Mine does.

Again the MMr platform could be bulletproof time will tell. On a side note I bought a new HE washing machine for my wife and the controller board ($400 part) burned out a few months after the waranty expired (my 15 year old washer that I replaced worked perfectly since it was new)
When it comes to new electronics I am a skeptic.

How "original" are we talking here? When we're talking new decals and a repro playfield is it still original?

That's not fair. Rick only posted that this afternoon. A few days ago, he said he had no idea what was going on with colorization after there were a number of related questions on the PPS board. Then it was that the production delays caused a resource delay in having work done on colorization (very odd and still unexplained how they could be/are related).

NOW he reports there is someone from CG working on colorization (and presumably the tearing issue). But if there was anyone working on it before today, Rick was downright foolish not to say that when he punted to CG on the issue.

You guys kill me! I guess, if somebody gave you ALL a primo ORIGINAL MM, you wouldn't take it. You ALL say, you all would rather have the MMR. Well while you talk about the the great MMR build! I will continue to play my minty original MM. As 2014, comes to an end, so does your chances of you all getting your MMR! See if 2015, is any better for you?

I don't know how "minty" your 20 year old MM is but I will take a brand new MMr. I dunno...Maybe it's that new pinball smell.

what in the world ...? who is saying they wouldn't take a free MM? i sure would. however, before MMR, one would have cost me like $15,000. for that price, no thank you.

most of the people posting in this thread seem to prefer the original, actually. maybe "all" means something different where you're from?

missed these posts too, although i did see several people point out we don't yet know whether MMR will be a better or worse build quality or more reliable than MM.

gloating and taunting, what a wonderful way to interact with fellow pinball fans. merry christmas to you too.

Pezpunk, you are correct! I apologize to all. For a year now, since the MMR announcement my MM has took a value nose dive. These post keep popping up and people keep bashing the original machines versus the remakes. Not even proven yet, I am sure it will, but?

I don't think so

I ordered a MMR and it amazes me that their is so much negativity on this site! It kind of takes the fun out of it. Even though I own a original AFM and MB I would still consider selling my originals to have a fresh new game when they make those (if they ever do so). Originals are old depreciated equipment even though you might have given them a face lift. Problems with the old electronics are inevitable. Who wants an old worn out machine with a face lift if they can upgrade to new like original or better for the same price or less?

Many of you will think I do not know what I am talking about so who cares anyway?

Imagine how frustrated Rick must be after reading all these negative posts. Guys who ordered MMr KEEP THE FAITH ! Don't fret over this non-sense negativity!

MHO Rob

Old depreciated equipment? Who cares? Most hobbiests can't depreciate their machines.

Problems with originals may be inevitable. But fixes to those problems are already known.

If your AFM and MB machines are crap, maybe replacing them with repros makes sense. But if they are nice, why bother? We have no idea how reliable the new electronics will be in the remakes or even what the remakes will cost.

You sound like a shill for PPS.

Hardly a shill, just a guy with a valid opinion. You've already posted on over 10% of this thread..time for a different obsession maybe?

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^^ that ^^

I played MMr on location at Logan's in Chicago (best arcade in the country?) last weeks.
It has lots of pros and cons to the original IMO.

Just opinions...

Cons of MMR
The light boards are interesting I didn't care for the all cool white led board and guess what it's not a bulb you can't change the color...is there a dimming feature in the settings?

Mono color DMD is a drag...why don't they just hire color DMD? But I hope he works it out regardless and it doesn't cost the LE owners a penny... They waited through with PPS and that is kind of a big deal imo.

Armor if the gold is the same as the games at expo it doesn't look good.

Pros
Games will be brand new...brand new in box!

Flippers and other coils have adjustable strength right? That's badass.

I like the translite the images are the same but they present better on MMR imo.

Stock shaker

Unknowns

Stern QC
Support from PPS
Dependability of parts

To answer your origional question I would keep the one you get a better deal on.
The MMR I played was nice I'd be happy if I got one

I'll be around tomorrow all day 408-891-7878 anyone that has any questions on any of these topics, just give me a call - it's 5 mins on the phone vs wasting everyone's time here. If I don't answer I'm probably doing something that is probably important, so either try back or I'll call you back.

thanks,
rick

MMR is for operator
MM original is for collector

sound quality is bad on MMR , no possibility to replace by pinsound system, no colored DMD and you can't change by your own led colors.

There you go again. Updates: sound, LEDs, modern tech (say you prefer old. Just say it). SHAKER....extra clear on playfield....powder coat...and, sooner or later, color DMD.

So, spend $$$ on whatever these 17 year old games are going for....add another $1,000 for a shaker and a color DMD and some powder...and you're almost to a brand, spanking new MM(r).

Hundreds of people have now reported that the game plays like the original....so the best you have is worrying about reliability? Worry away Mary.

Posted on your Commodore 286? Or maybe an original Mac?

My commodore 64 is way more reliable than any PC I have had since. just sayin.

But does it have extra CLEAR??!!

I would just answer the questions here, save you and others a bunch of time.

I'll give you "valid opinion", as I think any opinion is valid.

But to say AFM and MB owners should sell their games and "upgrade" to new remakes is pretty far out there. If you can do it with no net additional costs, maybe. But otherwise, the concept has shill written all over it.

Answering questions that many have here is far more efficient than having multiple phone calls on the same topics.

He didn't say all owners should, he said he would consider it. That's hardly advocating everyone to.

