(Topic ID: 302867)

MM flippers and trolls not working

By nicoy3k

2 years ago


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  • 40 posts
  • 7 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 2 years ago by nicoy3k
  • Topic is favorited by 2 Pinsiders

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#1 2 years ago

Hi guys

My troll and flipper solenoids stopped working. The switches work but the solenoids don’t fire. I know trolls and flipper are all in the same fuse section or whatever, but how do I go about trouble shooting this? Just eyeballing at the fuses they look fine but I am not really sure what to look for. Thanks in advance…

#2 2 years ago

Sorry to be an ass, but the title of your thread had be laughing about pinball flippers and people trolling. Hope you can work out your problem.

#3 2 years ago
Quoted from RyanStl:

...the title of your thread had be laughing about pinball flippers and people trolling.

Same here.

#4 2 years ago

You need to test a fuse to rule it out. You need a multimeter to test it. You can try replacing the fuse but make sure you use the same rating. A visual inspection is not enough and putting the wrong fuse rating is not a good idea.

#5 2 years ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

how do I go about trouble shooting this?

Pull the fuse and check with a meter.

Looking good isn't good enough. Those 20mm fuses can be blown and you can't see it.

LTG : )

#6 2 years ago

You can run a coil tests too and see what is all out. With the help of the manual this will narrow down which fuses.

LTG : )

#7 2 years ago

I'd start with F108, then F102, F103, F104, F115, F116, F117, F118.

LTG : )

#8 2 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

I'd start with F108, then F102, F103, F104, F115, F116, F117, F118.
LTG : )

Thanks man, tested all the fuses and they are fine. Any other ideas?

#9 2 years ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

tested all the fuses and they are fine.

Did you pull and check with a meter ? If so then check the 50 volt test point on the driver board. See if it's at 50 volts ( or higher )

LTG : )

#10 2 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

Did you pull and check with a meter ? If so then check the 50 volt test point on the driver board. See if it's at 50 volts ( or higher )
LTG : )

I did use a multimeter. Pardon my ignorance but what is the driver board and how do I check that it’s at 50v?

#11 2 years ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

I did use a multimeter.

Did you pull the fuses off of the board to check it ?

Quoted from nicoy3k:

Pardon my ignorance but what is the driver board

Same board the fuses are on.

Quoted from nicoy3k:

how do I check that it’s at 50v?

It's a metal stud sticking up labeled TP 50v , set meter to DC voltage. One lead to ground one lead to that metal test points.

LTG : )

#12 2 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

Did you pull the fuses off of the board to check it ?

Same board the fuses are on.

It's a metal stud sticking up labeled TP 50v , set meter to DC voltage. One lead to ground one lead to that metal test points.
LTG : )

Yes though it’s possible I messed it up. I set it to the setting in the picture and touched both ends of the fuse (removed from board), if the number changed from 1 I assumed it was good.
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#13 2 years ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

I set it to the setting in the picture

I would have set it to 200.

LTG : )

#14 2 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

I would have set it to 200.
LTG : )

Thanks I will try again at 200

As far as testing the 50v, is this metal stud the right one? What do I set the multimeter to and where is the ground? Does it matter if I side red/black on the stud or ground? Sorry for the stupid questions

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#15 2 years ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

is this metal stud the right one?

I'm sorry, yes that is it.

LTG : )

#16 2 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

No. Looks like a small metal post sticking up.
LTG : )

That is a metal post, looks flat from the angle? Just wanna confirm

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#17 2 years ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

That is a metal post, looks flat from the angle? Just wanna confirm

Yes that is it. Sorry I misread it.

LTG : )

#18 2 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

Yes that is it. Sorry I misread it.
LTG : )

Cool, and is this the ground?

Do I put the red on the ground and black on the 50v? Machine on obviously right? And what do I set my multimeter to? Stupid questions I know

#19 2 years ago

I might have done something wrong the 50v thing reads 157? I have the multimeter at this setting

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#20 2 years ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

I might have done something wrong the 50v thing reads 157?

You have your meter set to AC, you are trying to measure DC.

LTG : )

#21 2 years ago

For DC set your meter to this.

LTG : )

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#22 2 years ago

Your fuse - did you watch the youtube video, about 1:20 mark ? That is for checking a fuse with a meter set to ohms.

LTG : )

#23 2 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

Your fuse - did you watch the youtube video, about 1:20 mark ? That is for checking a fuse with a meter set to ohms.
LTG : )

So the 50v check says 73

For checking fuse, how do I set to the ohms setting? I just set it to 200 and saw if the 1 changed to a bunch of numbers

#24 2 years ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

So the 50v check says 73

That is fine. Not under load it will be higher.

Quoted from nicoy3k:

how do I set to the ohms setting? I just set it to 200 and saw if the 1 changed to a bunch of numbers

Watch the video, should be zero.

Is there a local collector or friend that can give you a hand here ?

LTG : )

#25 2 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

That is fine. Not under load it will be higher.

Watch the video, should be zero.
Is there a local collector or friend that can give you a hand here ?
LTG : )

No but I can look for help.

To test the fuse, or I have it on the right setting according to the picture?

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#26 2 years ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

To test the fuse, or I have it on the right setting according to the picture?

That will work. Touch the ends of the probes together - see what the meter says. Then put the probes on the fuse, one on each end. It should read the same as when the probes were touching each other.

