Now this is an interesting tidbit. I actually like this idea. Here is something that a potential sponsor can bite into.

Glad to hear that John. Even though it's none of my business, I was a little concerned for your health. It may be my imagination but your recent posts do seem a bit clearer.

I think you need a plan C- get a job and do it yourself. You speak of your meager retirement check. Get off the keyboard, out of the tavern, and earn it like the rest of us whales, mini whales, and wannabe whales.

I can agree your points, but disagree that it really applies to this situation. This isn't home remodeling. No one needs what John wants to do. It's a desire. This is someone trying to build a one of a kind, extravagant big kids toy with low odds of fruition. I compare it more like the ultimate Whale's Go Fund Me. Pledge your money and hope for the best, but realize you may get a zero return.

The irony is that if we all took our time that we have spent in these whale threads and billed it out at the rate we get for our real careers we could finance the 100k if not more!

So I posted an interesting and relevant tidbit regarding this for anyone who is willing to follow the path I gave a map for but who wants to search or even read anymore. Allow me to summarize:

Foreign guy builds a homebrew of Dragons Lair. Friggen epic build with features you would expect to be found on the most limited of releases.

Uses artwork and other IP features unique to the video game incorporates it to great effect.

As the game reaches completion something bizarre happens. Some postings are made by the maker seeking support for the solicitation of machines being made in the likeness of this fantastic creation.

Now here’s where things go off the rails and I’m working from memory however recent so the order or details might be off. Machine maker gets a cease & desist from the IP holder. Maker claims he never solicited the game and his account was hijacked by some known third party. Regardless IP holders say in no uncertain terms that even showing the machine in public will be met with lawsuits of the most unrelenting manner. A crushed creator crawls back into his den overcome with grief that his life’s work will never see the light of day…

Now I took two things away from the above experience. The first is anyone can sue for anything regardless of laws in place. And a big enough opponent will win thru attrition. You see that everyday. The second is it is far better to beg for forgiveness than ask for permission. The above tale is a perfect example of this.

So I am very curious to see how this works for John as I believe he is quite familiar with both the law and gag orders. I do hope this journey continues to be well documented but will not be surprised if this suddenly “Dies on the vine.”

Turner Logic has just announced Turner Pinball. That leaves one more secret pinball company GWJ says will soon launch.

John, the more that gets pulled out of you the more the information helps your cause.

How about this? Will it be a DMD or an LCD machine?

John, you might want to take a look at https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/p3-module-join-me-in-development
bingopodcast shares a bunch of lists of what he needs to do to finish his commercial playfield module

There is much more to me then people think they know. Like I say over the years I meet & talk with industry people over the years at shows, & on the phone. Jack always has a good laugh, along with others in the pinball business. Just like everyone knows I like to drink beer, & a die hard pinball nut.

There is a plan in play for TPB, & come August people will know if it Dead or Alive! The clock is still ticking down to August 1, 2022
No matter what happens I will be at SXSW & TPF next year.

Not allowed to post up on Deeproot thread now. Thanks! Maybe this one is going to be shutdown very soon.

Why do you keep avoiding any questions of substance? You keep repeating and recycling the same shit over and over. Name dropping David Fix and Jersey Jack when they all have absolutely NOTHING to do with this. Every single time I find reason to defend your dream you push the repeat of garbage button.

I have met Gene Simmons and Paul Stanley many times over the years, does not mean I am a member of KISS or could even play a fricking instrument.

So here goes again

Game going to be LCD or DMD?

DO you have a fully planned playfield layout prepared?

At this point we have to accept for John it is “ALL details TBD. That’s the best you are ever going to get from him. If there was a playfield design, art, game rules, pretty much anything ready to go, it would have been shown. There is not. The plan is there is there will be a plan once the dollars have been obtained. He will make a TPB games of some sort. No further details needed. Silly to ask otherwise.

Anyone giving him dollars better be prepared to accept this. I suppose it is not much different than many startups that have some inkling of an idea and get shoved dollars by VC to go figure out how to actually make it work. It is a faith in the founder and their prior track record. John is running the same playbook on a smaller scale here. I would be interested at some point when all is said and done who agreed to give him money and what their conception of what was supposed to happen is. That is to say where did their faith come from ? Alas we may never know, the rest of us, the unfaithful.

Maybe Turner Pinball can hire John

I’m sincere in my hope that this happens.

John, you could at least post pics of the ramps you plan to use, that will shut the naysayers down.

Already had my response earlier today instantly removed from the Deeproot thread, go figure that one for yourself. So likely you will not see me posting there. Maybe the sleuths can find it or not.

Why would I show a playfield design up here. It would only be trashed by the same people here, not my whales. I said earlier most likely going Fast Pinball. My usual vendors & contractors, plus the additional help & expertise I need within reason of plan a or b.

So we are talking about what ? This thread exists because ? I personally have given up on convincing you to do otherwise. So that’s out. You aren’t going to reveal any details. So what are we doing here ?

Yes why are people still here that have zero interest in this project. I am still here since the revised deadline seeking whales is August 1, up from September 1. Might give me more time for my 6 month build which the same people say cannot be done. Been pretty open about my process here, & who I know or do not know. Same with the project might die from the start.

In light of today’s announcements, who will we see a working pinball machine from first: John or Turner Pinball?

