(Topic ID: 251224)

Orbitor 1 Spinning Bumper replacement - In Development

By Isochronic_Frost

4 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 95 posts
  • 33 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by Boof-Ed
  • Topic is favorited by 16 Pinsiders

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Topic poll

“Would you be interested in a new Spinning Bumper replacement unit? Estimated price $200”

  • One Spinning Bumper replacement unit 3 votes
    9%
  • A pair of replacement units 7 votes
    21%
  • Interested in foam bumper replacements rather than the whole unit 8 votes
    24%
  • Spinning bumper replacements & spare foam bumpers too 12 votes
    35%
  • Not interested, not a justifiable expense 4 votes
    12%

(34 votes)

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There are 95 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 2.
#51 3 years ago

Proof is in the pudding! I have always been serious about this project and I’m very proud to have some tangible developments.
Feast your eyes on the VERY FIRST EVER *NEW* Orbitor 1 Rotor Sensor board!

A HUGE thanks to pinfixer for making this possible.
These two are prototypes to test and ensure they are working properly.

Once we ensure these work flawlessly, they will go into production!

Pretty excited about these developments.
Once these are fully tested, we’ll talk about costs and offering just the Rotor Sensor board for sale.
Of course this is just one step, I’m still fully intent on building the entire motor assembly.
ORBITOR 1 WILL LIVE!

178120D4-0004-43CB-A53F-25473C9CA7D2.jpeg178120D4-0004-43CB-A53F-25473C9CA7D2.jpegD2DBF088-7792-4E90-AC68-7741A40C51E7.jpegD2DBF088-7792-4E90-AC68-7741A40C51E7.jpeg
#52 3 years ago

I need 1 but 2 please!!!! And then i just need the discs for one, but will buy 2.

You are a legend, i'll tell the tech not to make a new board.

#53 3 years ago

Awesome!!!!

#54 3 years ago

Just talked to Ken, he's already made the board for me, but he said the problem is it's missing the spinning shaft and opto reader disc. He can't make those.

Still in for two boards to keep the ball rolling so to speak until the shaft and disc becomes available.

#55 3 years ago
Quoted from punkin:

Just talked to Ken, he's already made the board for me, but he said the problem is it's missing the spinning shaft and opto reader disc. He can't make those.
Still in for two boards to keep the ball rolling so to speak until the shaft and disc becomes available.

The double axle will be an interesting part. I’ll make it happen somehow! I’m sure some small motor manufacturers like mentioned before will have options for me.

I’ve already got a second test machine volunteered to ensure redundancy in the results!
Wish me luck, this will be a moment of truth for my personal scratch built O1. Fingers crossed!

#56 3 years ago

Luck? You're my only hope at this stage.

AlreadyBetFourThousandOnYouToWinByAHeadPunkin

#57 3 years ago
Quoted from punkin:

Luck? You're my only hope at this stage.
AlreadyBetFourThousandOnYouToWinByAHeadPunkin

Oh these will definitely work! Even if we have to redesign the board, which I doubt.
Luck moreso for my franken-pin Orbitor. It’s using a Magic transformer, Lightening Harness and everything else is cobbled together by pieces and parts. Theoretically it’s all correct.

Pins don’t always care about theory, I’ve had Stern MPUs give up the ghost whenever they feel like it!

3 weeks later
#58 3 years ago
Quoted from MarkG:

If you just picked a robust off the shelf motor could you detect a ball hit by monitoring the current draw of the motor rather than reproducing the disc and opto board? The solution they chose in the 80s might not be the best choice today. Sensors and microcontrollers are hobby level technology these days and might be a lot cheaper and easier to sort out than having a custom motor made.
A quick search turned up a bunch of current sensing options at: http://henrysbench.capnfatz.com/henrys-bench/arduino-current-measurements/
I don't know what kind of current change the motor might show but this might be an easier approach if the sensor is sensitive enough.
Or, if any part of the rotor is visible, you might be able to build a tachometer with an IR LED and receiver and a microcontroller. This too might be easier than a custom motor.
I could help out if these options are interesting.
/Mark

I'm an EE, yes current draw would work and be very easy to implement. Even in analog electronics, although a PIC or other microcontroller could possibly make it more interesting. You could sent multiple pulses to the switch matrix based on the strength of the hit for example. I'd make a mod like this if I had the time, but my job never lets me have any free time anymore. I do plan to someday add some multicolored lighting under the playfield and have it key off the bumper hits. Maybe add undercab lighting. Could make for a cool effect. I know this game gets a lot of hate in the forums, but its always a favorite whenever we have guests.

