(Topic ID: 79446)

Maverick fan thread - We play till we drop, winner takes all!

By Atomicboy

10 years ago


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There are 1,866 posts in this topic. You are on page 20 of 38.
#951 4 years ago

So I read through a bunch of posts for other games where people are having a somewhat similar problem and there where several fixes that they ended up doing. Some of those fixes where easy stuff that I already tried, some where very complicated and would involve me having much more knowledge and some involved buying a new flipper board. I decided to purchase a new flipper board since I was already buying a bunch of bulbs and plastics and other misc pieces. Figure worse case scenario I'll have an extra board down the line. Hopefully the board arrives by this weekend and I'll be able to test out the new board and see if that fixes it. If that doesn't then I'll be sad and be back to trying to learn how to read schematics and use new tools. Keep you guys posted. Thanks again for all your help.

#952 4 years ago

Well a very sad update... The new board did not change anything. So at this point am I basically checking the wires that go from the flipper board to the cpu board at the back box? And seeing if there is a snag or something else along the way? Could I use a multimeter to test congruence on the wires going from flipper board to wherever they are going?

#953 4 years ago

so I discovered some more info!!! maybe you guys can help me understand it. Also I apologize that i keep leaving more and more posts on here, I dont know exactly what the rules are and Im sorry if at this point Im really annoying and just taking up space, I think it would just be super cool to figure this out and Im hoping that if we do figure this out that somebody in the future who has this problem will be able to figure it out from reading this info. so Its like 90 percent selfish and 10 percent helping others.... anywho this is the info i discovered:

Backbox circuit board relays and their functions:

PPB/MRB board relay K1: this relay controls the solenoid L/R select circuit, and is controlled by CPU transistor Q29 (TIP122). It is extremely common for this relay to have cold solder joints! If the L/R (or A/B) select coils or flashlamps do not work, this relay should be checked. This relay is a 24 vdc 10 amp relay with two DPDT switches. There are a total of 8 solder points on this relay; two connect to the winding of the relay coil (to turn the relay on and off). The other six contacts (two distinct sets of three contact DPDT switches) are the relay switches. Source number FRL264 P024/02CK, Sega part 190-5002-00.

Im reading "this relay controls the solenoid L/R select circuit" and "If the L/R (or A/B) select coils or flashlamps do not work" as my exact issue right? like when they say L/R select i assume that are talking about selecting things with the left flipper button and right flipper button? If this is the case i think we found our problem right? now how the heck do i fix it? How does one replace a relay and what does the relay even look like?

i found this relay which says its for star wars, but maybe itll work for me as well, I can probably confirm part number in my manual: https://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/190-5002-00

#954 4 years ago
Quoted from Sirgubster9:

Im reading "this relay controls the solenoid L/R select circuit" and "If the L/R (or A/B) select coils or flashlamps do not work" as my exact issue right? like when they say L/R select i assume that are talking about selecting things with the left flipper button and right flipper button? If this is the case i think we found our problem right?

They are talking about the relay used in multiplexing coils and flashlamps (so that one transistor can be used to control a coil and a flashlamp). Your problem is switch matrix related - using the flipper switches to make selections to raise or fold. These are two completely different things.

#955 4 years ago
Quoted from Sirgubster9:

I apologize that i keep leaving more and more posts on here, I dont know exactly what the rules are and Im sorry if at this point Im really annoying and just taking up space

You always can start a separate repair thread, but make sure you put a link to the club thread so others may learn from your experience. It is always hard to predict how quickly you can get help, especially if you have multiple issues in the game you need help with.

#956 4 years ago

oh really? I was soooo excited I thought I found it, super bummer. ok thanks for info.
Ya right now I really only have the one problem.. that i know of ha ha, Im guessing once I get the flipper push button switches working there will be other stuff that pops up, but for now just the one tiny thing holding me back. thanks guys.

#957 4 years ago
Quoted from Sirgubster9:

oh really? I was soooo excited I thought I found it, super bummer. ok thanks for info.
Ya right now I really only have the one problem.. that i know of ha ha, Im guessing once I get the flipper push button switches working there will be other stuff that pops up, but for now just the one tiny thing holding me back. thanks guys.

So you tested all the switches in the switch edge test and those are the only 2 not registering?

