(Topic ID: 11275)

New member, quick ethics question.


By XedMada

7 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 43 posts
  • 26 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 7 years ago by Jgel
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

You

Linked Games

No games have been linked to this topic.

    Topic poll

    “What should I do with my knowledge of an extra ball bug?”

    • Let Stern know directly and tell no one else. 5 votes
      15%
    • Post it here for all to enjoy until its patched. 25 votes
      74%
    • Tell no one, use it to get a high score, laugh maniacally. 4 votes
      12%

    (34 votes)

    Topic Gallery

    One image has been uploaded to this topic. (View topic image gallery).

    129184399445261342.jpg

    #1 7 years ago

    Hi All! First post to pinside, love it so far.

    Im relatively new to the pinball obsession. I credit last year's Texas Pinball Festival in combination with a friends acquisition of a Fire Power for my, uh, "awakening?" Since then I have been happily obsessed and even got the lady more obsessed with playing than I am.

    I recently discovered what I believe to be a bug in a newer Stern machine that reliably gives the player an extra ball when it shouldn't. Some quick searching leads me to believe no one knows about it, and I haven't decided what to do with this knowledge. I thought id create a poll to see what the community thinks.

    #2 7 years ago

    *sigh*

    #4 7 years ago

    Prob hitting the add-a-ball target. Or playing a game that was never updated.

    #5 7 years ago

    Really? Have I already committed a faux pas in my first post? Or is the notion of asking what I should do so unbearably boring that it doesn't warrant a post? I'm new to the community, and honestly curious as to what the culture would expect here.

    An no, its not hitting the add-a-ball, and im quite certain the software on the machine has been updated in the past few months. Im new to the pinball community, not technology. =)

    #6 7 years ago

    Ethics and pinball are almost an oxymoron.

    I speak in the collecting mindset, not gameplay.

    #7 7 years ago

    Technically, it isn't even an extra ball. It launches a second ball in to play while you are actively playing, and I am certain it is not an intentional multiball.

    #8 7 years ago

    What game are we talking about?

    #9 7 years ago

    Your post is fine. If you don't want to tell us what your talking about its kind of a pointless thread though. At least tell us what game it is.

    #10 7 years ago
    Quoted from XedMada:

    It launches a second ball in to play while you are actively playing,

    Sounds like LOTR to me.

    #11 7 years ago

    What game?

    #12 7 years ago
    Quoted from XedMada:

    Technically, it isn't even an extra ball. It launches a second ball in to play while you are actively playing, and I am certain it is not an intentional multiball.

    Game might be broke.

    #13 7 years ago

    AC/DC Pro. Ive put about 6 hours on it already at my local arcade.

    And it doesn't happen on its own. You have to actively do something to make it happen at a specific time.

    #14 7 years ago

    Unless it is happening on more than one machine, it is probably an opto problem.

    #15 7 years ago
    Quoted from XedMada:

    AC/DC Pro. Ive put about 6 hours on it already at my local arcade.

    It's probably something in the settings...Since you have no way to flip thru the menus.

    #16 7 years ago
    Quoted from DCFAN:

    it is probably an opto problem.

    Could be.

    #17 7 years ago

    So, what do you have to do?

    #18 7 years ago

    I think he's talking about the 2nd time you load the cannon when a ball shoots out, but I think that's meant to be there to keep you active while trying to shoot the cannon.

    #19 7 years ago
    Quoted from Blakesell:

    I think he's talking about the 2nd time you load the cannon when a ball shoots out, but I think that's meant to be there to keep you active while trying to shoot the cannon.

    This be true says I

    The intial post just seems trolling like to me.

    #20 7 years ago

    If you want to tell them, tell them. If not, don't. If it's that obvious, it will be found relatively quickly anyway. I'm not sure a poll is really required here. How is this an ethics question? Is in unethical for you to not do QA for them?

    They'll find it.

    #21 7 years ago

    XedMada:

    Even if it's not an opto or other hardware issue, numerous software bugs are common on games.

