So two companies announcing polyurethane flipper bands practically back to back? That doesn't exactly strike me as a coincidence.

Curious, how do these compare to the Saturn rings that Planetary Pinball just announced?

Thnks guys! Will try these out for sure on my next order from you.

Are different hardness available?

I dare someone to try a Saturn Ring on the left flipper and a Super-Band on the right!

There are not different hardnesses available with Super-Bands. This is one formulation, available in 8 colors and clear (in stock soon). All colors play the same. You can get a variety of physical properties out of cast polyurethanes without changing the durometer (hardness). These properties were dialed-in over the better part of a year to give the best play and durability. Super-Bands will give you the bounce of a soft red rubber, yet last considerably longer.

These were used at the PAPA World Pinball Championships and other high-profile tournaments since their inception.

Guys, could it be this simple?:

http://www.planetarypinball.com/dealersus/

No. They are completely different products made out of different materials and have no ties to each other whatsoever. This I am 100% sure of.

I mean, I'm sure they have their own formulas, but they're both just polyurethane. I have no dog in this fight, I don't know any of the companies involved, and I think competition is great. I just worry there's a marketing hype train coming.

I have had Super Bands on many of my games since late May, I know they have been in testing for quite a bit longer than that. They play like regular rubbers no matter what color you choose no difference in hardness...they play great, and they clean up very easily. I have had purple ones on my Metallica since I got it, it has tons of plays on it and they still look great no wear and no complaints about play (I mean the Super Bands, not the game!!). They are on many of my other games with no issues, we just had a league session and pinball party at our house last weekend and we had many compliments on the play and looks of them.
I will have Super Bands on all my games that I am taking to Pinball Expo in Chicago that starts on Oct. 16th.
So come to Expo play some pinball and check them out!!

Phoebe

My apologies then, I stand corrected.

I can assure you these are two different products from two different sets of people. I don't know which product was developed first, I only know which one was announced first.

I believe the world champion!

Of course these come the day after I place my order! Rats! lol

OK, what color for LOTR? I'm not great with color combos.

Green.

+1, i was gonna say that.

Green goes with the playfield but makes the flippers look like a Packers helmet. I'm a Bears fan.

Haha haha!

Buy new flipper bats of a different color.

could look good with a chrome/brass, gold flipper bat.

yellow is not bad either, this is what i did on my game. sorry about the picture this is all i got.

Score_Card.JPG

Well, my wife owns one share of the Packers stock. I suppose I could call it a tribute to her.

Go with gold flippers then.

Saturn Rings are getting praise for JJP and will be used in their future games. Let the battle begin.

I can confirm that I don't know Joe or anything about this product. I can only say that competing stuff is good except it looks we are doing 2 very different things but it means more choices and the beneficiary is everyone. I suspect people who buy Saturn rings will buy superbands and people who buy superbands will buy Saturnrings. I also suspect people like and dislike things about both brands.
Heck, there are probably a bunch of people who will stick with traditional rubber. If you ask me, this is very exciting time for pinball. I can tell you that I floated the idea a few years ago but as Joe will tell you, it's not an easy thing to get right. This is the free market working as it should. Bad rubber creates a demand for a better one and there you have it! I don't see this as a bad thing. So I give thumbs up to anyone who can make a product here in the states.

Will these be made for Safecracker™ (1-5/16")?

Sensfreak, it's not really a battle. I actually like what Joe is doing. We both had a different approach and that shows American ingenuity. Being a urethane formulator I could certainly emulate what He is doing as he could what I'm doing.I appreciate what Joe has done and I'm sure being in the same business he can Respect what I have done. Joe will tell you that Urethane people all have there own niche and tricks. Heck, I'm even inclined to order a set of these just for the choice factor. Depending on what mood I'm in and what game, I may choose a different rubber! Remember, even Steve Job's eventually realized that Bill Gates was not the enemy. The winner here is pinball.

Very good point, saturnrings1. I will be ordering some of your product from Planetary Pinball to give it a go. I like the variety of colours you offer and the varying degrees of hardness. Looking forward to testing these out.

I'm looking forward to trying these out! Any plans for either of these brands to do a 5/8 inch version for Gottlieb's?

Will both of these products be available at Expo?