#958 4 years ago

now when you say switch edge test do you mean the in house test mode. I went to the test mode and it originally says "all tests ok", or something along those lines. Then I go to the next screen and you can press different switches and it shows up that all 4 trough balls are being used. Then i press the start button for instance and it says that Im pressing the start button on the screen now as well as the 4 ball troughs. I kind of thought the original screen saying that all switches where good was basically saying that all other switches where registering correctly, but obviously that doesnt make sense because the two flipper switches aren't registering so I apologize for my obliviousness... so should I basically go through and test all the other switches and see if any other ones don't register? and see if its like a whole column or whole row or just them?.. would that be the first step? thanks again for your help.

#959 4 years ago

No house test mode.

Actually, there would be 2 different switch tests to run. First remove all 4 balls out of the trough.

Run the Active Switch test to see if there are any anomalies. Note those.

I see in the manual, it is only labeled as Switch test, sorry, most labeled as Switch Edge test. Here, with the balls out, test out all the switches and make note of all the ones not registering and any single switch that may be registering others when it should only be the one.

#960 4 years ago

The message that says all switches ok just shows stuck switches. You need to use the switch (edge) test further in the menu to check for operation.

#961 4 years ago

ohhh ok i did not realize that wayout, thank you.

ok the active switch test i believe i have already ran and had no anomalies, but I can definitely run it again. i have yet to take the balls out of the trough, so i can do that as well. I tried popping them up by using that little metal plunger piece at the bottom (i saw some guy do it in a video, he said to make sure all balls where out before you lifted playfield), but whenever i tried to do that no balls would come out, im thinking i have a different style of pinball machine. so can I just eject each ball using the test mode option that allows you to do that then?

#962 4 years ago
Quoted from Sirgubster9:

ok the active switch test i believe i have already ran and had no anomalies, but I can definitely run it again. i have yet to take the balls out of the trough

Make sure you remove the balls out before running the active switch test otherwise, the trough switches will be called out.

Scan through the tests, there maybe a test called "clear balls out" or some similar name as it will cycle them out of the trough for you.

#963 4 years ago
Quoted from Sirgubster9:

i believe i have already ran and had no anomalies, but I can definitely run it again. i have yet to take the balls out of the trough, so i can do that as well. I tried

Run it again, hold down the flipper switches. You don't have to remove the balls, but it may help for clarity. Holding the flipper cab switches in should report them on the DMD if they are working.

#964 4 years ago
Quoted from Sirgubster9:

I tried popping them up by using that little metal plunger piece at the bottom

FYI, if you leave the playfield down in the cabinet, it is easier to pop them out with a quick flick of the plunger.

It is harder to pop them out if you have the playfield rails sitting up on top of the lockdown bar receiver. Even after 10 years, I sometimes still catch myself doing that and having to lower the playfield back down in the cabinet.

#965 4 years ago

I was unable to flick the balls out even with the playfield down, I'm probably just not doing it right. But I know there are some other ways to get the balls out.

I will empty em all just for clarity.

And ya I have pressed the flippers in, they don't register at all on the dmd so they definitely are no working as push buttons.

But I think it finally clicked as far as testing and checking the test matrix, I was having difficulty understanding for some reason, but now I get it. Just got to test all the stuff in the column and row and maybe other items are out and maybe I can find a pattern and go from there. No clue why this wasn't sinking in before. Thanks for all your help. Once I get some more info I'll be back asking more questions ha ha. Thanks again everyone

#966 4 years ago
Quoted from Sirgubster9:

I was unable to flick the balls out even with the playfield down, I'm probably just not doing it right. But I know there are some other ways to get the balls out.
I will empty em all just for clarity.
And ya I have pressed the flippers in, they don't register at all on the dmd so they definitely are no working as push buttons.
But I think it finally clicked as far as testing and checking the test matrix, I was having difficulty understanding for some reason, but now I get it. Just got to test all the stuff in the column and row and maybe other items are out and maybe I can find a pattern and go from there. No clue why this wasn't sinking in before. Thanks for all your help. Once I get some more info I'll be back asking more questions ha ha. Thanks again everyone

Test all switches. Sometimes there are other affected switches that end up as phantom switches closures not related to a row or column. This is what you seem to be experiencing with the start button so make sure all the green wires (slight tug on the wires to be sure) are connected to the trough switches. This is why it would be good to repeat that test with the balls out of the trough to see if the start button then causes trough switches to register.

