This one has me stumped to no end. I've been chasing this all week.

This is a decent condition Atlantis I just acquired and have gone through from top to bottom. There were many common issues I encountered going though it. All the score reels needed some attention. The credit unit was maladjusted to institute free play, the ball in play unit would not advance reliably, etc. I even found a few more defects that needed fixing after I went through everything, each time thinking I may have found the issue.

Symptoms during 5 ball play.
1. Top center rollover will score 3000 and an advance when not lit. It isn't constant. Sometimes it will score only 500 like it is supposed to.
2, Left and right top rollover lanes score correctly when lit and when not lit.
3. Center stand up will score 3000 and an advance when not lit some times. This only happens when one is turned on and the lit target is rotating between the three targets.
4. Center stand up scores fine when none of the stand ups are lit for 3000 and advance.

Symptoms during 3 ball play.
1. Center lane scores only 500 whether lit or unlit.
2. Top and center stand up score 3000 and advance when not lit when standups are lit.
3. Stand up targets all score 500 correctly when none are lit for 3000 and advance.

Diagnostics I've been through.
1. Swapped working head from my keeper Atlantis and the problem stays with the new game.
2. Swapped working playfield from my keeper Atlantis and the problem stays with the new game.

I'm leaning towards testing the main relayboard of my keeper Atlantis in this new atlantis to see if any of the defects stay with the new head and playfield.

Next, assuming I can isolate the defects to the main relay board, is to put the two main relay boards together on a table and compare, wire by wire, any differences between them. It really feels like I may have stumbled on a game that came from the factory with defects, maybe a wire or two on the wrong tabs.

Here are a couple of shots of relevant parts of the schematics. The E relay is the 3000 and Advance score relay. The P relay is what lights and unlights the stand up targets.

Thanks for any advice.

IMG_9566 (resized).JPG

IMG_9567 (resized).jpg

Mark,

Thank you for this guidance.

Yes, the E level cam has one tall post and two short posts. I've been able to validate those switches are clean and set up properly.

I've also scrutinized, cleaned, and adjusted the E relay properly.

I will scrutinize the C relay, motor switches 1A, 1B, and 4C, and look for the proper firing of the E relay tonight and report back here.

Thanks again.

Mike

Here is my progress.

I revisited the C relay, motor switches 1A, 1B, and 4C, and looked for the proper firing of the E relay. All are clean and set up properly.

For the top center lanes:
- The C relay properly pulls in in sync with the E relay when a lit lane is crossed.
- The top center lane still often scores 3000 when not lit.
- I can adjust the switches so that it only scores 500 all of the time but they seem out of proper alignment then.

For the stand up targets:
- The D relay properly pulls in in sync with the E relay when a lit target is hit.
- The center stand up target often scores 3000 when it is not lit for it. This only happens when a stand up is lit.
- Consistently the center target properly scores 500 when a stand up is not lit.

1A, 1B, and 4C are clean and set up properly regarding gap and wipe.

I have been able to follow proper set up and wipe of a switch as a competent guideline for years but, assuming this game is wired correctly, there is more going on at this time. It almost feels like the gap on an involved switch is off throwing off the timing. With the shared logic of the 3E and 4E switches, combined with the C, D, andE relays, it is a confusing circuit to follow, much less troubleshoot.

I put the playfield from my keeper Atlantis in the game as a reference. I'm not changing anything on it with the expectation that the issue lies in the main relay board. That is where my focus continues. My next step later this weekend is to do a detailed comparison of my working main relay board to the problematic relay board.

Again, any advice is appreciated.

It ohms out properly.

The top center rollover switches.

So after comparing to my keeper Atlantis, I found the timing of the 4E switches was slightly different and adjusted the problem game to match the good game. It appears to have corrected the problem.

By timing I mean the alignment of the switch closures and openings as the E level cam pins are actuating them.

Thanks for the guidance. Knowing it was in this area helped a lot.

Mark,

I spoke too soon. I play tested more this morning with no improvement to the condition.

I will block 4C or 1B and report back.

Mike

Blocking 4C provides the following results.

For the top center rollover sometimes it scores 500 points when not lit and sometimes it scores an advance with no point. When lit it always scores an advance but no points.

For the center stand up it experiences the same issues where it will score an advance when another target is lit but no points.

None of the 3000 points score which I assume is expected.

I spent more time with Atlantis last night with no improvement.

Lighting runs properly for all lanes and all stand ups. So that side of things is good.

This may be a stretch but what appears to be occurring is the game may think it is in 3 ball mode when the problems occur. So when the middle lane or middle target are scoring 3000 and an advance I'm getting the impression that that circuit thinks it is in 3 ball mode and a second path is active/lit for both the top lanes and the standup targets.

I have cleaned the 3 to 5 ball adjustment plug and socket and can't see where it can get into 3 ball mode in error for the scoring circuit.

Looking closer at the schematic it is almost as if the 4E switch is shorted both ways.

One question comes to mind regarding this schematic from the photo above. Why are the stand up targets represented by what almost looks like a make break switch? Is it possible for there to be a defect at the specific stand up target that could contribute to this problem?

Mark,

Thank you for your patience.

I found tonight that on 5 ball the center lane would mis score when set up for the left lane to be lit for 3000, with 3E flipped.

Putting it in 3 ball mode I found that the left lane would mis score when 3E was flipped.

The mis scoring is not constant. There will be times where the two noted lanes will score properly. The rest of the lanes score properly all of the time.

I completed the chart and a copy is below.
52AE5EDF-ED34-436B-B59F-43373C9F5777 (resized).jpeg

I was thinking the same thing here and have been puzzled that this switch, visually, is setup properly. Adequate wipe when closed and visibly open when actuated. I actually tore the switch stack apart this morning, pulling the switch blades and spacers off the sleeves, to see if there was any kind of internal defect. I could see someone before me had tried adjusting blades here and deformed a few of the blades at their base. I straightened these while I had it apart and had to fine tune the whole stack again but that was straightforward. The same issues remain.

I've been wondering if I have a short somewhere in the harness that could possibly create this condition. I'll check resistance readings and report back here.

Testing this switch I get full continuity or full open.

Any thoughts on the next step?

I desoldered the slate-black wire and the 3000 scoring went away for center and right lane. I assume this is the same as when I blocked this 3E switch with paper previously.

Here is where it gets weirder. For the standups when lit, the center target will often score 3000 when the upper target is lit. The weird part is that the center target scores one 100 and two 1000 sometimes when the lower target is lit for a total of 2100.

I think I need an exorcist.

I may not be interpreting your request correctly here. My meter has settings where the lowest range is 200 ohms. This also happens to be the setting it uses for continuity checks. So when the switch is open it reads a "1". When it is closed it reads 0.3 or 0.4.

I have another cheapy Radio Shack self ranging digital multimeter that has a setting separate from Ohms for continuity. I will retest the switch with it for resistance and see if I get different readings.

Yes, I mistyped that. At least my phone mistyped it. It should read lit, not hit. When the lower stand up target was lit, the center stand up target would sometimes score a single 100 and then two 1000s for a total of 2100 points.

I'm writing to follow up with the solution that evolved to correct the condition I had.

Recently I was able to enlist the help of an old timer here and he enlightened me to the need for the timing between the 3E switch staying engaged until the score motor run switch deactivated. We adjusted the actuator leaf at 3E to stay engaged longer and that appears to have addressed the issue. Definitely an odd nuance that surfaced even though the discrete set up nature of the involved switches appeared correct.

Thank you, Mark, for your help on this issue.