This is the reason why Im leaning towards a MET Pro. Its 2k cheaper and I can just buy an LED kit and its less prone to malfunctions via the reduction of these types of toys.

Thanks but that is irrelevant to this thread. Let's expend your logic further. Why not spend $300 and buy an EM? It has no toys to break and you can save $4000.

The EM has both a Premium version and a Pro version I could purchase today? My point is that for $2000 more your game is more prone to break.

What distributor is selling PRO's for $4300? Sounds like a good deal!

Your point ? Somebody asked ? Go make your own topic about crying and bashing !

Thanks Rob for this info !

Two general questions:

1 - Has Stern acknowledged this as being an issue and do they have some type of kit they would ship out?
2 - Does this void the warranty on the pin in anyway?

thanks

Yes there is. There is a set screw in the back under the jaw solenoid bracket. I know! I adjusted mine. And no, it was not a pro!

And LED kit will never give you the color changing & fading FX of the Prem/LE.

Lowering the snake jaw is no big deal...I did what the OP did - just a few washers - it brings it down enough to make a great gameplay difference.

Does this need to be done right out of the box to the snake jaw? Right now mine Metallica prem. is under some upgrade maintenance at a distributor and I can have them do it while its there. Also mine wont ever have one ball played with the "block", newton ball assembly is being installed amongst a few other things.

Might be one of those things that varies from game to game. I left like the lower jaw was causing some ball bounce outs....and by just lowering it a mm or so, the ball smoothly shoots into the mouth every time now.

The screw is part #8 on page b22 of the manual. (Page 22 of this pdf which also covers the premium)

http://www.sternpinball.com/upload/games/metallica/pro/421/MTLAB1.PDF

Screw #8 is just what the kickout plunger is sitting on. It doesn't lower the jaw.

#8 Adjustable bumper/stop-
try it, you might like it.

It doesn't affect the jaw, though. I mean maybe it helps the ball to plop & stay in the mouth...but doesn't affect the jaw.

I had this conversation with two diff people this week. Metallica is a great great game. So now u have people who say pro and others who say le/premium... My argument is the snake being able to stop the ball with his jaw, open his mouth during multi ball and hide it from u then give it back later, the hammer and coffin ball lock all awesome. the grave marker isn't a big deal but ok extra feature... So it's always the same argument do I want to spend 2k more then a pro. I'm always against stripped down games. Hate em. No thanks... The ones arguing are just trying to justify saving money. That's it, when u don't give a fuck about the cost go big or go home!
When u don't care about the cost who gives a hell if u broke it during home play, it's not unobtanium, prove to stern u own the game and replacement is guaranteed. There just being dinks to people trying to mod.

Yours must have been made on a Monday. Call Stern and they can tell you how it's supposed to work.

You keep talking about that screw - and I looked at it...and I'm looking at the manual now....it's not even remotely connected to the jaw. It sits under the kickout plunger. What are we all missing here?

You are missing actually adjusting the screw. It raises and lowers the lower jaw as it pivots from the back.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. I say it only adjusts where the plunger sits.

If anyone else wants to weigh in, feel free.

Did you actually try it?

Yes. It's a screw under a plunger. It's not capable of doing anything to the jaw.

Dunno what else to say until someone else chimes in. You have your story and I have mine. We need more lol

Must be the wrong screw. I called Chas at Stern right when I got mine and he told me how to adjust it. I could move it up and down almost a half an inch. It is in the back, and the jaw pivots.

We don't want to move the head, we want to move the jaw lower

Anyway, I've already accomplished this with the washer method so...I'm good.

The jaw is part of the head that you moved lower with washers. I don't know what else to say except you do it your way, and I'll do it the right way.

I did it myyyyyyyyy wayyyyyyuyyyyy !

I stand corrected. the screw only raises and lowers the lower jaw, the upper part of the head is in a fixed position.

Someone take a picture or video of this screw in action.