I also would look at all the switches in column 8 to see if any of them have a green-gray wire broken. It is best to give the wires a small tug as the heat shrink can hold a broken wire in place looking like it is connected. Also look to make sure that green-gray wire(s) are soldered to the middle connection of the playfield switches. The switches for 63 and 64 are likely physically different than the other six in that column.
Maverick switch matrix (resized).pngMaverick switch matrix (resized).png

#967 4 years ago

Oh dude this is beautiful. Thank you for the filled out diagram and all the info. Seriously thanks for the time you put in to help me out. This weekend definitely the plan. Will let you know what I find.

Side note I must have miscommunicated. The start button only comes on when I press the start button. Nothing phantom there, but I will be taking all 4 balls out and basically testing every possible switch and especially that column. I finally feel like things are going to work out. Thanks a lot once again.

#968 4 years ago
Quoted from Sirgubster9:

Side note I must have miscommunicated. The start button only comes on when I press the start button. Nothing phantom there, but I will be taking all 4 balls out and basically testing every possible switch and especially that column. I finally feel like things are going to work out. Thanks a lot once again.

So with the below message does not apply from what you are saying above? What you state below, it sounds as if you were in the Active Switch test. If so, that sounds expected if you still had the balls in the trough.

Quoted from Sirgubster9:

Then i press the start button for instance and it says that Im pressing the start button on the screen now as well as the 4 ball troughs.

#969 4 years ago

Oh ya sorry I guess in my brain it makes sense, but typing it out poorly. Basically when in the mode where it says what things are active and each item pops up on the screen. When I do nothing and the 4 balls are in the trough cuz I haven't emptied them yet it basically flashes up on the screen each ball switch. So it'll scroll through all 4 switches. Then I will push and hold down the start button as well and now it'll scroll through and name each ball switch and the start switch and then when I held down extra ball button it would show that switch being active as well. And then I would push either flipper button and sadly it will still just say the active 4 balls and no other switches. So I believe the start button and extra ball button and 4 ball trough buttons are all doing good. And then the flipper buttons aren't registering which they obviously are supposed to. So next I need to open glass and press other switches. Prior to this I was scared to open glass and press stuff by hand so start and extra ball where the only switches I was able to use the active test mode on.

#970 4 years ago
Quoted from Sirgubster9:

Basically when in the mode where it says what things are active and each item pops up on the screen. When I do nothing and the 4 balls are in the trough cuz I haven't emptied them yet it basically flashes up on the screen each ball switch. So it'll scroll through all 4 switches. Then I will push and hold down the start button as well and now it'll scroll through and name each ball switch and the start switch and then when I held down extra ball button it would show that switch being active as well.

Yes, this is the Active Switch test just as I had expected. Having the balls out is the way to find out if there are any stuck switches. That is all this test is really good for. So we can forget about it now.

#971 4 years ago
Quoted from Sirgubster9:

Attached is a photo of cpu board just in case something wrong pops out to you.

I'd move those batteries off the CPU board. Battery acid leads to damage.

I've got a new issue. Lower Right flipper working, but when pressing the right flipper button, it makes the display flash "192X64 DOT-MATRIX SYSTEM VERSION USA/0.00 RELEASE A 1.00 OCTOBER 5, 1994" and the horn for the Lauren Belle sound, just like it does when booting up as you turn the game on with the switch under the cabinet. Doesn't affect game play, just a quick flash on the display and the horn sound (annoying).

Purchased new RottenDog flipper board, because the existing one is hacked, and came with soldered fuses where the holders were shot, soldered in pin connectors, etc. Installed new board, played for less than 20-30 seconds, lower right flipper starts machine gunning and then blows fuse1 for Coil A at flipper board. Searched for a possible ground issue and attempted 4 new fuses that all blew. Through diagnostics, got a check lower right flipper end of stroke error.
Put old flipper board back in and is playing as stated above, no error through diagnostics, just annoying. Any thoughts?

#972 4 years ago
Quoted from DiegoWally:

I've got a new issue. Lower Right flipper working, but when pressing the right flipper button, it makes the display flash "192X64 DOT-MATRIX SYSTEM VERSION USA/0.00 RELEASE A 1.00 OCTOBER 5, 1994" and the horn for the Lauren Belle sound, just like it does when booting up as you turn the game on with the switch under the cabinet. Any thoughts?

