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(Topic ID: 217394)

The Munsters Hype (Because every evening its Halloween)


By Macca101010

2 years ago



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  • Latest reply 27 days ago by Jnyvio
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There are 8182 posts in this topic. You are on page 134 of 164.
#6651 1 year ago
Quoted from jfh:

I’m stumped - what is JAFL?

Just Another Fan Layout ?

#6652 1 year ago

yes, Just Another Fan Layout

#6653 1 year ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

yes, Just Another Fan Layout

I have to say I appreciate your honesty. I thought maybe because you own one and have it on location-you would want to fluff it up a bit. You usually are a straight shooter and I respect that

#6654 1 year ago

I know people (i.e. the Law) make fun of doing a coil count, but let's be honest... you know that is a factor in BOM and assembly time/cost. Each coil = a mech and more things to install/code/wire...

From a player perspective, coils = interaction. It is the chance to flip a ball, a diverter to change a ball path, a vuk to move it somewhere else.

Stern typically has 16 coils on a Pro model.
Classic B/W games are always 20+

The continual comparison of Mun to TAF is silly from a player interaction and game play perspective...
14 coils on MUN. 24 on TAF
Mun Coils (resized).JPGTAF coil (resized).JPG

#6655 1 year ago

This also made me realize, the one thing really missing on the Pro that they should have done...
3 magnets in the center of the pf, ala the power.

Really could have been a great feature and that are of the pf is completely empty.

#6656 1 year ago

I am wondering how strong the theme is on location. I know comparing the classic Adam's Family to Munsters is apples and oranges, but what if Munsters had same coil count and was a widebody like AF. Would it attract people like Adam's does? Is Adam's Family well known compared to Munsters franchise? Just curious how well the theme is doing on locations so far? Seems like Star Wars and Deadpool are killing it?

#6657 1 year ago
Quoted from pinmister:

was a widebody like AF

TAF is narrow body. It was TZ that was wide body.

#6658 1 year ago
Quoted from pinmister:

I am wondering how strong the theme is on location. I know comparing the classic Adam's Family to Munsters is apples and oranges, but what if Munsters had same coil count and was a widebody like AF. Would it attract people like Adam's does? Is Adam's Family well known compared to Munsters franchise? Just curious how well the theme is doing on locations so far? Seems like Star Wars and Deadpool are killing it?

My impression is the theme is bascially unknown by those that play on route. I mean... people know of it, but are not drawn to it.
The theme did not help it from a route perspective.

Addams is much better known as a theme and actually better known as a pinball. So many people remember TAF from " a friends basement" or "the arcade I played at as a kid" TAF pinball is part of the culture of americana in my perspective.

#6659 1 year ago
Quoted from Rum-Z:

TAF is narrow body. It was TZ that was wide body.

I always get them mixed up. Both of them are jammed packed-I can tell you that

#6660 1 year ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

The theme did not help it from a route perspective

If the theme does not do it for operators-we will see the value of this title fall off quickly. They seem to be selling well and if the code is too shallow for most homeowners-it will be yard sale city in a year from now. Might be one of those titles to pick up at a bargain down the road. I have no skin in the game but will watch on the sidelines.

#6661 1 year ago
Quoted from pinmister:

If the theme does not do it for operators-we will see the value of this title fall off quickly. They seem to be selling well and if the code is too shallow for most homeowners-it will be yard sale city in a year from now. Might be one of those titles to pick up at a bargain down the road. I have no skin in the game but will watch on the sidelines.

I dont think so. It will do OK on route no matter what and that is enough to keep it out.

For home, I actually think it has plenty of code. People need to get out and play it and put that narrative to rest. This game really does have plenty going on already with the strategy of cashing in jackpots and zaps to layer on everything else. I have no idea how it got started, but it needs to fall off.

Munsters has plenty of Breadth already.

For code it only really needs 3 things.

Level 2 to feel more diverse and unique.
More immersion and polish to bring the game together (already pretty good foundation at .91)
My hope is we also see a surprise Level III. Would be easy to add since there is "I" and "II" to use them both to make a "III"

p.s. ability to cancel all animations. They are much to long. I see route players all trying to cancel out of end of ball, jackpot/dragula, etc... Makes the game play way too long with always forcing you to watch the screen

#6662 1 year ago

Just Aim At Flashing Lights?

