wow really cool trip!!! would love to do something like that one day

Question about the music. Considering this is a DCS game and the music tracks are pre-rendered, were these enhanced and rendered at 44KHz as part of the overhaul? And if so are the original source instruments also at 44KHz?

Thanks for the tour! Great job.

they may be useing some kind of emulator system that uses the original game rom's

But what about the batteries!?!?

I seriously doubt they are using an emulator. It would involve so many hacks for the color DMD, sound, making it work perfectly which takes years, etc. They probably just compiled the original Williams source code for the BeagleBone's ARM CPU and went from there.

Great write-up! I really wanted to be there but I got stuck at the in-laws garage sale

original uncompressed sound files ...

Do you have access to any of those outtakes posted on the other thread? If you guys could incorporate those, make them an LE feature and then make it operator adjustable to use them or not, that would be awesome.

http://www.pinballnews.com/shows/expo2004/DanForden1.mp3

I'm sure they do. There were some out takes on the original MM web site I did for WMS.

As far as I know though those weren't outtakes, but high quality samples of the original voice masters used in the game?

http://robertwinter.com/pinball/mm/official/mm_sounds.html

You are overlooking inflation. $1.00 back in 1997 is the equivalent of $1.46 now in 2014. Just that alone makes $8K in 2014 equivalent to $5480 in 1997.

And you are overlooking the massive drop in parts and component costs. Not to mention the design was already done.

Before Stern figured out he could soak people for LE's, games were around $5000 in todays dollars.

People need to stop trying to justify $8000 being a reasonable and "needed" price. It was $8000 because originals were going for $15,000 and the demand was there. Period. It's not because that's what they need to charge to make money. Give me a break. Hell, with how quickly they sold out, I bet they were kicking themselves for not asking $9000.

Also, GOOD FOR THEM! Everyone knew the demand was there and they were the only ones who took on the huge effort to get it done. The fact that they pissed off a bunch of greedy collectors is just icing on the cake for me.

I ordered one of the first hundred units and I'm looking forward to it. I hope Cactus Canyon is the next remake. I'm almost positive it is. It's the only Williams machine from that era that would allow a similar profit margin. In fact, I'll bet $100 that it will be the next remake. It'll most likely have to have a lower price as MMR has sucked a ton of cash from the market.

I am not sure how you came up with those numbers, but if you assume 3% inflation compounded for 17 yrs (1.03^17) = 1.65. So that means it takes $1.65 in today’s worthless dollars to buy what a buck did in '97.

We all know that real inflation which includes food, fuel, energy, health care and tuition have gone up 3x or more not some measly 3% annually. So that extra $.65 is total BS.

Another way to look at the erosion of purchasing power is the fact that 1 oz of gold in 1933 before FDR devalued the currency traded for $20 bucks an oz. Now it goes for ~ $1300 oz. Which would you rather have in your possession? That 20 dollar bill from 1933 or a 1 oz Gold Eagle?

My methods for gauging inflation deal with prices of milk, gas, bread, eggs, certain new cars, and the average sized meal at fast food restaurants.

To me, those are the true gauges of inflation. Not the standard 3% most people assume.

I was with you until you wrote that.

I would love to understand the massive drop in parts and component costs ... not sure how qty 1000 in 2014 is gonna be cheaper than 4000 in 1997. Also, there is about $1M+ in electronics development costs. Then there are distributor margins, then there various other development costs, then there is manufacturing costs, then there is ...

oy.

^^^ Don't bother responding anymore. Let your pin speak for itself!

If you can't build an already designed and coded game for less that it costs for development and building of a Stern pro then you should probably rethink some things.

If you think people are stupid enough to believe you are only making a small amount on 8k MMR then... Well... You would probably be right. Lots of gullible and stupid people out there...

Stern doesn't design a pinball platform from scratch with every release. That is the true cost of MMR development.

Well, I'll take that as an improvement in relations.

Back when it was announced, there were tons of "collectors" who slammed them for daring to remake a game that devalued theirs. To me I just think that the more people that have a chance to own a game they love, the better. To actively be against that is just terrible and greedy to me.

I'd like to schedule another MMR open house at Chicago Gaming ... hopefully with more people this time. A little disappointing that in Chicago and as much interest in seeing the game we would hope for more people to come, etc. Let us know when is good timing ... this weekend being holiday is not good, so perhaps next weekend or during the week, etc?

rick

People may need more they just a week to make plans also don't do it on the same nights / days as the local Monthly tournaments

I really wish you were closer!!!

Yes, schedule it out a few weeks so people can adjust their social calendar.

And to actively take pleasure from others losing money like you did is just as bad.

I'd totally do BLACK trim/legs.

I would seriously consider coming for it if I could get a cheap enough flight. Sounds like a great opportunity.

Just looked again. You are correct. Pretty sure I have some others somewhere.

Not only would I take pleasure, I would lick their salty tears.

