New! Dark mode!

Browsing Pinside at night? Getting tired of all the white? Switch to dark mode using the button in the top right (or CTRL-B)!

(Topic ID: 227859)

New Pin Owner, Newbie type question about wire connectors / soldering


By okgrak

1 year ago



Topic Stats

  • 13 posts
  • 8 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by wayout440
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

You

Linked Games

No games have been linked to this topic.

    Topic Gallery

    One image has been uploaded to this topic. (View topic image gallery).

    lever nut (resized).png

    #1 1 year ago

    I've just acquired my first pins ( went for one and ended up with two) and I'm doing some repairs to bring them up to good health. I consider myself technically and electronically proficient, but I wanted to run an idea by the board to check my sanity.

    My first repair is to fix the left slingshot assembly on my Getaway. I'm going to remove the assembly from the underside of the Playfield, rebuild it, and mount it back under the play field.

    I understand the usual strategy is to desolder the connectors, and then solder back in place once mounted to the underside.

    Is there any reason why I would not do this:

    -Cut the wires approx 2-3 inches from the connectorsto the coil and leave the solder joint in place.

    - Strip 1/8" of wire and attach a lever nut to the ends of the exposed copper. ( photo attached for reference)

    -Remove the assembly, repair/rebuild, and then simply attach the wires at the lever nut. The lever nut is rated for 400V, 32A, and weights practically nothing. They also attach to the wires very tightly and there is no risk of them dangling off. I've used them for many projects.

    This seems like a logical thing to do upon each repair ( but not to retrofit), and in the future if I were to have a problem with the same mechanism it would be a simple disconnect and repair. It also avoids having to solder and desolder inside of the machine in a less than ideal environment and angle. If I were to replace with a new assembly, I would simply solder the wires in advance from my bench and simply snap into place inside the machine.

    Thoughts?
    lever nut (resized).png

    #2 1 year ago

    From a technical standpoint it'd work, but any pinball tech is going to glare at you. (same with wire nuts or anything like that) If you don't want to resolder, the common way to do it is to use a molex connector: https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/categories.asp?cat=46

    #3 1 year ago
    Quoted from zacaj:

    From a technical standpoint it'd work, but any pinball tech is going to glare at you. (same with wire nuts or anything like that) If you don't want to resolder, the common way to do it is to use a molex connector: https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/categories.asp?cat=46

    Why would they glare at me? Is this just from a "purist" or "do it as it's always been done" perspective? Because I'm having a hard time finding any flaw in the logic of working this way.

    #4 1 year ago

    Man, when I first saw your thread title, I thought you were looking for me (NPO = New Pin Owner).
    To address your question, direct soldier joints are considered the best connections. Doing things like introducing insulated male/female clips, alligator clips, etc is seen as.....less than ideal connections.

    Not my law. It is what I seem to see here more and more.

    #5 1 year ago

    If the wires are in the connector, how can you confirm that there making a connection, and if you run into a problem, you can't see whats going on.
    It would just make it harder to trace a problem down.

    #6 1 year ago
    Quoted from wdennie:

    If the wires are in the connector, how can you confirm that there making a connection, and if you run into a problem, you can't see whats going on.
    It would just make it harder to trace a problem down.

    I agree with you, but the downside seems to be outweighed by the upside. As in you don't have to ever solder or desolder inside the machine or in a really tight location....

    I've also gone through 4 or 5 50 packs of these things working on various DIY projects. Never have an issue with one of them.

    #7 1 year ago

    Most failures happen at the connectors, by adding these, you just adding more links to cause a failure.
    If your in a tight location which is hard to get to, you have too options, remove the part your going to solder on, to a
    location that is easier to get to, or like Zacaj suggested use male/female molex connecters.
    Get example, check out HEP, and how he adds a modular Molex connection on games he restores.

    And welcome to the club.

    #8 1 year ago

    It’s perfectly fine from an electrical standpoint - for this one job -. It will work fine, it will probably hold through a couple of moves, hopefully it won’t fall off or cause an intermittent connection to begin when moving the game. It will be a pain in the butt when troubleshooting, either for you or for the next owner. Once you’ve owned a bunch of games you hate to see stuff like this because it makes it more of a hassle. What if you need to remove the thing? The pinball community here is pretty tight - we try not to screw each other over.

    #9 1 year ago
    Quoted from okgrak:

    Why would they glare at me? Is this just from a "purist" or "do it as it's always been done" perspective? Because I'm having a hard time finding any flaw in the logic of working this way.

