+4 on that..

These are a must have IMO. If they don't have them I will install them right away but would be much better if they cut decals and installed them straight from the factory.

white and how bouncy it is sucks IMO. To each their own.

Yes, I agree 100%! If PPS doesn't have those or something similar factory installed your likely going to see plenty of unhappy customers posting pictures of messed up decals complaining about quality of the pin. Simple item like those cabinet protectors that prevent the legs from ever touching the cabinet would put that worry to rest.

Well as a company that is new to the manufacturing game it is probably important that customers trust what you say. Those that got in on the LE had to go off of very little information and put down 1K to secure it. Standard owners have the luxury of being able to wait to see how the LE run goes before putting money down. That is unless they want the game sooner rather than later and are willing to put down a deposit. So there was an incentive for people to make the jump and be in on the project early not the first time we have seen that happen.

_{Post edited by The_Dude_Abides : I edited the post before you got your response posted. Point is LE buyers had to act quick not knowing all the details. I know I didn't}

This link may be of some use to you in the future then.
http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/medieval-madness-remake-updates

Thanks for the kind words!

No problem hope it makes it a little easier for some to keep up on the latest. I'll do my best to keep it as up to date as possible.

Yeah I could care less as well. But to each their own.

No problem Keith glad to try and help fellow pinheads out when I can.

Any idea on when the decision will be made by WMS to approve or not?

I believe you can also hold left flipper down while plunging to send it around the loop for a super skill shot as well.

I think this is more user bias. I've had plenty side by side and there was no glaring deficiency in regards to cabinet construction in either direction IMO. Sorry don't want to derail the thread just couldn't keep my trap shut.

Yeah we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one.

DAMN YOU Ted!! Why won't you just let us disagree on our disagreement to not agree...

No it's not sorry man. Are you the type that just can't stand that others see things differently than you?? Sorry you if had difficulty with yours I've never had a problem with one of my newer Stern cabs so far thankfully. I don't care about measuring in my time owning them never have they had issue nor did I think they felt inferior in any way.

Thanks for your permission chief!

Okay then your right no one but you has the right to an opinion on the matter since you think your opinion on how they feel when you play them is 'fact'. Back on subject there is no reason to even discuss this any further.

Their trying to make this thing happen its going to take some time/work. I'm sure when there is a worthwhile update Rick will let us know.

Yeah the black chrome looks pretty slick to I probably prefer that over standard chrome on this title myself.

I agree looks good to me as well plus you get the durability of powder coat. If you can get a nice black chrome look from a powder coat that would be the best way to go IMO.

You have the option to go stainless steel for the original look. So what is the problem with providing a durable option for the armor that many people think looks great? They would not be forcing anyone to do anything since the original steel look for the armor has always been and still is an option. I think the black chrome powder coat option looks better than the gold personally so I am glad Rick is looking into some different potential options.

It's an open forum and in this thread I've seen suggestions/observations/concerns being voiced by customers and responded to by Rick. Which is a good thing in my view. If you want just updates go here.

http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/medieval-madness-remake-updates

I love how a few online members is considered a wave. This is one of the most loved pins of all time and with all the other LE stuff selling for near $8K I highly doubt they will have trouble selling at the very least 1,000 units.

Okay dude glad it makes sense to you. Still makes no sense to me but to each their own. I personally am not paying 15-20K for an 20 year old pin simply because it has a Williams logo on it when I can get a NIB Remake that uses newer technology for $8K.

So who cares if 5 guys dropped out or that someone knew 5 that dropped out? These 'strong arguments' tend to be made by people that don't really want the project to have success whom have little access to actual information. Those that tend to make these type of claims are primarily by current owners or restorers. It's doubtful there is any wave of drop outs and am pretty darn sure they will sell all 1,000 LE models easily next year.

Yeah it seems black nickle would be too expensive and does have it's problems. Have you considered trying to get a metallic black powder coat? I think that would address the looks and durability concerns.

Okay already we get it you don't like that they are remaking one of the best pins ever and that people are actually buying it. Not to mention you won't be able to flip it. Why do you insist on continually raining on the parade of those that want the pin? Your concerns sarcastic remarks and dislike are well documented. Just let it go man.

I'd rather have a NIB Remake than pay more for a 20 year old pin that is a cold hard fact.

Awesome Ill be at PAGG can't wait!!!

Don't buy so many of the high priced pins and price will go down to point more people will buy what you have in stock. I think it is more reaching a price brink with how high Stern LE and regular models of JJP are wanting to sell their pins for. If customers don't buy then distributors eventually wont buy and manufacturers then know they can't go past that point. IMO pricing has gotten out of hand and that is the probable reason for your not selling what you have in stock as quickly.