From my experience, test the bridge rectifiers on the boards. I've had the display reset issue on my Segas I've owned, so far the cause was always a bad bridge rectifier. Easy to replace on these boards too.

#973 4 years ago
Quoted from DiegoWally:

Battery acid leads to damage.

Actually not acid. Leaking alkaline batteries cause alkali damage.

#974 4 years ago

From myexperience, test the bridge rectifiers on the boards. I've had the display reset issue on my Segas I've owned, so far the cause was always a bad bridge rectifier. Easy to replace on these boards too.

Thank You. Do you think a bad bridge rectifier would also cause a brand new flipper board to blow a fuse each time the right flipper button was pressed?

#975 4 years ago
Quoted from DiegoWally:

Thank You. Do you think a bad bridge rectifier would also cause a brand new flipper board to blow a fuse each time the right flipper button was pressed?

No. There is only one bridge rectifier on the PPB that supplies 50VDC solenoid power to both flippers. If it was the problem, you'd have the same results with either left or right flipper. You also did not have this problem with the original board, correct? (both flippers worked, just not reporting switches)

A little bit difficult to diagnose in the forum. You should not be having a NEW problem with the new board. I'm highly suspicious that you may have some wiring issues. I hope you did not damage the new board from something else. Put the old board in and revisit your symptom report - what exactly happens with the old board - do flippers left and right respond properly? Switches report or not etc.... This is why I suggested actually testing the outputs from the original board with electronics tools.

Untitled (resized).pngUntitled (resized).png
#976 4 years ago
Quoted from DiegoWally:

I've got a new issue. Lower Right flipper working, but when pressing the right flipper button, it makes the display flash "192X64 DOT-MATRIX SYSTEM VERSION USA/0.00 RELEASE A 1.00 OCTOBER 5, 1994" and the horn for the Lauren Belle sound, just like it does when booting up as you turn the game on with the switch under the cabinet. Doesn't affect game play, just a quick flash on the display and the horn sound (annoying).

Purchased new RottenDog flipper board, because the existing one is hacked, and came with soldered fuses where the holders were shot, soldered in pin connectors, etc. Installed new board, played for less than 20-30 seconds, lower right flipper starts machine gunning and then blows fuse1 for Coil A at flipper board. Searched for a possible ground issue and attempted 4 new fuses that all blew. Through diagnostics, got a check lower right flipper end of stroke error.
Put old flipper board back in and is playing as stated above, no error through diagnostics, just annoying. Any thoughts?

The Rottendog flipper board is not just a plug and play board. You must set the game selectable switches correctly for the correct game. Please post a picture of the new board.

#977 4 years ago
Quoted from wayout440:

No. There is only one bridge rectifier on the PPB that supplies 50VDC solenoid power to both flippers. If it was the problem, you'd have the same results with either left or right flipper. You also did not have this problem with the original board, correct? (both flippers worked, just not reporting switches)
A little bit difficult to diagnose in the forum. You should not be having a NEW problem with the new board. I'm highly suspicious that you may have some wiring issues. I hope you did not damage the new board from something else. Put the old board in and revisit your symptom report - what exactly happens with the old board - do flippers left and right respond properly? Switches report or not etc.... This is why I suggested actually testing the outputs from the original board with electronics tools.[quoted image]

I'm thinking wiring too. Just haven't been able to locate.

Old board =
-All flippers working.
-When Right flipper button is pressed, seems to quick reboot (display and horn as described above), but does not shut down or effect play.
-Sometimes pressing the right flipper button will activate the center turbo bumper for a couple of beats.
-Once in a while, background music will drop out, but sound effects remain, and then after a minute or two, music is back.
-Rarely, the paddle wheel motor will stop and will start back up by pressing the Right flipper a few times.
That's it, all else is good. No errors through diagnostics.

New board =
-Right lower flipper machine guns or stays at end of stroke and blows fuse.
-Haven't got passed that to experience whether the same issues with old board will be present. Error through diagnostics as listed above.
I'll show a pic of pin settings on new board.

