(Topic ID: 60116)

FIXED!!! My ToM went nuts and is now busted ...WTF happened!??!

By Rarehero

10 years ago


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  • 32 posts
  • 15 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 10 years ago by Rarehero
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#1 10 years ago

So, innocently enough, I adjusted my TOM eddy outlane boards cuz the left was sporadic and the right wasn't working at all. Adjusted, switch test...all good. Played some games...when the right magnet fired for the first time, the right flipper powered up & all the other coils went dead...then the game just froze. The lights and inserts were still on but the DMD was all scrambled. I turned the game off and on...got the boot up beep & attract lights but the DMD is just scrambled non-sense. If you hit start you can kind of see through the DMD garble & the insert lights that a game has started but no ball kicks out and there is no sound. If I try to go into diagnostics it resets.

WTF happened!? Seems like my right magnet has something to do with it but how could it take out my whole game?

#2 10 years ago

Sounds like something got pinched and grounded out the machine.

#3 10 years ago

That was my thought a short to ground somewhere?

#4 10 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

So, innocently enough, I adjusted my TOM eddy outlane boards cuz the left was sporadic and the right wasn't working at all. Adjusted, switch test...all good. Played some games...when the right magnet fired for the first time, the right flipper powered up & all the other coils went dead...then the game just froze. The lights and inserts were still on but the DMD was all scrambled. I turned the game off and on...got the boot up beep & attract lights but the DMD is just scrambled non-sense. If you hit start you can kind of see through the DMD garble & the insert lights that a game has started but no ball kicks out and there is no sound. If I try to go into diagnostics it resets.
WTF happened!? Seems like my right magnet has something to do with it but how could it take out my whole game?

Tsk, tsk, what a shame. I think we should ask Lloyd.

#5 10 years ago

So I just took a look at stuff...F112 was blown. Obviously there's more wrong than that, but I replaced it. Now when I turn the game on, it won't even boot up...it turns on for about a a second & the right flipper powers up....then it shuts off...tries to power on again...shuts off.

#6 10 years ago

Disconnect the CPU board and see what you have in the way of voltages.

#7 10 years ago

K, just did that...my game has a Rottendog power board...all voltage lights are lit.

#8 10 years ago

So weird ...when I disconnected the CPU it made the "bong" sound when turning it on. When I connected the CPU again, now it just makes that "click" speaker sound - no "bong", no flipper getting stuck up now...nothing...just dead.

#9 10 years ago

switch matrix is probably grounded somewhere

#10 10 years ago
Quoted from PinballHelp:

switch matrix is probably grounded somewhere

Strange that adjusting the Eddy sensor seemed to be the catalyst of this implosion.

#11 10 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

Strange that adjusting the Eddy sensor seemed to be the catalyst of this implosion.

poking around with a screwdriver on the underside of the playfield while the power is on can create lots of fun scenarios...

Look around to see if any wires are pinched anywhere.

I'd also re-seat all the connectors on the driver and MPU board. The DMD thing kinda seems like it could be an issue related to connectors.

#12 10 years ago

When you connect the CPU, connect it without switches to see if it reboots.

#13 10 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

Strange that adjusting the Eddy sensor seemed to be the catalyst of this implosion.

Your Pinside portfolio shows that you have a Road Show which has the same MPU (WPC-S) as the ToM. If you still have this game, and if it has the original Williams MPU in it, would you be willing to swap it with the Rottendog MPU in your ToM temporarily (there's some risk involved) and see what happens?

#14 10 years ago
Quoted from pins4fun:

Your Pinside portfolio shows that you have a Road Show which has the same MPU (WPC-S) as the ToM. If you still have this game, and if it has the original Williams MPU in it, would you be willing to swap it with the Rottendog MPU in your ToM temporarily (there's some risk involved) and see what happens?

My TOM doesn't have a Rottendog MPU...it has a Rottendog Power and DMD board.

...but yeah, I could swap my RS's MPU into my TOM. Actually I have a 2nd TOM that I was going to finish shopping out and sell that I could swap boards with too...but then I might F up the TOM that's gonna be for sale lol ...oh, pinball.

#15 10 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

My TOM doesn't have a Rottendog MPU...it has a Rottendog Power and DMD board.....

I wouldn't pair the Williams MPU from the Road Show with the Rottendog boards in ToM.

#16 10 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

...but yeah, I could swap my RS's MPU into my TOM.

Ummm....put the TOM in Roadshow.

If your TOM has a problem off of the MPU, you'll blow up another one.

LTG : )

#17 10 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

Ummm....put the TOM in roadshow.
If your TOM has a problem off of the MPU, you'll blow up another one.
LTG : )

How can you defy such superior logic? Thanks for chiming in Lloyd.

#18 10 years ago

Don't swap any board in anything yet. Pull all connectors from the CPU except the power, report what the diagnostic LEDs do.

--
Rob Anthony
Pinball Classics
http://LockWhenLit.com
Quality Board Work - In Home Service
borygard at gmail dot com

#19 10 years ago

Agree with Rob. Just had this issue. It was bad ribbon connectors on my machine.