    I just "discovered" one on Scared Stiff a few months back (that nobody previously reported on RGP since the game was released)--and that game was produced in 1996.

    No biggie.

    Welcome.

    #22 7 years ago
    Quoted from XedMada:

    I recently discovered what I believe to be a bug in a newer Stern machine that reliably gives the player an extra ball when it shouldn't

    What is it..be more specific please.

    #23 7 years ago

    Since most votes are to share it, and its rather silly to go on posting about it without spilling the beans, Il just report what i've found. I'd bet they already have a fix for it in the pipeline any way, and if not, i'm sure the will now.

    When plunging a ball, after making the skill shot and before hitting a bumper, if you press the lock bar's Fire button, the Ball Save is activated and auto-launches another ball in to play. Usually while your first is still in the bumper cluster.

    It is actually activating the ball save feature, as the display shows "Ball Saved - Keep Shooting" and if you drain soon after it wont give you another one. I tried a number of combinations but making the skill shot and hitting Fire before a bumper seems to be the only reliable way to recreate the bug. I activated it numerous times and have a witness.

    Of course, even with this knowledge I didn't have the ball control skills to make the leader board. =( This is one Fast game!

    #24 7 years ago

    heck, it's just as easy to get free balls... just play with no glass on your own and grab the ball before it drains. Hard to keep track of your high scores though if you don't play with the same rule set each time. You're the only one effected. I bought a pin from a buddy. I asked him how in the world he recorded such high scores. Easy, he said, I play with nine balls...

    #25 7 years ago

    I wonder if that is just specific to the pin in your location.

    #26 7 years ago
    Quoted from XedMada:

    This is one Fast game!

    +1 Played it this weekend. Fast game, liked it a lot.

    #27 7 years ago
    Quoted from TheJesus:

    The intial post just seems trolling like to me

    *sigh*

    #28 7 years ago
    Quoted from gambit3113:

    TheJesus said:The intial post just seems trolling like to me
    *sigh*

    Didn't mean to troll, I honestly wanted some opinion before posting it. I don't really know this community yet and didn't want to jump on telling everyone how to steal a free ball if most people thought it would be wrong.

    But hey, you are in Garland. Head over to Nickelrama and try it out for your self. They added some atrocious Guitar Hero machine next to it so id suggest bringing ear plugs or head phones. What a shame.

    #29 7 years ago

    I, for one, applaud the OP's desire to do the right thing. Whether or not his reluctance to hand over the information was warranted in this instance, it's still nice to find someone who would even give something like this a second thought. Bravo!

    #30 7 years ago
    Quoted from gambit3113:

    TheJesus said:The intial post just seems trolling like to me
    *sigh*

    129184399445261342.jpg

    #31 7 years ago

    hi xed. welcome to pinside forums...

    #32 7 years ago

    Sounds like a save button some European games have to get around certain laws. Might have been enabled by the operator - or the software has it enabled by default for some reason, game set up for wrong locale?

    #33 7 years ago
    Quoted from XedMada:

    gambit3113 said:TheJesus said:The intial post just seems trolling like to me
    *sigh*
    Didn't mean to troll, I honestly wanted some opinion before posting it. I don't really know this community yet and didn't want to jump on telling everyone how to steal a free ball if most people thought it would be wrong.
    But hey, you are in Garland. Head over to Nickelrama and try it out for your self. They added some atrocious Guitar Hero machine next to it so id suggest bringing ear plugs or head phones. What a shame.

    I need to get over there. And my sigh wasn't for you. It was for TheJesus. He's obviously a people person.

    ...but welcome aboard! Nice to have someone in the neighborhood.

    #34 7 years ago

    I think your issue is based on the assumption that operators will address concerns raised by someone playing the game. Often they fall upon deaf ears. At least, this has been my experience. Never understood it, but that is the world we live in.

    But what is more interesting to me about this situation is the degree to which you are compelled to commit the transgression your conscience seems to judge as wrong.

    Can you play the game without what you may consider cheating (either the ruleset or, more probably, the owner since you deem this an ethics issue)?