#978 4 years ago

Pins were not set like this when board arrived.
Did not take notice (no instructions sent) until after first blown fuse.
Then, changed to these settings.

EF1F952A-C362-41EE-AD23-414A0F38D21F (resized).jpegEF1F952A-C362-41EE-AD23-414A0F38D21F (resized).jpeg
#979 4 years ago

The way I read that, switches 3 and 6 should be set to 1 and the others set to 0 (open). You have 1 and 4 set on. The DIP switches are upside down compared to the legend.

#980 4 years ago

Yeah that flipper board is confusing with the dipswitches upside down. Wtf did they do that for?

#981 4 years ago
Quoted from PoMC:

Wtf did they do that for?

Hopefully, the legend lines up with the dipswitches as logically presented. Likely they did that because that was the only available "real estate" on the board for a silkscreen legend.

#982 4 years ago

Thanks for all the responses. I didn’t even notice the Open and 1-6 numbers until I snapped the pic (eyes are getting old) and just followed the 0 & 1 straight down the column. I’ll mess with it tonight. Thanks again

#983 4 years ago
Quoted from Sirgubster9:

Oh ya sorry I guess in my brain it makes sense, but typing it out poorly. Basically when in the mode where it says what things are active and each item pops up on the screen. When I do nothing and the 4 balls are in the trough cuz I haven't emptied them yet it basically flashes up on the screen each ball switch. So it'll scroll through all 4 switches. Then I will push and hold down the start button as well and now it'll scroll through and name each ball switch and the start switch and then when I held down extra ball button it would show that switch being active as well. And then I would push either flipper button and sadly it will still just say the active 4 balls and no other switches. So I believe the start button and extra ball button and 4 ball trough buttons are all doing good. And then the flipper buttons aren't registering which they obviously are supposed to. So next I need to open glass and press other switches. Prior to this I was scared to open glass and press stuff by hand so start and extra ball where the only switches I was able to use the active test mode on.

Switches 63 & 64 in the switch matrix are the flipper end of stroke switches. These are normally closed and open when the flipper is fully up. Make sure your end of stroke switches are adjusted correctly. These switches most likely tell the game to raise or fold when the ball is sitting in the VUK.

#984 4 years ago

Nice Maverick for sale in NJ. Looks mint. Asking $2,100.

#985 4 years ago

allright team!!!! well Im finally no longer sick so i went out to the machine and finally tested all the stuff you guys had been trying to explain to me for several posts. Im super sorry for being such a dunce.... anywho. here is the verdict. the entire right column on the switch matrix doesn't work. Im like 90 ish percent sure that the rest of the switches work. There are a few lights and flashers that i cant get working but i believe those are on a different deal so it doesnt really matter for this topic. ok so all of column 8 which is the entire green grey wire. a couple odd things to note is first off the right flipper doesnt have a green grey wire at all. the left does. also there two green grey wires that are kind of connected together running side by side going from some of the switches to other switches and going to what looks to be a ground bolt randomly. I can take some pictures if that would help. are you guys able to help me out on what my next steps should be? and/or are you guys able to send me some pictures of your underside slash your flippers so i can see how my setup is different. also on the switch matrix it says row (return) CN8-9. now the green grey wire is definitely coming out of the CN8 plug, but is the green grey wire supposed to be going to the CN9 plug as well? is that what return means?

#986 4 years ago
Quoted from Sirgubster9:

the entire right column on the switch matrix doesn't work.

Glad to hear you are feeling better.

I figured the whole column wasn't working. At the top of the chart, it shows the column is driven by Q48. Test out this transistor and compare your results to Q49 or Q50. Likely you will see a big difference in how Q48 measures against Q49/Q50.

Set your meter to 2k ohms. Test the transistor outer pin to outer pin, then the middle to one of the outer pins and then middle to the other outer pin. One of these combinations is likely to show the transistor is shorted.

#987 4 years ago

Already posted response at other thread, but this one probably makes more sense for people looking up info in the future...

Ok let's assume the transistor ends up being shorted, can I just purchase a new transistor and remove the old one and solder in the new one? And where is this transistor that I'm testing located.. picture attached location?

And thanks so much for the info and getting back to me so quick

Screenshot_20190706-203019_Gallery (resized).jpgScreenshot_20190706-203019_Gallery (resized).jpg
#988 4 years ago
Quoted from Sirgubster9:

Already posted response at other thread, but this one probably makes more sense for people looking up info in the future...