Greed is despicable and it hurts the hobby(and everything else). Luckily, it didn't seem to be a majority. Most MM owners that I talked to had the attitude of "I love the game and would never sell it anyway" and "I'm glad people with less money will be able to afford one now".

To actually post on here, like some did, things like "I am getting out of this hobby if I cannot trust in my investment" means you couldn't care less about your fellow hobbyists. Buh bye and good riddance. Those douches were the reason for the run-up in prices to begin with and their exit is glorious. All they cared about was themselves.

Maybe on Monday the 26th.

99% of the people have the day off and could come down and check the game out.

If these so called douches didn't run up the prices,Rick would never have built MMR ! Get a grip dude !

http://www.pinsound.org/wp-content/uploads/FH_LEGACY/voice/031308-hey_it_s_only_pinball/hey_it_s__LEGACY__.mp3

did i just see a Krull playfield on that wall? Looked like it.

Nah, he is right. It isn't about the price of MM, rumor has it that Popeye is on track for PopeyeR.

I feel you. I like to watch people drive off of car lots with new cars, just the thought on how much they lost makes my day. When my mom lost money in her Enron stock, I almost peed my pants... peoples' financial misfortunes is just pure comedy gold.

On the flip side, my buddy at work just got a raise, and now he is no longer my buddy.

In reality, I know 4 MM owners and they are not bitter towards MMr being remade. In fact, all are happy that people are getting a chance to get one. I was in line to get the original MMr run in Australia, and it cost me money and time. I literally saved for a couple of years, and sold childhood collectibles to buy one, for a lot less than PPS is running them for now.

Weird thing is, most people that are buying a MMR probably have more money than I do. Just bizarre.

For the record, as a MM owner, I genuinely hope the MMR is a success. It definitely looks like it is. I hope all MM games keep their value as the newer games keep getting more expensive as 99% of the Pinheads need their pins to hold value if they plan on selling or trading their pins to acquire new pins. Most can't just simply write a check from their banking account.

If these so called douches didn't run up the prices, Rick would never have built MMR because the prices would be reasonable and he wouldn't have had to Just playing devils advocate.

if PPS was using the old boardset it might be possible to do a startup remake for less than the original. But the boardset development alone would be a major cost.

Did you guys see that sweet Hollywood Heat playfield on the wall?

Actually you're playing "douches advocate"

I thought the early bitching and moaning from some MM owners was misplaced and I certainly didn't feel sorry for them. That doesn't mean I was happy that they lost their $...just that they were big boys when they bought their $12k toys and they should act like big boys if/when those toys lose their value. It isn't particularly heartbreaking when a rich person loses some pocket change. But it can be annoying as hell when they start crying about it.

But we're all human. I've had a bad day or two myself on Pinside - - and off, so we all move forward as better people, right? MMr is a dream come true, and I'm sure most people feel that way, even those that initially complained.

CCr should of been the first "r" experiment made. There were 900 CC's made compared to 4000 for MM and the collateral damage would of been a lot less.

Weird how people consider people that spend 12k on a MM are the uber rich, while the person who can spend 8k + taxes/shipping are the common man. People in the real world would probably consider them one in the same, because 8k+ for a toy is rich people's problems.

Proof that they are the same, reread the comments made by MMR LE owners on what the regular MMR buyers are going to get, or even the fact the Rick was going to make more than the LE. You would think that people who were happy that they could finally afford to get a MM would be happy that even more people could share that dream. Gives you that warm glow knowing that every feature improving the regular MMR was met with fierce resistance from many of the LE crowd.

Disgusting- reminds me of the passage in Animal Farm, "the pigs walk like men".

Personally, every time Rick announces something new and improved I really think it is cool. I know he is making other pins that I might be able to save and buy that those features will transfer to. So it will effect me in a positive way someday.

Yeah it sucks when people lose money, but if it means more people get to enjoy something, than that trumps the losing money feel. When the MMrr comes out in another 10 years, the MMR people will know what I mean.

If my credit card has a 20k limit I could purchase a 12k MM or a MMR LE or a MMR. It doesn't mean im rich or wealthy it just means I'm able to take on that much debt. Unless member's start posting 1040's, annual budget or bank statements its impossible to know if someone is rich when they purchase pinball machines or just in a lot of debt.

And somehow I'm not remotely surprised.

There are not enough Williams ASIC chips left to possibly make 1000+ boardsets.

To make another run of the custom chips, count on $600,000.00 to start a run of them again.

Exactly.

Some people can sacrifice and save. Treating anybody as a rich snob based on a pin purchase is ignorant as nobody knows how much money they make or how they were able to "afford" it.

I hope they do make this someday. I think finishing and put in more code would sell more of them. Since that is a bigger hurdle versus an already finished pin, I can see why it was not first.

i'd like to go, but would need a little time to book flight/hotel.
coming from Austin

Dude you are way out of line here... I think you need to do some "reflecting" on what a creep you just made yourself out to be.

It goes beyond that.

Yeah, that is one of the most offensive Pinside posts I've seen, and that's saying something.