(Topic ID: 140104)

MM: for the same price, would you buy original or remake?


By nosro

4 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 363 posts
  • 120 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 years ago by CCary
  • Topic is favorited by 7 Pinsiders

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Linked Games

Topic poll

“For the same price, which would you prefer?”

  • Medieval Madness original in "very good" condition 217 votes
    48%
  • Medieval Madness remake NIB 239 votes
    52%

(456 votes by 0 Pinsiders)

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There are 363 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 8.
#51 4 years ago
Quoted from bkaelin:

that is funny, although I kind of disagree.

The analogy makes exactly zero sense since they both play identically. Unless he is suggesting Kate Upton is no better in bed than a blow up doll.

#52 4 years ago
Quoted from Hawkeyepin:

Why wouldn't AFMr likely ever exist?

Call it a hunch. Certainly no more outlandish than the claim that BBB, CV, and AFM will all be reproduced in the foreseeable future and smart people are selling theirs now.

#53 4 years ago
Quoted from pinchamp:

Another thought in my buying decision is valuation after purchase. Once the HUO MMR hit the used market, they will price at $1000 less than NIB. .

I doubt that. Most HUO Stern games aren't showing near that kind of discount these days.

#54 4 years ago

Original....even if it was a bit more.

#55 4 years ago
Quoted from Pinwhiz70:

MMR LE all the way I have a new one and a very nice original, myself and guests don't even play the old one anymore it looks dark and plays a lot slower and flippers aren't as strong as the MMR

image.jpg

So.... when are you selling that old dark,slow MM for $5k?

#56 4 years ago
Quoted from Kiwipinhead:

So.... when are you selling that old dark,slow MM for $5k?

$6,500 cash and it's all yours if you are for real???

#57 4 years ago
Quoted from Pinwhiz70:

$6,500 cash and it's all yours if you are for real???

Sorry.. got a very nice MM

Post some pic's. Someone in PS might buy it

#58 4 years ago
Quoted from Pinwhiz70:

$6,500 cash and it's all yours if you are for real???

I'll take it! Will you ship? As long as its fully working, no board hacks and in pretty nice shape. Post some pics: shooter lane, cabinet, play field.

#59 4 years ago
Quoted from teekee:

I'll take it! Will you ship? As long as its fully working, no board hacks and in pretty nice shape. Post some pics: shooter lane, cabinet, play field.

$450 for shipping and I'll crate it for $200

#60 4 years ago
Quoted from Pinwhiz70:

$450 for shipping and I'll crate it for $200

Can you get me some pictures? tonyd@neo.rr.com

Give me the details… issues, etc.

No need to crate. Can you blanket wrap on pallet?

#61 4 years ago

Original all day everyday. I haven't read through the whole thread, but I'm sure someone else made my main point already. The originals are easy to work on. Chances are, whatever problem you're having with a wpc95 board set, someone else already has a fix for it.

-2
#62 4 years ago
Quoted from Wickerman2:

old MM will never have the color display resolution available on the new one....if you value that sort of thing.

At this point neither does MMr

#63 4 years ago
Quoted from Pinwhiz70:

$6,500 cash and it's all yours if you are for real???

I think there are many people (myself included) that would be happy to take it off your hands for $6,500 so long as it isn't a basket case...

#64 4 years ago


Quoted from teekee:Why not???
Just as I thought. Original MM's dominate again... take Pinwhiz70 and his 26 other bogus accounts out of the picture and its no contest.

You would buy a game from someone with 26 other bogus accounts?

#65 4 years ago

Callin' the bluff

#67 4 years ago
Quoted from Imeh:

You would buy a game from someone with 26 other bogus accounts?

Yes! Waiting for some pictures!

#68 4 years ago
Quoted from teekee:

Yes! Waiting for some pictures!

Be nice if it comes true!

#70 4 years ago

This is easy, if both were NIB with a warranty then I would probably buy an original just because I think it would hold its value better. I was VERY close to cancelling my MMR and buying a nice MM UNTIL the preview video for the updated color display....It looks AMAZING and is unavailable for an original. Yes I know you can buy a color DMD but the new colorization is WAY better than the admittedly awesome ColorDMD

#71 4 years ago

Would be great if at the shows we could have an original and MMR next to each other to play....
No easy answer on above.... probably a remake simply because I think you will be hard pressed to find one in that good of condition at a price of the remake. Assuming you had a completely restored original at the same price..... I would go original.

#72 4 years ago
Quoted from pinmanguy:

you've got my dream pair of pins right there

Thank you. I feel very lucky to have the small collection (5) that I have been able to quire.

#74 4 years ago

LOL! I don't think he is gonna follow thru!

#75 4 years ago
Quoted from yzfguy:

LOL! I don't think he is gonna follow thru!

Maybe he's having trouble with hi camera?

#76 4 years ago

Can't believe he would be bluffing. I imagine a lot of MM owners with a great condition original ran out and got an MMr too!