#59 3 years ago

Yes, I could use some discs too. Motors, bumpers, discs, sensor boards, playfield, the bubble backglass cover, just about everything.

#60 3 years ago

Haven't checked the thread in a while but I was excited to see the pics of the new boards.
Keep up the good work

#61 3 years ago
Quoted from mamawaldee:

I'm an EE, yes current draw would work and be very easy to implement. Even in analog electronics, although a PIC or other microcontroller could possibly make it more interesting. You could sent multiple pulses to the switch matrix based on the strength of the hit for example. I'd make a mod like this if I had the time, but my job never lets me have any free time anymore. I do plan to someday add some multicolored lighting under the playfield and have it key off the bumper hits. Maybe add undercab lighting. Could make for a cool effect. I know this game gets a lot of hate in the forums, but its always a favorite whenever we have guests.

I haven’t updated yet but the boards were sent back for tweaking. The power was getting to the motor and everything was operating, but the bumpers weren’t scoring or registering at all. Unfortunately the horseshoe opto went obsolete basically when they made this game, so we tried 2 different styles you’ll notice. Neither worked.
We may have to switch the method we use regardless. We shall see. Hoping we can source a new opto but I will tell him that we can use something different, ie current sensing.

#62 3 years ago

Suggestion if changing board - how about sizing the test point hole for one of these? Most people testing these like clip on test points instead of just a pad. Probably black would fit best on that board -- part number TP104-01-00. Requires a 0.063" hole, they're about 10 cents each.

tp104-01-00 (resized).jpgtp104-01-00 (resized).jpg
3 months later
#63 3 years ago

Just an update letting you all there is not much progress being made currently. The pandemic has prevented my board-maker from getting access to the Orbitor 1 he has being using.

I figure maybe I can start getting some estimates for foam bumper replacement since I know that was a popular request.

#64 3 years ago

I'm still in. Thanks for the update.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.ChrisHiblerPinball.com/Contact ... for board repairs
http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info

1 month later
#65 3 years ago

if anyone is interested

PURE_PENALTY is selling new made up speech boards for stern inc orbitor 1

vsu (resized).pngvsu (resized).png
#66 3 years ago
Quoted from pug123:

if anyone is interested
PURE_PENALTY is selling new made up speech boards for stern inc orbitor 1
[quoted image]

That’s awesome, thanks for linking these! The VSU-1 was getting ridiculously hard to find and expensive! It’s great that it’s being reproduced now. Definitely gonna grab one.

#67 3 years ago

Link to where to buy? I can’t find them/ must be looking in wrong spot?

#69 3 years ago

thanks

#70 3 years ago

Thanks for posting! Order placed!

3 months later
#71 3 years ago

still watching this. I might be interested in replacement motors, but definitely interested in new foam bumpers.

#72 3 years ago

The pandemic really screwed my original plans, thanks for the reminder! It’s taking way longer than I wanted, my own Orbitor is still sitting out of commission, but now it’s time to go at it again.

#73 3 years ago
Quoted from Isochronic_Frost:

The pandemic really screwed my original plans

Me too! I was trying to get a part made... All good...all good... COVID!
Job DEAD.
Now tying to pick up the pieces and start over.

2 months later
#74 2 years ago

Work has restarted on this project! Never fear!

#75 2 years ago
Quoted from Isochronic_Frost:

Work has restarted on this project! Never fear!

I am in for spinning motors assemblies, and other remake parts as available!

#76 2 years ago
Quoted from Isochronic_Frost:

Unfortunately the horseshoe opto went obsolete basically when they made this game, so we tried 2 different styles you’ll notice. Neither worked.

