New Mod: TRON Interactive Backboard Display

https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-PKKP5Dm/0/X2/i-PKKP5Dm-X2.jpg

Quoted from Ashram56:
If so that would be an interesting development. I've not hooked up my logic analyzer to this bus, as my understanding based on the schematics was that it was a control bus for the power board, and therefore would not reflect the game status. But I could be wrong.
(and no I'm not in the mod business, just like to tinker and understand how this all works)

You probably know more than me Just for reference here is a picture of the Eli board installed:

#52 2 years ago

FRX

Frax

Pinside member

Conyers, GA

12y 103K 16,662 2 9

OP
Quoted from Compy:
2. What about my lightcycles?
Our mod can still function very well with the Hallmark Light Cycles in front, but we're also designing alternate brackets so that they can be moved farther to the sides for those that wish to keep them out of the way

Ha, called it. Nice.

#53 2 years ago

VNQ

Ashram56

Pinside+ Frequent

3y 52,800 1,231

Quoted from snakesnsparklers:
You probably know more than me Just for reference here is a picture of the Eli board installed:
https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-PKKP5Dm/0/X2/i-PKKP5Dm-X2.jpg

Thanks,

Would you mind providing the reference of the big integrated circuit in the middle of the board ? The square one. I suspect it's a CPLD/FPGA, but could be wrong.

Also, I would appreciate if you could capture a video of the fiber optics behaviour according to gameplay. Does it react to multiball status, various switch, etc ? From what I understand this bus is an output of the CPU board, so it's used to drive inserts/flashers/coils. It should not read switches, unless again it does output somehow game status (in which case, if your video proves that point, I will definitely connect my logic analyzer to it)

But I don't want to hijack this thread

Cheers

#54 2 years ago

MOO

snakesnsparklers

Pinside member

Quoted from Ashram56:
Thanks,
Would you mind providing the reference of the big integrated circuit in the middle of the board ? The square one. I suspect it's a CPLD/FPGA, but could be wrong.
Also, I would appreciate if you could capture a video of the fiber optics behaviour according to gameplay. Does it react to multiball status, various switch, etc ? From what I understand this bus is an output of the CPU board, so it's used to drive inserts/flashers/coils. It should not read switches, unless again it does output somehow game status (in which case, if your video proves that point, I will definitely connect my logic analyzer to it)
But I don't want to hijack this thread
Cheers

PMing you

#55 2 years ago

PNX

xeneize

Pinside+ Frequent

11y 104K 1,418

This mod looks fantastic. If we can find a way to integrate the moving Recognizer, I'd be "in".

#56 2 years ago

BEN

Chosen_S

Pinside+ Frequent

10y 113K 6,296

Beautiful mod, way to go!

Nitpicking things I’d want fixed before I drop $5 bills, not complete deal breakers. Just polishing…

The Jack Pot not being one word, animation needs attention

The animations spinning in circles made me feel a little seasick, maybe slow them down a little?

The white washed with LCD screens has been a thorn in our sides for years, changing that angle a little bit might be a good idea, you’ve already been hammered with that one, sorry

Any daft punk multiball animations for the LE’s??

Maybe another option for the LE’s is to use a smaller screen and mount it somewhere else on the play field?… Just spit-balling on that one

Beautiful idea, execution, and feedback

Edit: to preface... I’m an LE owner, I’ve spared no expense on this machine to have it the best I think I can get mine, including a professional custom music package, 3 sub woofers, and every tasteful mod that I could justify putting in the machine, I also built a Flynn sign for a topper that Hovers above the machine. It’s my favorite machine, just want this to be oh so perfect, that I can’t resist

#57 2 years ago

???

littlecammi

Pinside member

Carol Stream, IL

11y 82,650 4,535 19

Quoted from Chosen_S:
It’s my favorite machine. Just want this to be so perfect that I can’t resist.

I understand. Many mods are called, but few are Chosen.

#58 2 years ago

CPY

Compy

Quoted from xeneize:
This mod looks fantastic. If we can find a way to integrate the moving Recognizer, I'd be "in".

Working on that very thing right now!