#6663 1 year ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

I know people (i.e. the Law) make fun of doing a coil count, but let's be honest... you know that is a factor in BOM and assembly time/cost. Each coil = a mech and more things to install/code/wire...
From a player perspective, coils = interaction. It is the chance to flip a ball, a diverter to change a ball path, a vuk to move it somewhere else.
Stern typically has 16 coils on a Pro model.
Classic B/W games are always 20+
The continual comparison of Mun to TAF is silly from a player interaction and game play perspective...
14 coils on MUN. 24 on TAF
[quoted image][quoted image]

Believe Munsters has 15 if u include the magnet also . It's also nice the pro has the dual color gi which adds a nice effect during gameplay. But yea not many games compare to pat l pins as far as toys and cool mechs.

#6664 1 year ago

Reminds me of Dirty Harry talking to Horace in Sudden Impact

“What the hell’s a JAMF ? “

#6665 1 year ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

p.s. ability to cancel all animations. They are much to long. I see route players all trying to cancel out of end of ball, jackpot/dragula, etc... Makes the game play way too long with always forcing you to watch the screen

You can cancel out the end of ball with a simple hold of both flippers (I do it almost all the time.) It also works to shorten some of Grandpa's video clips when hitting the scoop, but doesn't seem to work on the Dragula clip.

#6666 1 year ago
Quoted from bigd1979:

It's also nice the pro has the dual color gi which adds a nice effect during gameplay.

Don’t get me wrong I love me some Stern, check my collection for proof of that but we are in 2019.

We really shouldn’t still be grateful that we get RGB lighting, in this day and age with consumer tech as it is today, it should be standard at this point.

#6667 1 year ago

If your going to compare Addams to Munsters I would like to think you would have to compare premium/LE to Addams

#6668 1 year ago
Quoted from J85M:

Don’t get me wrong I love me some Stern, check my collection for proof of that but we are in 2019.
We really shouldn’t still be grateful that we get RGB lighting, in this day and age with a consumer tech, it should be standard at this point.

I agree but we gotta take what we get with stern lol

#6669 1 year ago
Quoted from Spacemanratso09:

If your going to compare Addams to Munsters I would like to think you would have to compare premium/LE to Addams

How much was Addams selling for new in 1992?

If it was $2900 that's about $5200 in today's dollars. So it's equivalent to a Pro price-wise. Correct me if I'm off on the price, though.

#6670 1 year ago
Quoted from wesman:

I just watched the first half of the Deadflip video again, displaying the ruleset with Dwight and John, and I don't think I've seen a game as jackpot happy as this.

W?D comes to mind which is also a Dwight game

#6671 1 year ago
Quoted from westofrome:

If it was $2900 that's about $5200 in today's dollars. So it's equivalent to a Pro price-wise. Correct me if I'm off on the price, though.

Pricewise I think the pro-equivalency of TAF vs MUN Pro is probably correct, buildwise though, I think TAF is more inline with MUN Premium/LE. A conundrum... LOL.

#6672 1 year ago
Quoted from westofrome:

How much was Addams selling for new in 1992?
If it was $2900 that's about $5200 in today's dollars. So it's equivalent to a Pro price-wise. Correct me if I'm off on the price, though.

That's just inflation though, that doesn't include economies of scale when you are making 20k units of just one model. They were also making 10s of 1,000's of other models at the same time. I'm sure coils and the like are a lot cheaper when you are buying 300,000+ at a time.

#6673 1 year ago
Quoted from J85M:

Don’t get me wrong I love me some Stern, check my collection for proof of that but we are in 2019.
We really shouldn’t still be grateful that we get RGB lighting, in this day and age with a consumer tech, it should be standard at this point.

It's strange that AC/DC ( 2012 ) has better lighting than a lot of the more modern games.

#6674 1 year ago
Quoted from jfh:

I preferred the Premium because I like the lower playfield (and the fact you can disable it if you want and use Pro rules). But I loved how smooth the Pro was.
When I played it was on a Premium where the playfield cover wasn’t flush/level so there was some ball misdirection and speed loss so it felt slower than the Pro. IMO, the Premium was fast, the Pro blazingly fast. Game play is all but identical except for Grandpa’s lab. If you don’t have a strong preference then the question boils down to “Is the mini playfield worth $1600 to you?”
I happen to like the black & white art package better, so I suspect if I get one it will be a Premium if I am reasonably confident the cover can be leveled correctly. But waiting to make a final decision (probably until fall) to see what happens with the code.