I just repaired one of my original opto boards recently. This is the replacement that I used. I tested it first on the bench, observing the waveform with an o-scope, then placed it in the game and tested. It works well as a substitute. Be careful when installing. The pin 1 indication is different than the original, so you have to ignore that. Just install it with the emitter and detector on the correct side and it will work.

Optek Technology OPB866T51

Digikey 365-1747-ND

https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/tt-electronics-optek-technology/OPB866T51/1638054?s=N4IgTCBcDaIMwDYCsBaAjAdgCwZQOwBMQBdAXyA

#77 2 years ago
Quoted from Isochronic_Frost:

I don't know if anyone ever figured out if these were RPM sensitive or if it merely scored when it detected any sort of speed decrease.

I can answer this question. The circuit design is actually pretty ingenious. It's not sensitive to a specific RPM, it only detects a sudden decrease in RPM. I bench tested the board when I was repairing it. I used a function generator to simulate the square wave signal from the optical encoder. I tried different frequencies to represent different RPM values. The circuit will only trigger the switch matrix output when there is a sudden drop in frequency.

#78 2 years ago
Quoted from PinChatt:

I can answer this question. The circuit design is actually pretty ingenious. It's not sensitive to a specific RPM, it only detects a sudden decrease in RPM. I bench tested the board when I was repairing it. I used a function generator to simulate the square wave signal from the optical encoder. I tried different frequencies to represent different RPM values. The circuit will only trigger the switch matrix output when there is a sudden drop in frequency.

That’s what I figured! That is ingenious on Stern’s end. It’s a shame we didn’t see more of these bumpers.

#79 2 years ago

I spent some time this evening and created a 3D CAD model of the motor bracket. This is a 3D pdf rendering of the bracket assembly (includes the 2 press in studs to mount the PCB). Note that the original bracket has a tab that is spot welded on one flange. The tab has a threaded hole and a screw and nut were installed to help position the PCB so that the optical encoder disk can be centered in the opto sensor slot. You can see the tab and screw in the photo below. There is a better photo of the tab with the PCB in the very first post of this thread.

I didn't model the welded tab because I don't think it's really necessary and it will definitely add cost to the bracket fabrication. I can easily add it though if you think it is needed.

I still need to verify all the dimensions are modeled correctly and create a 2D drawing with manufacturing notes.
O1 Motor Bracket Assy R0.pdfO1 Motor Bracket Assy R0.pdfO1 Motor Bracket (resized).jpgO1 Motor Bracket (resized).jpg

#80 2 years ago
Quoted from PinChatt:

I spent some time this evening and created a 3D CAD model of the motor bracket. This is a 3D pdf rendering of the bracket assembly (includes the 2 press in studs to mount the PCB). Note that the original bracket has a tab that is spot welded on one flange. The tab has a threaded hole and a screw and nut were installed to help position the PCB so that the optical encoder disk can be centered in the opto sensor slot. You can see the tab and screw in the photo below. There is a better photo of the tab with the PCB in the very first post of this thread.
I didn't model the welded tab because I don't think it's really necessary and it will definitely add cost to the bracket fabrication. I can easily add it though if you think it is needed.
I still need to verify all the dimensions are modeled correctly and create a 2D drawing with manufacturing notes.
[quoted image][quoted image]

Excellent! I greatly appreciate this and look forward to submitting to the local fab place herbertbsharp mentioned as well as others to see how much it will cost. I’m very confident that we can get at least 50 sets committed to owners out there. These bumpers are failing left and right at this age. By finally producing them we can foster the love that Orbitor 1 deserves!

#81 2 years ago
Quoted from Isochronic_Frost:

Excellent! I greatly appreciate this and look forward to submitting to the local fab place herbertbsharp mentioned as well as others to see how much it will cost. I’m very confident that we can get at least 50 sets committed to owners out there. These bumpers are failing left and right at this age. By finally producing them we can foster the love that Orbitor 1 deserves!

Thanks!

What are your thoughts on that welded tab? Should I add it to the model, or leave it off?