Quoted from Chosen_S:
The Jack Pot not being one word, animation needs attention

We're re-rendering that animation as one word. All the other multiballs have it as one word. Upon seeing it a second/third time, it got annoying to me too

Quoted from Chosen_S:
The white washed with LCD screens has been a thorn in our sides for years, changing that angle a little bit might be a good idea, you’ve already been hammered with that one, sorry

We take everything constructively! We're addressing the issue on both the angle of the display and the panel's on screen adjustments.

Quoted from Chosen_S:
Any daft punk multiball animations for the LE’s??

Of course! We wouldn't leave you out in the cold.
Screenshot from 2021-07-20 17-44-13 (resized).png

Quoted from Chosen_S:
Maybe another option for the LE’s is to use a smaller screen and mount it somewhere else on the play field?… Just spit-balling on that one

We have a million different screen sizes after doing the work for our Twilight Zone run. This is indeed something that was considered, but reorganizing the moving recognizer into a more compact assembly gives us more options (including providing it to people with pro games). We're also re-manufacturing the interactive EL wire ramp kits, but one step at a time.

These are all fantastic points (from everyone!), and we definitely take them to heart. Where practical, or critical for the game experience, we'll make adjustments and improvements. I sincerely appreciate it.

#59 2 years ago

DAD

Sijcolo

Pinside member

Golden, CO

9y 79,300 646

Great looking mod. I’m in.

#60 2 years ago

BEN

Chosen_S

Pinside+ Frequent

10y 113K 6,296

OP
Quoted from Compy:
Working on that very thing right now!

We're re-rendering that animation as one word. All the other multiballs have it as one word. Upon seeing it a second/third time, it got annoying to me too

We take everything constructively! We're addressing the issue on both the angle of the display and the panel's on screen adjustments.

Of course! We wouldn't leave you out in the cold.
[quoted image]

We have a million different screen sizes after doing the work for our Twilight Zone run. This is indeed something that was considered, but reorganizing the moving recognizer into a more compact assembly gives us more options (including providing it to people with pro games). We're also re-manufacturing the interactive EL wire ramp kits, but one step at a time.
These are all fantastic points (from everyone!), and we definitely take them to heart. Where practical, or critical for the game experience, we'll make adjustments and improvements. I sincerely appreciate it.

I can’t wait for you to have such an awesome product, super excited to see what you come up with! Thank you for addressing all of the facets

#61 2 years ago

KJM

KevInBuffalo

Buffalo Pinball

11y 131K 3,186 11

OP
Quoted from Compy:
We have a million different screen sizes after doing the work for our Twilight Zone run. This is indeed something that was considered, but reorganizing the moving recognizer into a more compact assembly gives us more options (including providing it to people with pro games).

Moving recognizer on the pro? You can proactively sign me up for one of those

#62 2 years ago

Blacktoothgrin

Pinside member

8y 33,650 46

Well after owning for 8 years and 3 years of no mods for this pin. Thinking what else could be added. This happens. Of course I pre ordered! Can't wait. Thanks Mr_Tantrum for the heads up!

#63 2 years ago

F W

AUKraut

WilliPinball

7y 113K 2,788

Quoted from KevInBuffalo:
Moving recognizer on the pro? You can proactively sign me up for one of those

Amen to that!!!

#64 2 years ago

???

chrishoyle99

Pinside member

Unknown

5y 25,650 68

OP
Quoted from Compy:
Working on that very thing right now!

We're re-rendering that animation as one word. All the other multiballs have it as one word. Upon seeing it a second/third time, it got annoying to me too

We take everything constructively! We're addressing the issue on both the angle of the display and the panel's on screen adjustments.

Of course! We wouldn't leave you out in the cold.
[quoted image]

We have a million different screen sizes after doing the work for our Twilight Zone run. This is indeed something that was considered, but reorganizing the moving recognizer into a more compact assembly gives us more options (including providing it to people with pro games). We're also re-manufacturing the interactive EL wire ramp kits, but one step at a time.
These are all fantastic points (from everyone!), and we definitely take them to heart. Where practical, or critical for the game experience, we'll make adjustments and improvements. I sincerely appreciate it.

just ordered this great mod - also would definitely be in for a moving recognizer and EL wire ramp kit - keep these great mods coming...

