

We were simply relaying the information that we received from the creators of the game. Please don't make this about an agenda to sell games.

#5867 48 days ago
Quoted from ZMeny:

We were simply relaying the information that we received from the creators of the game.

Do the flippers during normal gameplay feel any different than GnR to you? You mentioned the JJP talking point twice in the video and podcast but didn't give your "first impression" regarding flipper feel in either.

#5868 48 days ago
Quoted from C_S_S:

Do the flippers during normal gameplay feel any different than GnR to you? You mentioned the JJP talking point twice in the video and podcast but didn't give your "first impression" regarding flipper feel in either.

I would say yes they feel stronger and more consistent especially during multiball. I’ve been playing mine a lot since our first impressions video and I have yet to bump up power which I typically always do out of the box on JJP games. On the other hand, the flippers still feel like JJP flippers, softer than a Stern. I haven’t felt the need to increase the power yet but I may bump them up in the future to get more power.

I watch Karl’s stream and heard him talk about weakness on the right flipper. He plays better and longer than me so I don’t doubt him a bit. When I play I’ll put a couple games on it then take a break so I haven’t noticed significant differences in dropped strength yet.

#5869 48 days ago
Quoted from ZMeny:

I would say yes they feel stronger and more consistent especially during multiball. I’ve been playing mine a lot since our first impressions video and I have yet to bump up power which I typically always do out of the box on JJP games. On the other hand, the flippers still feel like JJP flippers, softer than a Stern. I haven’t felt the need to increase the power yet but I may bump them up in the future to get more power.
I watch Karl’s stream and heard him talk about weakness on the right flipper. He plays better and longer than me so I don’t doubt him a bit. When I okay I’ll put a couple games on it then take a break so I haven’t noticed significant differences in dropped strength yet.

That right flipper was missing a coil sleeve he found afterwards!

#5870 48 days ago
Quoted from iceman44:

That right flipper was missing a coil sleeve he found afterwards!

Well, that doesn’t help hahaha

#5871 48 days ago

Great reveal video and great first impressions from Zach and Greg. I really enjoyed both of those. As for the game I'm looking forward to playing it and I'm sure it will be fun. Hard to find 12k reasons to buy it though. I can't help but feel like it was the unmasking at the end of every scooby-doo and underneath the mask was a stern pro with powder coat. Time will tell on this one but with JJP's long record of qc and playfield issues, questionable coding paths, and the lack of anything to interact with in the game, it's a real easy wait and see.

#5872 42 days ago

I wanted this to be my first JJP. Looks like it’s tons of fun. Can’t wait to play. I’m priced out as well. Not gonna sell 3-4 games to get one.

#5873 39 days ago

….son of a demogorgon!!!!

Thank God for Medisinyl Mods! BUY YOURS NOW!

SDTM Exclusive: NEW Medisinyl Mods Stranger Things Collection (Reveal & Installation)

#5874 37 days ago
Quoted from ZMeny:

….son of a demogorgon!!!!
Thank God for Medisinyl Mods! BUY YOURS NOW!
SDTM Exclusive: NEW Medisinyl Mods Stranger Things Collection (Reveal & Installation)

Son of a bitch, I’m in. But where to order? Not on flipnout site yet, or is it? ** Found list in thread titled “Stranger Things - Lab set - Gate Wall, Deprivation Tank ++ [[Medisinyl Mods]]”.

Looks like 190 preorders, so far. Medisinyl’s going to need a bigger carbon footprint along with a few more printers.

#5875 36 days ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

Son of a bitch, I’m in. But where to order? Not on flipnout site yet, or is it? ** Found list in thread titled “Stranger Things - Lab set - Gate Wall, Deprivation Tank ++ [[Medisinyl Mods]]”. To date 414 of 500 kits have been reserved.

Yup just add your name to that thread queue and you’re in

1 month later
#5876 4 days ago

NEW SDTM! Toy Story 4 Pinball Review

Comment below on your experience with Jersey Jack Pinball's newest game!

#5877 4 days ago
Quoted from ZMeny:

NEW SDTM! Toy Story 4 Pinball Review
Comment below on your experience with Jersey Jack Pinball's newest game!

Theme... A-

stare.gif
#5878 4 days ago
Quoted from manadams:

Theme... A-[quoted image]

Not surprising.

#5879 4 days ago
Quoted from manadams:

Theme... A-[quoted image]

Who doesn’t love Toy Story?

#5880 4 days ago
Quoted from ZMeny:

Who doesn’t love Toy Story?

