wtf is a 'secret podcast' even to start with? what kind of concept is that?
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Quoted from 27dnast:I'm not trying to take a pot-shot at Josh. I'm sure he's a super good dude and has the best of intentions. He's sacrificing a lot of personal time to run a volunteer league that's massive. Just commenting on what I hear. Maybe I'm hearing it wrong, but it certainly sends a weirdly mixed message to my ears. Perhaps a message that has a messenger that's a little too close to the action to see the bigger picture?
Well you need experience to have a better shot at making a functional system.. so the fact it is an 'insider' job shouldn't matter much. They have also been VERY open to feedback and refinements.. so I don't think there is much merit to the concern of insiders.
WPRR was always done with the idea of ENCOURAGING play.. and I think its clear its been very successful at that. It's effectiveness as a RATING system as it comes to player vs player skill is not quite as clear, and those who were around at the time know that there was another system pushed by PAPA and bowen called PARS - which strived to be a ranking system only.. much like one has in Chess, Tennis, etc. The 'accuracy' of the ratings has always taken a backseat for WPRR and there are inherent issues that will never be fully addressed. Much of the tweaks have been around balancing, closing attempts to game the system, and generally keep encouraging MORE EVENTS.
The rest of the comments seem to be about the SCS - which is just one event.. it's not the WPRR system as a whole.
The friction always stems from the scenario when people look at WPRRs as a true skill rating system... it's not that and won't ever be in its current form. Nor does it really pretend to be. Think of it as a ranking of performance on the pinball events circuit... that's really what it is. You won't get to the top without competing... but not being in the list doesn't mean you aren't as good as some of those people.
Quoted from ifpapinball:The accuracy is just as important to us as the promotional aspect of what WPPR is all about. Many of the changes over the last few years have been far more about improving the accuracy of points earned at these events based on the quality of those events, while not worrying about what that may do to discourage players to participate.
I've extremely pleased with how the rankings look, especially in that top 100-200 range, and would welcome anyone that thinks they have an idea for a more accurate system. I have a .csv file with 11,542 event results that I can send to anyone interested
Here is where I disagree with your statement... the system is about ranking accumulating performances, not necessarily rating players as players. It will always punish a player who doesn't compete as much as other people of similar skill (because it's an **accumulation** of performances - not a grading).
Keeping out the fluff, and making the points carry more 'quality' are certainly changes you have made over the years.. and I'm sure it feels like whack a mole sometimes But the model of accumulating points to establish rankings is always going to hinge on participation. And that was the poster's complaint. This isn't like some sports where points are used, but everyone competes the same events.
That's why I said "Think of it as a ranking of performance on the pinball events circuit"
That will correlate well with an actual ranking of players... if the players all participate a reasonable level relative to each other.
Quoted from WJxxxx:Thanks for the input Snailman.
My original post was purely pointing out that the winner of a competition in V5 now earns less points than the winner of the same competition 3 years ago in V4. There is no debate about that - that IS fact. I said absolutely nothing about how it effects the overall rankings - Josh brought that up.
But that is only a temporal problem... and lesser of evils vs rebooting and starting over. Is it really fair to huff and puff over that point for something that will resolve itself and never come back?
Quoted from frolic:I can't criticize this, as I'm in their target market. It's just interesting how this played out.
It's alot easier when you let other people take the risks and just copy their model
Quoted from epthegeek:That would run waaaay too late.
They have an entire convention center... they could always move things around more
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