#65 2 years ago

???

chrishoyle99

Pinside member

Unknown

5y 25,650 68

just an idea, if there could be a 'deluxe' version of the moving recognizer, with maybe 2 motors which enables a small rotation as well as left and right movement - so when the recognizer gets close to the extremities of it's movement it could gradually pitch / rotate to give a realistic movement (similar to the film). Totally happy to order just a left / right moving recognizer, but just an idea for a possible uber cool enhancement.

#66 2 years ago

FPG

luvthatapex2

Pinside member

North Wales, PA

11y 129K 5,772 7 100

I think you mean fiber optic ramp kits? Good to hear! Those kits have been NLA for a long time.

OP
Quoted from Compy:
Working on that very thing right now!
We're also re-manufacturing the interactive EL wire ramp kits, but one step at a time.
These are all fantastic points (from everyone!), and we definitely take them to heart. Where practical, or critical for the game experience, we'll make adjustments and improvements. I sincerely appreciate it.

#67 2 years ago

CPY

Compy

Quoted from luvthatapex2:
I think you mean fiber optic ramp kits? Good to hear! Those kits have been NLA for a long time.

Ah, good correction! Yes, fiber optic ramp kits, just like the original.

#68 2 years ago

SES

u2sean

Pinside member

Madison, WI

12y 71,900 698 18

Alright, my favorite game of all time. I'm IN! This seriously looks incredible - well done! Since I have a TZ and have been procrastinating ordering that one, I figured I'd just get that too while I was at it.

#69 2 years ago

???

chrishoyle99

Pinside member

Unknown

5y 25,650 68

OP
Quoted from Compy:
Ah, good correction! Yes, fiber optic ramp kits, just like the original.

Just checking, your fibre optic ramp kits can be fitted to the PRO version?

#70 2 years ago

VNQ

Ashram56

Pinside+ Frequent

3y 52,800 1,231

To clarify, will the recognizer fixture for Pros and the new fiber optic mod require the Pinvision mod, or will they be independent?

Regards

1 week later

#71 2 years ago

JWB

Venetic

Pinside+ Frequent

Already put in a preorder, but if you need any help testing on another Tron in Austin, I can help

#72 2 years ago

NYB

planters49

Pinside member

12y 48,400 481

I have the Twilight Zone mod and was about to preorder the Tron mod, but will have to wait until they get the moving recognizer toy issue fixed since that is a key item that makes the Tron LE a Tron LE. The animations on the mod look really awesome though.

#73 2 years ago

MOO

snakesnsparklers

Pinside member

I would love it to include a bracket or something to relocate just the right side lightcycle. I don't think the left side cycle is going to block much of the screen but I need to see more video of it in action behind the actual cycles to be sure.

#74 2 years ago

VNQ

Ashram56

Pinside+ Frequent

3y 52,800 1,231

As asked before, It would also be good to clarify if the upcoming mods adding a moving recognizer and fiber optics to a Tron Pro are going to require the interactive backboard, or will be independent

Regards

#75 2 years ago

FRX

Frax

Pinside member

Conyers, GA

12y 103K 16,662 2 9

OP
Quoted from Compy:
This is indeed something that was considered, but reorganizing the moving recognizer into a more compact assembly gives us more options (including providing it to people with pro games).

You son of a bitch!

If you do that, I'll HAVE to buy one, and I don't even own a Tron anymore! (But would like to someday.)

#76 2 years ago

DAD

MK6PIN

Pinside+ Pro!

11y 164K 13,478 1

Ahh Jimmy,

Just saw this post..TRON!!! My LE thanks you….backboard kit ordered….

Edit - Eek… not so much worried about the light cycles as suspect they will still look fine. Gonna have to check the moving recognizer thing though. That thing is badass and hoping something can be sorted there….

#77 2 years ago

CPY

Compy

Good evening all, Happy Friday! Hope everyone has a cold one and is relaxing in their gamerooms!

Progress Update:

1. We ordered most of the parts for the electronics today. We've been stockpiling some of the more scarce components over the past few months and have those already.

2. Our wonderful wonderful plastics fabricator up in Dallas sent us some sample prints today. We got questions over the past week or so about matching the plastics with the side blades that certain folks had. We think we have a design that works with or without art blades and it's attached here.