I have played some very minty MMs, but the best I ever played was an MMR. It had all the charm of the original, and none of the... 15 yrs old!

It played like a NIB MM. I don't get the objection whatsoever. Yes, there is some new tech under the hood, but it's not like it's experimental hydrogen fuel cells??!! It's tried and true electronics. Just a streamlined version of the original using the latest tech.

I'd be proud to have either in my collection, if the price was right.

Tried and true electronics? Really....

Maybe if people weren't so asinine and didn't hang on every word he posts in some online forum as some sort of contractual obligation or didn't demand information that no privately held company would be willing to divulge, then it would be more efficient to post here. Since this is obviously not the case, I completely understand why he wants to field questions via telephone. I am in no way saying communication has been perfect so far, but I do believe Rick has made a good faith effort to relay information in a way most other pinball manufacturers are unwilling to attempt. This is a service most companies, whether pinball related or not, never provide.

I think there is a place for both MM and MMR for collectors. I almost jumped on the chance at pre-ordering an MMR but a local collector friend of mine had bought a really expensive boat at the beginning of summer and was liquidating some of his higher end B/W titles to pay most of it off. One of them happened to be a HUO MM in excellent condition with all original documentation, manuals, schematics, coin mechs and even goody bag still stapled inside (no this is not what sold me on it)

I crunched some numbers and in case you didn't know Canadians get hosed big time when it comes to exchange rate and taxes. Last June $7995usd converted to $8800cdn and that is really conservative because credit cards always charge a higher rate and so do our banks. Now I have to pay 13% tax on $8800 which is another $1144. I don't think even an MMRLE comes with wings to fly itself to my front door so there is likely another $150-200 shipping charge by my local distributor as well? Regardless you can see it is slowly creeping towards $10k after it is all said and done. If you work on the current exchange rate $7995usd ~ $9300cdn before taxes!

I rationalized my decision in purchasing MM over MMR was that it used the same WPC95 board sets as some of my other games like Congo and TOTAN. I like to work on my own games and sometimes it is really handy to be able to interchange boards or components to test things out. There is also a huge wealth of repair documentation on these games such as clay's old guides or current ninja blog, pinwiki or even posts from users here documenting their problems. If I am stuck I could always drive up to my friend who is a wiz at board work or absolutely worse case throw in a new Rottendog boards.

I'm confident MMR will be great and have talked to many people who have had a chance to play it and they say it plays just like the original. I'm not going to be one to knock it being inferior to the original. The reliability and serviceability of the new board set is still to be determined until it hits the hands of collectors or we see more MMRs do on route. I hope it is a rock solid platform and PPS can continue to re-make other hard to find or out of reach titles.

You can't have your cake and eat it too. Canada also has Northern European-like quality of life and lifespan. Sounds like a reasonable trade-off.

That's the right answer!

Everyone should have a Medieval Madness. Pros/cons for either version. My original plan was to have one of each.

To be fair I think Rick knows that he cannot win with whatever he posts on this forum. I kind of applaud his his stance of if it's that much of a concern call me and I'll personally talk to you. He knows very few people are going to call because in truth all we do on pinside is bicker about a whole lot of nothing. I'm as guilty of it as anyone. I was happy to see clarification on the colorization questions that came up and the production update last week. Hopefully there is another update before Christmas.

OP, buy whatever one you want. The original is tried and true if you can find a nice shopped model you will likely have few issues. The new MMr seems to be holding up well during testing so that at least seems to be a great sign. Imagine how many stern issues would be corrected before production if they had a test game in operation for a month before they started mass production.

That isn't entirely unknowns.

Stern QC - if it's like Stern build quality of the last decade, it will be better than Williams out of the box. And the assembled games goes back to CGC for QC and boxing and shipping.

Support from PPS - me, CGC, ticket desk, phone support.

Dependability of parts - ummm, same as every other Williams part made today. As good as the original.

LTG : )™

Bottom line, not really any place for the price of an original to go but down, so why buy an old one now? Highly unlikely that something coming out of Stern's factory will be poor quality, no matter what the new product will have a warranty, and pretty much every report on the prototypes suggests "it feels the same as an original"... Except for maybe a few HUO williams machines that could be considered "collectible", there's really no way for the price of originals to go back up

I wouldnt kick a MM or a MMR out of my gameroom. Would be nice to have either one. Both are out of my $$ league right now.

On one hand you have paid for a machine that has not been built yet, on the other hand it sounds like you have come across a very nice original that is available now. Pics of the existing machine and price would help here.

I think you just implied you found a nice MM for less than $7995 USD ?

That's cool. Some of us might still be interested in that really nice original you mentioned. Pics or it never happened.

vultures-1.jpg

but... you didn't say that you did not-not pass on the lower cost original either, no?

confused-1.png

Did he say lower cost too?
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i think he said it came with colored coin mechs too. those are delicious.
...but i wasn't really paying attention, was a little distracted...

vulture-2.jpg

Think again.

I would take a nice original. I know what I'm getting and I like to clean and fix games up.
Unless you want a MMR to unbox wait until they are out and see how they preform.
I was very close ordering a WOZ, glad I didn't.
I would never preorder any pin now. I hear about the unfinished codes, bugs, problems and long waits!! No thanks!! But that's just my opinion.

Ok. How about "any opinion is valid except yours"?

Welcome to my ignore list.

How about an opinion is only as valid as the message it conveys? Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but all opinions aren't create equal. There are plenty of invalid opinions. Tough concept to grab, I know.