Ok let's assume the transistor ends up being shorted, can I just purchase a new transistor and remove the old one and solder in the new one? And where is this transistor that I'm testing located.. picture attached location?

Yes. 2N3904. Yes, correct location.
If there is a Fry's Electronics store near you, NTE part 2N3904 may be available there.

#989 4 years ago

There is legitimately one 5 minutes from me... Yessss. I have a multi meter that I used for arcade dc testing. I've never used it like your suggesting though, but I'll try and figure it out. And then I'll hopefully find a YouTube video of someone replacing a pinball transistor.

#990 4 years ago
Quoted from PinballManiac40:

Glad to hear you are feeling better.
I figured the whole column wasn't working. At the top of the chart, it shows the column is driven by Q48. Test out this transistor and compare your results to Q49 or Q50. Likely you will see a big difference in how Q48 measures against Q49/Q50.
Set your meter to 2k ohms. Test the transistor outer pin to outer pin, then the middle to one of the outer pins and then middle to the other outer pin. One of these combinations is likely to show the transistor is shorted.

Hopefully obvious, but I just wanted to remind future readers of this thread that Ohming out transistors (or anything really) should be done with the power OFF.

#991 4 years ago

Ok so q48 definitely doesn't look so hot. I think maybe some one tried to fix this before.... Maybe? Attached is pic of backside of board. What should I do? BTW Q48 is the top one

20190707_092019 (resized).jpg20190707_092019 (resized).jpg
#992 4 years ago

Appears it was changed before or just resoldered.

#993 4 years ago

Ya that scares me a little bit. Makes me think someone already tried this fix. Anywho. I went to Fry's and according to Google this is the transistor cross over version. But I used the 20 ohm on the transistor before connecting it to the board and I only get something when I go from the middle connector to either outside connector and I have to have the red probe on the middle connector and black on outside ones. And if I go outside pin to outside pin I get nothing. Does that make sense or did google lie to me and I got the wrong transistor?

20190707_175204 (resized).jpg20190707_175204 (resized).jpg
#994 4 years ago

Fry's should had NTE part 2N3904. I never heard of the one you picked up.

Compare your results of Q48 to Q49 or Q50. 200 ohm range may work, but I mentioned to use 2k resistance setting.

I see markings on the back of the Q48 in the board, so likely someone took off a used part from another board.

#995 4 years ago

I don't think Fry's does. But I can try harder. Oh 2k. I think I was using 20. But I can double check that as well. I typed in the 2n3904 part on Google and the nte123ap was the cross over supposedly. I don't think Fry's had any numbers even close to 2n3904. All the numbers where nte31 all the way to like nte908 or something like that. Nothing that seemed even in the same category as 2n3904. Maybe I will just purchase that exact number online. Will take a bit longer to get, but I probably won't have time to work on until next weekend anyways.

#996 4 years ago

These ones are the exact right ones right? And I'm getting a couple 100 for 5 bucks when I just paid 2 dollars for 1 at Fry's ha ha. Just wanted confirm these where correct right?

Screenshot_20190707-191245_Amazon Shopping (resized).jpgScreenshot_20190707-191245_Amazon Shopping (resized).jpg
#997 4 years ago

If you use the www.nteinc.com actual website, only NTE 2N3904 is the only substituted for part 2N3904. NTE is just the company name. Likely stocked at Fry's only as 2N3904. You can ask the service desk in the computer area. You can call your local Fry's to save a trip, I would imagine.

All those you show on your post are all unknown brand names to me. Who know where they are coming from via Amazon, not to mention quality.

#998 4 years ago

Oh ok I'll try Fry's again. In the meantime I did go to the nte website and there was an arcade or electronics distributer that had a website. I order a few from them just in case my Fry's is out of stock. Thanks. Keep you posted on after the install.

#999 4 years ago

Plenty of pinball websites sell 2N3904 that would not be the NTE brand. I was just stating earlier, the brands that Amazon are selling are not familiar to me. I did not want you to end up with fakes.

#1000 4 years ago

Oh gotcha ok that makes sense. Well now I got nte ones coming so that should solve that problem. Now I just gotta work on installing it correctly and not ruining other stuff as I do it.

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