You can not prevent new companies from entering the pinball manufacturing arena nor can you prevent pinheads from buying from them regardless of the argument. Prices on NIB pins should come down IMO if new competition helps facilitate that then I am all for it.

You've said your piece repeatedly now. Please don't continue to troll an update thread.

I can answer that one with a simple no. LEDs just don't look like incandescent bulbs no matter what you do to them. LED light is brighter and their colors are much more vibrant than incandescent bulbs. I know not all will like that but I for one am very thankful that they are using LEDs as they are much less stressful on a pins hardware (less heat) and are brighter.

News flash guys just about every new pin from here on out remake or not will have LEDs in them. Why? Because they put way less strain/heat on the hardware and provide more light with much richer color. For the most part color matching inserts except for orange and yellow is the best way to go when LEDs are used. Using white many times make the inserts look washed out.

LEDs will not look like incandescent bulbs guys just not gonna happen. I for one am glad they are doing what just about every maker of new pins is doing which is using LEDs for all lighting needs. I do agree that it needs to be right with no flicker or strobing. I haven't noticed any of that on new sterns or WOZ and have faith that PPS will get it right.

Well please let me know when it's done I'd love to come down and give it some play! Congrats on getting WMS approval that was a huge step in the right direction. Best of luck to you and the team going forward many of us pinball addicts are hoping you knock it out of the ball park.

Footiefakes??

Please lets not make this thread all about you. You've said your piece we get your stance.

I'm very aware how discussions on forums work. I'm here to make sure members don't make threads all about themselves. So I allowed him to respond to some inquiries and then asked him to stop for a while and allow others to discuss.

I am a little confused why some on here talk as if they know more about Rick's/PPS business then they themselves do. It is pretty evident that this project was started at least a year before the announcement was made. This project has likely been planned and in development for longer then many would think. How does an outsider have a better understanding than PPS on how much progress has been made towards final production at this point? They already have a test machine that got a thumbs up from Sharpe and was performing well enough to gain WMS approval. They seem to be moving full steam ahead with 4-5 months to dial things in.

Yes this is a pinball discussion forum, however, it is not solely 'your' pinball discussion forum. There are other things/topics people want to discuss here other then this over and over again. I see no reason for you to criticize how buyers here act as it is their money and if they are happy with the progress and plan then so be it. You have no solid evidence to demonstrate why the project needs more time other than this is a new platform. We get your point. However, some of us think that due to you have no real clue as to how far along this project really is that you are basing most of your comments on pure speculation. You have explained your position on the subject over and over now I am asking you for a second time to let it go an allow the thread to move in a different direction.

Well we will have to agree to disagree on this one he's taken up about a page of this thread making wild speculation regarding this project and how much time will be needed to complete it. Not based on any knowledge/facts of how long the project has been worked on or even how much headway they have made but upon pure speculation. When that happens a maker has every right to call them out IMO.

It's more so some claiming to know where the project is at and how much time would be needed to ship out a quality working machine. Questioning is fine but indicating that PPS is somehow skipping steps or insisting that their timeline is way off without any information to back it up what so ever is another thing.

Discussing does not mean you or any other party taking over the thread. You can say your piece without trying to take over the direction of the entire thread man. Stating a stance over and over does not really add to the discussion it just adds to the number of times others need to read it over and over again. Your welcome to disagree but that is not going to change my stance on preventing members from trying to take over or troll threads on Pinside.

I did not indicate it was you but moreso the one you kept trying to defend. I did not tell you to stop at this point but if I did then you would be expected to stop that's how it works. IMO you are getting very close to the point where I ask you to give it a bit of a rest here. This thread is not about you or me it's about a remake and a new company trying to put out their first pin. Lets drop this topic from here on out and move on please.

Testing has not begun so discussing what they 'missed' in testing is pretty premature. Of course we can sit here and speculate all day but until testing of prototypes begins that's just what it is. I get your points but as I said above please leave it alone and move on.

I agree 100% that is one reason I liked how Stern went about making ST pretty much the same gameplay/layout minus some nice bling of course.

Thanks for understanding. I agree it is a difference but not a big one IMO. That said, I'm not a huge fan of kickbacks so that could be the reason behind my indifference. The LE VUK does slow the game down a bit and returns to the flipper but even that IMO is a somewhat small difference. LE is definitely easier but to some that is not always preferable by all. Sometimes I like a little extra challenge like on the ST Pro. As always to each their own were not all gonna like the same stuff. The layout is exactly the same was my main point gameplay is slightly different IMO. Sorry to go off topic guys. I guess what I was trying to say is I would prefer all LE models have very small or even non existing gameplay/layout differences from the standard models as like with MMR.