3. A few have asked "Why the September ship date? What you have looks nearly done!" - We need the next few weeks to test prototypes and installation with a few early adopters. There we can identify any deficiencies with electronics, cabling or mechanical assemblies. When we shipped Twilight Zone, the mod had about 6 weeks of burn in and stability testing.

PXL_20210731_003112256 (resized).jpg
PXL_20210731_003121780 (resized).jpg
PXL_20210731_003205115 (resized).jpg
PXL_20210731_003225712 (resized).jpg
PXL_20210731_003246969 (resized).jpg

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We've also got some updated animations (and fixed some too)!

Screenshot from 2021-07-30 19-49-55 (resized).png
Screenshot from 2021-07-30 19-50-15 (resized).png

Screenshot from 2021-07-30 19-52-18 (resized).png
Screenshot from 2021-07-30 19-52-57 (resized).png
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Screenshot from 2021-07-30 19-51-35 (resized).png

Screenshot from 2021-07-30 19-55-52 (resized).png
Screenshot from 2021-07-30 19-53-41 (resized).png
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Quoted from Venetic:
Already put in a preorder, but if you need any help testing on another Tron in Austin, I can help

I couldn't send a PM fast enough! Thank you for volunteering, it's great to have someone local as well. Other props to pinlynx for beta testing as well!

Quoted from planters49:
I have the Twilight Zone mod and was about to preorder the Tron mod, but will have to wait until they get the moving recognizer toy issue fixed since that is a key item that makes the Tron LE a Tron LE. The animations on the mod look really awesome though.

Understood. We'll keep you posted. All the animation props to Sjsilver here - He's done a fantastic job, and we can't wait to see what he does

Quoted from Ashram56:
As asked before, It would also be good to clarify if the upcoming mods adding a moving recognizer and fiber optics to a Tron Pro are going to require the interactive backboard, or will be independent
Regards

Sorry I missed your last post about it! Fiber optics and moving recognizer wouldn't require the purchase of a Pinvision. However Pinvision customers would be given early access to those mods. I've ordered the drive assemblies to start testing on this.

Quoted from Frax:
You son of a bitch!
If you do that, I'll HAVE to buy one, and I don't even own a Tron anymore! (But would like to someday.)

Hah, we can make one to sit on your desk and move! We definitely don't want to take anything away from game owners for sure! I think you guys will love it.

Quoted from MK6PIN:
Ahh Jimmy,
Just saw this post..TRON!!! My LE thanks you….backboard kit ordered….
Edit - Eek… not so much worried about the light cycles as suspect they will still look fine. Gonna have to check the moving recognizer thing though. That thing is badass and hoping something can be sorted there….

Thank you so much! We do have some brackets planned for the light cycles and we're definitely sorting out the recognizer! The good news is there's plenty of vertical space and mounting points for the drive unit I have in mind.

Thank you everyone again! The response has been overwhelming, but keep the questions coming. Thank you both Titan_Pinball and Sjsilver for all your help!

-- Jimmy

#78 2 years ago

KJM

KevInBuffalo

Buffalo Pinball

11y 131K 3,186 11

Now that’s what I’m talking about. Love that art surrounding the monitor. Nice work!!

#79 2 years ago

MSW

ToucanF16

Pinside+ Frequent

10y 122K 5,195

Compy thanks for this phenomenal update.
I have a Tron LE. One question (and sorry if it’s already been answered). Are you shipping just one version that works with or without the moving recognizer or will there be separate versions of TRON Interactive Backboard Display?

#80 2 years ago

SMP

shaunpurslow

Pinside member

Fort Myers, FL

3y 39,050 81 8

As a fairly new Tron owner I can't tell you how happy I am to hear that you are working on a new fiberoptic ramp kit. Not being able to find those anywhere and having to deal with less than satisfying, unchanging and very dim EL wire is frustrating. I have already ordered your backboard display and I will be there on day one to order your fibreoptic kit. Thank you for all that you do!

#81 2 years ago

FRX

Frax

Pinside member

Conyers, GA

12y 103K 16,662 2 9

OP
Quoted from Compy:
plastics fabricator up in Dallas

Okay, is it Eric, or Chaz? LOL. If they're printing plastics like this, I need to talk to them about my Crescendo plastics...