I might have no money, but I am retired. Have the team ready to help get the build done by March 2023. I think Chris Turner has a lot more on his mind then getting a pinball machine by then. Here I will say Dave Fix, & leave it at that. If Chris wants to reach out I would be happy to offer some advice. Pinball Production Is Hard!

Yup. “Dave fix.” ‘Nuff said!

Did anyone ask you to show a playfield design? NOPE. You were simply asked if you had a completed playfield layout or drawing. As usual, side step any question of importance.

Great which’s reluctance to embrace TurnerRoot really calls into question his sincerity.

Why wouldn’t you explore this union? It just makes too much damn sense.

I relistened to the SAPS interview with David Fix. Here is the quote [emphasis mine]:

"There are two new companies on the horizons that are going to be releasing pins in the next year or two. Two new companies in the Chicagoland area. Wow!"

He then immediately goes on to talk about deeproot as a separate topic, so it seems to me that neither of the two companies that GWJ is talking about were related to the Turner announcement. How many companies can this market support?

Agree that Turner was not being counted among the two new companies talk.

The pinball bubble:
Stern
JJP
Spooky
CGC
American
Homepin
Multimorphic
Dutch
Pinball Bros
Haggis
?
?

Quetzal
Pinball Adventures
Ballarama

You said the "b" word. Levi incoming.

Turner.

And I thought one of them was the revival of the Gottlieb name through the rights acquired from Mondial?

I don't know this story. What's the scoop?

Who is going to code this? The coder will have 6 months and no finalized design or finalized ruleset. So in reality, the coder will have max 3 months to code an entire machine. An experienced coder would charge a whale of a fee, so it looks like this cheaper person will need to learn mpf in that three months too. Ludicrous.

And the shallow code line doesn't cut it. The game still needs all the basics, which aren't very basic, development-wise.

This issue alone almost guarantees that this game will not be even close to done in 6 months. John, plan for a year at the very, very least.

John mentioned FAST Pinball so they'd likely use Mission Pinball Framework (MPF)

MPF can be configured completely via scripts and pre-defines, entire games can be made in this method. It's still beyond a boomer barfly but you don't need a Lyman Sheats either.

His timeline is still insane. The fact he won't take advice from Josh who worked on the insane Houdini turnaround.... Dumb.

6 months is the timeline. I had my comment removed very early on the Deeproot - Chris Turner breakout today. It was not by me, & gone it seemed in seconds of posting. Guess I will focus my attention here.
My understanding from Dave Fix talk was 2 new pinball companies the next 2 years in Illinois, not another one like Chris Turner. From my dealings like I have said there maybe more players coming in southern USA! Pretty sure the companies are not already known, but who knows. The Gottlieb mention I had no idea, but thought that would be logical since Haggis got into remakes with PPS. Interesting times are a coming to the industry.

John I think more people would be interested if you have secured the license. You still don't have that?
I want an NHL pin and looking for investors totalling 6 figures before I secure the license..cmon man

Well, we don't wish you too fail. We're just 110% positive that you will with your current plan. At least we can look forward to the pinside drama.

There is a hockey tie in with the TPB on Wednesday. See if you or the sleuths figure that one out. I will wait to August 1 to see what the numbers are.

John knows what he is capable of and he’s sticking to it. He doesn’t need other peoples experience to know how fast it can be done, he knows instinctively what timeline he can meet. If you were as good and capable as he knows he is, you too could have finished in just a few months. Some people would call this a pipe dream. Not John. He’s been contemplating it for well over a year, the entire game plan is mapped out in his head for the next 6 months. And the team he is working with is unlike any that has been assembled before. Just you wait and see mister. Well … or it might die as he is also fond of saying to throw people off the track.

Is there anyone silently hoping that TPB doesn’t grant a license as a way of letting everyone back out of the fiasco with little actual damage done ?

Or it moves forward & a bunch of guys wait to see what is going on with TPB pinball machine prototype of 1 or more. Only 6 days to go. Ben does not think I have a coder, there is one for the project like I said previously.

The guy has a pinball & video game connection. Ben I had to take Fortran & Basic at College, along with drinking.

Punch cards and GOTOs. Fond memories. Don't forget to reserve some time to learn object-oriented programming in Python to write the inevitable custom functions in MPF.

If TPB doesn't work out will you consider a different theme or it dies?

Yes John but as you leak details you seem to again be skipping over the important questions: has your guy ever fully coded a pinball before and if so how long did it take him to do so.

I own 50 pinball machines. I still actively code and design electronics for my own medical device company. I’ve refurbished a machine from top to bottom. Played around with Visual Pin design. Hell, when I was a kid I sent in my pinball designs to Williams and got a letter back from Steve Kordek and also used Brøderbund Pinball Construction Set. And one of my good friends designed all the Bally replacement boards we all use.

So I know lots of things like you and know lots of people too. And what that experience informs me (as every other person has tried to tell you that has even more experience than me at this) is that you are underestimating the enormity of the task in front of you in the timetable you have set.

It’s seriously almost better that you don’t share details of the team. That way it doesn’t further undermine the already shaky ground you are standing on.

Hey I can’t dissuade you from doing this, but at least get some realistic plan and time table in front of you. Right now it’s looking a lot like you called up your buds and said “Hey dude I wanna build a pinball machine. If that sounds neat wanna help ?”. And the response of “Sure bro, never done that before but it can’t be too hard, count me in” means in your mind this can be done in 6 months

Hockey is fine, but I would avoid NHL logos if I were you.

John, are your friends that promised to help retired or they still have their day job?