#82 2 years ago

Good stuff fellas.

Rhetoricaly: How could one of these best be used in a homebrew pin? (Besides the obvious "making an O1 from scratch" that Mr. Frost is up to.)

Hmmmmmm...

#83 2 years ago

I'd probably grab a couple

2 months later
#84 2 years ago

I would be in for a motor and rubbers too
Just got an Orbitor. Thanks

5 months later
#85 2 years ago

Big update coming tomorrow!!

E921F0DA-06B4-4299-90B0-F39A861AC259.gifE921F0DA-06B4-4299-90B0-F39A861AC259.gif
1 week later
#86 2 years ago

Did I say tomorrow? I meant tomorrow next week!!
I visited PBR last Wednesday and talked with Steve. He approved my post of this info, however, please don’t hold him responsible for this endeavor which is my undertaking. He will NOT be remaking anything for this, however he was getting pricing for BRAND NEW motors from Multiproducts.

We talked a lot about pricing and quantity, so I hope everyone who responded to my poll was serious.
These motors will be pretty damn expensive, I’m not gonna lie. This will take some time, but Steve is willing to work with me securing the motors then I will make complete assemblies.

If you want your original motors rebuilt, Steve can do that for you, he rebuilds them and does a fantastic job. However if you want complete assemblies, stay tuned.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Right now the plan is to price out motors and get a committed number for interest. I have learned an incredible amount from Steve. After explaining some of the roadblocks I’ve encounter he offered such simple, 5-second solutions. I don’t see any further “issues” at this point aside from the minor opto difficulties (which Steve also has a solution for). It’s now a matter of actually getting these parts ordered and fabricated.

The rotational motors are actually different, so I was wrong. Apologies.
There is a clockwise and counter-clockwise motor. We’ll order half of each. Steve suggested 25 of each. I suggested 50, it is reasonable to me that many owners would buy complete replacements just to be safe because I highly doubt we will ever make more unless demand really goes vertical!

The only thing Steve isn’t interested in is the foam spinning bumper itself. The minimum quantities are an issue. We are seriously gonna be stuck with a crapload of these foam things if we order them. Right now, it’s not a concern of mine, if we have to order 500 foam bumpers, so be it. Hope you guys like spares!!

*At this point the plan is for me to create the assemblies, Steve has no interest and will not do it, period.*

#87 2 years ago
Quoted from Isochronic_Frost:

Did I say tomorrow? I meant tomorrow next week!!
I visited PBR last Wednesday and talked with Steve. He approved my post of this info, however, please don’t hold him responsible for this endeavor which is my undertaking. He will NOT be remaking anything for this, however he was getting pricing for BRAND NEW motors from Multiproducts.
We talked a lot about pricing and quantity, so I hope everyone who responded to my poll was serious.
These motors will be pretty damn expensive, I’m not gonna lie. This will take some time, but Steve is willing to work with me securing the motors then I will make complete assemblies.
If you want your original motors rebuild, Steve can do that for you, he rebuilds them and does a fantastic job. However if you want complete assemblies, stay tuned.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Right now the plan is to price out motors and get a committed number for interest. I have learned an incredible amount from Steve. After explaining some of the roadblocks I’ve encounter he offered such simple, 5-second solutions. I don’t see any further “issues” at this point aside from the minor opto difficulties (which Steve also has a solution for). It’s now a matter of actually getting these parts ordered and fabricated.
The rotational motors are actually different, so I was wrong. Apologies.
There is a clockwise and counter-clockwise motor. We’ll order half of each. Steve suggested 25 of each. I suggested 50, it is reasonable to me that many owners would buy complete replacements just to be safe because I highly doubt we will ever make more unless demand really goes vertical!
The only thing Steve isn’t interested in is the foam spinning bumper itself. The minimum quantities are an issue. We are seriously gonna be stuck with a crapload of these foam things if we order them. Right now, it’s not a concern of mine, if we have to order 500 foam bumpers, so be it. Hope you guys like spares!!
*At this point the plan is for me to create the assemblies, Steve has no interest and will not do it, period.*

I have been following this thread. It is impressive that you have made it this far and with a solution in sight.