#82 2 years ago

TWC

Da_Topper

Pinside member

11y 39,050 350

Is this going to be a limited run or time frame to get? How will this work if you have a ton of mods? I already run an extra power supply. Here’s a list of mods on my game. Lit Clu ship, light cycles, Recognizer, Flynn sign, arcade cabinet, scoop, speaker lights, back glass animated, flipper buttons, shooter housing, 3 bank, LED Flipper bats, EL instruction cards, EL Zuse figure with cane, color dmd, shaker motor, and Eli fiber optic kit.

1 month later

#83 2 years ago

MOO

snakesnsparklers

Pinside member

How is this coming along? Any details on the re-positioned light cycle mounting brackets? Can't wait to see this in action!

#84 2 years ago

JWB

Venetic

Pinside+ Frequent

Hey Folks! Compy was kind enough to drop by and help install a prototype of the mod in our Tron, and we did an impromptu stream to show it off! It can be a little dim/hard to see, best view is towards the last 1/4 of the stream after i moved the camera around a bit. We plan to stream this again soon with some updated clips and i will probably have a direct hdmi feed to show off the animations more clearly. So far it looks super super awesome in there. I voiced my own feedback for initial improvements and plan to put some good testing on it. Vod can be found here: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1146139499 (Warning, we are not a kid friendly stream, lots of language going on!)

#85 2 years ago

CHP

ChipScott

Pinside+ Frequent

Jackson, TN

7y 97,550 1,237 2 76

Quoted from Venetic:
Hey Folks! Compy was kind enough to drop by and help install a prototype of the mod in our Tron, and we did an impromptu stream to show it off! It can be a little dim/hard to see, best view is towards the last 1/4 of the stream after i moved the camera around a bit. We plan to stream this again soon with some updated clips and i will probably have a direct hdmi feed to show off the animations more clearly. So far it looks super super awesome in there. I voiced my own feedback for initial improvements and plan to put some good testing on it. Vod can be found here: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1146139499 (Warning, we are not a kid friendly stream, lots of language going on!)

That does look really awesome.
Glad that I scored a preoder spot, can't wait!

#86 2 years ago

CPY

Compy

Good morning all,

Major major major thanks to Venetic for having me on the stream. It was a crazy last minute decision as I had just intended to install the test unit and get some things going. Jordan and Becca (and cats) are gracious hosts and borderline insane pinball fans. The test went exceptionally well and we got some great feedback. Here's where we stand:

1. Printed circuit boards are done!
2. Software is done, we're just rolling in a few more video updates!
3. Anti-glare investigation - TRON has a ton of cool white GI, and to get the most out of the monitor, I'm looking for options to apply anti glare adhesives/plastic to the front. Our standard plastic is reverse printed PET-G.
4. I've swapped the monitors from standard TFT displays over to IPS displays. The only issue here is that IPS displays are a bit dimmer than their TFT counterparts which allows for greater dark contrast. While you can see the display clearly in-person, streaming it is hard due to glare and lower bright levels. But the picture is 10x better. We're getting more out there and getting more feedback.
5. Stern has quite a few DMD power options, so we're making more cable harnesses to accommodate that.
6. Finishing up light bar PCB design! We've got a strip of lights mounted to the top so you don't lose those back lights/flasher action.
7. Brackets! Got some final measurements yesterday to send those out.

More out the door next week!
-- Jimmy

#87 2 years ago

RSG

tatman9999

Pinside+ Frequent

Lisle, IL

14y 113K 4,655 48 31

Looks awesome. Can’t wait for them to ship.

#88 2 years ago

JOE

evileye

Pinside+ Frequent

10y 68,800 926

How did I miss this thread?! Simply outstanding. Goes with the theme perfectly. Definitely looking forward to see how you incorporate the moving recognizer for us LE owners.

#89 2 years ago

SMC

smoothbore19

Pinside member

6y 48,550 796

Ordered, looks 100 times better than a color dmd.