    Because you're being lazy and using an ugly dangling connector instead of a factory one. Even adding a connector will get looks from some people but at least a molex is the proper connector for the job. Every connector is a failure point and adds resistance to the connection, etc. On my first project pin I added molex and I've never had to disconnect them. Connectors just aren't worth the effort. You don't remove components completely that often. Even for a complete mech rebuild you don't need to. The only time they're useful is when doing a full playfield swap.

    #10 1 year ago
    Quoted from zacaj:

    Because you're being lazy and using an ugly dangling connector instead of a factory one. Even adding a connector will get looks from some people but at least a molex is the proper connector for the job. Every connector is a failure point and adds resistance to the connection, etc. On my first project pin I added molex and I've never had to disconnect them. Connectors just aren't worth the effort. You don't remove components completely that often. Even for a complete mech rebuild you don't need to. The only time they're useful is when doing a full playfield swap.

    I guess fundamentally I'm overestimating how often I will do these kinds of repairs.

    #11 1 year ago
    Quoted from okgrak:

    Is there any reason why I would not do this:

    -Cut the wires approx 2-3 inches from the connectorsto the coil and leave the solder joint in place.

    - Strip 1/8" of wire and attach a lever nut to the ends of the exposed copper. ( photo attached for reference)

    Yes, this is considered to be a hack. While from an electrical standpoint (power wiring, lighting, etc...) these are probably fine; however with the shocks and vibrations from the playfield, especially around the flippers, these are going to fail. Ask yourself this...Why did Williams direct wire flipper coils and not even use Molex connectors?

    Another thing to consider, the coil itself will more than likely never fail, the best thing to do if you don't want to re-solder the connections is to just remove the 2 allen screws from the coil stop and leave the coil attached to the coil wiring harness. If you are doing a flipper rebuild, you will want to replace the coil stop anyway and its likely easier to remove with the flipper mech in the machine than on your bench, especially if someone in the past decided that using Locktite Red on it was a good idea.

    #12 1 year ago
    Quoted from Pin_Guy:

    Why did Williams direct wire flipper coils and not even use Molex connectors?

    .
    .
    W/B DIDN'T until Pinball 2K, then they started using .093 Molex Connectors on most (not all) major under PF Components.

    We have both Pin2K Games and I've never had a connection issue in either Game.

    #13 1 year ago
    Quoted from okgrak:

    I guess fundamentally I'm overestimating how often I will do these kinds of repairs.

    Probably. Think about it, ever open something like a 1938 radio that still works? Everything is soldered except that the tubes plug into sockets. Soldering is the most reliable form of wire connection when done properly. The primary reason connectors are in a pinball machine is for assembly....not really for troubleshooting or to facilitate future repairs. You want to solder when you can, and where required use only the proper connectors. The goal is to never have to do a repair in the future by making your repairs more reliable than what has failed, and to try not to add additional failure points. I haven't been in my five games to repair them since the initial overhaul when I aquired them.

    Promoted items from the Pinside Marketplace
    $ 20.00
    Playfield - Protection
    UpKick Pinball
    $ 12.00
    $ 1,000.00
    $ 35.00
    Cabinet - Decals
    Pinball Haus
    $ 17.00
    Playfield - Decals
    Metal-Mods
    $ 100.00
    Gameroom - Decorations
    The Flipper Room
    $ 35.00
    Playfield - Plastics
    Ramp-O-Matic
    $ 93.00
    $ 17.00
    From: $ 99.00
    Lighting - Under Cabinet
    Rock Custom Pinball
    $ 39.99
    Eproms
    Matt's Basement Arcade
    $ 5.00
    Playfield - Decals
    Doc's Pinball Shop
    $ 19.95
    Electronics
    Lermods
    $ 16.00
    $ 6,750.00
    Pinball Machine
    The Pinball Place
    $ 89.95
    Cabinet - Shooter Rods
    Super Skill Shot Shop
    £ 99.00
    Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
    PinballToys
    $ 9.95
    $ 30.40
    From: $ 5,999.99
    $ 5,999.00
    Pinball Machine
    Nitro Pinball Shop
    $ 99.00
    Cabinet - Toppers
    Bat-Signal Projector Out of stock
    Docquest Pinball Mods
    $ 35.00
    Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
    3D MODS
    $ 4.49
    Electronics
    Yorktown Arcade Supply
    $ 24.75
    Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
    The MOD Couple
    $ 279.95
    Lighting - Led
    Pin Stadium Pinball Mods
    $ 5,899.00
    Pinball Machine
    The Pinball Place
    $ 69.99
    Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
    Lighted Pinball Mods
    From: € 0.39
    Rubber/Silicone
    Scandinavian Pinball

    Hey there! Got a moment?

    Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run thanks to donations from our visitors? Please donate to Pinside, support the site and get anext to your username to show for it! Donate to Pinside