Thus far i will be sticking with regular old rubbers. I honestly don't see the need for anything else on my personal games. Heck,FT has over 1500 games on new rubbers and looks as good as new thus far...

OK, I've never had to consider choosing soft, medium or hard flipper rubber. Any wisdom to share on this if I go with Saturn Rings? I'll be putting them on my LOTR with the stronger flipper coils.

That's what Saturn Rings is all about. You have a choice. All games play different, the speed is different and many other factors. there use to be 2 hardness rubbers but over the years it was cheaper just to make one.

Class act posts my friend. I wish the actual machine manufacturer debates went this way.

Different/competing products = good for pinball!

Last I checked this was a thread started by marco. It's bad form to come into a competitors thread and pitch your competing product.

He's responding directly to the post above him asking for help, and the first few posts he made were simply clarifying these are two different and great products and consumers win either way. I don't see anything terribly unreasonable (yet )

I also worry about how well the traction/stick is on these new formulations compared to original. If they clean up a lot better, than says to me that they may not have the same grip as original rubbers. Maybe that's not the case, but it's #1 on my mind. *I do not want to lose ball control for ability to further accessorize my barbies*.

The problem is the original rubber out there isn't original. It's mostly shit that wears at the tips in under a couple weeks. I have been complaining of this forever, and for a long time didn't really see anyone else posting any problems with flipper rubbers, only the white pf rubbers. Luckily I have found a source for the good stuff (very limited, sorry it's mine!).

I'd be interested in trying this new stuff to see the difference, as if it does last longer, cleans easier, AND plays the same, it might be worth it.

Most people claim subtly better ball control with the Super-Bands. Try them out and decide for yourself if you like them. They were not designed for the bling factor. They were designed to play great and to last long.

Lightning flipper sizes?

Super balls to go with our super bands.

th-6.jpeg

I would be afraid of a Ghostbuster type of effect.

I like the glossy look of the flipper rubbers Stern uses. The problem is they are pure crap, even worse than the ones we use. A freshly shopped location game already had some tearing at the tips.

Also, if someone will make white rubber rings with this same material it will be well worth it. How many times have you had a location game break a rubber ring that is buried beneath several layers of playfield parts? At the moment we have no choice but to stick a ball there. The original rings last much longer. When I tear down games sitting idle for years and still find "good" HAPP rings in once piece, that says something.

I really want all the playfield rubber sizes in colors. Saturn has hinted they're going to do this, what about Super-Bands? Someone take my money!

Let me respond to both products. Gum rubber dry rots and cakes up and loses traction very fast compared to urethane. The Grip of a good urethane is not only long lasting and consistent, it's superior when using the correct urethane. Both of our rings are urethane rubber. I have also seen references to rubber versus non rubber. urethane is not a non rubber, It rubber! Viton Is rubber, natural gum rubber is rubber and there are many more. The difference is that Viton and Urethane are Synthetic. I will double down and say once people experience Synthetic Rubber they will never switch back unless it comes down to $$. there are just to many pros and to few cons. There is a reason that synthetic rubber costs 2 - 3 times that of natural rubber. It's the same reason Synthetic oil costs 3 times as much as regular oil. In any case, I don't need to convince anyone. Once people use these products, most will find many benefits. Of course there always be hold outs just on principle, costs or other reasons. I have to be suspicious of anyone that would be weary of a product and make claims without spending 4 bucks to try it! That's like looking at a new car and saying I bet that paint finish makes it drive like crap. Hop in the seat and take a ride, be it mine or Joe's rings. Or not!

I have been testing the Super-Bands in various capacities for almost a year now, and I can say they are a top-notch product.

Best pinside post yet

My concern as well. As soon as I see video of someone doing loop passes with these I'll be sold.

I haven't been in the market for rubber formulations, but I don't agree with the reasoning that synthetic materials should be more expensive than natural ones. Some natural components may be rare or difficult to process. Often, people develop synthetic materials because they are cheaper.

That said, urethane rubbers do have material advantages over natural rubbers. So yeah, I plan to buy a bunch of these myself! Will they be available at Expo by any chance?

You're correct in the sense that they "Shouldn't" cost more. The issue is that Someone needs to pay those Polymer chemists! You can use slave labor to extract rubber from a tree and in fact they do. Urethane's do cost more to process. There is no getting around that one.