Sewer clowns?

it.gif
#5881 3 days ago
Quoted from manadams:

Sewer clowns?[quoted image]

Now THERE is a theme I could get behind for a machine….IT, not dumb Bean

#5882 3 days ago
Quoted from ZMeny:

Now THERE is a theme I could get behind for a machine….IT, not dumb Bean

bean.gif
#5883 3 days ago
Quoted from ZMeny:

Comment below on your experience with Jersey Jack Pinball's newest game!

I got a ball and a half in before I got the ball wedged somewhere hidden on the playfield, taking down the machine for the evening
I did the same a ton on a local "first run" RUSH a couple times so... maybe I have a personal issue with getting balls wedged?

I did notice the flippers felt MUCH better, IMO, than past JJP games. So that's encouraging. What I was able to see of the light show was fantastic as usual, and the shots I was able to take were fairly reasonable/nice. While my time with it was brief, what I experienced was pleasant enough to warrant seeking one out locally and giving it some actual time.

#5884 3 days ago

Enjoyed the review! Going to play one on location in a few hours, will see how it goes.
Thanks for the video.

15
#5885 3 days ago

B+

Another B+

Gotta say it. This video felt like a sales video. More so than any previous. You actually watched Pixar’s making of Toy story 4 videos just to be able to defend this choice. AI spiders…extra dirt and wear on the textures.

Theme A-. Come on!?

Greg Bone gives out a rant defending the shrewd business practices of JJP because they have to maximize profits!? Yikes.

Somewhere along the way…you guys lost your way. Did JJP give or discount to Greg that Toy Story machine? I doubt he bought it. I miss the early videos when he was like rest of us and had to save up for these machines…and had to choose where he put his limited funding.

Disappointed SDTM mega fan here. But hey…you sold some machines right?

#5886 3 days ago

So true, as said in the video, TS4 has a tight tilt from factory. Lightly leaned on the glass and that tilted it in a great game I had going, wasn't even nudging it.

#5887 3 days ago
Quoted from Scandell:

B+
Another B+
Gotta say it. This video felt like a sales video. More so than any previous. You actually watched Pixar’s making of Toy story 4 videos just to be able to defend this choice. AI spiders…extra dirt and wear on the textures.
Theme A-. Come on!?
Greg Bone gives out a rant defending the shrewd business practices of JJP because they have to maximize profits!? Yikes.
Somewhere along the way…you guys lost your way. Did JJP give or discount to Greg that Toy Story machine? I doubt he bought it. I miss the early videos when he was like rest of us and had to save up for these machines…and had to choose where he put his limited funding.
Disappointed SDTM mega fan here. But hey…you sold some machines right?

I do think "reviewers" should make disclosures about their relationship or benefits they've received from the manufacturer. Not saying Greg has but it would go a long way to dispel any suspicion.

#5888 3 days ago
Quoted from ZMeny:

Who doesn’t love Toy Story?

No one. It is a universally loved movie.

This isn't Toy Story...This is Toy Story 4. I'd have to count myself as someone who was disappointed in the film. Weakest of the four movies IMO.

Still love you, Zach.

#5889 3 days ago

I thought this was going to be a commercial but I figured I would give it a go for old times sake. An hour and five minutes holy fuck is this a review or a late night infomercial. This is a hard nope for me. I just jumped to the end and to no ones surprise it's a B+.

#5890 3 days ago

"Every time Greg rates something its a B+!!!!!!"
"Ive been a fan for years and good ole Greg always rates things a B+!!!"
"OMFG Greg has changed now that he works with Zach, only a shill would rate this a B+!!!!!"

Tough crowd, lol.

#5891 3 days ago

I can't believe people are still posting the "biased shill, paid off by the manufacturers" comments. I mean this happens after every single review.

Are people just now coming to these conclusions? I don't get it. Zach has been a distro for a very long time now.

I find SDTM videos very entertaining, and Iove Zach and Greg's personalities and interactions. I like to hear what they think of different games, but I certainly don't use their videos as buying advice.

#5892 3 days ago

TS4 is really fun guys. Spend some time on it, draw your own conclusions! For me, there is something to be said for having a little more space for shots. Could it have used another wow mech, sure heck ya. I don't have enough time on it yet to come up with a rating but i don't think there's anything out of line with SDTM's ratings.

I'd probably go a little lower on Theme. Hell Toy Story is a B- theme for me in general. So id probably have given TS4 a C/C+. It's still Toy story and it appeals to probably more people than it doesn't.