#90 2 years ago

RBM

RobbyIRL5

Pinside+ Frequent

4y 73,300 974 18 31 2

OP
Quoted from Compy:
Good morning all,
Major major major thanks to Venetic for having me on the stream. It was a crazy last minute decision as I had just intended to install the test unit and get some things going. Jordan and Becca (and cats) are gracious hosts and borderline insane pinball fans. The test went exceptionally well and we got some great feedback. Here's where we stand:
1. Printed circuit boards are done!
2. Software is done, we're just rolling in a few more video updates!
3. Anti-glare investigation - TRON has a ton of cool white GI, and to get the most out of the monitor, I'm looking for options to apply anti glare adhesives/plastic to the front. Our standard plastic is reverse printed PET-G.
4. I've swapped the monitors from standard TFT displays over to IPS displays. The only issue here is that IPS displays are a bit dimmer than their TFT counterparts which allows for greater dark contrast. While you can see the display clearly in-person, streaming it is hard due to glare and lower bright levels. But the picture is 10x better. We're getting more out there and getting more feedback.
5. Stern has quite a few DMD power options, so we're making more cable harnesses to accommodate that.
6. Finishing up light bar PCB design! We've got a strip of lights mounted to the top so you don't lose those back lights/flasher action.
7. Brackets! Got some final measurements yesterday to send those out.
More out the door next week!
-- Jimmy

Is the moving rectifier part of this package? I know I read you were looking into it. Looks great so far!

1 week later

#91 2 years ago

SMC

smoothbore19

Pinside member

6y 48,550 796

Is this still going to ship in September.

#92 2 years ago

CPY

Compy

Quoted from smoothbore19:
Is this still going to ship in September.

Yep, we've been testing these with some alpha testers and early buyers over this month. Here's where we're at:

1. Stern has about 3 different ways they power some of their components like DMDs depending on whether or not the game was an LE, Pro or an export. We've ordered new harnesses and adapters to make this plug and play.
2. Everyone is getting an upgraded IPS display. Through testing, we found that IPS displays deliver a much better color depth, so we're waiting on those to arrive.
3. We're experimenting with anti glare plastic. We had a test unit on the Fliptronic Twitch stream and the glare was a lot. I know to many this won't matter, but we're looking at it as an option. These have been printed and packed.
4. PCBs and software are done.

So, as soon as the displays and plastics get in, more units will ship out. Otherwise, the CNC machine is cooking and we're cutting panels and shipping more each week with the inventory we currently have (we had some IPS test panels on hand and plastics).

If people want to know where they are in the queue, feel free to DM me and I'll get you any and all info! The good news is that we've been able to make vast improvements with the test units in the field.

-- Jimmy

#93 2 years ago

SMC

smoothbore19

Pinside member

6y 48,550 796

Sounds good. Thank you for the reply

1 week later

#94 2 years ago

SMP

shaunpurslow

Pinside member

Fort Myers, FL

3y 39,050 81 8

Jimmy sent an awesome email out this morning updating on the progress. He covered many things but what jumped out the most to me was the before and after of the IPS Display upgrade. The darker blacks and reflection removal is crazy. I am super excited and can't wait to see it in person.

IPS Before and after (resized).png

#95 2 years ago

KJM

KevInBuffalo

Buffalo Pinball

11y 131K 3,186 11

Quoted from shaunpurslow:
Jimmy sent an awesome email out this morning updating on the progress. He covered many things but what jumped out the most to me was the before and after of the IPS Display upgrade. The darker blacks and reflection removal is crazy. I am super excited and can't wait to see it in person. [quoted image]

That looks way better. Nice work!

1 month later

#96 2 years ago

SMP

shaunpurslow

Pinside member

Fort Myers, FL

3y 39,050 81 8

Hi Jimmy,

Just popping in to see if you had an update for November.

Cheers!

#97 2 years ago

MOO

snakesnsparklers

Pinside member

I would also love to see an update, these look like they are very close to shipping?

#98 2 years ago

JCD

Analogkid

Pinside+ Frequent

Adel, IA

11y 55,100 78 4

I'm so late to the party on this....but I don't think I've been this excited since the machine originally came out!!! I'm totally in!!

#99 2 years ago

JWB

Venetic

Pinside+ Frequent

I can't speak to any specific updates, but Jimmy currently has my Tron at his place and is making sure everything is working and looking good for me to take it to Houston arcade expo this weekend to show off! I can say the anti-glare plastic works very well at cutting down reflections. If Jimmy doesn't snap any pics or video, I'll be sure to do so soon!

#100 2 years ago

JWB

Venetic

Pinside+ Frequent