#20 10 years ago

I really don't have any good advice for you Rarehero, but it sure seems like you
have some Rotten luck sometimes. Good luck and I hope you get it fixed.

-1
#21 10 years ago

CPU is jacked. Pull CPU and MPU . Take out batteries. Wrap each boards in tin foil. Send to

#22 10 years ago
Quoted from RobKnapp:

CPU is jacked. Pull CPU and MPU . Take out batteries. Wrap each boards in tin foil. Send to

CPU and MPU are the same thing. If there's some ground issue on the game - putting a repaired board in there will just blow up again.

Quoted from LTG:

Ummm....put the TOM in roadshow.
If your TOM has a problem off of the MPU, you'll blow up another one.
LTG : )

Seems that the problem happened when the magnet and flipper got stuck on - would it be worth putting the RS MPU in TOM and turning it on with the HV off - just to see if it boots up? Then press the interlock switch for a sec to see if the flipper gets stuck up again? At least that way I'll know for sure if my power board is damaged & I prob have to replace the flipper's transistor.

Quoted from Borygard:

Don't swap any board in anything yet. Pull all connectors from the CPU except the power, report what the diagnostic LEDs do.

Will do! Gonna wheel this poor dead game out to the garage and test further out there...

#23 10 years ago
Quoted from Borygard:

Don't swap any board in anything yet. Pull all connectors from the CPU except the power, report what the diagnostic LEDs do.

K, Rob - just did this. When I turn the game on, the top and bottom LEDs are on...then after it goes "bong" - the bottom one is lit solid,the middle one just blinks rapidly forever, top one is off.

According to repair guides, that means normal...right?

#24 10 years ago

Man the behavior on this thing is so odd...OK, so - I reconnected everything after doing the "Rob test". Now, the game comes up in attract mode - but no sound and DMD is scrambled (solid, no "ghost" images). When I turned on the game with the CPU detached, I got the "bong" sound. Now that it's attached, no sound. When I closed the coin door, this time BOTH flippers powered up and the 50v fuse blew instantly. If I press start, the game goes into the start sequence, but no ball launch, no sound. Eventually the trunk starts turning (ball search).

Soooo...maybe the CPU isn't the problem? Maybe this is all related to the Rottendog power board? Hmmmm

image.jpgimage.jpg

#25 10 years ago

Yes your LEDs indicate normal CPU boot up. You're likely looking at a data issue, could be CPU, could be sound or DMD driver board, could be driver, or even ribbon cables. Try swapping ribbon cables between the CPU and other boards with a game that boots.

Next up if that doesn't do it, boot with the ribbon cables completely disconnected from each board one at a time. When/if the game functions normally (minus functions of whichever board is disconnected ) then that board is bad.

Next would be swapping the CPU, that will narrow things to either CPU or driver at this point if all above things don't allow the game to function normally.

--
Rob Anthony
Pinball Classics
http://LockWhenLit.com
Quality Board Work - In Home Service
borygard at gmail dot com

#26 10 years ago

I would disconnect the fliptronics board (all connectors). Then see what it does.

It sounds like this started there. If the original problem was a shortcircuit blowing up an IC for data on the fliptronics board, then everything connected to it (data from cpu to all other boards) may experience problems.

#27 10 years ago

Agree completely with Rob here. Start with cable swap.

#28 10 years ago

K, thanks for all the great troubleshooting ideas! When I start tinkering again I'll report my findings.

#29 10 years ago

Always, ALWAYS, start by checking power. For any repair. Doesn't matter if its a computer, a radio, a $6000 audio processor or a pinball machine. It's not like it's difficult or time consuming folks.

2 months later
#30 10 years ago
Quoted from wayout440:

Always, ALWAYS, start by checking power. For any repair. Doesn't matter if its a computer, a radio, a $6000 audio processor or a pinball machine. It's not like it's difficult or time consuming folks.

You can remove your thumbs-downs for Rob & Carl because....

Quoted from Carl_694:

Agree completely with Rob here. Start with cable swap.

DING DING DING DING DING. I finally got around to monkeying with the game yesterday - and it turns out the ribbon cable going from the CPU to Fliptronic to DMD board was what was causing the problem. As soon as I swapped that w/ the one from my Shadow, the game came right up and played fine! Amazing that a ribbon cable would randomly go 'bad' causing the 50v fuse to blow, DMD to garble, and sound to go out...WTF...but YAY, my ToM is back in action! Ready for ColorDMD!

#31 10 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

Ready for ColorDMD!

Time to pencil in a field trip to Rarehero's house!

Glad it turned out to be something easy in the end, I know that was frustrating you.

-1
#32 10 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Time to pencil in a field trip to Rarehero's house!
Glad it turned out to be something easy in the end, I know that was frustrating you.

Thanks man! Really glad to have gotten my Road Show and Theatre back in business with very minimal work (just a lot of confusion!). My Road Show resets seem to be resolved by making sure the CPU was attached better.

Only 2 games left to fix and all my games are up! BSD has some battery leak damage on the CPU - I can probably fix it (or get lazy and send it to someone ). Shadow's brick wall target is still acting like a butthole. 2 games down ain't bad, though!

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