Thanks for the input!

Quoted from bigd1979:

Believe Munsters has 15 if u include the magnet also . It's also nice the pro has the dual color gi which adds a nice effect during gameplay. But yea not many games compare to pat l pins as far as toys and cool mechs.

Doesn't the premium have dual color GI?

Added 21 months ago:

EDIT: Nevermind, misunderstood.

#6675 1 year ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

Munsters next to TAF just showcases how empty Munsters is compared to a classic 90s game.

The only "toy" that interacts with the ball is Spot. TAF has so much more with the "oh my god did you see the hand grab the ball", the "man the power took control of the game" and the "vault opening"

Comparing TAF, a 4 flipper game with 2x the amount of stuff to Munsters is silly IMHO.

Who cares about that stuff? All that really matters is the theme and art...

They could remove more things and the game would play even faster. Everyone knows speed = flow = fun.

#6676 1 year ago

I get it on the dollars argument but I thought it was comparing coils,shots and shit
My bad

#6677 1 year ago
Quoted from Durzel:

Addams Family, please
I would suspect that side by side Munsters would make Addams look very old. But then it is very old, but is still super captivating to players new and old alike. There's lessons in there to learn I suspect.
I wonder if Stern had one eye on TAF in terms of coming up with a rule set for Munsters. TAF isn't remotely deep but makes money hand over fist.

The Munsters is a far better game than TAF. Matter of fact when i went and played Munsters the other night there was an Adams Family sitting beside Munsters. I dropped a couple quarters in it and played a game and had no desire to play it again.

#6678 1 year ago
Quoted from Who-Dey:

The Munsters is a far better game than TAF. Matter of fact when i went and played Munsters the other night there was an Adams Family sitting beside Munsters. I dropped a couple quarters in it and played a game and had no desire to play it again.

Wow you liked a new Stern game more than _____?!

Quoted from Jvspin:

They could remove more things and the game would play even faster. Everyone knows speed = flow = fun.

Agreed! All the "shit" they put in a game just get's in the way of mods!

#6679 1 year ago
Quoted from Who-Dey:

The Munsters is a far better game than TAF.

Yet to be seen if Munsters does win ( The far better game) until we see final code.

BUT if Munsters doesn't win?
then there is a lot of egg on there face that it couldn't even beat a game that was made back in 1992.

#6680 1 year ago
Quoted from TheLaw:

Agreed! All the "shit" they put in a game just get's in the way of mods!

Don’t you mean all that stuff gets in the way of “shit mods” and there’s plenty of those offered up these days

#6681 1 year ago

We don't rate pinballs by coil count anymore, its Doll/Action figures count now

#6682 1 year ago
Quoted from Who-Dey:

The Munsters is a far better game than TAF.

tenor.gif

Quoted from Squizz:

BUT if Munsters doesn't win?
then there is a lot of egg on there face that it couldn't even beat a game that was made back in 1992.

My that measure, there is lots of egg flying in lots of faces then, IMO.

#6683 1 year ago
Quoted from J85M:

Don’t you mean all that stuff gets in the way of “shit mods” and there’s plenty of those offered up these days

Wonder how this mod sold

#6684 1 year ago
Quoted from Squizz:Yet to be seen if Munsters does win ( The far better game) until we see final code.
BUT if Munsters doesn't win?
then there is a lot of egg on there face that it couldn't even beat a game that was made back in 1992.

If it doesn’t win it lost out to a top 5 game all time

#6685 1 year ago

Plus if your going to compare the two you have to act as if Addams Family would be new out of the box
If you look at it that way even then I think they are comparable in a lot of ways accept obviously layout
I don’t know much about pinball and I haven’t played Munsters yet but I looks like,just to me only,like MM layout wise I’ve played a bunch of that

#6686 1 year ago
Quoted from Who-Dey:

The Munsters is a far better game than TAF.

Umm, no.

#6687 1 year ago
Quoted from JayLar:

Thanks for the input!

Doesn't the premium have dual color GI?

Yep only difference between models is the art and lower playfield

#6688 1 year ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

I see lots of people here that have likely not even played the game yet. Go play it and form an opinion, then share.
I have been playing Beatles more, but Munsters is still getting a fair share of my quarters.

TOTALLY AGREE - the most logical response.