Yes please

Sorry, I'm at work and as I'm trying to explain this customers keep coming in. The lower jaw is connected to a lever that goes to the plunger and coil that controls it. On the latch coil bracket is that adjuster screw that determines the resting position of the lever that is connected to the jaw through a spring loaded flap, thus by turning that screw in or out it raises and lowers the jaw. Sorry no vids folks!

Well you've made some good points about the premium/LE.

Now you've just invalidated everything you said earlier. You could've saved yourself a lot of typing by just posting I hate pros! and hitting the send button. Even worse, three other premium/LE owners have given this post a thumbs up. All four of you are an embarrassment to the hobby IMO. You don't like pros. We get it. Feel free not to tell us about other things you don't like.

I did not find the adjustment screw mentioned helped whatsoever, and yes I moved it to its limits both ways and discussed it with Stern. I used the spacer method successfully about a year ago and shared the idea with another pinsider and from what he told me, he had success as well. By now the spacer concept has made the rounds.

If the screw adjustment method works for some, then more power to those folks.

And my game was made on a Tuesday

That would be me & it worked to perfection. I started a thread on it about a year ago & with 4 spacer washers the snake works great. Thanks again Jeff!

I hate pros! But they come in handy price wise when I trade them for big money wms Bally games to vendors

#8 screw is an adjustment for the jaw latch that is all.

Anyone have issues with the ball being ejected sdtm after performing the washer adjustment? I was having bounce outs on my premium and lowered the jaw as others in this thread have; the bounce outs improved but now I'm getting sdtm ejects about 40% of the time and the rest of the time it barely hits the end of the left flipper.

I wasn't having the issue before the adjustment and I used the same size washers on each side of the mechanism. I'm thinking I may have to remove the washers and just deal with the occasional bounce outs

I must have been hallucinating then. As was Chas.

The latch is what holds the jaw in place when it is down. One moves the other.

Nope....ball always goes from Snake to left flipper. Maybe the "guide" part of the VUK needs adjustment.

I had a problem with my snake' slower jaw locking and not opening. When I called Chas he didn't have an answer and was going to talk to the engineer. After a few days I called back and he said that screw adjusts the latch that closes the jaw. I have tried loosening that screw to lower the jaw. It didn't work. If you loosen that latch too much, the jaw will not lock. I had to add washers underneath to mine to lower it. Yours must have not been that high to begin with.

Here is a pic of mine before I added washers.

image-54.jpg

Mine was a little lower than that, but had a problem with the ball getting stuck behind the snakes lip, which as it turned out was a defect in the way they had placed the screw behind it. In the meantime I messed with that adj. screw and I was able to lower the jaw well below the playfield, and well above it without a problem latching. That is why I am posting here. It is an obvious adjustment that worked on mine. But not all machines are the same, I guess.

http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/metallica-lepremium-ball-stuck-behind-snakes-lower-lip
131691-i.jpg

Gotcha.
I sent the pic to Stern originally when I got the game. They agreed it was unusually high but had no idea why. My snake's lip is still above the playfield but not like it was previously after I used the washers.

You know, they are still building these games by hand, one at a time, so minor differences and problems will occur. I dissected the whole snake system when I had that problem, so I thought I might throw in my two cents here. After I was done I had my snake in a much better position just a tad above the playfield and never had another issue. I have added washers to fix other problems, but I just thought I might offer a shortcut to those that might want to try it.

No worries. You were going on your experiences and I was going on mine.

It's all good. It's just a little frustrating when you try to offer tech help that you know might work because it's already been done and others say it will do nothing.

I would recommend consulting more of the experts who perfected the add a washer method. I wouldn't recommend trying my method, because I wouldn't want for you to be disappointed. It would seem that mine was the only machine that came with an adjustable snake jaw.

This is why I don't think I will ever give advice on here again. Seems like on pinside these days someone is always right and someone is always wrong.

+1