Would price be pretty consistent with what is out there or would it be more affordable to add? If you don't know at this point I understand just figured I'd ask.

Double ditto.

Careful now lets not go making too much sense.

I HATE white rubbers and would never put them on any of my pins. I know they have become the 'in' thing but IMO they are way too bouncy. There is a reason almost no manufacturers put white rubbers in their pins.

I know it's crazy that people that are willing to drop $8K on a pin want options right. Just joking around man but IMO buyers have every right to ask for certain options and sometimes they even get them. So where is the harm in asking?

Well played sir, well played.

Not according to Cliffy. You don't want to put them on beat up spots they won't work as intended. I've always put Cliffys in shooter lane area it causes no damage and totally prevents wear in that area. IMO it's a no brainer to protect high wear areas before damage is done. Especially on high prices pins.

Yup agree to disagree I can always do that. When people buy my pins they know they will be protected with little to no wear in typical wear areas. I think that could be why I usually have no problem selling when I need to.

Well if that's the case MMR will likely be the first and last remake I purchase. I just don't think many pins have the appeal to sell for $8K plus shipping (in large numbers). I could definitely be wrong about that I know.

No I don't think that would be the reason.. Go back through RGP and see why SR says he puts black rubbers in his pins. Plus black rubbers actually make the playfield look much dirtier from the debris. That said, I'd rather have to clean more often then to play with bouncy whites on.

No but it sounds like it may be time for me to give 'em a shot though.

Yup been there many times before myself. Another reason to look into the rubbers mentioned above.

It is if your trying to bounce pass.

Good luck waiting for a 5K MMR. You may be waiting a very long time. Most getting MMR have played it a ton and know they love it. For that reason I think many buyers will be holding onto it for a long while.

Will there be an easy way to access 12 V power to hook splitters up to? I know that is probably a silly question but I am a silly man.

Please guys knock off all the political talk and lets try to keep this thread on topic. All other random topics can be discussed in new/different threads.

I understand having options has to provide frustrations for you all at PPS. I don't understand how it is a big ask to provide customers paying $8K+ for a remake with some options like type of glass (standard or something like invisiglass) and trim color. What you see as mistake may be for the best even if it causes some headache(s). With all the new pin buying options this type of dedication to customers could very well distinguish you from others manufacturers and generate more buyers in the end.

Of course there are way more important details then the trim color I think most understand that. So far you guys have done a great job in developing the remake and handling dialogue with the community. Many of these machines are going into collectors homes offering a few options on such a high priced remake shows you care about us picky pinball addicts. I can assure you it definitely doesn't/wont hurt your chances of getting more of my money in the future if you do end up remaking more.

I know bit of a bummer for all of us Nor Cal buyers I guess it's just how it goes sometimes. The Bay Area has a good amount of NIB pin buyers sure would be nice to be able to see and play it in person. With PPS located locally I thought it was a lock to be at both of our shows this year. I'd also be interested in knowing if we can play it at the San Jose location and/or at CAX.

Wow so awesome to have 3 options for the LEs. Thanks PPS you all rock! Us pinball addicts salute you

_{Post edited by The_Dude_Abides: I was incorrect we have 3 options}

Shiny black looks great thanks for the options! I edited my post to avoid any confussion.

How much is it to add the invis glass option? I remember reading it would be an option and less than it is usually but haven't seen anything more about it? When a friend contacted a distributor the were basically charging how much it is usually. Just wondering if there is a bit a discount on adding it to LE.

Thanks for clarifying Rick that is totally understandable I'd hate for production to get held up by this sort of thing. So far I haven't tried anything like this due to the high cost. Is this something you prefer MMR buyers to contact you after receiving their pin or should we try and get in touch with you before? I did not order my MMR LE from PPS as you were sold out would the discount apply to me as well?

I realize that this is not high priority for you as you begin with producing a run of your first pin. I've just been tempted to get some anti-reflective glass and figured a MMR LE would be a good way to try it out. If you don't want to deal with this right now I totally understand and will bring it up after production is up and running.

Ship has sailed with color choices guys. I think PPS has already gone well beyond others by listening to their buyers and offering up a variety of options. No other pin maker has done this. It is not all that simple and adds some more steps in production process but they still decided to offer a variety pretty damn cool of em IMO.

Well to my knowledge standards never have been and likely never will be more valuable then LEs. Name one standard edition of any pin that sells for more then the LE. I personally don't like having different models but it's how things are now days.