#77 4 years ago

I am going to say neither at the moment because I do not buy new machines. Not wanting to take the hit that comes with NIB.

From a servicing standpoint the original is superior. 20 years of knowledge on how to fix wpc 95 hardware is handy.
The original is more collectible.

The new one will be more reliable in the short term. New electronics vs almost 20 years old.
The new one will be mint.
The new has leds stock.
The display looks to be incredible, but we do not know how much the upgrade will cost.

8500 won't buy you a brand new condition original. So this is not a fair question, but if modified with the condition being what 8500 gets you, I'd buy new. Personally, I will wait on the side lines and see what the values do. Also will keep me from going for AFM or LOTR.

#78 4 years ago

Pinwhiz

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#79 4 years ago

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#80 4 years ago
Quoted from dung:

8500 won't buy you a brand new condition original. So this is not a fair question...

The poll poses the choice between a "very good" original against a NIB remake.

#81 4 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Are the brains of that thing really stapled to the underside of the playfield?!
That seems like a pretty bad idea. Playfield vibration is enough to knock solidly soldered wires off of coils, can't imagine what it will do to transistors and chips over the years.

I saw that pic and thought exactly the same thing. I can picture surface mount devices falling off the pcb over time. A coating would solve the problem but then its a pain to do any repairs.

10
#82 4 years ago

I try to stay out of these things since I know I will instantly be accused of being biased. Full disclosure is I own MM. It has a ColorDMD. I colored a game for ColorDMD. I have most of the games discussed for possible remake.

Do I worry about the loss of value? No for two reasons. I plan on dying with them and I bought them for much less anyway. When I bought my MM I saw prices going up so I said I better get one before the price wave got too stupid so I indulged and spend $5,000. To this day it is the most I ever spend on a game. I've been at this longer than most. MB I think was $3,800 and AFM $2,800. I don't think you want to hear about $1,800 TZ and TOTAN for $1,900 or less.

Next, I hate mods. Gluing toys to game and clipping light strips makes me nuts. The rampant use of overdone LEDs hurts my eyes. Yup, I'm old and still enjoy classic Ballys and even some [gasp] EMs. We use to restore games to what the "designer" would have wanted. Like with IJ doing the lost plastic and jackpot backbox lighting. We use to laugh at a guy named Tom Wibble for covering TZ with ever piece of crap he could find. I attribute modern modding to "wibbling" machines. That said when I saw ColorDMD my anti-modding days ended. I said to myself if the designer had this available it would be used.

What do I think of MMr? When I saw the pictures of brand new MM games rolling off an assembly line I got a woody. I didn't care that I owned one for years. I saw something wondrous. When one of my friends got one I did not say "you devalued my game" I said "awesome, glad you got SS and not then baby puke 'gold'".

If you read this far here is my summary of MMr. I am leaving price out because I think both are stupid. I paid less for cars.

Pro:
New - I have bought HUO but never NIB. The less the machine is used the nicer. Who can argue?
Colorization - Looks sweet. Work of art.
Adjustable flipper strength - Mixed emotions, but the good part is you have a feature available if you feel there is an issue.

Con:
Repair - Not only do I know how to work on it and every board, I am surrounded by games I can swap parts with. The "big under board" scares the bejezzus out of me. But time will tell about reliability and support.
Colorization - I have ColorDMDs in 14 games right now. At 2 years per games release I am long dead before I see remakes of what I have now.
Adjustable flipper strength - I don't put the stronger coils in my LOTR. This way when I play people who did I kick their butts.
LEDs - I can put them in where I want but still have incandescent if I want. I choose choice. (old man eyes, remember)
Longevity - Has shown to hold up. Tried and true boardset. Even the playfield wood was harder. While Stern has moved to a distributed system with Spike this is a step back to Vacation America. Possible catastrophe.
Availability - Original, done, no more. MMrs are re-selling now because people say "have it now, don't wait". But when manufacturing and shipping have caught up and market hits saturation what happens? Just like new Stern games too many people think they are buying an investment.

The only winners are people buying this game because they can not have a great game. The MM versus MMr argument is a stupid waste of time. Besides, MMr will always be "wanna-be".

Still waiting for the PopeyeR to come out

#83 4 years ago

Hahaha that brings me back. Isn't wibble the one who was literally selling quarters for $20 as a TZ mod?

I'm not as old as you but just as crotchety. Most mods are stupid, tacky, and intrusive. Color dmd is not.

#84 4 years ago
Quoted from glasairpilot:

The remake does everything the original does and is brand new with better technology. I don't care what argument is made about original being better. The fact is that a 2015 Impala is a better car than a 1993 Impala because tchnology is better. I would rather replace a whole single board every 15 years than try to replace 8-10different boards or various wiring & connectors all the time. MMr makes a lot of sense IMO. If the original MM was so much better than MMr prices would still be $15k for pristine examples. Not so. The market has spoken. When all 1000 orders are filled this year and MMr standards are hitting the street MM will continue to fall. If you have a AFM, CV, BBB, etc now is a good time to sell. They will all be knocked off with better technology.