LTG : )

#27 2 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

That will work. Touch the ends of the probes together - see what the meter says. Then put the probes on the fuse, one on each end. It should read the same as when the probes were touching each other.
LTG : )

Just tested all the fuses again and they seem fine. Is there anything obvious that I could be missing? Both trolls and both flippers don’t work at all, the switches for trolls and flippers are fine though.

#28 2 years ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

Is there anything obvious that I could be missing?

Wiring intact on high power interlock switch on coin ? Ribbon cable ?

I think you hit the point where you need some help.

LTG : )

#29 2 years ago

I tried changing the fuses for new ones and that didn’t do anything

I think it’s related to the trolls because I am randomly getting a “bad right troll up switch error”. But when I test the switch it works fine. It’s also strange that the credit dot doesn’t go away when I activate the switch in test mode…

#30 2 years ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

I think it’s related to the trolls because I am randomly getting a “bad right troll up switch error”.

Not the main problem.

Tests - Switch Edge - pull troll up, push troll face - switch should register.

Whether it does or not isn't the problem here.

One thought - each troll assembly has two switches and two connectors, one for the troll face, and one that lets the game know the troll is up or down. You don't have the connectors mixed up do you ?

LTG : )

#31 2 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

Not the main problem.
Tests - Switch Edge - pull troll up, push troll face - switch should register.
Whether it does or not isn't the problem here.
One thought - each troll assembly has two switches and two connectors, one for the troll face, and one that lets the game know the troll is up or down. You don't have the connectors mixed up do you ?
LTG : )

Unfortunately I already checked that

#32 2 years ago

Do you have voltage at your flipper coils? Set the meter to DC, touch the black probe to the braided ground strap inside the cabinet and the red to each of the solder lugs on one of your flipper coils.

Your coin door must be closed. If it’s open, high voltage is disabled to your playfield.

#33 2 years ago
Quoted from The_Pump_House:

Do you have voltage at your flipper coils? Set the meter to DC, touch the black probe to the braided ground strap inside the cabinet and the red to each of the solder lugs on one of your flipper coils.
Your coin door must be closed. If it’s open, high voltage is disabled to your playfield.

Thanks I will try that, I really appreciate the help

A little background on the issue (apologies this is long winded)

I installed the wolfsoft/pinball decals illumated troll mod

This mod is a bit different than the regular illuminated troll mods because the yes pulse when they are on and then blink when you hit the troll switch

the mod uses a little custom board that you run your troll eyes as well as the troll switches to, it plugs into the power board under/near the top of the playfield to power the leds

Initially I was having problems with this mod, it was causing a bunch of random switch errors and the bridge would go up and down

I realized that the led eye wires were stripped and making contact with the metal troll switch creating a weird short/connection causing the errors (at least that is my theory)

to fix it I wrapped the eye led wires in electrical tape and all was good, machined worked perfectly for a month playing it dozens of times

then last night in the middle of my game I start getting the same strange issues, bridge going up and down, switch errors, etc

I figure its the troll mod so I remove it

However even after removing the mod I was getting L/R lower troll switch errors

The switches work fine in my testing, but for some reason the error/credit dot doesn't go away after I activate it

Then suddenly the right troll isn't coming up, the left one is however and the flippers work fine

I figure it has something to do with these switch errors so I continue to test the switches

Then the left troll also stops working and the flippers as well

I am completely stumped !

#34 2 years ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

I realized that the led eye wires were stripped and making contact with the metal troll switch creating a weird short/connection causing the errors

Probably caused damage to your CPU switch matrix. Hence all the problems.

Get the CPU checked/fixed first.

LTG : )

#35 2 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

Probably caused damage to your CPU switch matrix. Hence all the problems.
Get the CPU checked/fixed first.
LTG : )

So this helped me figure it out. I pressed on the CPU and now it works. Actually had a different issue caused by the same reason a while back… unfortunately it seems to mess up again after a few minutes until I press on it again… is there a permanent fix for this?

#36 2 years ago

Class act, LTG… Still willing to help out, even when the OP has a history of being less than polite to you and yours. World needs more people like you!

#37 2 years ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

is there a permanent fix for this?

I don't know if your are skilled in board repair. If not consider sending to ChrisHibler for repair.

Turn game off. Socketed chips on the CPU, gently press in tight. The square ASIC chip, gently press in.

If that doesn't do it, likely a weak solder joint or something. Which would need a pro to find and permanently fix.

LTG : )

#38 2 years ago
Quoted from PlanetExpress:

even when the OP has a history of being less than polite to you

He sent me a PM with an apology, and posted on Pinside similar, he was having a bad day.

Hard to fault a person who sets things right. Anyone can have a bad day and not be as nice as they normally are.

LTG : )

#39 2 years ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

is there a permanent fix for this?

One other thing to check. The pads on the board that contact the huge metal plate the board fastens too. Be sure they are clean, the posts they fasten to are clean. And screws holding it down are tight.

LTG : )

#40 2 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

One other thing to check. The pads on the board that contact the huge metal plate the board fastens too. Be sure they are clean, the posts they fasten to are clean. And screws holding it down are tight.
LTG : )

Ok I will. Like I said when I push on the cpu everything is back to normal but after a while it seems to mess up again and need another push. Thanks for all the help I really appreciate it.

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