Bravo

1 week later
#88 2 years ago
Quoted from Isochronic_Frost:

Did I say tomorrow? I meant tomorrow next week!!
I visited PBR last Wednesday and talked with Steve. He approved my post of this info, however, please don’t hold him responsible for this endeavor which is my undertaking. He will NOT be remaking anything for this, however he was getting pricing for BRAND NEW motors from Multiproducts.
We talked a lot about pricing and quantity, so I hope everyone who responded to my poll was serious.
These motors will be pretty damn expensive, I’m not gonna lie. This will take some time, but Steve is willing to work with me securing the motors then I will make complete assemblies.
If you want your original motors rebuilt, Steve can do that for you, he rebuilds them and does a fantastic job. However if you want complete assemblies, stay tuned.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Right now the plan is to price out motors and get a committed number for interest. I have learned an incredible amount from Steve. After explaining some of the roadblocks I’ve encounter he offered such simple, 5-second solutions. I don’t see any further “issues” at this point aside from the minor opto difficulties (which Steve also has a solution for). It’s now a matter of actually getting these parts ordered and fabricated.
The rotational motors are actually different, so I was wrong. Apologies.
There is a clockwise and counter-clockwise motor. We’ll order half of each. Steve suggested 25 of each. I suggested 50, it is reasonable to me that many owners would buy complete replacements just to be safe because I highly doubt we will ever make more unless demand really goes vertical!
The only thing Steve isn’t interested in is the foam spinning bumper itself. The minimum quantities are an issue. We are seriously gonna be stuck with a crapload of these foam things if we order them. Right now, it’s not a concern of mine, if we have to order 500 foam bumpers, so be it. Hope you guys like spares!!
*At this point the plan is for me to create the assemblies, Steve has no interest and will not do it, period.*

Correction on the previous info. Steve DOES NOT rebuild motors. He said these ones for Orbitor 1 are awful and take way too much work.
Your only option will be to buy new motors from me or Steve, once I put together the order, he’ll have a few for stock.

We discussed the project a bit more as well. The new run of motors won’t be plug and play. You need to transfer the aluminum block and pin at that top of the shaft that the bumper attaches too. They will not come like that from the factory. It was a custom-milled part Stern attached themselves.
These spinner bumpers are gonna be quite the adventure to make. Prices is not cheap!! Multiproducts also changed the minimum from 50 to 100.

Still moving forward at this point!

#89 2 years ago

Keep us posted!

#90 2 years ago

Still interested in backups. And very interested in foam bumpers

2 months later
#91 1 year ago

Any updates? I sent you a pm Isochronic_Frost but have not heard back from you.

1 month later
#92 1 year ago

I read through this thread and I'm excited that this is still progressing slowly. Is there any update on where things are now?

Also are replacement bushings available for the original motor? One of mine has a pretty bad wobble now and I don't want to damage the opto running it.

2 weeks later
#93 1 year ago

Any update, good or bad, on the progress would be appreciated.

2 weeks later
#94 1 year ago

Update for transparency:
I’m working on opening a barcade locally, and that’s been my main focus for the past couple months. We are opening next week, and I’ve fixed up most my pending pinball projects to route at the barcade!

Thankfully this has cleared out the workshop and Orbitor 1 will take priority. My partner has also been grilling me about it, and very badly wants to play it!

There hasn’t been any meaningful progress made on the Orbitor 1 motor replacements, since my last post. I’ve been trying to locate whoever “Phoenix pinball” is that had reproduced those Opto boards posted earlier in my other thread. https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/orbitor-1-a-scratch-build-reaching-for-the-stars/page/4#post-6339766

Other than that, the earnings on these route games can help fund this endeavor. It’s quite expensive for all these materials and motors, and because of the complicated timeline of the past few years, I won’t be taking any sort of money or payment for these until they’re plug-and-play ready.

2 months later
#95 1 year ago

Just got my O1 back and I’m definitely in need of the bumpers. The motors still work but I’m sure it’s only a matter of time before they don’t so another interested party here.

There are 95 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 2.

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