Played Beatles yesterday and absolutely love it.
So much fun!

Beatles Sparks Lots Of Joy.

#6689 1 year ago

I like it better. I dont hate TAF, just never really seen the appeal to it like a lot of people. Its a great theme though and i would like to have one for that reason alone.

-4
#6690 1 year ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

I know people (i.e. the Law) make fun of doing a coil count, but let's be honest... you know that is a factor in BOM and assembly time/cost. Each coil = a mech and more things to install/code/wire...
From a player perspective, coils = interaction. It is the chance to flip a ball, a diverter to change a ball path, a vuk to move it somewhere else.
Stern typically has 16 coils on a Pro model.
Classic B/W games are always 20+
The continual comparison of Mun to TAF is silly from a player interaction and game play perspective...
14 coils on MUN. 24 on TAF
[quoted image][quoted image]

Thanks for this information. Very good point you’ve made. This info alone makes me rethink buying a Munsters. They’ve cheapened the table. It maybe fun, but if Stern is going to charge me such high prices for almost half of a TAF table, I’ll be buying a TAF remake in the future.

Do you happen to know how many coils Batman 66 has?

12
#6691 1 year ago
Quoted from Thunderbird:

Thanks for this information. Very good point you’ve made. This info alone makes me rethink buying a Munsters. They’ve cheapened the table. It maybe fun, but if Stern is going to charge me such high prices for almost half of a TAF table, I’ll be buying a TAF remake in the future.
Do you happen to know how many coils Batman 66 has?

So you're not going to buy a Munsters because someone on the internet told you it doesn't have many coils for real? The only thing i can say to that is....Bwaaaaaa haaaaaaa haaaaaaa haaaaaaaaa!!!!

What a f*cking joke dude!

11
#6692 1 year ago

AFM would have to be one pinball with the lowest coil count, yet one of the greatest pinballs made.

#6693 1 year ago

I dont give a sh*t how many coils its got as long as its fun and this game is FUN! I count fun not coils.

#6694 1 year ago
Quoted from Kiwipinhead:

AFM would have to be one pinball with the lowest coil count, yet one of the greatest pinballs made.

actually 16 coils plus the visor motor.

More than the most Stern Pro.

Quoted from Who-Dey:

So you're not going to buy a Munsters because someone on the internet told you it doesn't have many coils for real? The only thing i can say to that is....Bwaaaaaa haaaaaaa haaaaaaa haaaaaaaaa!!!!

What a f*cking joke dude!

The only joke is some of the continual knee pad wearing fan boys... You would gain a little credibility if you were actually honest that Stern continues to focus on cutting bottom line and often it is impacting the quality and fun factor of a game.

Prime example... Munsters is good. It surely would have been better with a few magnets in that vapid open space on the center of the Pro model. However, they were not thinking about the value of a feature rich game. They count coils and set a BOM limit for each game. They have been clear on this and that some designers will add things to a prem/le model as compomise they will pull something from the pro.

Coil count is a nice number to examine what is being invested into a game. It is not the end all be all, but it does tell you something with a simple single number...

That reality is enough for some people to "click" and relaize what they are spending 5600 on and had been rationalizing up to this point.

#6695 1 year ago

This is hilarious. The old coil count myth again? Copper is a rare (but a mostly plentiful) earth metal. It does cost. Coils have a lot of copper (duh?) They are one of the most expensive things in a machine next to rest of the other components beside labor. They set the basic ground floor of the BOM along with cabinet, back box, playfield, translite, plastics, decals, flippers, lockdown bar, legs, a general list of hardware and rubber rings, CPU, node boards, wire, switches, inserts and lights/LEDs. The remaining monies now have to be spent on the things that make a box of parts a titled game, so license, artwork, layout, mechnical design, graphics, programming, sound, music, light show, animations, call outs, prototyping, whitewooding, sample games, market research, and promotion. The balancing act is to make all this come together to make something that is... wait for it... a good return on investment.

In this industry, that means a machine that attracts a large swath of the publics interest, continues to hold that interest, and provides a decent amount of entertainment for the cost of a dollar. It also has to do this with minimum intervention by the operator, for as long as possible at the least amount of cost of ownership.

Or as @who-dey said, it’s just has to be fun.