Wizard modes are rare. Walk around good arcade and watch people play pinball. How many did you see... yup zero. Im a fair player at best and good game involves a mini wizard mode for me. If i can stack a control room with a dinosaur and start chaos multiball its a good game. Total Isolation 1, cherry bomb, sauron team ups... now were cooking! Ive seen one final wizard mode in the games in my collection and my head was about to explode (Lost in the Zone). I'd personally like more of this~ I doubt I'll ever see a final wizard mode in a modern pin, and I sure wouldn't be upset if it was little more within reach.

All you guys that complain Toy Story 4 is too easy, idk you must be a hell of a lot better of a player than me. Zach had a really solid point, if TS4 is too easy so is every B/W.

Pinball has become so polarizing with everyone out to jump on one side or the other. I will never understand what someone would get out of running down something they don't like post after post in thread after thread.
-But i guess that's just a microcosm of todays society. Respect is demanded, while being respectful is in short supply.

Thanks for the video's boys keep em coming! ZMeny Hollywoodbone If anyone thinks they can do better, I'll believe it when i see it! Money wear your mouth is fellas!

#5893 3 days ago
Quoted from Darscot:

I thought this was going to be a commercial but I figured I would give it a go for old times sake. An hour and five minutes holy fuck is this a review or a late night infomercial. This is a hard nope for me. I just jumped to the end and to no ones surprise it's a B+.

Ahhhhh Im sorry to disappoint!!!! Your Lost World DMD coloring was probably going to be a C. Glad I could help you get that up to a B+

#5894 3 days ago
Quoted from DakotaMike:

I can't believe people are still posting the "biased shill, paid off by the manufacturers" comments. I mean this happens after every single review.
Are people just now coming to these conclusions? I don't get it. Zach has been a distro for a very long time now.
I find SDTM videos very entertaining, and Iove Zach and Greg's personalities and interactions. I like to hear what they think of different games, but I certainly don't use their videos as buying advice.

It’s good entertainment and they are good guys.

It’s like anything else, whether it be DR or any other pin, only a dopey idiot who can’t think for himself would get “triggered” by their reviews.

I much rather look at their video reviews than hear the stupid blather coming from the angry mob brigade.

They contribute LESS than Zero!

#5895 3 days ago
Quoted from ZMeny:

NEW SDTM! Toy Story 4 Pinball Review
Comment below on your experience with Jersey Jack Pinball's newest game!

Enjoyable.
Thanks for the show.

#5896 3 days ago
Quoted from Scandell:

B+
Another B+
Gotta say it. This video felt like a sales video. More so than any previous. You actually watched Pixar’s making of Toy story 4 videos just to be able to defend this choice. AI spiders…extra dirt and wear on the textures.
Theme A-. Come on!?
Greg Bone gives out a rant defending the shrewd business practices of JJP because they have to maximize profits!? Yikes.
Somewhere along the way…you guys lost your way. Did JJP give or discount to Greg that Toy Story machine? I doubt he bought it. I miss the early videos when he was like rest of us and had to save up for these machines…and had to choose where he put his limited funding.
Disappointed SDTM mega fan here. But hey…you sold some machines right?

Sorry you feel that way man. I only knew those things about ts4 because I researched trivia for last week’s stream with Joel to do giveaways. But, if you’d like it to be research just for the sake of shilling a game, then I guess that’ll work too.

#5897 3 days ago
Quoted from iceman44:

It’s good entertainment and they are good guys.
It’s like anything else, whether it be DR or any other pin, only a dopey idiot who can’t think for himself would get “triggered” by their reviews.
I much rather look at their video reviews than hear the stupid blather coming from the angry mob brigade.
They contribute LESS than Zero!

People just get hung up on the fact Zach is a distributor and have a hard time thinking for themselves. Is what it is, if I bought into mob mentality I wouldnt be enjoying Rush right now.

Zach should start selling watches next.

#5898 3 days ago

I liked it the review. It was entertaining. Good reasoning behind each of the grades. I wasn't expecting a fully objective, scientifically based and peer reviewed segment on TS4 pinball, maybe that's why I still enjoyed it.

I think the big Flip n Out Pinball ad at the beginning of each show should be a large enough clue to the uninitiated that there might be some conscious or unconscious bias involved in the reviews, so don't see a need for some disclaimer.

I agree though that "value" used to be discussed more when reviewing/comparing machines. Not in a "how it makes you feel" type of valuation, but a "how much it eats out of your bank account" valuation. I remember the "This or That" segments repeatedly mentioning cost when making choices.

For me it's two Stern Pros or one TS4? Or a Stern Premium + 2800.00 or TS4 LE? TS4 would have to make me feel REALLY good while playing to be the "that" choice in those scenarios. To each their own.

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