(Topic ID: 251055)

My '77 Williams Big Deal will not index back from 4 to 1 players


By MD_Pinball_Dude

9 days ago



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  • 11 posts
  • 3 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 days ago by MD_Pinball_Dude
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There have been 6 images uploaded to this topic. (View topic image gallery).

0Big-Deal-Work-12 (resized).jpg
Index2 (resized).jpg
2019-09-08 18.15.50 (resized).jpg
Index2 (resized).jpg
2019-09-08 18.15.50 (resized).jpg
Chime (resized).jpg

#1 9 days ago

I just got a newly purchased 1977 Williams Big Deal set up and through pure dumb luck have not set it on fire (yet) despite my best efforts (who knew you actually have to line up the pins up when putting wiring connectors back in place?). I have replaced one coil so all the reels now will reset back to zero, all the pretty lamps glow again and it seems to be working except it will not index back to Player 1 from Player 4 in a four player game. All other player modes work fine. 1 to 2 to 3 back to 1, etc..... I start the game, push the credit button and every time I press the credit button the player indicator lamps glow accordingly, except the 4th lamp! I start playing, it indexes to player 2 after a drain, then player 3 after a drain and then player 4 after a drain, but on the next drain it stays stuck in player 4 scoring and the player light stays on the 4th player. I can cut the power and back on again and it will reset back to original conditions when the credit switch is pressed. I could possibly live with this, but the Electrical Engineer in me will not let this happen. I will add a photo of the player index unit later on. Any thoughts? I don't think this game was ever cleaned in it's life. The long chime was almost cut in two from use! It is a great unit on the whole and for $300.00 a steal.

Chime (resized).jpg
#2 9 days ago

There is NO voltage to Player 4's lamp after pressing the credit button four times. Here is a photo of the player index reel at startup in 4 Player Mode. I may have unwound the reel one revolution when I was poking around the head unit.

2019-09-08 18.15.50 (resized).jpgIndex2 (resized).jpg
#3 8 days ago

It is definitely the player unit not unwinding. It tries, but I think the B1-26 marked solenoid is not unlocking the pawl. The bigger A-22 solenoid did fire (very quickly) I tried to set the smaller unit into the unlock position, but it still did not unwind. I moved the clockwork coil spring forward and back a turn each way, but no joy.

#5 8 days ago

You would need to manually advance and reset the player unit. Press the advance solenoid plunger three times to see if the stepper smoothly clicks into each position. Then press the reset solenoid plunger to see if it will reset back to the player 1 position. Check to make sure the wiper contacts are clean, or it might be that the player unit needs to be taken apart and cleaned.

You should also take a look at the coin unit. The coin unit controls the number of players selected for a game. If the 4 player game light is not lighting up, then the coin unit stepper might not be fully rotated in the 4 player game position. You can do the same with the coin unit stepper - manually advance the stepper, make sure wiper contacts are clean, evaluate if the stepper might need to be taken apart for cleaning, etc...

#6 8 days ago

fredsmythson - thanks for the tip. I will let you know what I find.

#7 8 days ago

Hi MD_Pinball_Dude
I believe to see (Video in post-4) the player-unit-STEP-UP-coil fire --- but the RESET coil should fire.
It is getting late - no theory for now --- see https://www.ipdb.org/files/245/Williams_1977_Big_Deal_Instruction_Manual.pdf on page-18 - see "Upper Terminal Strip" , Position "B" --- wire-R-W (red-white) --- look up in Your pin --- wire truely soldered-on (my two question marks in the JPG) ? what color of wire ? Look on the Jones-Plug (connecting Backbox to mech. panel in the Cabinet, my one question mark)) --- same color of wire ? Jones-Plug good ? wires soldered on ? Greetings Rolf
0Big-Deal-Work-12 (resized).jpg

#8 7 days ago

Thanks, Rolf. I found a website that had the entire game's wiring in one long pdf file and it made more sense (to my style of engineering training) to see it laid out this way. I kinda chuckled when saw just how logical these pinball systems are. Your drawings make it even better when I put the two next to each other. I will have to work on this tomorrow night.

#9 4 days ago

Cleaned the Jones Plug and got Player 4 to glow again. Thanks Rolf. Still having issues with 4 player games, but even baby steps are welcomed.

#10 3 days ago

It's a dirty wheel bushing. I can move it to 4 Player and it does not spin back quickly on its own even if nothing is in the way of the index teeth. A cleaning and light oiling is on tap as I have already pulled the index gear off and confirmed it is just old oil.

#11 3 days ago

100% fixed and fun to play. Thanks for all the pointers. A little cleaning with PB Blaster, some light oil and it is done.

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