10
#6696 1 year ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

The only joke is some of the continual knee pad wearing fan boys... You would gain a little credibility if you were actually honest that Stern continues to focus on cutting bottom line

Well im not looking for any credibility on here so thats a good thing i guess. Im just here to talk about pinball and how awesome the new Munsters game is. I talk about the good and the bad both but i would rather focus on the good and the Munsters has A LOT of good in it. I will never understand why some people on here make it their goal to try and run down every game that Stern releases, cracks me up.

-9
#6697 1 year ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

actually 16 coils plus the visor motor.
More than the most Stern Pro.

The only joke is some of the continual knee pad wearing fan boys... You would gain a little credibility if you were actually honest that Stern continues to focus on cutting bottom line and often it is impacting the quality and fun factor of a game.
Prime example... Munsters is good. It surely would have been better with a few magnets in that vapid open space on the center of the Pro model. However, they were not thinking about the value of a feature rich game. They count coils and set a BOM limit for each game. They have been clear on this and that some designers will add things to a prem/le model as compomise they will pull something from the pro.
Coil count is a nice number to examine what is being invested into a game. It is not the end all be all, but it does tell you something with a simple single number...
That reality is enough for some people to "click" and relaize what they are spending 5600 on and had been rationalizing up to this point.

Right on the money with no pun intended. Lol! Accurately stated, “knee pad wearing fanboys” are a plenty in Pinside Sterndom!

Time to get real Stern slurpers: if coil count doesn’t equate to fun factor, then why do the most fun games usually have the highest coil count? The reason we play the game is because of things that interact with the ball. Coils are the main things that do that. Reduce that number and it reduces the overall fun experience significantly. Ending with just ramps and a bash toy or two. Boredom sets in with the same worn out fan layout, with everything placed at the back of the table as we’ve seen over and over from Sterns copy and paste program.

Stern tables are getting emptier by the release. Code can only make up so much in the fun factor area. Stern needs to be more responsibile in the cost accounting versus what they charge for the tables. Look at their recent history. They come in with great titles and skimp on everything and way overcharge for the final product. Beatles, comes to mind? Pretty soon we are going to be discussing how fun the table will be to mod, because it has great artwork and a few lights, but not much else. But because it has extreme nostalgia for the Stern fanboys, they’ll bow to the stripped down table that has great artwork and a beloved title and pay $9,000.00.

Meanwhile, Pappa Stern continues to see how much milk he can get from ol’ Bessie, while he keeps cutting her hay rations. Admittedly, Stern acquires the best IPs and has kept pinball alive, but how are they going to increase the home buyers is the big question, with machines more suited to arcades? Where people play for 10 minutes and don’t care what coil count is and ball interaction in relation to the price. After all, they’re only paying a buck and not nearly $10k, after shipping and tax etc, like us home buyers.

I do like the overall Munsters package at a much lower price, if they’re going to give me a much lower product value in terms of mechanical interaction. Otherwise, I’ll Just enjoy it with a few dollars on location.

#6698 1 year ago
Quoted from Who-Dey:

Well im not looking for any credibility on here so thats a good thing i guess. Im just here to talk about pinball and how awesome the new Munsters game is. I talk about the good and the bad both but i would rather focus on the good and the Munsters has A LOT of good in it. I will never understand why some people on here make it their goal to try and run down every game that Stern releases, cracks me up.

Munsters is for sure lots of good. I will never understand why people are incabale of acknowledging a game is good, but also being honest about what it is lacking, and the obvious cost cutting decisions that impacted the design and overall fun factor ( esp when making the very short jump to comparing to other games).

Instead we get these constant fanboys and some of us that even like a game feel the need to bring some reality to the constant fan boyism

#6699 1 year ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

Munsters is for sure lots of good. I will never understand why people are incabale of acknowledging a game is good, but also being honest about what it is lacking, and the obvious cost cutting decisions that impacted the design and overall fun factor ( esp when making the very short jump to comparing to other games).
Instead we get these constant fanboys and some of us that even like a game feel the need to bring some reality to the constant fan boyism

Did you read my review of Munsters that i gave after i played it? I clearly stated that it had shallow code so i don't think a fan boy would have said that. I gave a good honest review of my opinion of the game. I also said that the game would probably be best suited for Munsters fans and not people who loved deep coded games.

#6700 1 year ago

AFM has at least 17 (plus the motor)

Ball trough
Auto plunge
2 flippers
2 slings
3 pops
4 Martians
Diverter
Scoop
VUK
Knocker

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