    I am sure most of us would take advanage of the malfunction, but some pinball people might look at it like setting baseball records on steroids and not opt for the freebie eventually in order to have satisfaction of "beating" the game or doing one's best fairly.

    For example, i have reached valinor on my LOTR only once and a malfunction allowed my game to continue when it should have been over. Yes, i got there, but i don't consider that i have ever achieved Valinor.

    #35 7 years ago
    Quoted from MrWizzo:

    For example, i have reached valinor on my LOTR only once and a malfunction allowed my game to continue when it should have been over. Yes, i got there, but i don't consider that i have ever achieved Valinor.

    In the record books, it would look something like this ...

    Reached Valinor on 02/14/2011 *

    * cheated

    #36 7 years ago

    Welcome to the Club, Xed!

    #37 7 years ago
    Quoted from XedMada:

    AC/DC Pro. Ive put about 6 hours on it already at my local arcade.
    And it doesn't happen on its own. You have to actively do something to make it happen at a specific time.

    It's probably just part of the game.

    #38 7 years ago

    XedMada welcome to pinside. Don't worry about all the heavy breathing. Some ppl here are less interesting or interested than others.

    To address your question, I suspect if its not really meant to be part of the rule set that it will be discovered and addressed in later updates. Like any software, it is quite likely that the original releases are both not quite finished and not quite debugged/QA'd. That being said, I'm sure Stern has a facility for reporting such issues.

    #39 7 years ago

    Ive already emailed a couple of their support addresses to let them know. I work in software design and development as my day job, so I know all too well about the joys of software QC and in field bugs.

    Thanks for the warm welcome all.

    #40 7 years ago

    My policy in cases of bugs is to contact the producer. If they don't promptly respond and say they're addressing it, then release it publicly and they will. It's the nature of software and unfortunately, sometimes vulnerabilities need to be exposed in order to ensure systems are robust.

    #41 7 years ago

    Welome Xed

    I dont think theres really any ethics issue here. Email the devs and let the info spill.

    Its not like its an ATM hack

    #42 7 years ago

    Hi Xed!

    Sure report it, pinball is a game, not a how-to-hack thing...

    Welcome here!

    #43 7 years ago
    Quoted from gambit3113:

    And my sigh wasn't for you. It was for TheJesus. He's obviously a people person.

    Promoted items from the Pinside Marketplace
    $ 48.00
    Cabinet - Other
    ModFather Pinball Mods
    $ 12.50
    $ 209.99
    $ 19.95
    $ 48.00
    Cabinet - Other
    ModFather Pinball Mods
    $ 7,999.00
    Pinball Machine
    Little Shop Of Games
    $ 9.90
    Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
    pinballmod
    $ 69.99
    Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
    Lighted Pinball Mods
    $ 99.00
    Gameroom - Decorations
    Pinball Sales
    $ 24.99
    Lighting - Led
    Lee's Parts
    From: $ 42.00
    Cabinet - Shooter Rods
    ModFather Pinball Mods
    $ 15.00
    Playfield - Decals
    Iron Monger Decal Out of stock
    Flashinstinct
    $ 18.99
    Eproms
    Matt's Basement Arcade
    $ 189.99
    From: $ 799.00
    Hardware
    CPR Playfields
    $ 17.00
    Electronics
    Yorktown Parts and Equip
    $ 5,799.00
    Pinball Machine
    Gulf Coast Pinball, LLC
    $ 29.95
    Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
    ULEKstore
    $ 53.00
    Cabinet - Shooter Rods
    ModFather Pinball Mods
    $ 15.00
    Playfield - Decals
    Metal-Mods
    $ 6.00
    Electronics
    German-Pinball-Modular
    $ 430.00
    Cabinet - Armor And Blades
    MI Pinball Refinery
    $ 14.50
    Electronics
    PinballElectronics.com

    Hey there! Got a moment?

    Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run thanks to donations from our visitors? Please donate to Pinside, support the site and get anext to your username to show for it! Donate to Pinside