I agree in all above except an original silk screened cabinet will always be preferred by me. That said, my HUO MM is sold with a remake on the way to replace it. Probably would not have ever sold my original without the remake option.

#85 4 years ago

WOW! this really splits the community. As of me voting it's split right down the middle at 99 votes for each!

#86 4 years ago

Something about sliding an MM out of box, OG or Remake, just wins me over. NIB MMR for me.

#87 4 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Hahaha that brings me back. Isn't wibble the one who was literally selling quarters for $20 as a TZ mod?
I'm not as old as you but just as crotchety. Most mods are stupid, tacky, and intrusive. Color dmd is not.

Dude, you are old school with me. I remember you in the old RGP, but I was just quieter back then. Not that I'm older I want these damn kids to get off my yard.

#88 4 years ago

Original always for me. 100%.

#89 4 years ago

Thanks for starting this thread before Kaneda got the chance. MMr NIB all the way baby. Live in the now!

#90 4 years ago

Tired of maintaining old machines. I would take the nice, new MMR in a heartbeat even if a decent used one was a couple thousand cheaper (which they are at this point).

-3
#91 4 years ago

Did Teekee get the pictures of the $6,500 MM from Pinwhiz yet? Lol

Original all day folks these new games aren't built as good as the older Bally/Williams games.. MMR's will be falling apart after 20 plus years after being in a home environment compared to originals that have made it through the good old days in bars, bowling alleys, and arcades. Time will tell...

#92 4 years ago

The first time I played MM was at 2014 TPF and now I have a black LE on order. I think that puts me on the MMR side.

#93 4 years ago
Quoted from Riptor:

I saw that pic and thought exactly the same thing. I can picture surface mount devices falling off the pcb over time. A coating would solve the problem but then its a pain to do any repairs.

SMDs are at at least as reliable as through-hole parts, generally more so because they don't develop cracked solder joints as easily. Repair is also easier IF you have the right tools, which is - to your point - not as likely especially for large ICs. That being said, I'd still take the proven WPC platform with a shed load of parts, swappable boards, community knowledge, etc. over the MMR. Choice is good and I don't fault anyone buying an MMR, I think it's cool it exists and hope it is successful, God knows people waited long enough for them!

They took our Pinball machine!!

#94 4 years ago
Quoted from Riptor:

I saw that pic and thought exactly the same thing. I can picture surface mount devices falling off the pcb over time. A coating would solve the problem but then its a pain to do any repairs.

You obviously know zero about surface mount board design.

-2
#95 4 years ago
Quoted from pacman11:

Did Teekee get the pictures of the $6,500 MM from Pinwhiz yet? Lol

NOPE! He decided to keep his original but did offer his MMr to me for $6500... respectfully declined and told him I was buying those in the low 2 range... maybe!

#96 4 years ago
Quoted from pacman11:

MMR's will be falling apart after 20 plus years after being in a home environment compared to originals that have made it through the good old days in bars, bowling alleys, and arcades. Time will tell...

Falling apart like 20 year old Sega's and DE's? Stern is able to assemble a machine and has a track record.

B/W was known to have issues *back in the good old days* straight out of the box

The new parts that chicago coin are supplying are in all likelihood made by the original vendors that did the willaims parts.

The only real unknown is how well the boards will hold up.

#97 4 years ago

This is such a no brainer since I already own an MMR. I would take a new remake over any classic game in my collection. State of the art electronics, clear coated playfield, better cabinet build, colorized dmd with new animations, redundant LED designed boards. I love what PPS is doing even though I am heavily invested in many of the classics they are rumored to remake.

#98 4 years ago
Quoted from dung:

The new parts that chicago coin are supplying are in all likelihood made by the original vendors that did the willaims parts.

I doubt that.

Most, if not all, of those fabricators closed shop when Williams shut down their pinball division.

-3
#99 4 years ago
Quoted from Gritty:

State of the art electronics,

unproven

Quoted from Gritty:

clear coated playfield,

nothing new to MMr

Quoted from Gritty:

better cabinet build

This is a pinball machine not a bobsled... I'll take silkscreen cabinet any day over inferior decals... blah!

Quoted from Gritty:

colorized dmd with new animations, redundant LED designed boards.

Does nothing for me... not playing a video game. It doesn't fit a 20 year old classic IMO. Plus I still love the flexibility of the old board system.

Plus the support system is in place for the original board set... hope the support system doesn't go away for the new board set.

And will never be considered a 'collectible' if you're into that... and many are. Just a bunch of used HUO MM remakes floating around soon.

#100 4 years ago

Fun game, but I wouldn't buy either at the prices they're going for. $6500 is probably my upper end on a pin. If they never get there, i'll be content to play them at Expos once or twice a year.

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