Well, Rick did tell us pics were coming....

This might be heresy, but is there any appetite out there for having an option for a manual shooter over the "big stoopid red button".

MM is an all time great game, no doubt. It would just be a little better with a manual shooter rod. I have no idea how big of a deal it would be to engineer this as an option, but MM with a manual shooter = awesome. MM with the button = I guess I'll press it to play one of the greatest games ever

here you go..

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It's ok, the lockdown that pinball life sells is in two pieces so its never been spot welded and therefore doesn't have the dimples. You powder or plate the pieces apart. Then once the powder or plating is applied you use gorilla glue and a couple c clamps to fasten it. It works extremely well and has a fantastic clean look.

I think you are alone on this as it makes absolutely no sense.

Absolutely, and based on what he said, they should be here today at the latest. I guess my only point was, there was more to think about for him than just snapping a few pics and throwing them up on Pinside. He has other things to consider and maybe that's the delay.

Quite possibly

I am in the possibly small camp that thinks that taking the manual plunger away makes for a less skillful and interesting game.

On a game with a manual plunge if you fire the ball off and it drains within seconds you know who's fault it is... yours. You gave the ball the initial momentum, you set it on its way, and you got a result that was not to your liking. Too bad.

With a "Press a button" launcher you press a button and try to get control before the game screws you; as an added minus the ball is launched with nearlty the exact same force each time. That seems less interesting to me.

I find it unlikely this would be an ordering option, but what the heck. For my 8K it can't hurt to ask.

Troll Bombs.

Doh; I admit I had forgotten about that... Oh well. I guess you would need further mods like an AC/DC style lock down bar and at that point I am probably in crazy town

Population me... and the guy from post #4 on this thread...

http://rgparchive-removed.com/rgpforum/showthread.php?t=108351

Honestly this would make the game "better" IMO, but I can't see it happening.

Looks like the board set they are going to use is the same as JJP, it is at the very least the same "board model"(most stuff in the lower cabinet, single small board in upper cabinet). Am I off base here?

Naw you're on the money. A 5" squared CPU board in the head and the driver boards in the bottom cabinet (closer to the components they control) is the way it's been stated.

The placement and relative size of the boards may be similar, but it is far from the same board set. JJP is PC based, and the MMR pictures we've seen almost certainly show a BeagleBone Black, which uses an embedded ARM processor. It's more like the processor in a smartphone than a PC.

The pictures of the driver boards are just too blurry to make anything out.

Not at all. I was just excited to see there was a true HUO one out there. I didn't think there were any.

I agree. I don't like the buttons for plunging. Maybe they make the BOM cheaper...or Williams was trying to seem more modern.

No.

Little board to run things in the head.

Three driver boards ( identical, interchangeable ) mounted under the playfield. ( with protection over them so nothing can get though the playfield and get on top of them ).

LTG : )

Sounds like a great idea!

I doubt Roger Sharpe would sign off on that big of a change, especially one you can see.

LTG : )

I asked this before, but what are the plusses of getting rid of a matrix system.

It's going to be interesting to see how big these driver boards are and how they're mounted. You sure as hell don't want to have to remove a driver board to get to lamp/coils/switches that might be mounted between the board and the playfield (you sure better not have to... that would probably be a show stopper for me). They're going to have to be in spots where there isn't much there and that's a hard thing on that playfield...

Jaz

Well, the pluses of USING a matrix system are less outputs required on the processor/system at the expense of higher overhead. This reduces the amount of drive circuits needed in things like lamps but adds complexity. Also, the matrix system reduces the number/amount of wires.

So, the advantage of NOT using a matrix system would be one circuit for one output or input. Easier to diagnose what is going on. But, there is more wires needed for this.

Jaz

I may be delusional but maybe Rick has been absent from this thread because he's busy sorting through the hundreds of amazing high resolution MMR LE photos he received and trying to decide which ones to post...

In my custom game, and not saying it is the same, the boards are about 3"x8" and are mounted on brackets perpendicular to the playfield. I would not see why the boards in this case would be any bigger. I also placed them where there is the least amount of under playfield items, but also central to the items they were driving, to minimize wire distances.

It seems like all games with a launch button do so for skill shot reasons. MM - the only skill shot is the top lanes - so there's no reason for a light plunge. However on CV (similar era), the skill shot is a target that can only be hit with a skillful plunge.

That is a fact it is cheaper to put in launch button than a plunger assembly. I would guess that was the only reason for doing it as well. There's already a coil in place in the shooter lane, so the plunger assembly could be considered redundant (good for reliability to plunge a ball, higher cost).

I believe you can also hold left flipper down while plunging to send it around the loop for a super skill shot as well.

Will the LED brightness on the inserts be adjustable? I've seen a few MM's with LED's and the brightness kind of overwhelmed the beautiful playfield artwork.

Yes, super skill shot by holding the left flipper down sends the ball through the loop and requires an immediate (lit) shot up ramps, loops, catapult, etc. If you make it, hurry up at the castle lights. In my opinion this is really the only skill shot you should be making.

It's still yet to be seen what tech PPS is going to use as their alternative, if it will be like JJPs or a different style of bus system.

I *think* JJP uses a shift register style system for their LEDs. I don't have a WoZ and have never seen one, so I am going off my own conjecture based on what I've seen said here on Pinside.

Matrices have an inherent "scanning" problem. To activate a node in a matrix, the matrix has to step through the columns or rows depending on which way you make it move. For example, it sets all the bits in the matrix rows, then powers up Column 1. Then, it turns off Column 1, sets all the bits in the rows for col. 2, and then turns on column 2 briefly. Repeat over and over for every column in the matrix, looping back to col. 1 when you reach the end.

Depending on the speed of your clock, that scanning can cause a visible effect in lights.

Same is true for switch matrices. The processor has to scan through the matrix to see if a switch has been hit. It checks all of column 1, then 2, then 3, etc.... If a switch gets activated and deactived in column 1 while it's checking other columns, the switch hit gets missed. Luckily with pinball, switches stay "pressed" long enough for way more than 1 cycle of the scanning process, so switch hits don't really get missed.

A bus system ensures that everything gets it's rightful chance to communicate back to the processor.

Does that help?

i-was-told-there-would-be-no-math.jpg

Now I understand......

I like to think I am good at math, but when letters start replacing numbers in equations....you can throw it out the window

That answers my question. Just like matrices were used to eliminate wires on pinball machines, busses have been used on automobiles to do the same. The only problem being that they have now added wires for functions that never really needed them. Like using the cars PCM to activate the horn.

Whaaa?

Killing-Them-Softly-Frankie-Russell-71.jpg

Shooter rod or Dragon on right ramp, Brian Eddy went with the dragon,

PPS / Rick - Quick question. Can you please post some pictures of MMR or explain the reason for the delay in posting them? Thanks!

Maybe he's still sick. He has probably been under a bit of stress lately, I'd imagine.

Rick is busy at his office working on pending MMRLE orders.

image-337.jpg

This is, IMO, the greatest skill shot sequence in the history of pinball. Just one of many charms of the best pinball machine ever made.

I was not aware of this, and for location play he made the right call.

Buying one for my house, I would gladly pay a bit more for the shooter rod...

Wow!

Now THAT'S what I'm talkin' about!!
More! More!

WOW. Looking mighty impressive Rick, thank you.

LTG : )

Not bad for a refake huh??
It's gonna be GREAT!!!!!

Way less wires than a Ford Fusion!

I do like less wires. Looks good so far.

less wires...tastes great!

Love the fact there is still a real knocker in the backbox.

Not bad, not bad at all.

I can't wait to get my fingers in one of these.

LTG : )