On a toy this expensive options should be offered. Weird to me how so many pinheads ask makers to do less to keep the drama/hardship down. Really on a pin that is a remake that cost $8K plus shipping?? Well I for one want more options at that price tag not less.

I see your point but disagree of the end result. So Rick has had to deal with some online bickering. So what this is an $8K plus shipping product. Makers seem to always want things their way like pay 3 years in advance, put down $1K well before we ship, buy our product sight unseen because it is an "LE" and it will sell out, wait 1-2 years for complete code and so on.

Now we the people who buy these expensive toys that allow makers to well make money finally get some options and I should feel bad the maker has some extra hardship? I'm sorry but for too long makers have been taking advantage of us pinball addicts. IMO to compete going forward with so many new manufacturers they are going to have to cater a little more to their customers. I in no way feel bad about that.

We sure are a whiny group.

On a somewhat non-whiny subject I picked up some of the glare resistant glass Rick made available for a discounted price at BAA open house and have to say I am impressed. Did have a different coating then the other glass out there but was very happy with how it looks while up and playing. I'm glad I picked it up.

No IMO that is not true. I have them in a dimly lit room and I did notice the difference and thought it was a worthy upgrade. The discount price was around $165. It's not about reducing the glare to zero at all it is more about the experience when your standing right up to the machine you can't really see any glass between you and the playfield. I'm definitely happy with the purchase and if I get a chance to snag a few at a discounted price in the future I will.

Another reason I'm glad you offered a glossy black trim option. Matches art best and does not clash with hinges.

PS you can never gauge flipper strength accurately at expos as the electricity is always overloaded. As noticed with WOZ at shows was weak but just fine in non overloaded environment.

Okay give the useless posts a rest please and keep it on topic.

I'm not to concerned about being in front of the line at all with the rate at which Stern builds pins. We will all have them in short order once production begins. Sorry not trying to sidetrack but rather add a bit of perspective.

Okay guys look the pin is not shipping with the mechs. That's life no matter what you think about it thats the way it is. If it's really that big of a deal to you then don't buy it. If your not buying it then there is really no need to complain non stop about it IMO.

I think they should be included but it is a small cheap thing I can do on my own if I want so I'm not concerned. I just want to be playing my MMR ASAP.

I'd rather have a shaker, choice of color for trim, LED lighting, new hardware then I would a coin mech. Do Sterns ship with coin mechs? yes. However, do current Stern LE or other models ship with shakers? No. Do you get to choose from a variety of trim options even for LE models? No. Which would you rather have a $200 item or a few dollar coin mech? I'll happily take the shaker and other options over a coin mech even if I have to order/install one in the future.

Haha.. You and others are harping on a few dollar item. I'm pointing out I think it's silly to harp on such a small thing when PPS has offered a lot of cool things/choices that are much more expensive. If that's not a valid or obvious point to you then I'm happy to agree to disagree.

You and others have made your point your upset it doesn't come with mechs. Some of us don't really care which is fine to see it different. However, when it gets to page after page of hearing the same complaint over and over it seems to be taken too far by some.

No the recent releases did not to the best of my knowledge.

Perhaps but it becomes pretty clear we are a whinny bunch when we harp much more on a mech then we do to the other more expensive items being included. I get stating a disappointment regarding the mechs not coming with it. However, do we really need pages of complaining? You can make a point on a forum without trying to take over a thread. Some have a tough time realizing that.

I as a paying customer don't care about the mechs Rick. Thanks for producing MMR and giving us LE buyers so many cool options/features! Can't please everyone but overall your doing a hell of a job.

Now that's something most of us actually care about!

Why don't you guys create a separate "were enraged over the no coin mechs" so the discussion here can remain about updates and other things regarding MMR. You've all stated your frustration here over and over and over we get it. I think it's time to give it a rest in this thread from this point forward and if you want a different topic to discuss this already tired subject you all are welcome to do that.

No he said he's done with that topic not all Pinside in general.

Because IMO the subject and those that won't let it go are getting close to trolling at this point. You guys have made your point here it's time to move on or start another thread. Rick has addressed how PPS will handle the issue and welcomed direct contact if further clarification is needed.

I've asked for it to stop (in this thread) and you don't have to like it but if it continues past this point there will be thread bans handed out.

Right there with you man. I just can't wait to get the first announcement and or pics of MMR LE's rolling down that line. Once that happens I know it won't be long.

Darn I sure hope MMR LE will be ready to rip through the line as soon as AC/DC production ends! Hopefully things are ready to roll at that time. Would be a little frustrating watching Stern run something other then MMR LE after AC/DC.

I'm not sure but don't think it would take Stern longer then 2 weeks to get out as many of them as they wanted to get out. I could be wrong on that of course.